Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > >


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-22-2009, 02:25 PM
3rd Gen Neal's Avatar
3rd Gen Neal 3rd Gen Neal is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 406
Likes: 0
Liked 9 Times in 3 Posts
Default Unmarked vehicle sirens

Was hoping the LEO's in the forum could tell me how unmarked police/FBI cars go about displaying emergency lights when they need to. I'm sure the audio is easy, under the hood or something, but what about the light? I watched a movie yesterday and a few times it showed the undercover agents throw the big round light up on the roof like the old Kojak episodes. Surely this isn't how it's done, or is it?? Just really curious. Thanks, happy Sunday.
__________________
Let go...Let Gun
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-22-2009, 02:50 PM
sigp220.45's Avatar
sigp220.45 sigp220.45 is offline
US Veteran
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 3,095
Likes: 5,191
Liked 5,011 Times in 915 Posts
Default

My FBI Suburban has wig-wags in the headlights, a siren under the hood somewhere, a red/blue LED thing on the passenger side visor that flips down, and another LED thing in the back window. The back window thing is great for tailgaters.

I rarely use them anymore, though. I've learned that whoever is dead will still be dead when I get there. Most people don't notice the light or hear the siren until you're right behind them, then they slam on the brakes. If I need to get somewhere fast I just drive fast, yield at red lights, and turn on all the reds and blues once I get there since everybody else does.

I don't make traffic stops in my unmarked rig. If it becomes necessary to make a felony stop I call for a marked unit. I tell my wife and kids not to stop for unmarked vehicles (though they should yield to them) and call 911 if an unmarked car is trying to stop them.

I haven't seen anyone use a Kojak light in years. I hated them, since they plug into the cigarette lighter and if you put it on the driver's side the cord is right in your face or across the wheel. You can stick them on the dash, but unless you have metal plate there for them to stick to they slide all over the place.
__________________
Just don't lead 'em as much.

Last edited by sigp220.45; 11-22-2009 at 02:56 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-22-2009, 05:33 PM
MKT's Avatar
MKT MKT is offline
SWCA Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Temecula, CA
Posts: 1,236
Likes: 7
Liked 73 Times in 50 Posts
Default

My unmarked Tahoe was set up pretty much like Sig220's Suburban. Wig wags and a full stealth red/blue light package with strobes and led ambers to the rear (again, great for tailgaters). The stealth lights up front were concealed in the grille and even inside the headlights. Stops using an unmarked ride are frowned upon and should only be in an exigent circumstance, let the marked unit make the stop.

As of last Sunday, I'm back in a marked unit. I starting to miss being just another car on the road, you see so much more in a plain ride.
__________________
Non illegitimae carborundum
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-22-2009, 05:50 PM
RogueJSK's Avatar
RogueJSK RogueJSK is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Northwest Arkansas
Posts: 262
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Default

Low profile LEDs on the sun visors or mounted behind the front and back windshields seems to be the most common around here. I've also seen lights mounted behind the front grill.

There was only one car in our fleet that I can recall that still had the old-style dome light, and that was the very old unmarked CVPI that was used by one of our bailiffs. It was retired and auctioned off a year or so back.

Last edited by RogueJSK; 11-22-2009 at 05:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-22-2009, 05:51 PM
Old Corp's Avatar
Old Corp Old Corp is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Coastal NC
Posts: 1,589
Likes: 530
Liked 1,560 Times in 599 Posts
Default

I date back to some of the dash 'fireballs', noisy rotating incandescents. At one time my dept. required they be placed on the roof for a run, or a stop. That is until they saw what the steel-bracketed magnets did to the paint on the roof. Today's LED's mounted on the passenger-side flip-down visor are many times better, and the unobtrusive ones on the back deck are a huge improvement on visibility and safety.
__________________
Ret'd LEO
SWCA #2275
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-22-2009, 06:54 PM
Firehouse Firehouse is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,214
Likes: 2
Liked 39 Times in 18 Posts
Default

