i first noticed this when the glock 19x came out. it was originally created for the army's handgun contract


unlike the other entrants, this gun only had a 4 inch barrel. when it came on the civilian market, it was extremely popular. they followed up by releasing the glock 45, essentially a glock 19x optimized for police and civilian applications, also 4 inches, with an mos option and front slide serrations(for those who prefer front slide manipulation with the presence of a red dot above the rear serrations)



later on smith and wesson released their newest generation m&p 2.0 pistols, with the most popular and sought after slide and barrel configurations being 4 inches. front slide serrations were added, again, to give users an option to manipulate the slide with a red dot installed



with the continued proliferation of red dots and advancements in ballistics technology, i believe the 4 inch barrel will become the defacto full size barrel length superseding the previous standard of 5 inches.


in fact, if the trend continues it has, in a decade or so we may have police carrying full size duty guns with a 3 inch barrel.

Much of the LE community already carry guns with 4" barrels. The in term for them is "duty size". I don't think the 5" barrel ever was a standard anyway. Look at the High Power and the CZ 75, their barrels are 4.5" and 4.7", respectively. The Beretta 92 is the only widespread modern LE pistol that comes to mind. A 5" tube must be a royal pain when holstered in a car.

There are plenty of 5" pistols out there, Canik, S&W, Springfield, Walther and even Glock still make 'em.

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Release the Kraken

The full size 1911 going extinct? Surely you jest

Beretta 92 was 4.9" The Centurion and Compact are 4.25" and what the M9 should have been!

Some of us would also argue that the M1911 should have been designed around a 4.25" barrel.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

There was a very sweet CZ Tactical Sport that was talking to me at Palmetto State Armory in Greenville, with a 5.25" barrel.



Sent from my motorola one 5G using Tapatalk

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Slava Ukraini!

This has infected revolvers as well. Six inch guns are rare. Kimber put adjustable sights and a 4" barrel on the K6s and labeled it "Target".

I understand that the market for 6" revolvers is pretty shallow. Which is too damn bad for those of us that like them. In a tactical world target revolvers are as in-demand as buggy whips.

Just when I just bought another. Why didn’t anyone tell me?

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Sure you did

Ohio has 5” minimum for deer legal handgun. I was never a fan of 4” guns
for anything except anti personnel weapons. I have several 6” S&W , K & N frames. I always thought that N frame with 5” tapered barrel, like the run of 27s they made years ago was the best field gun variation.

Today’s gun owner has a real problem with size and weight. When a Rossi 931 is considered a too much gun to try and carry by a firearm instructor, that’s an indication of where we are at. I expect to see more advancements in smaller semi autos with a potential new small caliber yet to be designed.

Three summers ago I bought a Like New Model 10-7 with a 6" barrel. I bought it 5 minutes after it was traded in! I paid $25+tax more than the trade in value because They didn't want that antique stinking up the shop! It took about 6 months to get to the range; with my handloads some of the best DA shooting I have ever done!

Aside from 1911's, I can't remember owning a 5" anything. Even the Full Auto MAC-10 had a 6" barrel!

Ivan

If you don’t mind the weight and price of magazines jump on it. My son has a TSO which is phenomenal.

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Todays main civilian market is for concealed carry where smaller is better, at least for carry. In law enforcement circles, it's the age of the mini-cop. With the lowering of entrance standards to increase female recruitment you now have a much larger percentage of smaller stature cops. There is a big difference in practicality for a 6'+ man with a 5 or 6" duty weapon and a 5'4" cop.

I carried 5 and 6" guns most of my career without difficulty, although I did carry 4" revolvers a bit too. I never worked for an agency that required a specific gun, well when I did I was grandfathered in. However, as happy as I was with a 6" duty gun at my then 6'1" I generally feel smaller is better for concealed carry in my retirement here in steamy S. FL. In my normal jeans and aloha, Cuban, or T, a full size duty gun just isn't practical.

Point being, law enforcement and the military will want handguns that best fit the average user, which has gotten a good deal smaller.

If I was looking for a uniformed duty carry gun again I think I'd want a 5" semi or a 6" revolver. I never had any issues carrying a longer tube. It's a holster choice. I've always carried a higher ride holster, mainly for retention in physical confrontations. The longer tubes do tend to be harder on vehicle seats but well, they weren't my seats and the whole car was pretty much worn out by the time the seat was getting trashed.

But yeah, the longer barrels are far less popular now I guess. Although for range play I'd still prefer the full size gun except with the ammo situation I need for what shooting I do to be with what I carry. Were I to "open carry" a scenario I don't envision, I'd consider a full size gun again.

Years ago I saw a dash cam video of an officer trying to clear leather with a 6" revolver. The perp stuffed his draw and beat him up while three other guys piled out to subdue the officer. Sadly, the officer was killed with his own gun. I think he might have prevailed with a 4". Handguns are for close combat and to shoot your way to a rifle imho.

The American fondness for the 5" M1911 wanes for many reasons and the same can be said for the M92. Yes, there are still companies making 5" pistols but, again, American's fondness for full sized service pistols wanes for many reasons, the most obvious being that for the average gun buyer today concealment is the priority.

