|
|
11-11-2020, 08:30 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
A 1907 Vintage Winchester 94
Last edited by Shark Bait; 01-28-2023 at 09:13 PM.
|
The Following 54 Users Like Post:
|
2ndshift, 4barrel, 6518John, 75Vette, ameridaddy, Babysitr, bigmoose, britbike1, browningcollector, Continental Op, damienph, David LaPell, dr. mordo, Eddie Southgate, Ethang, fdover, Gene L, Goblin, GUNMIKE, inspcalahan, jeffrefrig, Joesmanykids, John F., Jonzim, jringo8769, Kitgun, Kurusu, Lee Barner, LoboGunLeather, Marlin57M, mauser9, MCorps0311, Muddyboot, NYlakesider, OLDSTER, Old_Cop, Onomea, pawncop, Ranger514, REM 3200, RobertJ., Rudi, S&WIowegan, sabashimon, Seaburry, Spajohn, stu1ritter, THE PILGRIM, tndrfttom, Truckin, usmc2427765, vonn, wundudnee, Zarr |
11-11-2020, 08:35 PM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2014
Location: AR—Town & Country
Posts: 7,478
Likes: 80,268
Liked 26,096 Times in 5,948 Posts
|
|
Our gun season starts this weekend. I know someone for whom that rifle would be a perfect match! I even have his picture.
__________________
Possum—The other white meat!
|
The Following 10 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-11-2020, 09:30 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 398
Liked 5,023 Times in 1,625 Posts
|
|
Nice looking set up. I remember seeing those sights fairly often on 1895s, but not so much on 94s.
__________________
I need ammo, not a ride.
|
The Following 4 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-11-2020, 10:39 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 2,127
Likes: 1,916
Liked 2,383 Times in 1,066 Posts
|
|
One beautiful model 94 and the sight it neat! We'll be waiting on a range report after you take it out. Congrats!
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-12-2020, 12:07 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 5,046
Likes: 6,759
Liked 7,849 Times in 3,114 Posts
|
|
I think I see "30 W.C.F."; is that a .30-30 or something else? The gun is one pure beauty, and the sight just seems to send it up to another level.
Looking at this, and then my '60s or '70s era model, the older quality just kinda pours out of your gun, Shark Bait. Almost answers my question of "how do these things stand the age of time?" (Or something like that!)
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-12-2020, 12:18 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffrefrig
I think I see "30 W.C.F."; is that a .30-30 or something else? The gun is one pure beauty, and the sight just seems to send it up to another level.
Looking at this, and then my '60s or '70s era model, the older quality just kinda pours out of your gun, Shark Bait. Almost answers my question of "how do these things stand the age of time?" (Or something like that!)
|
Yes, .30 WCF (Winchester Center Fire) is the same as .30-30. I am thrilled to have found this gun today. This is why I love checking gun stores that have the old stuff. It's almost like a treasure hunt. Just today learned that an old favorite LGS recently switched to online sales only. I was really disappointed. Then I found this. I have a new favorite LGS.
|
The Following 4 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-12-2020, 12:40 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Northeast
Posts: 3,165
Likes: 8,324
Liked 2,809 Times in 1,683 Posts
|
|
Yep that old craftsmanship just jumps out at ya on these vintage guns. Am sure they would cost a bundle if made the same way with all milled parts. Would be a thrill to hunt with one like yours or a Remington Model 14 or 141.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-12-2020, 09:36 AM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Northwest Alabama, USA
Posts: 1,601
Likes: 365
Liked 1,905 Times in 680 Posts
|
|
Very classy! Congrats on a nice find.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-13-2020, 06:59 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2016
Location: 30min SE Montreal
Posts: 2,026
Likes: 150
Liked 1,540 Times in 841 Posts
|
|
Sorry I can't answer your question about the rear sight.But I just couldn't help telling you how I am jealous!Congrats for your purchase.What a beauty!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-13-2020, 07:17 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Utah
Posts: 2,004
Likes: 4,546
Liked 7,560 Times in 1,441 Posts
|
|
Good looking rifle. That sight was a factory option. If I remember correctly 1907 is around the cut off for letters from Cody for Model 1894s.