In today's litigious society, a single teardrop light thrown up on the roof or slapped on the dash won't cut it in emergency responses. In the event of an accident you can guarantee a lawsuit. Even with a fully marked vehicle tricked out with the latest and greatest in LED's and state of the art siren systems can expect a heap of trouble if you strike another vehicle or hit a pedestrian in an emergency response. Ambulance drivers and other emergency vehicle operators have gone to prison after accidents when a private citizen was struck and killed. Police vehicles, ambulances and fire trucks are requesting the right of way in an emergency response, although other drivers are expected to yield and grant the right of way, the emergency vehicle operator bares the ultimate responsibility to maintain safe operation and control of his vehicle. The only vehicle that has the true right of way without having to yield for other traffic or request the right of way is your friendly neighborhood US postal worker.

Ultimately, proper markings and vehicle lighting for your agency fall back to the responsibility of state and local laws or statutes.

Also, this is a statement for volunteer firefighters, using your private vehicle to respond to emergencies and especially while using a dash light is asking for it. Have an accident and see if your insurance company doesn't bale on you leaving you holding the bag for any damages, legal fees, and medical fees incurred as a result. A foolish move if you don't do your homework.

Also, it's a good idea to have blanket coverage on your personal car insurance to cover you in the event of an accident while operating emergency vehicles in case your agencies insurance leaves you in the cold. Just a thought.

Last edited by Firehouse; 11-22-2009 at 07:03 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-22-2009, 07:09 PM
TheGreatGonzo TheGreatGonzo is offline
US Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 395
Likes: 6
Liked 63 Times in 32 Posts
Default

I drive an unmarked SUV and, per my agency policy, in addition to the audible siren, it has:

2 sets of red/blue LED's under the grill;
1 set of red/blue LED's mounted in the front windshiled over the mirror;
1 set of red/blue LED's mounted in each side windown of the cargo area;
1 stick of 4 red/blue LED's across the top of the rear cargo window;
Wig-Wags;
Corner strobes in the front and rear running lights;

And cars still ignore when I run code. I am very, very, very, very cautious when operating in emergency mode.
Gonzo
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-22-2009, 07:42 PM
BarbC's Avatar
BarbC BarbC is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Central FL
Posts: 3,843
Likes: 468
Liked 470 Times in 162 Posts
Default

The ones that pulled me over in DE and MD have them hidden in the grille. I can spot them now.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-22-2009, 08:18 PM
ohiobuckeye ohiobuckeye is offline
SWCA Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Southern OH USA
Posts: 879
Likes: 44
Liked 58 Times in 40 Posts
Default

Unmarked vehicles being illegal to make traffic stops is one of the few good things about Ohio traffic laws. Having an entire state "police" force whose primary function is writing traffic tickets is bad enough.
My wife has instructions to never stop for anyone in an unmarked vehicle and to keep moving until she finds a marked vehicle or a police station. Fortunately (or unfortunately..depending on your point of view) one rarely has to drive very far on Ohio's highways to find one of our uniformed professional ticket writers.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-23-2009, 01:48 AM
Jellybean Jellybean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,556
Likes: 2
Liked 193 Times in 152 Posts
Default

Quote:
Unmarked vehicles being illegal to make traffic stops...Ohio traffic laws.
I don't remember what I did with my O.R.C. handbook, but I don't think that is accurate.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 11-23-2009, 02:34 AM
nicky4968's Avatar
nicky4968 nicky4968 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Littleton, Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,169
Likes: 858
Liked 321 Times in 169 Posts
Default

Well, back in Colorado (I'm on the road again), I get a kick out of young police officers on "crotch rockets", probably confiscated from some druggie, tooling along at 75 in the 75. A lot of people go by them at 90/100 and are surprised as heck when that little dynamo lights up like a Christmas tree.
When I was young and foolish, I used to race flat track bikes. Even at my best, I don't think I would use something that light to go that fast on the highway.
__________________
and what his trumpet saith
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 11-23-2009, 08:03 AM
ect1222t ect1222t is offline
US Veteran
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Montana
Posts: 414
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Default Lights