I like my M92 Beretta but it's hidden in a secret place in my house for home defense. Carrying it is out of the question - I have short barreled pistols and revolvers for that purpose. Again, sure, there are some folks who will carry full sized service pistols but for the highest percentage of 21st century "gun carriers" smaller is not only better it is mandatory.

For long range shooting, sure, longer barrels are the best choice, but with a little effort and training most folks can hit a man-sized target at 45 feet with a short barreled pistol and gun fights at 75 feet are for warriors on the battlefield and maybe cartel battles.

Personally, I don't see why anyone chooses a single action pistol of any kind over a TDA pistol or a striker fired pistol and claiming that the same trigger pull every time is better doesn't quite stand up to the fact that that is how striker fired pistols operate.

YMMV

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Come and take it!!

I have a 5" S&W 544 in 44-40. It's the best 'natural shooter' I own (revolver or auto). I do have to say my M&P Shield 2.0 in 45 is a close second, but that's grip design.

That's sort of taken care of itself, now. You can get them from 2-1/2 to 6", but not always in .45 Auto.

Not sure I'd want one of the baby 1911's in .45, though.

Sheesh! Your point?
I did not talk exclusively of revolvers and spoke of longer (and shorter) tubes in general. Included in my non-revolver personal history of which I spoke were the 659, 669, 645, 4506, Glock 21 and Kimber 1911. I have plenty of experience carrying both revolvers and semis in multiple barrel lengths. Do you feel better now.

Pistols are getting smaller, and worldwide fertility rates are falling. Tell me THAT'S not a correlation!!!

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Pisgah

I carried a Beretta 92F and then a 92D for 15 years as a cop. The length never was an issue for me.

Are you referring to the killing of Constable Darrell Lunsford?

Pistols are just going back to their original popular barrel length of 100~120mm (4~4.5 inches). Georg Luger was correct all along. ��

As red dot sights become more accepted, I could see duty guns going smaller, or shorter, as the sight radius is no longer needed to pass a qualification.

Read a few of his posts oink, he's not quite figured out the culture here yet in his short stay. Hopefully he'll tone it down and bit.

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Live long and prosper

A local pd has an academy going on right now and one of my preferred shops has had a revolving door of cadets coming in to buy/order 4" or 4.25" M&Ps and red dots, hmm.

I probably carry my Shield Plus more than any other as the weather warms but I love my 5" and 4.25" 1911s as much as my 5" M&P. During cooler/colder weather it's one of the 1911s.

Of all the handguns I own, I would say the most natural pointer is the 4.25" Colt Commander.

Revolver wise it's probably the 4" 681/686.

Don't get me wrong, I own full size 1911's and 6" and 8-3/8" S&W wheelguns.

But for a natural shooter, the 4 to 4.25" works for me.

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BTDT, Got The T-Shirt

I would agree with on the Commander and 4 inch 686, and I'd add a Glock 23.

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- Change it back -

As for a semi auto, I would never get away from this Bul Armory 1911 Government (5")
It's far and away the best outta the box shooter Ive ever had or shot. It shoots like a $3k gun.
This is the 2nd magazine ever thru it from 7 yards, 8 rounds of 230 gr fmj on hind legs
http://
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i believe we might be seeing 3.5 inches as the standard soon. faster draw, faster pointing and transitioning, better balance, etc. i noticed the 5 inch guns felt ever so slightly like they were dipping forward when gripped, especially during firing when the heavier slide would dip forward. with sub 4 inch guns, it feels like the center of mass is closer to the hand and feels much more controllable and grippy. not like it was dipping forward out of my grip.


here is my rendition of a 3.5-3 inch inch full size service gun:

Don’t tell Jimmy Caan.

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Thirty characters. Exactly...

"Thief", one of Michael Mann's early, and best, movies imo.

But the continuity is a little screwy in that ending scene. He has a 5", then a 6" Longslide, then a 5" again. I think they couldn't get the Longslide to work reliably with blanks during the shootout.

Still a good movie.

I feel like such a dinosaur.

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Titling this thread "5 inch full size pistols are going extinct" is extremely problematic.
It casts a wide net that implies all pistol types for all purposes.

Perhaps "5 inch plastic cop guns are going extinct" would be a better choice?
Otherwise, you're inviting responses that you probably won't like (this one included!).

There are many reasons to own, carry and/or shoot pistols.
To name just a few there's competitive shooting, hunting, outdoorsman utility, urban self-defense, handloading experimentation, or even just fun.
And, there are tastes that can be generational.
A lot of us have vast shooting experience that goes well before the development of every single gun mentioned in the OP!

Quite obviously there are a lot of other folks who fall into the "Shoot the Bad Guy Target at 7 yds" crowd.
OK, I get it. Good for you.

But, don't kid yourself that you speak for everyone.

In G. Gordon Liddy’s book of his life, he tells of his tenure in the FBI. Early in his career he was issued a .38 but was loaned a 5” Model 27 but a senior agent who didn’t feel the .38 was “gun enough”.
Liddy found the 5” barrel was indeed too long for comfortable wear in a vehicle and if I recall correctly his wife gave him a 3 1/2” Model 27 for Christmas that year.

