Please share any advice or PM with links to knowledgable sources.

Recently picked up a master swordsmith Japanese sword from the mid 1800s. Thing is basically perfect condition. Have wanted one for a long time and the gent told me to use sewing machine oil.

Any help or further direction is greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance. No pictures until I can ensure that I am properly handling this blade. I am not even pulling it out of the scabbard. Thank you, TH

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I'm not sure what's best to oil it with, but you'll probably have better results if you search using the term "Katana" rather than "Samurai Sword" since that's the sword's proper Japanese name and I presume that the more knowledgeable folks on the subject would refer to it as such.

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Nihonto message board,

But be prepared they are not as kind as the
great members on this forum to those who lack knowledge.




Nihonto Message Board

No pictures!!???

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Possum—The other white meat!

Glad You are asking. Only someone with the proper knowledge should handle the blade other than to view it. Looking is permitted but nothing further. I am a neophyte with these items and proper handling hasn't to My knowledge been translated yet.

Sorry buds on the no pictures, I just want to wait and limit handling until I can properly maintain this thing. Bought from a serious collector who auctions at Sotheby's et cetera. True collector. Even after I paid him and we shook hands, I could tell he didn't want to part with it...he did so kindly, because he knew it was going to a good home. Most of his collection is 1300s-1600s...so you can imagine.

@ lrb, thanks for your post and insight. I was actually in your neck of the woods recently on vacation; mostly, Northbrook and the surrounding area. People were very friendly and not as 'uppity' if you will; and I think the Covid had something to do with that. Went to Ruth's Chris...it was OK. Being a humble man who likes to BBQ, well, I've had better. Service was great, however.

I will contact those folks eventually and ask them to help guide me. Appreciate the 'heads up' but not really needed. I am humble and have thick skin. My interest is in the pursuit of further knowledge; hence, my name on here.

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The most knowledgeable Japanese Sword guy I ever met was Marine Raider Gordon Warner (RIP).
Gordon wrote several books, including one on Japanese Swords.
I recommend that you contact your Seller and ask him about Katana maintenance.

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NRA LIFE MEMBER

While not a vintage one like yours, I have a katana with a 1095 carbon steel blade, so maintenance is a regular thing.

When I first started out, I used this katana maintenance kit:

Japanese Sword Maintenance Kit
– Bugei Samurai Swords

It's the traditional way to clean and maintain a katana. Instructions on how to use it are included. The kit uses a powder that you apply to the blade to remove old oil and moisture, clove oil, and rice paper for wiping it down, as well as a hammer and punch for removing the handle (tsuka). Oh, and like S&W revolvers, there is a proper way to remove the tsuka (may be necessary to check for corrosion or to see if the blade was "signed" by the swordsmith).

However, I will say that I don't think it's really necessary. Nowadays I use a clean cloth to wipe the blade down and periodically apply some oil to it. I'm using Lubriplate, the same lube I use with my guns and knives. Just make sure you wipe it off well before replacing it back in the scabbard (saya).

Oh, and when taking it out and putting it back in the saya, make sure you do it horizontally with the edge facing up and let the spine of the blade (mune) gently slide on the bottom of the saya's interior. This will help prevent damage from the edge (ha) against the saya.

Hope that helps.

Thanks for all the responses so far; it is truly appreciated. Clove oil is what the seller told me or if in a pinch, sewing machine oil.

I contacted the seller and we are meeting tomorrow to further discuss and probably result in me buying something else...

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I have dabbled a bit in Japanese swords, and own one, a wakizashi, or short sword. The advice to seek the counsel of your seller, a serious collector, is the best idea, I think. If he has maintained the sword, had it polished within the last couple of decades, you may well need to do nothing at all other than light maintenance with a cleaning kit every six months or so.

If the blade needs polishing, that's a whole other ball of wax.

My wakizashi was inherited from my father. It was a WWII bring back, and had some rust. It is also mid 19th century. Not made by a famous smith, but a good blade, I was told. I had it polished in Japan for about $1800 25 years ago. This was not particularly expensive, and was considered work suitable for the quality of my blade. A higher quality blade would have gone to a different polisher and cost more.

I question whether true Japanese sword polishers even exist in the US. I recall reading, when I was dabbling, years ago, that to become a sword smith takes ten years of apprenticeship. To become a sword polisher, which is a seperate profession, takes twelve.

I would recommend Renaissance Wax. It was designed for such applications.

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Dick

Hobbyist,
There is at least one person who posts in the Blade Forums sword forum that appears to have a very extensive knowledge of Japanese katanas, wakizashis and tantos. I would suggest that you post your question there. It is my understanding that having a vintage sword repolished is an expensive proposition so you are right in exercising caution.

1chessiefan

I use mineral oil mixed with clove oil on the blades of my swords (5ml of clove oil per 1 liter). I think the clove oil doesn't really do anything except add a pleasant smell but that's a good thing. I use food grade mineral oil on the theory that it wouldn't contain harmful additives. You can buy it at most pharmacies, they sell it for constipation (curing it, not giving it to you). I mix some up and keep it in a plastic baby bottle, the kind with a rubber nipple. Makes a good dispenser, comes out a drop at a time when you squeeze the bottle a little. I use rice paper to spread a thin layer on the blade. Avoid touching the blade with your fingers as the acid from your fingertips can etch into carbon steel over time. I also use pecard leather dressing on the leather parts applied with a piece from a 100% cotton tee shirt. I check each sword once a year and reapply as needed.