I remember as a kid my dad's old cars had the blue lights in the grille of his '50 Chevy, and his '56 Plymouth had the plate on the dash for the magnetic mounted rotating blue tear drop with the little vinyl cover to prevent the driver from being blinded by the light. Chicago Police have blue lights. -Ed.
__________________
Shoot the CPU, not the monitor
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 11-23-2009, 11:09 AM
truckemup97's Avatar
truckemup97 truckemup97 is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Indian Territory
Posts: 3,327
Likes: 1,762
Liked 540 Times in 254 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybean View Post
I don't remember what I did with my O.R.C. handbook, but I don't think that is accurate.
I certainly don't claim to be an expert on Ohio laws, but that's common knowledge amongst truckers. Ohio can't use unmarked cars for traffic enforcement. They also can't hide in the dark with their lights off. As I said, I'm no expert, but that's been my experience over the last 15 years.
__________________
Insert short witty words here
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 11-23-2009, 11:34 AM
ohiobuckeye ohiobuckeye is offline
SWCA Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Southern OH USA
Posts: 879
Likes: 44
Liked 58 Times in 40 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybean View Post
I don't remember what I did with my O.R.C. handbook, but I don't think that is accurate.

Keep looking...It is correct.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 11-23-2009, 12:01 PM
Jellybean Jellybean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,556
Likes: 2
Liked 193 Times in 152 Posts
Default

truckmeup97 is correct, Ohio can't use unmarked cars for traffic enforcement. But the way it's worded is they can't be assigned to, or intended for, traffic enforcement. If an officer in an unmarked unit sees a traffic violation he can do a traffic stop just like one in a marked unit. He obviously won't be using radar or laser, but he can still stop you for speeding.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 11-23-2009, 12:22 PM
Jellybean Jellybean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,556
Likes: 2
Liked 193 Times in 152 Posts
Default

Here it is, found it online.

Lawriter - ORC - 4549.13 Marking and equipment for motor vehicle used by traffic enforcement officers.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 11-23-2009, 02:10 PM
3rd Gen Neal's Avatar
3rd Gen Neal 3rd Gen Neal is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 406
Likes: 0
Liked 9 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Thanks for all of the replies guys and gals, I'm not surprised LED's are the king. Many interesting points and I bet there are some extremely humorous tales involving the old school Kojak magnet lights. Thanks again.
__________________
Let go...Let Gun
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 11-23-2009, 09:58 PM
ohiobuckeye ohiobuckeye is offline
SWCA Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Southern OH USA
Posts: 879
Likes: 44
Liked 58 Times in 40 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybean View Post
......If an officer in an unmarked unit sees a traffic violation he can do a traffic stop just like one in a marked unit. He obviously won't be using radar or laser, but he can still stop you for speeding.
Only if you volunteer to stop. There's no penalty for ignoring the unmarked car and all he can do is call for a marked car to make a legitimate stop.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-23-2009, 11:13 PM
EdnAZ EdnAZ is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Jawja (for now).
Posts: 149
Likes: 202
Liked 76 Times in 35 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ohiobuckeye View Post
Only if you volunteer to stop. There's no penalty for ignoring the unmarked car and all he can do is call for a marked car to make a legitimate stop.
Right but what you want to remember there is that the guy in the unmarked (in states that don't use UMs) probably has to call the guy in the marked for the ticket book.....if he's already there to make the stop....press hard four copies.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-24-2009, 01:13 AM
Jellybean Jellybean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,556
Likes: 2
Liked 193 Times in 152 Posts
Default

Quote:
Only if you volunteer to stop. There's no penalty for ignoring the unmarked car and all he can do is call for a marked car to make a legitimate stop.
A "legitimate stop"???

Lawriter - ORC - 2921.331 Failure to comply with order or signal of police officer.

Last edited by Jellybean; 11-24-2009 at 01:17 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 11-24-2009, 05:59 AM
S-W4EVER S-W4EVER is offline
US Veteran
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 232
Likes: 3
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigp220.45 View Post
I rarely use them anymore, though. I've learned that whoever is dead will still be dead when I get there. Most people don't notice the light or hear the siren until you're right behind them, then they slam on the brakes. If I need to get somewhere fast I just drive fast, yield at red lights, and turn on all the reds and blues once I get there since everybody else does.
I'm at this point in my career too. There are very few legitimate emergencies in my beat, so a minute or two either way isn't going to make much difference.