That is a pretty nice rifle and a letter would certainly be worth getting.
__________________
Bill Bates
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-13-2020, 07:21 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: BISHOP, California
Posts: 953
Likes: 4,433
Liked 1,291 Times in 533 Posts
|
|
My 30-30 Winchester is my favorite truck gun.
My Ruger .223 semi-auto with a 30 round magazine is my second.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-13-2020, 07:59 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Auburn, Kansas
Posts: 1,287
Likes: 4,481
Liked 4,758 Times in 875 Posts
|
|
In 1966 I bought an 1894, 20", octagon rifle for $55.00. I never could prove whether it was a cut off or original. It was a 1908, .32Winchester Special. I showed it to different Winchester guys and had different opinions on originality. I solved that problem by giving it to my son. Those old 94s just ooze history and quality. It was probably a quality done cut off.
|
The Following 6 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 02:39 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Alaska
Posts: 1,004
Likes: 1,700
Liked 1,044 Times in 428 Posts
|
|
That is simply a beautiful old rifle, one that you were fortunate to have found! Just holding it and cycling the action, it could tell stories. Unfortunately, with being in Alaska, those beauties don't pop up very often, since the area is "so new". During those early 1900s up here, the same guns saw very hard use and many didn't survive another 100 years, plus there weren't that many to begin with.
Your story of searching the LGS's for old guns makes me yearn for a few more years down the road when I can do the same.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 03:21 PM
|
|
Moderator
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Great Lakes State
Posts: 29,690
Likes: 12,673
Liked 33,609 Times in 7,847 Posts
|
|
Nice rifle and a cool sight! You can get a Cody letter up to about 360,000 on the 1894’s. Yours should be close.
That “climbin’ Lyman” is a rather valuable rear sight. I see your’s has the flip down aperture. They were offered by Winchester as an option and required extra holes in the receiver. If you have a gun that’s drilled for a Lyman 21, you’ll pay what you have to for the sight to make it whole. I’ve seen them go for $300 - $400. A close up of the rear seat blank (dovetail filler) should tell us if it’s factory work. Their blanks were rather unique.
__________________
"I also cook."
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 03:25 PM
|
|
Moderator
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Great Lakes State
Posts: 29,690
Likes: 12,673
Liked 33,609 Times in 7,847 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by wundudnee
In 1966 I bought an 1894, 20", octagon rifle for $55.00. I never could prove whether it was a cut off or original. It was a 1908, .32Winchester Special. I showed it to different Winchester guys and had different opinions on originality. I solved that problem by giving it to my son. Those old 94s just ooze history and quality. It was probably a quality done cut off.
|
Factory 1894 short rifles with barrels under 24” had forearm wood 1” shorter than standard and the rear sight dovetail was 1” closer to the receiver. When Winchester made short rifles, they took 1” off the back of the barrel.
__________________
"I also cook."
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 05:27 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2016
Location: 30min SE Montreal
Posts: 2,026
Likes: 150
Liked 1,540 Times in 841 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by wundudnee
In 1966 I bought an 1894, 20", octagon rifle for $55.00. I never could prove whether it was a cut off or original. It was a 1908, .32Winchester Special. I showed it to different Winchester guys and had different opinions on originality. I solved that problem by giving it to my son. Those old 94s just ooze history and quality. It was probably a quality done cut off.
|
Early 20th century,gun companies would really bend backwards to please customers.You could order your model 94(or any other model)with whatever barrel lenght and configuration you wanted for a nominal(might I add minimal)extra.So it is very possible that what you(now your son)have is a custom gun from the manufacturer.S&WCHAD gave you an easy way to check this out.You might have something highly valuable to a collector if it turns out to be from Winchester,this configuration being pretty scarce.
Last edited by Qc Pistolero; 11-14-2020 at 05:29 PM.
