Anybody remember this: S&W MK V (i.e Mark 5) Mace Gun?

I carried one in the '70's.

One of our younger officers asked what duty gear I had in "the OLD days" (Darn smart-mouthed whippersnapper, ). I mentioned the Mark V and he wondered what it looked like. I haven't found a picture of one on the net. Anybody have a pic?

For those of you that still don't know what I'm talking about, S&W used to offer a Mace dispenser (Mace is a chemical eye/nose irritant, pre-OC - Geez, I gotta 'splain every thing). The mace canister fit into a plastic body that had a pistol grip, trigger and front sight. I recall it also had a thumb safety. Align the sight, disengage safety, pull trigger - just like a pistol, except you got a stream of Mace in the face istead of a bullet.

Luckily, I still have available (for "Show and Tell") a full leather duty belt and gear - a set of dump pouches, a set of speedloaders with double pouch, Jordan holster (plus a seperate break-front holster - Bianchi "The Judge"), the M19 to fill the holster(s), open topped cuff case with shinny nickle-plated handcuffs (linked by chain of course), baton ring with a "straight stick" nylon baton, and Kel Light ring (don't have the Kel Light anymore, but a D-cell Mag Light fits), or I'd have to find more pics. (What, no radio holder? Our "hand held" radios were too big for a holder worn on the belt!)

I had to show him pics of a flat sap and sap gloves I don't have either of these anymore.

Next week I'm going to try and find my thumb-cuffs. He could get a kick out of those.

Thanks,

Still have my both of my flat saps and thumb cuffs. I tried the sap gloves but never felt good wearing them and my shooting suffered a lot with them on. My flat saps were given to me by an old timer as a reward for proving myself in the field. Sadly he is no longer with us but still lives on in fond memorys. He was a heck of a FTO before the were called FTO's.

I usually only wore my sap gloves at "pay as you play dances" at one of the local bars; normally attended only by "happy" loggers, migrant workers, farmers, and "off the reservation" locals. Never tried to shoot anything while wearing them.

Do you have the lead-in-the-palm gloves, or lead-across-the-knuckles type? I always figured across-the-knuckles would be easier to shoot with, but I liked the in-the-palm type - made a nice sound when you woke someone up (or put them to sleep) with a "love" slap.

Peace, (I'm much more peaceful now, than then)

P.S. I miss my old pre-FTO Senior Deputy also - many of them were amazing men, LEOs, and trainers.

Necropost but: I do not have a pic - no digital camera - but I still do have the S&W Mace MK-V canister holder and 2 holsters - 1 plain black and the other BBW. My refill is long gone, but to my knowledge, refills are still available from other mace and pepper spray manufacturers, as many small PD's still use them or have them in inventory. At least last I checked.

Wow! After all this time, someone not only remembers them, but has one!

My department issued them in the mid-70s. I remember the mace worked 100% on cops and usually not so well on the drunks. Our refills had a warning printed on the side "not for use on disturbed or angry persons or individuals under the influence of alcohol or narcotics" or something like that. I guess you were only supposed to spray calm sober people.

After a lot of bad experiences with mace we abandoned the Mark Vs and went back to using nightsticks, saps, and sap gloves. My sergeant at the time had a newfangled plastic nightstick with a steel ball set in the handle end for extra striking power in a jab. I remember my lieutenant telling me to "hit em' on the head with the flat part of the sap as the edge would cut em' up too bad". He said the edge was good for breaking the collar bone if you had to.

When I went to the state academy in 1978 they taught the Lamb Baton Method. The lamb technique was to aim for and destroy the knee joint with a hard single hand strike to the side of the knee joint. It pretty much guaranteed bringing down even the largest bad guy. For some reason they don't teach this any more. Ah, the good old days.

They were the lead-across-the-knuckles type. Anybody remember the Bianchi Aluminum batons? I never thought they were heavy enough to be effective. Switched to a PR24 baton and liked it much better.

Like this? From 1969 IACP Chemical Weapons Manual by Crockett.




I had a Safariland aluminum baton. Loaned it out and never got it back.

I just joined this forum. Yes, I had one bought it in the mid 70's, along with a pair of S $ W aluminum handcuffs. I still got the cuffs, don't know about the device.

Thanks to Hummveecop, I now own his S&W MK V Mace Gun with two holsters (plain blank leather, and a basketweave).

I'll post pics soon.

Glad to see other "seasoned" folks here that have used the Mark V, saps, etc... on duty.

Arthur Lamb, Boston Police Dept. Yes he came to the Barnstable Police Dept. Hyannis, MA, to do a one day seminar on his method. He was here on June 12,1976. I was one of the attendies at that class. I also had him autograph his booklet, "The Lamb Method" . I may still have the club and holder. The Barnstable Police never issued his equipment. I bought one myself, but never carried it, because the Dept did not authorized it.

