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  #1  
Old 01-13-2021, 12:46 AM
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Default Have I grown too old to buy a new home defense shotgun

I have several shotguns, I used to have more. Two of them fit the bill as a "Home Defense Shotgun" as they are pump action with 20" barrels. They are, however both from the 1930's:





So this brings me to my question. Being that I am in my mid-60's does it make any sense
for me to purchase a new, made in America, plastic stocked home defense shotgun for about $350
when my old reliables do just fine , I enjoy shooting them, and I do not shoot them so much that I expect to wear them out.
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:55 AM
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Only if you want one.
The new plastic forends with M-Lok or picatinny rails are great for mounting a light-laser.
Otherwise those shotguns look fine.
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:59 AM
Sam McCord Sam McCord is offline
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If you were 13 years old you would not live long enough to wear either of those out. From where I'm sitting you have the shotgun issue covered, one for each hand.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:02 AM
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You're never too old. It's all about what you already have and want. Many of us rationalize our needs. Beyond perhaps, a basic hunting gun and a defense gun, the remainder are all about "want." And "want" is just fine. Go for it!
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:03 AM
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I have a gaggle of HD shotguns. They're fun. Get what you want.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:05 AM
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I think you know the answer...

If it ainít broken donít fix it.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:11 AM
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Quote:
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I think you know the answer...

If it ainít broken donít fix it.
With my older guns it's more like "If it ain't broke don't break it."
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:11 AM
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A few months ago, I got a pretty good deal on a Turkish import auto 12 gauge. The recoil is a breeze compared to pumps, feeling about 50% of what I am used to in an 870. My investment to date with Nordic extended tube and a tactical light is about $250. Better sights than the 870:too.

I will likely buy a nicer import shotgun in the near future, but found a shotgun that is fun to shoot I realize I am getting older and less recoil is better.

@LCC - everyone raves about the Beretta 1301, but the $1000+ cost was putting me off. I had been prowling around for an old A5 or other low priced auto to try out the 12ga. Autos. I have always been an indifferent shotgunner.

I ended up putting in a dozen or so Gunbroker bids on Turkish imports from ST Auctions. I bid low and finally got one for well under $200. Appears to be very similar to the TriStar shotguns and several other names, all which seem to come from Berika as the OEM. No warranty, so I was rolling the dice.

Less than 150 shells to date, so I donít know about the longer term durability. Reliability has been great, as the only malfunctions were with 1.5Ē mini shells, which do not feed and did not recoil enough to feed the next 2 3/4Ē shell. Maybe it also bobbled with a non lethal rubber star round too, but also expected. I found it reliable with high brass, low brass, three different slugs, etc. The stock has an effective rubber cushioning pad... Not the most attractive, but a joy on my also-repaired shoulder and partially rewired upper/lower back.

Last point is with some trial and error, I found the Nordic Components Benelli Nova thread pitch matched the magazine tube. I was able to add a +2 shell tube easily after that.

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Old 01-13-2021, 01:13 AM
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A few months ago, I got a pretty good deal on a Turkish import auto 12 gauge. The recoil is a breeze compared to pumps, feeling about 50% of what I am used to in an 870. My investment to date with Nordic extended tube and a tactical light is about $250. Better sights than the 870:too.

I will likely buy a nicer import shotgun in the near future, but found a shotgun that is fun to shoot I realize I am getting older and less recoil is better.
can I inquire what model? Looking for a 12 ga home defense semi with reasonable recoil for my repaired shoulder.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:23 AM
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My basic shotgun is a police surplus Remington 870 that is, while not ancient, not new either. I am completely confident in it. For serious social use I keep it loaded with low-recoil buck with the same for my occasional foray into 3-gun. I am old and knocked around and no longer enjoy getting the xxxx kicked out of me on the range.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:39 AM
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Being up there in years and no longer finding recoil fun, or at least invigorating, I'd suggest someone approaching senior status consider a 20 gauge instead. There's lot to be said for an auto loader too.

A light mount & light is also an outstanding idea.

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Old 01-13-2021, 01:48 AM
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I like your style! My main HD shotgun is older than I am, a 1959 870 Wingmaster. Action is smooth as glass. I would love to get a Beretta 1301, but my trusty 870 would still pull HD duty.
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Old 01-13-2021, 02:22 AM
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Iíd rather have that Ď97 than anything made today.
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:00 AM
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The '97 took care of business in WWI, WWII... Vietnam.

They stand up to the rigors of Cowboy Action Shooting completion, they're certainly up to the task of home defense.

I used one for CAS for many years, that I had cut down to a 20" bbl and thin wall chokes installed. It's now my "house gun"... besides, who doesn't love a pump that was designed to be slam fired?

And I'm drooling over that fact that your '97 is not a take down model.



