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  #1  
Old 11-22-2010, 03:24 PM
Wyatt Burp Wyatt Burp is offline
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Default Joe Kent! Is This Chopped Rem. Model 8 Factory?

As a fan of these fine rifles, Joe, I was wondering if you ever encountered one of these chopped Remington Model 8's. I saw a cut down Model 8 at a gunshow twenty years ago and now wonder if it came that way. I'm 99% sure it had the full heavy, but shortened, barrel shroud unlike this one. In "Carbine Williams" Jimmy Stewart uses a cut down Rem. Model 8 as the gun he invented in prison. I don't think I'd want my fingers near the barrel during recoil on this one.
If this gun exists I want one!

Last edited by Wyatt Burp; 11-22-2010 at 03:27 PM.
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Old 11-22-2010, 05:27 PM
2152hq 2152hq is offline
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A guy by the name of Pete Vershneider was doing carbine conversions on Model 8 and 81 Remingtons.
Don't know if he still is.
[email protected] ,,,tel: 315-591-6639

His carbines were 17" barreled jobs.
He also did/does conversions on the 8/81 to accept the 15rd Police Officer Equiptment Co. magazines that are only occasionally found.

I don't think he makes any new mags, but perhaps he does.
His carbine conversions came about as a direct interest in the Williams conversion.

If you dig through some of the old threads on the Vintage Semi-Automatic Rifle Forum Model 8 & 81 sections, you can probably still find some info and pics.

I just sold one of my Remington Model 8 rifles in 30Remington.
Kept the other 2.,,a 30 and a 32.
Found a Lyman tang site and the Lyman replacement 2 leaf fold down site and base for the rear bbl sight recently.
Those will go on the 30. Those open rear sights are just too close to the shooter w/old eyes to see very well.

A carbine would be a nice project,,
But I still have my eye out for an FN mod.1900 rifle.

Last edited by s&wchad; 11-23-2010 at 07:45 AM.
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:50 PM
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Yep. Pete does (did) cut some down. The one pictured was "Carbine's" short stroke chamber whatever design. That barrel is fixed.
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Old 11-22-2010, 07:33 PM
Wyatt Burp Wyatt Burp is offline
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Yep. Pete does (did) cut some down. The one pictured was "Carbine's" short stroke chamber whatever design. That barrel is fixed.
So, was that movie right by having a cut down Model 8 in it? Did Carbine Williams make a gun from scratch or modify a Remington? I think I'll e-mail that guy who shortens them. I need another project I can't afford.

Last edited by s&wchad; 11-23-2010 at 07:45 AM.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:18 PM
Joe Kent Joe Kent is offline
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Wyatt, 35Rem is correct, Pete has done cut downs that you cannot tell from what should have been factory{never were}. One of my young friends who lived close to Indy and went to school here in IL. had a cut down Model 8 in 35 that shot like a house afire. That was a number of years ago and was done by a gunsmith in his home town. The problem with making Police Equipment type Model 8's is the cost of the Magazines if you can find them and then you still do not have an original and you are modifying a 60 to 100 year old gun that parts are hard to come by. I have one Model 8 and two 81 Police Equipment Guns and only shoot them on very special occasions as I don't want to risk damaging them. As far as mags go, the last I saw sold in the neighborhood of 1K per. Still, all in all, very neat rifles. I can't seem to ever get enough and am on the hunt for a Model 8 Police in 30Rem. all my others are 35 Rem. Again all my best, Joe.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:21 PM
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So, was that movie right by having a cut down Model 8 in it? Did Carbine Williams make a gun from scratch or modify a Remington? I think I'll e-mail that guy who shortens them. I need another project I can't afford.
The picture is THE Model 8 Williams modified in prison.
What a concept, huh? Let the inmate have a rifle...
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  #7  
Old 11-22-2010, 11:30 PM
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35Rem, very, very different times for sure. If you study the development of the M1 Carbine, Williams gets far more credit than he really deserves, but it makes a great story when General Jimmy Stewart plays him in the movie. I must confess that I too enjoyed the movie.
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Old 11-23-2010, 12:13 AM
SG-688 SG-688 is offline
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OK, Joe. You woke me up, now I can't go back to sleep!!

From a previous custom combat thread, a sample of Joe's Remingtons:




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Old 11-23-2010, 12:36 AM
Joe Kent Joe Kent is offline
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SG-688 ,thanks for posting the pictures of my Police Rifles,{sorry to wake you up} When you are "picture challenged" it is good to have smarter friends.
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Old 11-23-2010, 11:10 AM
Wyatt Burp Wyatt Burp is offline
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OK, Joe. You woke me up, now I can't go back to sleep!!

From a previous custom combat thread, a sample of Joe's Remingtons:




I'm a Colt New Service fan but are those top two colts Army Special's? They look too small in relation to the Det. Special to be New Service's. And are they police marked, also? And what's the S&W? It looks like an odd 4 1/2" barrel. The front sight suggests a cut-down Outdoorsman .38. That nickel gun knocks me out.
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Old 11-23-2010, 12:15 PM
Joe Kent Joe Kent is offline
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Wyatt, Both are New Services, the one on the left was cut to 3 1/2 , chromed and carried by a friend in Il. State LE in a supervisor position{Cal. 45 Colt}. The other is a 38 Special Border Patrol marked New Service with old, period stags. The Smith is a Kansas City Reg. Magnum 357. The Detective Special is a correct period Fitz, but unfortunitely will not letter. All cool guns that go together with the Remingtons that a Cop who was a gunner would have used in the day.
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Old 11-23-2010, 12:22 PM
Wyatt Burp Wyatt Burp is offline
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Wyatt, Both are New Services, the one on the left was cut to 3 1/2 , chromed and carried by a friend in Il. State LE in a supervisor position{Cal. 45 Colt}. The other is a 38 Special Border Patrol marked New Service with old, period stags. The Smith is a Kansas City Reg. Magnum 357. The Detective Special is a correct period Fitz, but unfortunitely will not letter. All cool guns that go together with the Remingtons that a Cop who was a gunner would have used in the day.
There's nothing like a cut down Colt New
Service. Doesn't my 1917 look way bigger than my Cobra compared to your Det. special and New Service in your freinds photo?

