This was turned up in a plow furrow probably around ‘67 or ‘68. When Dad was plowing, I used to walk behind the tractor and look for arrowheads. I had found a beautiful large one there a year or so earlier so I always looked closely in that part of the field. I remember having to use my pocketknife to free this from the furrow. I showed it to my Dad and he said it was probably a toy gun that some kid had lost years ago. It was hung up on a nail in an old tool shed and remained there for almost fifty years.
A few years back I was looking for my grandfather’s old corn sheller when I saw the gun and looked at it real closely for the first time.
The first thing you notice is that obviously non standard machine screw in the barrel pivot. That, and the need to finish plowing, is probably why my Dad dismissed it as a toy years ago. But some features make me think it may have been a real top-break revolver.
The good:
It has what appears to be the latch at the top of the frame.
It has a slot in the bottom of the grip frame for a hammer spring.
It has a trigger and the stub of a hammer.
The five shot cylinder has flutes.
It appears to be chambered for a .38. (A .38 S&W seemed to be the closest fit to the end of one of the chambers that I was able to somewhat clean out. A .32 was too small.)
The only picture I found on the internet of a toy top break looked nothing like this.

The not so good:
As it is, the gun weighs 13.1 oz. Even accounting for metal loss due to rust, that seems a bit light for a revolver.
The barrel has a narrow rib on the top but no front sight. The barrel does show signs of damage at the end and may have originally been longer.
That big stainless steel screw!

Two of the cylinders appear to be empty but I can’t be sure about the others. If ammunition were present it’s likely inert after all this time but until that can be determined, it’s treated with respect like any other gun.

The spot in the field where this was found was about forty feet from an old county road that was abandoned when the state highway was built in the late thirties. It’s possible someone could have thrown it from a car or a buggy but that’s only conjecture.

There’s a lot of knowledgeable folks on this forum and we all love a mystery so what do you think?

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I think it needs a good soak and scrub.

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The best I can with what I got

I say it's real.

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Made it, Ma! Top of the world!

Soak it several days in automatic transmission (red) fluid and see what it looks like then. If it is still a mystery, take a new picture and repost it to this thread. I do not think it look like a toy.

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SWCA 3417 HF 642 NRA-TC

I'm going to assume that it's real, and here's why..****st. Most toy guns were made of zinc or some other cheap non-ferrous alloy, whereas this is clearly made of a ferrous metal like iron or steel. Older toy guns were typically made of wood.

The screw is most likely just a quick and easy replacement for the original screw which may have been lost or damaged. (Bubba can trace his ancestry straight back to the Mayflower, and came from a long line of amateur kitchen gunsmiths.)

I presume that the gun was discarded in a ditch either because it was discarded evidence used in a crime of some sort. A firearm that had accidentally fallen from a carriage or something would have been recovered by the owner or found by someone much sooner. That gun was most likely deliberately buried so that it wouldn't be found.

Granted that is all purely theoretical conjecture on my part, but it's just too corroded/degraded for anyone to be 100% sure of what it is they're looking at.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

It looks about like the Colt and occasional Remington cap and ball guns we used to dig out of the ground in Hanover County, Virginia, in the Cold Harbor/Gaines Mill area.

Their previous owners, some wearing gray, some blue didn't need them anymore I suspect.

I'd say it's real.

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John 3:16 .

Agree with a good long soak in ATF/acetone in a sealed metal can.

From the contours of the frame that are visible, my guess is you may find an Iver Johnson Safety Auto Hammerless underneath.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

After they killed someone with it. If a ballistic and DNA test is run on it you may be charged with possession of a murder weapon. Larry

Looks like a good restoration project.

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Not in jail.

Given the degree of corrosion, even if this was a hot firearm, I don't think there is now any way of linking it to a crime. I think it is real, it might still be loaded. Soaking it in automatic transmission fluid is a good idea.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

Check for loaded!

Just thinking out loud, once you identify it... the gun plus a reasonable estimate for ground time before you plowed it up gives you a time window... ask LE or scan old local papers for a shooting with that caliber in that time frame... is your road an old route leading from any old major city?

This hinge screw looks rather non-corroded for a ground gun.

I’d also check with previous owners of the land; is there a story about gr-grandpa losing his gun in the field while plowing? Fell out of his pocket and stepped on? Probably a long shot.

Cool story however it turns out! I’ll be interested to see the post-soak version.

I go with real.

I think the frame, at the grip area, shows detail that I would think would not be necessary or considered in manufacturing a toy from that era.

The frame, at the bottom, shows a notched insert for the main spring and the alignment pins for the stocks.

I would say it's a real gun, the shape of the frame looks a lot like an Iver Johnson or an H&R hammerless model. The fact that the trigger is all the way back indicates it likely went into the ground with a broken trigger spring. Those guns were double action only and the trigger goes forward as soon as pressure is released. Also the odd screw indicates it may have had other issues.

It's possible the gun was discarded as broken and useless by whoever had it back then. Another possibility is that someone turned a broken gun into a toy for their kid to play with. Who later lost it..... To modern folk that might seem strange but I have known of several cases of just that happening in the old days. I have personally handled a number of "family guns" that older family members recalled using as toys for years. Some were just broken, some deliberately "fixed" so they were safe (though one old muzzle loading shotgun turned out to have a load in it, with the nipple hammered flat it wasn't likely to go off though!).