As for lighting, I had a medium titanium-colored CVPI (w/ door markings only) in my previous department with an LED red/blue light in front of the rear view mirror, wig wags, and an arrow stick in the back window. That was the best setup I ever had.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 11-24-2009, 11:13 AM
truckemup97's Avatar
truckemup97 truckemup97 is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Indian Territory
Posts: 3,327
Likes: 1,762
Liked 540 Times in 254 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybean View Post
Yes, a legitimate stop. I think it could successfully be argued (in court, not on the side of the road) that an unmarked car with LEDs in the grill does not identify one as a police officer. I drive a truck, and frequently haul military cargo and high value electronics. Hijackings are on the rise. Before I pull over for an unmarked (read: unidentified) car, I will call 911 on my cell phone and verify that the unmarked car is actually a policeman. I would also recommend to all my friends/relatives of the fairer sex that they do the same. I'd rather face the officer in court than my wife face the funeral director.
__________________
Insert short witty words here
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-24-2009, 01:52 PM
ohiobuckeye ohiobuckeye is offline
SWCA Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Southern OH USA
Posts: 879
Likes: 44
Liked 58 Times in 40 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by truckemup97 View Post
Yes, a legitimate stop. I think it could successfully be argued (in court, not on the side of the road) that an unmarked car with LEDs in the grill does not identify one as a police officer. I drive a truck, and frequently haul military cargo and high value electronics. Hijackings are on the rise. Before I pull over for an unmarked (read: unidentified) car, I will call 911 on my cell phone and verify that the unmarked car is actually a policeman. I would also recommend to all my friends/relatives of the fairer sex that they do the same. I'd rather face the officer in court than my wife face the funeral director.
Ditto...The sheriff who explained it to me some years ago, made it clear that Ohio law forbids the use of unmarked cars for stopping anyone on Ohio highways. I did not see anything in the earlier ORC posting that made exceptions for a cop in an unmarked car who decided to do otherwise. Failure to obey a police order only applies when the officer is readily identified as a police officer and thats not very easy to do in a plain unmarked car at 70 miles an hour, and waving a tin badge just don't get it done in the middle of a dark night.
As I recall, this law was passed in Ohio, and several other states, back in the late 40s, maybe early 50s, as a result of a serial killer who used a red light on his car to stop his victims...I believe the name was Carryl Chessman and his primary hunting ground was in California. He drew much national attention as "The Red Light Killer" and there was a book written about him. I may have the name spelled wrong and off a tad on the dates, but you get the idea.
That said, should one be pounced upon by an unmarked car while driving along the highway, the circumstances of what you're doing, the time of day, your surroundings, and a little common sense is in order. A flagrant violation on your part in the middle of a busy city block with dozens of witnesses, is a far cry from someone trying to stop you on a deserted country road at 2:00am when you have done nothing wrong. Again...common sense....Nobody is advocating that legitimate easily recognizable police orders be ignored.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-24-2009, 02:04 PM
Jellybean Jellybean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,556
Likes: 2
Liked 193 Times in 152 Posts
Default

truckmeup, again I agree with you 100%, well 98% with the first sentence being the exception.

Of course since there are no "legitimate" defenses listed in the ORC, your success in court would be detemined by how well you can convince the judge of why you did what you did and the individual judge hearing the case. In fact, this can apply to marked police cars too, based on past incidents. If you are in a remote area and don't feel comfortable stopping there is no reason you should put yourself in peril. But your circumstances and actions had better fit together with your excuses.

3rd Gen Neal, I'm sorry for hijacking your thread, I'm done.

In regards to your OP, I hardly ever used my siren, in any vehicle. It was a clue to the bad guys that it was time to go. If responding to an accident I was taught that it made injured victims relax because they knew help was coming, and that would make them bleed faster. The blood vessels would constrict if they were scared and hurting causing the blood flow to decrease.