Last edited by Wyatt Burp; 11-23-2010 at 12:25 PM.
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Old 11-23-2010, 12:24 PM
Wyatt Burp Wyatt Burp is offline
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Wyatt, Both are New Services, the one on the left was cut to 3 1/2 , chromed and carried by a friend in Il. State LE in a supervisor position{Cal. 45 Colt}. The other is a 38 Special Border Patrol marked New Service with old, period stags. The Smith is a Kansas City Reg. Magnum 357. The Detective Special is a correct period Fitz, but unfortunitely will not letter. All cool guns that go together with the Remingtons that a Cop who was a gunner would have used in the day.
There's nothing like a cut down Colt New
Service. Hey. I know where there's a couple .35 caliber Model 8's. Where are the police markings. Are they conspicuous?
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Old 11-23-2010, 02:20 PM
Joe Kent Joe Kent is offline
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Wyatt, to the best of my knowledge Remington did not mark Model 8's at the factory. They did ,however , mark Model 81's and Model 11's from about 1930 to the very early 40's if the order was big enough. The factory markings will be on the left side in large letters and say "POLICE GUN PROPERTY OF" and then the agency name. One of my Police 81's is so marked and I have a Model 11 12bore also so marked. The 8's are another story and if they have markings at all, they most likely were done on a local level. I also have a documented Texas Ranger Model 81 marked in the stock and forearm with DPS markings. As an aside, that very gun is pictured in John Henwood's book on the Remingtons.
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Old 11-23-2010, 09:08 PM
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Old 12-16-2010, 11:33 AM
81police 81police is offline
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Okay I have to jump in and share on this one, it's just too good of a post.

I have a chopped, functional Model 8 that was built with the help of a friend from New York. Barrel length is 17" and caliber is 35Rem. I shortened the stock and she's now about 35" overall.




I too am very fond of Police versions of the Model 8 / 81.


Great topic and great website!

Cam Woodall
The Great Model 8 & 81

Last edited by 81police; 12-16-2010 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 12-16-2010, 11:37 AM
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Hey Cam! Welcome to the S&W Forum!
Pete V. was mentioned above. S&WChad is the member here with the GORGEOUS F Grade Model 8.
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Old 12-16-2010, 02:15 PM
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Very interesting stuff.
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Old 12-16-2010, 02:31 PM
Wyatt Burp Wyatt Burp is offline
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Okay I have to jump in and share on this one, it's just too good of a post.

I have a chopped, functional Model 8 that was built with the help of a friend from New York. Barrel length is 17" and caliber is 35Rem. I shortened the stock and she's now about 35" overall.




I too am very fond of Police versions of the Model 8 / 81.


Great topic and great website!

Cam Woodall
I'm speechless! That is exactly what I'm talking about! And that pistol grip is icing on the cake. I want on real bad!

Last edited by Wyatt Burp; 12-16-2010 at 06:06 PM.
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Old 12-16-2010, 02:36 PM
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Cam,
Welcome and thanks for posting the photos! I love the 81 and I can only imagine the work that went into that Model 8 carbine conversion.
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Last edited by s&wchad; 12-16-2010 at 02:43 PM.
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  #21  
Old 12-21-2010, 06:23 PM
81police 81police is offline
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that's right guys, Pete did the barrel assembly work, and what a job he did.

Walt you're lurking around everywhere!
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Old 12-21-2010, 09:46 PM
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Walt? Come on Cam, it's Larry.
Who else is "35Rem"?
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Old 10-27-2012, 02:03 PM
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Thread was E-Mailed to me and when ever I think about these cool guns , my interest in finding more is re-awakened. Joe.
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Old 07-05-2013, 05:14 PM
Joe Kent Joe Kent is offline
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Let's see if we can smoke out any more Model 8's or 81's from Forum members?
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:10 PM
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I have a Model 8 in .32 with a Marble's folding tang sight and 2 original stripper clips. It is one of my favorite rifles and the one I have used to not shoot a deer the last three hunting seasons. I inherited it from my father. I love old police weapons and I don't think that I would hesitate to go on patrol with a Colt New Service and a Model 8 or a Winchester 1907 today. Hell, if one of my Chiefs would go for it I probably would.
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Old 06-29-2014, 01:41 PM
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Anymore Model 8's owned by Forum members?
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Old 06-29-2014, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
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The picture is THE Model 8 Williams modified in prison.
What a concept, huh? Let the inmate have a rifle...
You've obviously have never heard of "convict guards". It was a common occurrence up until the late 60s or early 70s. I remember a big deal about some bodies being found on the Cummins and Tucker Farms in Arkansas about that time, and they were still using the "convict guards". That's the way things were back then.....
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Old 08-05-2014, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
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Anymore Model 8's owned by Forum members?
I have a Model 81 Special Police from the LA Sheriff's Dept.
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Old 08-06-2014, 07:41 PM
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Quote:
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You've obviously have never heard of "convict guards". It was a common occurrence up until the late 60s or early 70s. I remember a big deal about some bodies being found on the Cummins and Tucker Farms in Arkansas about that time, and they were still using the "convict guards". That's the way things were back then.....
As depicted in the Robert Redford movie ... Brubaker, IIRC.
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Old 08-06-2014, 09:53 PM
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Welcome aboard, Cam.

Is that .35 Remington a brute to shoot?
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