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Old 01-13-2021, 03:25 AM
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Me thinks you are better than good to go..as you are.
Ain't no plastic in those fine proven examples,
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:09 AM
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At age 68 I bought a Mossberg Shockwave chambered in 12 gauge. I thought about attaching a tactical high LED light. I could see where the bad guy is but he would also know where I am, so nope on that.

I have three rounds of bird shot then two rounds of double ought buck. I would hope the sound of racking in the first round would send the bad guy packing.

Hopefully we are never faced with a situation like this.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WR Moore View Post
Being up there in years and no longer finding recoil fun, or at least invigorating, I'd suggest someone approaching senior status consider a 20 gauge instead. There's lot to be said for an auto loader too.

A light mount & light is also an outstanding idea.
Thinking something similar. Currently have a 12 ga 870. When the current gun shortage passes, I was thinking Iíd pick up a youth sized .410 pump. Run it with slugs.

My wife really doesnít like to shoot the 870. I donít think sheíd have an issue with a .410.
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Old 01-13-2021, 05:36 AM
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With my older guns it's more like "If it ain't broke don't break it."
I carried a Winchester Model 12 Riot Gun for close to twenty years that my agency purchased when I was four years old. It never failed to fire when I had it and I purchased one of them after they were retired by the department. While I have other several other Riot Guns, none are any better than my old Model 12. Itís my favorite.

Nothing wrong with the Riot Guns you have.
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Old 01-13-2021, 06:20 AM
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are the shotguns you now own inadequate?I am drooling over them,and would trade my Mossy tactical for one any day
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Old 01-13-2021, 06:27 AM
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The decision on a purposed defense shotgun may not be an option anytime soon. My observations indicate that finding any new make/model in stock will be difficult. Perhaps if you were lucky, you might find a used one. They will carry Covid/political price tags. If you find a gun you really like or want, you might grab it....sooner than later.
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Old 01-13-2021, 07:03 AM
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"Have I grown too old to buy a new home defense shotgun?"

Breathing, have a pulse, able to stand upright? Check.
Cash, or credit card not maxed out? Check.
Finding what you want? As the song goes, that's where the fun is.

Good luck in your decision.
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Old 01-13-2021, 07:35 AM
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Some of the scatter guns.



Remington 870 Express HD
Norinco 982 (870 clone)
FN Self Loading Police
Winchester 1300 Defender Speed Pump
Browning BPS High Capacity
Kel-Tec KSG (Gen 2)
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Old 01-13-2021, 08:09 AM
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Those are way too nice to sit in an evidence locker which is where they might wind up if you have to use one. I have a newer one for the house and save my older ones for enjoying.

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Old 01-13-2021, 08:10 AM
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To satisfy your itch I will gladly send you a NIB Remington 870 12ga tactical shotgun with an extended magazine tube in exchange for your two old shotties. I'll even cover the shipping costs both ways. I have a thing (sorry to admit it) for short shotguns, and the older the better.

Seriously, you have a couple of real beauties there, with quality and style you could never match with one of the newer offerings. Maybe it is time to give them a rest from HD duties and get yourself a $350 plastic fantastic (although in the current market those prices are double plus) and save those two for more fun pursuits.

Whatever you do you can't go wrong.

Now, about that deal I first offered...they would be going to a good home, I promise!
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Old 01-13-2021, 09:49 AM
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To satisfy your itch I will gladly send you a NIB Remington 870 12ga tactical shotgun with an extended magazine tube in exchange for your two old shotties. I'll even cover the shipping costs both ways. I have a thing (sorry to admit it) for short shotguns, and the older the better.

Seriously, you have a couple of real beauties there, with quality and style you could never match with one of the newer offerings. Maybe it is time to give them a rest from HD duties and get yourself a $350 plastic fantastic (although in the current market those prices are double plus) and save those two for more fun pursuits.

Whatever you do you can't go wrong.

Now, about that deal I first offered...they would be going to a good home, I promise!
For your plastic fantastic I will trade you five used shells cycled though either of the two shotguns in my OP-Your choice. You are not going to find an offer like this anywhere else. Do we have a deal?
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Old 01-13-2021, 09:52 AM
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You got yourself two real nice shotguns there. If you want something to stand in the corner, I'd look at a Kel Tec KSG or a Mossberg Shockwave . . .
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:16 AM
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I like old guns too. But if I were worried about my ability to handle a 12 gauge due to age or physical limitations I would very seriously be shopping 20 gauge guns. I believe they are an overlooked alternative that should be nothing to dismiss. There are slug and buckshot loads available for the 20 gauge that provide acceptable results in a self or home defense application.

An autoloader would make it even more manageable still.