NJSP carried the HK P7 for several years. I always thought it looked silly with a big grip and a short barrel. And yes, I own a P7M8 and an M13...so I guess I'm silly too. But I do like my 8 3/8" Smith's.

Anyone who has spent a 12 hour shift sitting in a police car wearing a full duty belt knows why anything over 4" has gone away as a work gun. I can say that in 40 years of working in LE in the north east, I have never come across anyone carrying a duty gun over 4". The military move away from longer handgun barrels is more about changing the carry mode. Most combat kit now uses a chest carry instead of the traditional waist belt carry to accommodate handgun access in vehicles. In that mode, the shorter barrel is a little easier to work with.

In recent years, in uniform, I always had a semi with a light. Big and bulky regardless of length. No comfortable way to carry in a vehicle, high ride, low ride or thigh holster. Guess I need to scroll to the top and see what the original post was about! Anyway, I just got a commander sized 1911 in 9 mm and I have to say it's pretty sweet. First "mini" 1911 I've owned.

Handguns were designed to be portable, easy to wield firepower. Ir is their only advantage over rifles. Shorter is more portable and easier to deploy. The advantage of a 5" barrel over a 4" or even a 3 1/2" in actual handgun combat ranges is smaller than the portability and deploy ability of the shorter guns.

Buyers prove their desire for shorter guns on a regular basis by the prices they will pay. Go to any gun auction board. I do not care if it is revolvers or semis, the shorter guns always get higher prices than longer ones. Even in 1911 they sell way more shorter guns than 5 inchers. I have 1 1911 clone and it is an alloy 4.25. Why would I want more weight and another 3/4" of slide and barrel when I can put a big bullet on a silhouette at 50 yds all day long with the lighter shorter easier to carry gun?

Look, I have seen you make remarks similar to this one and the "this is not a revolver thread" one several times. When you are the one who pushes the button first don't be surprised or offended when it gets pushed back. Some of us have some tough edges and can be every bit as blunt. You are not exactly silky smooth yourself. Live with it.

Just because pistol is in the title doesn't mean revolvers are excluded. In fact revolvers were called pistols a long time before a semi auto ever existed.

Edit* my mistake. All good.

That was a great way to put it without getting dinged.

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Sure you did

I spent many shifts sitting in patrol cars wearing longer tubes. 686 6", 645 5", 4506 5", 629 6" and 1911 5". There's also the Glock 21 but I think that's only 4.6".

But then I never worked in the North East.

Don't get me wrong, I'm also very fond of the 686 4" and 66 4" and carried both at times as well as a 669 and a 659. I've never been loyal. The gun I carried the longest time was the 629 6". I've always been partial to the 19/66 but I think the 4" 686 is/was an absolutely fantastic duty gun. The 6" would have been better without the underlug. I never actually carried one but I always figured the 5" revolver was the perfect duty length. Unlike with the 686 for a semi auto the 4", especially in plastic, is just too short for proper pistol whipping. (Don't panic, just kidding)

"5 inch full size pistols are going extinct"

This type of weapon is NEVER going extinct!

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Made my dog proud

The really short pistols seem top heavy in a belt holster. Most of my time in uniform an M7 holster was the answer, and that is sort of a cross between a true shoulder holster and a chest carry.

In those days I never saw a police cruiser as much of an obstacle.

Tank vs car HIGH SPEED - YouTube

Somehow missed this thread the first time around.

I have no experience with LEO carry, therefore almost no knowledge thereof.

I have a fair amount of experience with non-LEO concealed carry. My handle hints at my acceptance of rather short-barreled pistols with revolving chamber clusters, I also have quite a bit of experience at carrying a Colt Government Model in a Milt Sparks Summer Special. It is more comfortable than and just as concealable as a Colt Commander, for me. Just to make things perfectly clear, my LW Commander is probably slightly MORE accurate than my stainless Government, but the LONGER gun carries more comfortably. I even know why, but what difference does it make? It is true for me, and may not be for you.

So I sit here at my keyboard, having chosen a 2" revolver for OWB with no concern that I might have compromised accuracy, and with long experience that a 5" steel slabside does not compromise IWB comfort or concealment. I do not feel that my experience qualifies me to tell others what they should carry.

Likewise the reverse.

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Formerly Model520Fan

You obviously have not seen inside my safes.

I always wanted a 5" M27 and I love the standard 5" military issue 1911 and I don't own any handguns with a longer barrel. For carry I like a Sig 365 and If I want something bigger I like my Sig 365 XL with Holosun optic but for shooting, I always thought the 5" was about the perfect length.

My BIL became an NJSP trooper in the late 80's. I always told him his HK P7 looked silly because of the small footprint. Big guys (back then) all spit shined and fancy with a little pea shooter on their belt. I now own two and love them, but they are too valuable to carry. A Glock 17 (or 22) with a light is a beast to wear all the time and it's only 4.5"

Some of us still use the term pistol to include revolvers, semi-autos and single shots.

They call that one a Commander.

Rosewood