Just remember, you never draw it from the saya unless to draw blood before you replace it.

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

Leave it in the scabbard for now....but If you ever disgrace yourself, your family, or any forum members here you will be forced to draw it and you know what you will have to do.

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Thirty characters. Exactly...

I only have one, from the 1800s, which I bought from the guy who brought it back from Okinawa after WW-II. I use Hoppe's gun oil or a silicone gun cloth. Still in excellent condition after about 40 years in my possession. Excellent temper line on the blade edge.
Do not touch the blade with your bare hands. You will find finger prints forming in the steel. I had to remove one.
When you take it out of the scabbard, take a clean cloth and run it down the blade. You will feel the irregularities you cannot see that tell you it is a hand forged blade. Amazing sensation.

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Infected by Smith&Wesson

Japanese choji oil is what you need, it's easy to find online. Most of the "traditional" japanese sword cleaning kits commonly sold use mineral oil, not choji, so don't be fooled into those. Sewing oil would work in a pinch.

DO NOT use renaissance wax or any other kind of paste preservative. Japanese Nihonto are polished in a very specific way and you'll damage the value by using wax. Collectors of Nihonto are a very obsessive bunch and you need to properly maintain it to protect your investment.

Unless you're going to use it for cutting competition, which I don't think you are, you shouldn't need to do much to maintain it. A wipe down every six months to a year should do it, depending on where you live. Too much maintenance is just as bad as too little so don't get obsessive.

Hope this is of interest. Details on the maker, the year, and the approximate location. Ordered some traditional oil and a cleaning kit. Did not have a chance to connect with the gent I bought it from...family obligations today. Have his business card and there is one or two others I am interested in. Heck, whatever the cost, still cheaper than buying guns and bullets these days...

Attached Images

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Sorry for the digression, but Sip, it's great to have you back to your old self, sharing your humor. It has been missed my friend; hope all is well with you and your family wherever this finds you. Kind regards, TH.

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With things like that I like to go back to the source as far as possible.

Check out the Shimada Museum of Arts.

They do have an English version of the website but it only translates a small portion of it. Perhaps it's easier to contact them through facebook messenger;

島田美術館 | Facebook

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Jorge

As luck would have it, one of our friends here--I will not post his name without his OK--is fluent in Japanese. Turns out there are questions, relative to the tag and the story. In his feedback, the signatures are indicative of 1943 and a different maker. I am wondering if the original collector I purchased it from, got two similar swords at the time or had two similar and got the tags mixed up. Once the proper oil has arrived to maintain it, I will inspect the signature (hopefully, there is one). Last I knew, this gent had around a 100+ of these over the years so I can understand even a serious collector like him having a mix up. Will know more soon; thankfully. Best, TH.

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Before someone flames me for not inspecting the signature previously; all I will say is that the person I bought it from does not need the money, has a sterling reputation, and is truly the most knowledgeable expert probably for a many State radius. No one is perfect and I think this may have been an honest mistake or on the upside a potential windfall, although I will disclose to them either way it turns out.

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Just thought of my favorite Sherlock Holmes quotes: It is a capital mistake to theorize in advance of the facts...

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Excellent temper line on the blade edge.
It is called hamon and is usually the result of clay backing the blade but really good smith using very good good high quality high carbon steels wit just the right amount of carbon a few other trace alloys can create them. What your actually seeing is where the very hard martensite structures meets the pearlite structures and properly done looks like rolling clouds. The hard part is the polishing working up through the grits to very high polish without actually smearing the formations which will happen if you used a buffer. I have tried it on 2 knife sized blades a bit of success, but never close to what is possible. It is also hard to photograph.

THIS IS NOT MY BLADE and the guy who did id is really good

I see the initials. Is that by Jim Hrisoulas?

There is the possibility that it's an antique blade that was remounted or reworked, shortened, etc., for wartime service. Those markings may have been added at that time. Antiques weren't always signed and some of the most beautiful ones with dramatic presence aren't.

i believe you are describing the difference between polishing and burnishing, and yeah, the latter is easy to do accidentally, especially on softer steels, or when there is a really big difference in hardness as you cross the hamon.

Nova on PBS actually did a special called Secrets of the Samurai Sword. I liked it so much I bought a copy from them. A shorter version is on youtube. Here's the link:

I was told choji oil is just mineral oil with clove oil added. Not so?

There are a few experts on the Japanese forum over at gunboards.com.

Very good people who will answer your questions and offer advice. Good, detailed pictures will be wanted

No, that blade was made by Jan Halfinec

I have several of Jim Hrisoulas books.

You can also get a similar effect with San Mai. This is where a core of high carbon steel is forge welded between softer steels. hen when the blade is ground and hardened the harder steel will be exposed on the edge and the transition line may wave and pattern because of the forging methods.

Another method is to use a high carbon steel and then only edge quench it. But, this method produces a fairly straight line where the martensite meets the pearlite.

KNIVES just because