If it was a "crime gun" it likely was discarded because the trigger spring broke, whether it was used to shoot anyone or not.............. Overall condition says it was a long, long time ago. Not likely to be of any use for forensic examination at this point. Just an interesting old relic now

Another vote for real. Cool find!

Looks like a Meriden Arms Company top break hammerless. They made firearms for many different distributors with various brand names. One brand name was Eastern Arms sold by Sears Roebuck and Company.

Was the Lincoln assassination gun ever found???
I vote it's real.

It sure would be cool to know the story behind that gun. If it was used in a crime, tossed from a car, or just dropped from somebody's pants as they walked through the field.

My old college room mates dad plowed up an Indian grave that was lined with slate. They looked at it, then covered it up and didn't tell too many people about it.
Your story reminded me of that.

My best bet.

Chicago arms.

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Expect the unexpected

Chicago Arms is another Meriden Firearms Company made brand distributed by Fred Bifflar Company from about 1870 to 1890.

I would say it was a real gun. Over the years I have seen several old guns that were unearthed, and their condition was very similar to what you have there.

Cool thread so far. It will be interesting to see what lies under the corrosion after acetone/transmission fluid soak.

One of my favorite tourist stes in Cody, WY is one that has a display of dug up and found firearms. One was a sharps rifle somebody found leaning up against a tree in the mountains that had likely been there for decades, and another was a revolver found in an arroyo that still had a couple of loaded chambers. The museum displays depicted the weapons behind glass in settings representing how they were found. Really neat.

In the bottom of the handle frame was for the leaf spring. I'll bet it's real.

PS: Don't fire it until you get a gunsmith to check it out.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

Looks to me very much like the .38 or .32 S&W Secret Service Special.
They were not made for the Secret Service to protect the president.
That was just a sexy name chosen by the manufacturer for marketing.
Neither were they made by S&W. The S&W mark on the barrel was
supposedly just to indicate the caliber, but again it didn't hurt the
marketing. Manufacturer was the Meriden Firearms Co, which I believe
was a division of Sears & Roebuck. Some of my information is from an
"I have this old gun ...." article by Jim Supica

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In Omnia Paratus

It's real alright. Looks like the one clean screw is an aftermarket addition. I suspect that the piece is price-less.

I really hope that the TC takes folks advice and gives it a good soaking/cleaning then follows up with some "after" pics, as I'm really interested in seeing what lurks beneath all that rust/corrosion.

This thread reminded me of how once in my youth I found a oddly shaped thing in the creek outside of my family's cottage. It was like a big clump of dirt and leaves that had hardened around something. So I chipped away at it until I discovered that under all of those layers it was a hammer head, rusted from being submerged in water for who knows how long, but still very much intact, preserved by all the mud and leaves that had been caked over it for so long.

I'm curious how well that Revolver might be cleaned up.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

After a month's oil soak (and replacing that screw from Gun Parts AKA Numrich Arms), any remaining problems should buff out. Refinish with touch-up blue.

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Formerly Model520Fan

But can you use plus p

Looks real to me. That should buff right out.

If he removes all of the caked on grime then he'll have a true "BARE" gun.

It’ll buff out!

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213th FBINA

.....have it carbon dated?

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

Save it for a gun buy back.

hit it with a couple coats of Ren Wax using a microfiber cloth and head for the range or...................

..........soak the daylights out of it in ATF/acetone and see what you uncover!

I'd avoid using Flitz, you might scratch it.

Be sure to report back with pics!!!

Great Find!!!

^^^what he said. Somebody years ago ditched a hot piece, IMO.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts on this gun. I believe it to be a real top break and the wisdom here seems to agree.
I may stick it in the parts washer for a couple of months but I don’t think it will change much, it’s just too far gone. I don’t remember just what it looked like when found other than it was very rusty. Obviously corrosion has continued for fifty some years.
The property were it was found had been purchased in 1960 and the gun had likely been buried for many years before that.
I do believe the proximity to the old road played a part in where it was found. Local lore has it that some of Dillinger’s gang cased a state bank in a town about six miles down that road. If I could just make that connection, Gunbroker, here I come!

The last time it broke, the owner gave it a fling.
Now its yours.

I can't do pics, but I looked up forehand wadsworth hammerless, it looks a lot like this, if someone else could look it up and compare.

H&R or Iver Johnson top break in 32 or 38? Probably late 1800’s. The 32 short was very popular back then.

There was many manufacturers of top break revolvers l

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Plant garlic in the fall

A genuine relic. I would not try to take any of that...patina off it. It earned every bit of it.

Even though there were a lot of little topbreaks, the only one I found with that "spur" on the top of the backstrap like the one of the OP was the one I showed.

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Expect the unexpected

It looks like the "shiney" screw is a stainelss screw Bubba installed at some point, the rest of the gun corroded and the SS screw didn't.
Steve W

It's worth a try at least. You'd be surprised at just how well these things can turn out. I've seen some crazy "restoration projects" on YouTube of guns that looked beyond hope.

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Shooting Comfort is bilateral.

Do not try to restore it, it's just fine like it is. I have seen these YouTube videos of restorations, the guns had more interest and appeal before they were restored!

B. Mower

Pretty sure it’s not +P rated.

I bet you could still have some fun with a metal detector around Cold Harbor.