Check em out.
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:48 PM
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You got yourself two real nice shotguns there. If you want something to stand in the corner, I'd look at a Kel Tec KSG or a Mossberg Shockwave . . .
If looking for new plastic I would go with the Maverick 88 18.5 by Mossberg, who stands by their products . Available NIB online for last night for $339.

Instead, I think I will keep my eye out for a used Wingmaster with decent wood, good metal and an 18.5" or 20" barrel. It will give me a wood refinishing project and I can blast away at the range without a second thought other than honing my skills and safety.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:58 PM
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Consider: These are excellent condition collectible shotguns. If you did use them in self-defense, they will be confiscated for the duration of the investigation which can be two years in some cases. While confiscated they will be in a police property room and will not be treated well. Even if 100% justified using the shotgun for self-defense, you will likely have to go before a probate judge and ask them to release the firearm to you since charges are not pending. You are then at the mercy of the politics of that judge on whether or not you ever get it back.

So this being the reality of a self-defense situation, what would you rather lose? The fine vintage firearm you had for so long and cannot replace it or the memories associated with it or a cheap Mossberg 12 or 20 gauge Cruiser or Maverick?

Edit: Its why I keep a Rock Island 12 gauge for self defense and a 9mm Makarov as my carry gun. Both are dependable and I won't feel sick to my gut if I can't have them back after giving some perp a sudden case of lead poisoning.

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Old 01-13-2021, 02:39 PM
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new and plastic is probably overrated... wouldn't know actually.. never saw the need... this works just fine...
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:30 PM
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Not broken = Don't fix

You're good to go imo.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:36 PM
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Oldie goldies, nothing wrong what you have IMHO.
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  #33  
Old 01-13-2021, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bushmaster1313 View Post
I have several shotguns, I used to have more. Two of them fit the bill as a "Home Defense Shotgun" as they are pump action with 20" barrels. They are, however both from the 1930's:





So this brings me to my question. Being that I am in my mid-60's does it make any sense
for me to purchase a new, made in America, plastic stocked home defense shotgun for about $350
when my old reliables do just fine , I enjoy shooting them, and I do not shoot them so much that I expect to wear them out.
Nothing wrong with what you have. They even look like shotguns; they're good quality, simple, and hold plenty of ammo. No real need for flashlights, special sights, or other questionable gimcracks hanging off of them.
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  #34  
Old 01-13-2021, 04:43 PM
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I would get a slip on recoil pad for it pump 12 are mean.If you want a new one and can find it probably should get it.
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  #35  
Old 01-13-2021, 04:53 PM
Muss Muggins Muss Muggins is online now
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Well, by your original post, you were looking for a new plastic home defense shotgun. Advice was given. Since youíve now changed the parameters and decided to buy a third shotgun similar to what you already have, I doubt the forum can be of assistance. Thanks for asking . . .

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Originally Posted by bushmaster1313 View Post
If looking for new plastic I would go with the Maverick 88 18.5 by Mossberg, who stands by their products . Available NIB online for last night for $339.

Instead, I think I will keep my eye out for a used Wingmaster with decent wood, good metal and an 18.5" or 20" barrel. It will give me a wood refinishing project and I can blast away at the range without a second thought other than honing my skills and safety.
Just a reminder:

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Originally Posted by bushmaster1313 View Post
. . . So this brings me to my question. Being that I am in my mid-60's does it make any sense for me to purchase a new, made in America, plastic stocked home defense shotgun for about $350 when my old reliables do just fine , I enjoy shooting them, and I do not shoot them so much that I expect to wear them out.
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  #36  
Old 01-13-2021, 04:54 PM
Hapworth Hapworth is offline
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What next? A thread with a couple Vietnam era Colt 1911s asking if you're covered for around the house or should you get a Glock?

We're getting played for compliments folks -- Bushy's knows he's got the hottie shotties.
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  #37  
Old 01-13-2021, 06:23 PM
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[QUOTE=Hapworth;

We're getting played for compliments folks -)[/QUOTE]


And it only took 36 posts for someone to figure it out. Larry
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  #38  
Old 01-13-2021, 06:25 PM
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IMHO, you have 2 quality shotguns there. I don't think you can shoot either one of them enough to wear them out. Enjoy those beauties!
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Old 01-13-2021, 06:33 PM
Muss Muggins Muss Muggins is online now
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Weíre getting played for compliments folks
I decided that years ago. [Edited] Call me skeptical . . .
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  #40  
Old 01-13-2021, 07:28 PM
wetdog1911 wetdog1911 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WR Moore View Post
Being up there in years and no longer finding recoil fun, or at least invigorating, I'd suggest someone approaching senior status consider a 20 gauge instead. There's lot to be said for an auto loader too.