I would use lights if needed, which wasn't very often. The last unmarked car I used had wig-wag head and tail lights, plus an LED mounted on the visor. The first one had a magnetic gumball, which if I hit a hard bump on the road would fall off and smack me in the head as the coiled cord was pulling it in. I did have one that was mounted on the dash, but it didn't have the cover to keep it from blinding me, so it didn't last long.

Last edited by Jellybean; 11-24-2009 at 02:09 PM. Reason: Never mind the edit, I said I was done.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 11-24-2009, 04:11 PM
Lt JL Lt JL is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,103
Likes: 1,591
Liked 954 Times in 398 Posts
Default

I have an unmarked 06 Impala that lights up like the Mother Ship in Close Encounters. Wigwags, strobes on all 4 corners, back, side and front led bars, and a three tone siren with airhorn to wake the dead. I check it all once a week in the garage. I will turn on the lights if stopped on a roadside so I don't get smoked. That's about it. John
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 11-24-2009, 11:12 PM
EdnAZ EdnAZ is offline
Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Jawja (for now).
Posts: 149
Likes: 202
Liked 76 Times in 35 Posts
Default

That reminded me to answer the origional question. We used to have the junky strobe visor lights that noone could see except the guys in the car with them (and they were blinded).

Now we have led lights built into the interior visor that are covered with a small tint strip so you can't see them from the outside. Those suckers put out so much light that if I was behind you wouldn't know that the car didn't have an external lightbar. The real nice thing about them is that they have flashback guards so I'm not blinded and they don't roll across the dash like the kojak lights.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 11-25-2009, 02:22 AM
MKT's Avatar
MKT MKT is offline
SWCA Member
Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens Unmarked vehicle sirens  
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Temecula, CA
Posts: 1,236
Likes: 7
Liked 73 Times in 50 Posts
Default

My unmarked Tahoe that I had before going back to a marked unit had a new style controller. Instead of the standard Whelen controller it had all of the light and siren controls on a separate mike style controller. I never quite got accustomed to that controller since it wasn't, or at least didn't seem too user friendly. The power switch was hidden on the side and there is no visual cue to let you know it is on during daylight hours.

Anyone else have one of these new controllers?
__________________
Non illegitimae carborundum
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 11-25-2009, 08:55 AM
The Big D The Big D is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 2,471
Likes: 507
Liked 817 Times in 374 Posts
Default

Think I've noted this before but drove a series of low profile LEO vehicles in my career. Now that I think about it, some were waaaaaaaaay low. Included among them were a F-150 Ford pickup truck, a BMW 325, a Honda Civic, a Lincoln Town Car, and my favorite, a Lexus SC400. ALL were properly equipped with lights, siren, and concealed radio(s.)

None were intended for traffic enforcement but circumstances sometimes required me to effect a stop...traffic related and otherwise. There was never a doubt they were LEO vehicles once emergency equipment was activated. Never did anyone fail to stop, either, though I was cognizant and understanding that some may not. Yes, whenever it was possible, I requested a marked unit(s) to assist. Sometimes that wasn't possible.

Most common reaction after a stop? "I didn't know you were the police." My reply: "That's the point."

As an aside, I was involved in a DWI "pursuit" and apprehension a month or so ago. Was in my vehicle that is pictured in the "Car Pictures" thread. The real police were a bit impressed...or so they said.

Be safe.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
concealed, military, sig arms, titanium

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Get A Way vehicle was.... oldman45 The Lounge 18 11-02-2011 05:49 AM
TWELVE REVOLVER unmarked 24-4 4306 S&W Revolvers: 1980 to the Present 3 09-19-2011 08:49 PM
Model 29 Mountain Gun (unmarked barrel) Bodyguard S&W Revolvers: 1980 to the Present 4 02-23-2010 11:35 PM
looking for a gun safe to keep in my vehicle.. nh40ve Concealed Carry & Self Defense 4 03-02-2009 06:51 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:18 PM.


S-W Forum, LLC 2000-2015
Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)