Guy switches from .45 to 9mm after gunfight

Sgt.Peck · #**101** 12-05-2013, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex1001

I'd like a more detailed explanation on why you ditched the 40 entirely. My reason is that as an instructor I have a LOT of people (Mostly women) say "I'm new to armed self defense, what do you recommend?". What follows is a VERY detailed evaluation on my part. After verifying the student's mindset and teaching basics with a 22, I try to get the student into the largest, most powerful gun they can handle reliably (Read: They feel comfortable with). This usually entails their using a pistol/revolver from my accumulation. The 40 does have operational disadvantages for most new shooters, but some take to it like a duck to water.
I'm just curious if 'Im missing some aspect here.
P.S. I've carried a 45 ACP 1911 for 35+ years and now have the resulting back problems. I'm going to switch to a 45c M&P (8 ozs lighter) or a 40c M&P (14 ozs lighter- feels like nothin').
_______________________
Boxers or briefs? At my age, Depends.

My dept. went to the Glock 40 cal. back around 1998. Since then we had continuous problems with this caliber. The sharp recoil would cause breakages. Officers on the smallish side had trouble qualifying as well. Finally in 2012 we completely switched back to the 9mm. Personally, I'm very happy with that decision and wondered why it took so long.

vito · #**102** 12-05-2013, 11:10 AM

I certainly am not an expert, but over my many years of shooting, and many years of reading about actual shooting cases, the caliber arguments sometimes strike me as similar to those of the middle ages "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin" issues.

More times than I can count I have read of people being killed by a single 22LR round, and similarly, people able to run away, get to a hospital, etc. with 3 or 4 45acp rounds in them. (Don't ask for specifics because I certainly do not save all of these anecdotal stories from newspapers, magazines, etc.).

So in my opinion, as many others have said in the same or different words, carry what you are comfortable with and practice as much as you can. If and when you need to actually use a firearm to defend yourself you will find out a lot more about yourself than what caliber works best. If you don't believe me, talk to any military veteran about what it is like to be under fire (if he or she will talk about it at all).

guzzi · #**103** 12-05-2013, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hapworth

Have a gander at one of the 1911, Glock or general gun forums -- there's usually a knock down, drag out .45 vs 9mm thread every six minutes.

Agreed, but this forum is more civilized. jb

DR505 · #**104** 12-05-2013, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamlayton

Well now, every caliber is lethal and the other way around, also. The object is that the other guy dies---even if you have to use a trenching tool.
Blessings

Don't confuse lethal and effective. You can shoot a guy with a .25 ACP, and if he continues his mayhem then, but dies three days later from the shot, it was 100% lethal, but not effective.

SgtLumpy · #**105** 12-05-2013, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hapworth

Have a gander at one of the 1911, Glock or general gun forums -- there's usually a knock down, drag out .45 vs 9mm thread every six minutes.

Which range bag is best?

Sgt Lumpy

Smithsrevenge · #**106** 12-05-2013, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtLumpy

Which range bag is best?

Sgt Lumpy

5.11 tactical with tactical pouches tactical slings, tactical compartments and tactical flaps! Duh!

Sent from my VS930 4G using Tapatalk

LaVistaBill · #**107** 12-05-2013, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by venomballistics

the ideal gun weighs 5 Oz when carried, 40 pounds when fired, and eats 12 Ga slugs from a belt.
I guess he couldn't deal with the lack of weight when fired.

I'll take one of those, plus a 4 oz. gun belt to go with it!

DR505 · #**108** 12-06-2013, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by policerevolvercollector

Here in an excellent book on the subject giving the pros/cons of most defensive rounds using real life examples.......

Stopping Power: A Practical Analysis of the Latest Handgun Ammunition - Evan P. Marshall, Edwin J. Sanow - Google Books

It is a very good read. The authors consider stopping the aggression immediately (whether fatal or not) to be a "success" which for all practical purposes IMHO is the goal.

Marshall and Sanow have had an incredible amount of criticism regarding their "research." From what I've seen, their method of compiling and use of statistics are not well regarded.

dcxplant · #**109** 12-06-2013, 01:02 AM

Mobile 1 is the most bestest and the ONLY engine oil anyone should use.

If you're not using Mobile 1 you are plain wrong!

""snicker""

ImprovedModel56Fan · #**110** 12-06-2013, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcxplant

Mobile 1 is the most bestest and the ONLY engine oil anyone should use.

If you're not using Mobile 1 you are plain wrong!

""snicker""

Perhaps so, but for my hand and body, a 1911 is faster to shoot, easier to hit with, and carries more easily than a Beretta 92. Not badmouthing the 92 - it's a good gun with twice the capacity. But the final answer is not the same for everyone. And it may not even be final.

Smithsrevenge · #**111** 12-06-2013, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcxplant

Mobile 1 is the most bestest and the ONLY engine oil anyone should use.

If you're not using Mobile 1 you are plain wrong!

""snicker""

I use valvoline

Sent from my VS930 4G using Tapatalk

blujax01 · #**112** 12-06-2013, 12:05 PM

While I'm not considering going down in caliber, I am thinking about offering up my LEO package 45C in the Classifieds (WTT) for a 4" M25 or 625 45ACP revolver.

Bill Bates · #**113** 12-06-2013, 12:44 PM

9mm vs .45acp; such silliness. I'm sticking to my 4 inch .44s because their Special. Tom Threeperson and Jelly Bryce had it right ;^)

Dennis The B · #**114** 12-06-2013, 12:46 PM

There was another incident recently, in which a police officer using a .45 caliber automatic, expended somewhere north of 30 rounds, before finally killing the bad guy. The last round was a head shot.

He has now switched to 9mm, and carries 145 rounds of ammo.

While I'm certainly glad that he survived the encounter and came out on top, my primary criticism of him was, and still is, his lack of adopting the the necessary tactics to take out the bad guy. He states that he hit the perp with a number of "center mass" hits, but didn't kill the guy until he shot from beneath a car.

Why one cop carries 145 rounds of ammo on the job

Lost Lake · #**115** 12-06-2013, 01:58 PM

I read the article Dennis.

The cop shot 30 times and hit the bad guy 14 of those times with 6 being fatal shots. Yet the guy kept shooting back and running around.

The officer laid in the grass and targeted the bad guy who had taken position behind the squad car and when the BG looked beneath the squad the officer rapid fired an additional 3 rounds which were all head shots (total shots fired = 33).

The cop had 4 rounds remaining in his gun. 4 rounds after firing 33. I bet he was getting a little worried.

I never agreed with folks that tell me the 'average' gun fight is 3 rounds, and carrying 7 or 8 big bullets is perfectly reliable to stop whatever may come up.

Time to make myself a magazine holder and carry some extra rounds....

.