A light mount & light is also an outstanding idea.
What I have, a police trade in Rem 870 metal top folder, Wingmaster base gun. The only marks on it are from the folder when folded. Other than that, it seems to have seen very little use. No surprise there, it is not pleasant to shoot with the stock in either position. I would MUCH prefer a 20ga, or, even a .410. I also prefer autos over pumps. Mainly from lack of experience shooting pumps (zero).

I have a badly shattered R shoulder that pretty much precludes even shouldering a long arm, so, 'from the hip', more or less, it is.

In my mind, a "Whippet" would be nearly perfect AND I have a base for one, along with a dilemma. I inherited a pre-war Remington "Sportsman", limited to 3 shots, 20ga. Model 11, A5 clone. It was my Uncle's and he let me use it on my first ever duck hunt in 1962. He left it to my Dad and then to me when my Dad passed in 2018. So far, I've resisted the urge to have the bbl shortened (It's 28 or 30" long), but, my kid isn't interested at all and it does look a bit groady from my Dad's improper storage the years he had it. The internals are pristine though. I had given it a thorough cleaning when he first got it and before he stuck it in the attic and forgotten.

Hmmmmm .... I bet my kid or his wife would be interested in the whippet configuration since they live in a fairly isolated farm house deep in the country. She also grew up aroung guns and knows how to shoot.

More to ponder.

Rob
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  #41  
Old 01-13-2021, 07:44 PM
BigBill BigBill is offline
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In my late 50’s I got a new maverick with a 28” mod barrel, purchased the 18” improved cylinder riot barrel and the 30” full chock.

I have a Winchester 120 with a short slug barrel but I wanted a seperate shotgun for home defence.
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Old 01-13-2021, 08:24 PM
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I have a Mossberg 500A 12GA dads JC Higgins 12GA protected our family 40 years
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  #43  
Old 01-13-2021, 08:27 PM
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Youíve got it backwards: the older you get, the more expensive toys youíre allowed!

At least thatís my story and Iím sticking to it.
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  #44  
Old 01-14-2021, 12:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiasconva View Post
IMHO, you have 2 quality shotguns there. I don't think you can shoot either one of them enough to wear them out. Enjoy those beauties!
Thanks, I do enjoy them, but only one or two magazines per range session.

For more repetitive practice I've taken the late Dave McCraken's personal advice and I've shot self defense shotguns with target ammo at the 16 yard trap line. It takes a quick point and shoot, and has drawn several snickers, but even with a cylinder bore and an 18.5 or 20" barrel I am usually able to break about half the targets.

But with a gun 80+ years old all it would take is a broken extractor to put it out of commission after the first shot in a defensive scenario. And as long as they work I am not opening up my oldies but goodies to install a replacement extractor, even assuming I could find the correct part.
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Old 01-14-2021, 02:13 AM
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I'm older than you. I like modern shotguns but my home defense shotgun is a mid-20th century Ithaca Model 37. It will do to ride the river with.

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Old 01-14-2021, 06:23 AM
Ivan the Butcher Ivan the Butcher is offline
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I have a model 97 made in 1904, it is sawed off to 18", almost no finish left some military steel butt plate and a badly carved dog on it. I use it for Cowboy action shooting. On a good year I run a couple thousand rounds through it between practice and matches. Compared to some hunting guns that might be a lifetime's worth of shooting, all in on season. At a 116 years old and still going strong. I also have a 97 made in 1954. It is like new! Friends ask why I don't use that for competition? The 1904 isn't worn out yet!

Why use a pump shotgun for the HD/SD roll? Every bad guy in the world knows that the action sound means they are in trouble. Why use a 124 year old design? A 97 says it with a snarl!

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  #47  
Old 01-14-2021, 07:07 AM
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Some people daily driver antiques or classic cars. Me? I like my 10 way power seat, climate control, and 5 star safety rating.
I have to say my AKKAR 870 clone security gun is completely satisfactory. I've done the somewhat painful exercise of shooting it prone position with slugs and the 100 yd groups are about as good as the ones I shoot with milsurp iron sighted rifles. 4 revolutions to the target is all the spin a Foster slug needs, LOL.
I've got a set of screw in chokes for it so it's quite adaptable.

What's interesting is the difference in opinions over pistol grip stocks on shotguns.
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  #48  
Old 01-14-2021, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
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new and plastic is probably overrated... wouldn't know actually.. never saw the need... this works just fine...
Robvious, How'd you get that big gun to feed those little shells that are on the table next to it. And different sizes too! Cool.
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  #49  
Old 01-14-2021, 09:50 AM
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Nothing wrong with the ones you have. Butt, it you want another one get it. I think the cut off age for buying defensive shotguns is currently set at 116 in the US
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Old 01-14-2021, 10:01 AM
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My home defense shotguns are old models which I paid more for than new ones cost. Real steel and wood, plus workmanship is better than plastic and alum.
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