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 07:23 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by s&wchad
Nice rifle and a cool sight! You can get a Cody letter up to about 360,000 on the 1894’s. Yours should be close.
That “climbin’ Lyman” is a rather valuable rear sight. I see your’s has the flip down aperture. They were offered by Winchester as an option and required extra holes in the receiver. If you have a gun that’s drilled for a Lyman 21, you’ll pay what you have to for the sight to make it whole. I’ve seen them go for $300 - $400. A close up of the rear seat blank (dovetail filler) should tell us if it’s factory work. Their blanks were rather unique.
|
The serial number is 388*** so I just missed it for the letter. An image of the rear sight plug is below. It looks like the rear sight was cut off. The front sight is also marked as Lyman.
There is no evidence of a rear sight elevator being used , so I think the Lyman sight must have been added very early if not a factory installation. The wear on the sight is also on par with the wear on the rifle..Can you describe the unique blank the factory used?
Last edited by Shark Bait; 11-15-2020 at 09:52 AM.
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 10:08 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,518
Likes: 19,273
Liked 32,340 Times in 5,474 Posts
|
|
Excellent find! Probably a great critter-gitter, but one of those that is getting to be too rare, valuable, and collectible to drag around in the hills and woods. Enjoy it, friend!
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 10:30 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
I would love to get a nice mule deer buck with it someday. I need to get it to the range and see if it still shoots as good as it looks. Lobo, looking forward to lunch again sometime soon. Maybe we can get some trigger time too. Be safe sir!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 10:33 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by wundudnee
|
Wundudnee, that picture screams "MERICA"!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 10:56 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Derby City,Ky.
Posts: 4,675
Likes: 5,277
Liked 3,503 Times in 1,680 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shark Bait
|
That is a beauty!
__________________
Life is short,live it fully.
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 11:23 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 6,702
Likes: 13,215
Liked 15,591 Times in 4,907 Posts
|
|
A very cool old classic. Looks like that sight has been on there the whole time.
__________________
No baby we aint
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 11:31 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,199
Likes: 775
Liked 1,961 Times in 690 Posts
|
|
I have some of those.
To include the four of them that hang over my fireplace in the living room. The newest one in this picture is the take down model on the bottom made in 1920.
Last edited by Charlie Foxtrott; 11-14-2020 at 11:32 PM.
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 11:38 PM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2014
Location: AR—Town & Country
Posts: 7,478
Likes: 80,268
Liked 26,096 Times in 5,948 Posts
|
|
I wonder what the spread is in point of impact from the top line to the bottom on that site? It looks like there is at least a couple of inches of adjustment from top to bottom. I would think that would make a tremendous difference in point of impact.
__________________
Possum—The other white meat!
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-14-2020, 11:55 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6518John
I wonder what the spread is in point of impact from the top line to the bottom on that site? It looks like there is at least a couple of inches of adjustment from top to bottom. I would think that would make a tremendous difference in point of impact.
|
I'm guessing it's far more than the cartridge is reasonably capable of. But I still wouldn't want to be on the receiving end when the bullet got there.
|
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-15-2020, 08:10 AM
|
|
Moderator
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Great Lakes State
Posts: 29,690
Likes: 12,673
Liked 33,609 Times in 7,847 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shark Bait
The serial number is 388*** so I just missed it for the letter. An image of the rear sight plug is below. It looks like the rear sight was cut off. The front sight is also marked as Lyman.
Can you describe the unique blank the factory used?
|
I sent this in a PM, but here’s a photo of a factory Winchester blank. They’re unmarked and perfectly flat on top with fairly sharp edges.
__________________
"I also cook."
|
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-15-2020, 11:00 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,543
Likes: 667
Liked 6,774 Times in 1,312 Posts
|
|
From what I can tell, the sight screws fit in to the factory screws on the 1894. The front screw is where the screw for the pin for the bolt goes, and the rest looks like it all goes where the factory screws set up. A really clean looking 1894 rifle.