Maybe one of you LEO types can explain the nightsticks/batons with a handle sticking out sideways. Does it have a purpose other then banging into car doors and other things?

They're called side handle batons. The most common one is the PR 24 by Monadnock.

The side handle allows for a whole new set of strike, jab, and take down techniques over the straight batons.

I like them. They are very usefull.

I don't care for carrying one on my belt (the handle does bang into things and sometimes catches things, and I had to take it out of/put it in its carrier whenever I entered/exited the car ). I prefer having one in the car though, for the times when I new I'd likely have a need for a baton. I prefer the expandable/colapsable baton (ASP or Monadnock) on my belt, to be hady when I didn't expect to need a baton.

I never liked a PR 24, I carried a straight nylon stick at first, scored an aluminum one which got gone somehow or another (2nd rule of police work: You can leave a million dollars in cash on the squad room table for 6 weeks and no one will take a bill, but leave your stick, cuffs, flashlight, cuff keys, or anything else long enough to turn around and pull a booking sheet from the box your stuff will be GONE)
We carried flat saps too, the sound they made on a noggin was a sound once heard will never be forgotten....first time I heard it I was surprised...I thought the guy was dead.....
never had the gloves....

Hey everyone,

I was doing some websurfing just to see if the Mk V would come up in a google search and lo and behold, I found you guys.

I actually have two Mk 5's, a couple of inserts for them, and a basket weave holster. The first time I saw one, I was a police explorer in 1971. 10 years later, I carried one on my Sam Browne as a city cop in Southern California. Personally, I liked it for the intimidation factor, and because I knew exactly where the front was. It fits comfortably in the hand and the trigger makes it as easy to point and shoot as pistol. I kind of wish they still sold the replacements in a new and improved pepper spray formula.

When I was in Ft. Lauderdale in the 70s we had Mace. The main use of it was when someone forgot to lock their cruiser their air conditioning ducts got filled with it. Usually just made drunks mad(er). Sap in the sap pocket was the ticket.

I had one back in the 1970's during my LE Career. I always found that I got more "Mace" on me than the bad guy and so I always tried to keep away useing it..... I don't know where it went to but I no longer have any of the old MACE Sprays......

I agree on the conventional PR-24's. However, I loved the collapsible PR-24 and the straight baton version. They used a plastic rotating scabbard - multiple click positions - great for getting in and out of a car. The collapsible PR was my fave - when you flicked it open, that sound sent chills up the spine of anyone who heard it. Most effective. Sorry I sold them for the ASP.

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Go ahead, make my day !

I hated pr24's I stayed with a straight cocobolo night stick.

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Fidelis Ad Mortem

For sheer damage on a perp I liked the PR-24. The banging it off everything and getting hung in seatbelts etc part sucked. I trained with a PR-24, but the dept decided to stick with asps for the time being. Then I hung up my spurs and started a new career. Now my dad has the asp. I'm still not sure if that was a good idea on my part or not lol.

I have a PR card but my agency only allowed the straight second growth hickory batons after they started issuing them. prior to that I carried a flat sap. When we were issued Mace it was the standard canisters. I used the PR as a M.P as our CC was a CHP officer and approved them, if he had authority was another matter we never had to use them and didn't get any flack over it.

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20 years Mil, 18 yrs Sac P.D.

My lieutenant pulled this out of the basement the other day for a museum/display project I had been assigned at our department. I was doing research and came across your post.

Sorry, only five years late.

Stay frosty.

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I was the first LEO in Colo. to buy a can of mace from Ray Bartholomew a sales man from George F Cake & company. Used it the day I bought it and it defiantly saved me a whipping! The first man to get maced was named Jerry Rice, came to me saying 'I have always wanted to fight you!" I calmly removed the mace from the carrier and sprayed him. "Damn, Spray me like I was a little bug!" Without the Mace he would have probably won! As I remember it was about 1964. Word got around and the mace became a big seller for them. I remember the mace gun but did not buy one, I figured it was not as practical as the regular mace.

Still carried my flat sap, never hit anyone in the head, but did break an arm or two.

The palm sap made using a pistol impossible but it sure was handy. The lead gloves were too expensive for me.

Thumb cuffs were great!! You could carry several in addition to your hand cuffs but had to be very careful, it was just too easy to break a thumb. The zip ties made them obsolete.

Safari Land made the best leather in its day, still have basket weave belt and some of their holsters + all the other stuff. The Safari Land thumb break was a very secure carry!

My night stick was my friend, learned from an ex NY City cop who was a real artist, could play a complete Rosinie Overture on a jerk without missing a beat in about 30 seconds!

It was a different time, most of us worked alone and back up would be hours away. Talk about a thread recalling great memories!!

Sorry for the rant.

Thanks for the post, Pard. Even if it is late.