__________________
Vaya con Dios
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-15-2020, 11:24 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
Shot it today. First 3 rounds were under an inch at 50 yards. So far so good. Really liking this old rifle.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-15-2020, 11:25 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 626
Likes: 5,546
Liked 999 Times in 347 Posts
|
|
Very nice! How long are the barrels, 26”?
|
11-16-2020, 12:09 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Northwest MT
Posts: 2,457
Likes: 9,823
Liked 3,352 Times in 1,336 Posts
|
|
I really enjoy the weight and balance of those old octagonal barrels. Last summer, I ran across one in a LGS that I was told was built in 1911. Unfortunately it had received a mediocre reblue job, with matching refinished wood somewhere along the line. I passed on it, since I own a 1967 Canadian Centennial edition reproduction of the 94 pictured. I'd still love to own one of the old , original WCF carbine models with a 20-inch octagonal barrel.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 12:32 AM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 8,389
Likes: 2,476
Liked 13,054 Times in 4,535 Posts
|
|
Mmmmmm, yes, delicious rifle. I had a reasonable M94 collection for awhile but I liquidated it to buy other guns. I did keep a couple.
I like that comment about about the picture screaming "America" and it made me think, in current parlance "America's rifle" is an AR-type rifle, but it wasn't so long ago that a lever rifle was "America's rifle" and for good reason!
I never owned any 94s made after USRAC took over but most of mine were post-1964. I do have one really old one, though; I need to dig it out and see what the serial number tells me about date of manufacture.
Well done, Shark Bait!
FYI, my very good friend and personal FFL recently acquired an early 20th century Model 94 Winchester .30-30 from a family down in Uvalde, a small town at the southern tip of the Texas hill country. Beautiful rifle with notches cut into the lower tang directly above the lever. We had fascinating discussions speculating who, what, when, and where with respect to the gunfights that rifle must have seen. Anyway, he sold it to a friend for $850.00, which I thought was pretty reasonable.
__________________
Come and take it!!
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 09:33 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by damienph
Very nice! How long are the barrels, 26”?
|
I believe it's 25 or 26 inches. Haven't measured it yet.
|
11-16-2020, 09:46 AM
|
|
Moderator
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Great Lakes State
Posts: 29,690
Likes: 12,673
Liked 33,609 Times in 7,847 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shark Bait
I believe it's 25 or 26 inches. Haven't measured it yet.
|
26" barrels were standard on 1894/94 rifles (20" on carbines). It's measured from the bolt face, which is about even with the back edge of the front receiver bridge. Shorter or longer barrels were available as an extra cost option, but they're typically in 2" increments (even numbers). There are exceptions, but they are extremely rare.
__________________
"I also cook."
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 11:59 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Northern California
Posts: 6,655
Likes: 3,299
Liked 17,158 Times in 2,907 Posts
|
|
I love those rear sights though I’ve never owned one. My ‘95 Winchester appears to have had one once. I like those sights because they are retro over engineering, kind of how l look at my Savage 1899 “Stith” mount. Just beautifully machined technology of years gone by.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 02:00 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Northwest MT
Posts: 2,457
Likes: 9,823
Liked 3,352 Times in 1,336 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shark Bait
I believe it's 25 or 26 inches. Haven't measured it yet.
|
My replica Canadian Cetennial is a 26" barrel, as was the 1911 I looked at.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 02:06 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: nc
Posts: 662
Likes: 689
Liked 861 Times in 389 Posts
|
|
Your Lyman Sight was popular for 80+ years... Move the lever to unlock, adj from 50 to 500 Yds. Got 1 on my 1921 1895 in 30-06.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 02:28 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 3,183
Likes: 9,014
Liked 9,908 Times in 2,006 Posts
|
|
I believe Lyman stopped making them in 1943. The sight adds an extra "cool" factor to the gun. I shot it yesterday and my first three rounds grouped under an inch at 50 yards.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
11-16-2020, 04:55 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: nc
Posts: 662
Likes: 689
Liked 861 Times in 389 Posts
|
|
DOM 1894 to 1949 for a wide range of rifles.
|
|
Thread Tools |
|
Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
|
|
|
|