My one year old Chow/ GSD mix Kimber (yeah, i know, wrong forum) has started limping after a fall coming up two stairs. The vet says "Luxating patella" which is a defect in the knee joint that can only be fixed by expensive surgery. Anyone have experience with this? Any other options? No liability is incurred by your advice in any way....

UPDATE in post 22

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I used to be disgusted..

I would try rest and limited exercise. No stairs for a while. Glucosamine, Rimadyl, even small doses of buffered aspirin might help. Check before giving OTC meds because many are toxic to dogs and/or cats.
Does your dog like to swim? If so, gradually building a swimming routine might help strengthen supporting muscles without stressing the joint.

We have a Beagle /Terrier mix that when she was about a year or so old developed a on and off again limp on her back leg. She would run then limp, then continue running. We took her to the vet and, luxating patella.

We gave her the operation to help it. They make the groove deeper in the bone so the patella rides in place rather than jump out. The also move a muscle to pull it a certain way. The result was that she was better not 100% but I would guess 85-90%. When she lies down she like that leg out stretched. She also likes it rubbed when being pet.

This was done almost ten years ago.

We would do it again if needed.

As far as I know a luxating patella is a bone problem and sort of a minor birth defect if you will. Perhaps if it was caused by trauma it might be that the tendons are stretched and not holding the knee cap in place?

In fact were taking this dog to the vet today, seems to have a Urinary Tract Infection. She is an expensive dog but I think shes priceless

Best wishes

I would try glucosamine and chondroitin. Also don't try to restrict his movement. Exercise is good. And if he's overweight, put him on a diet. I think surgery is the only way to really fix his knee, but the other suggestions might at least help. As spirit4earth mentioned, check with the vet before giving him any non prescribed meds. While the ones mentioned are safe for dogs (NO tylenol or acetaminophen), your vet knows his history and what other meds, if any, he's taking. Best wishes for his recovery.

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Misty

Misty is on the right track. We have a 15 year old chihuahua that has the same issue, both hind legs. When her knees go out she goes into a seizure. The glucosamine really helps keep her mobile, and she doesn't have the problem too often now.

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Even older, even crankier....

Follow the instructions listed in Mark 16: 17-18.

Our 8-9 yr old Husky has a bad back leg as well. She suffers from a knee issue.

We have stopped her from using the steps, and give her a buffered aspirin each day in her evening food. Seems to help. The aspirin was on the Vet's recommendation.

Sad deal for her as she enjoys being active...then afterwards is stiff and in pain at that leg.

FN in MT

If you give your dog aspirin it is usually the low dose 81 mg. Depends on the weight of your dog. Check with your Vet,

But be sure it is buffered not the enteric coated, as that kind will pass through a dogs system and do nothing.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Surgery is pretty much the fix for this. There's a groove the patella is suppose to slide in and if it's not deep enough for whatever reason then it can slide out of place. Imagine having your knee cap slide to the side of your knee! (Just having the knee cap in any location other than where it should be can hurt.)

The vet will go in and make it so the patella will stay/travel as it should instead of slide out of place. I've seen this surgery a few times and it's definitely helped!

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L'LS

If Kimber doesn't get the surgery, is it likely that more injuries will occur making the situation even worse or more complicated to correct in the future than it is now?

Phil, that's what we worry about too. Thanks everyone for the suggestions, i bought the Condroiton and Glaucosimine today, and we'll see how that goes. I spent some time on a Chow forum (fora for EVERYTHING these days!) and some dogs have had the surgery multiple times on the same knee. That's just not an option for us... We'll try the meds and rest and see what the future holds...

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I used to be disgusted..

Allow me to chip in on this discussion.

Over the last thirty years of raising, training dogs for field and obedience work, I've only had one dog that had serious orthopedic problems, one of my current labs.

To begin, your decision on how to proceed, by necessity, must be based on what you can afford, how old the dog is, if there are other health problems, etc...

But here's what you should know, and a lot of great and not so great advice have been given already.

1. No dietary additives, vitamins, or pain medications will "fix" a structural orthopedic problem. I use glucosamine and chondroitin for all my dogs, but, at best, it will ease age related arthritic pain...not "fix" a dislocating patella.
2. Take great care in giving aspirin, and only under a vets order. I've just finished reading a veterinary study that as little as one dose of aspirin can cause gastric bleeds in dogs. If your vet recommends it, he/she will tell you the danger signs to look for.
3. If your dog is overweight, get the extra pounds off! What does your vet say about the size of your dog?
4. More often than not, as in the case with my current lab who required a very, very expensive TPLO surgery on one of his knees, the subsequent success of the surgery is directly in proportion to the absolute owner compliance with post-op instructions given by the surgeon. And by absolute compliance, I mean absolute. Your chances of succeeding are exponentially better if you follow instructions to the letter.

When deciding what to do before the surgery, I asked the vet: What happens if I do nothing, and hope for the best? His answer was, "in five years, you'll have a completely crippled dog." And if I get the minimal nylon bands? His reply, "I don't recommend banding surgeries in larger dogs, they just don't have a high rate of success."


And, finally, I asked about the radical TPLO surgery, and his response was, "he'll be a brand new dog."


I opted for the surgery, due to the fact that though it wasn't easy to come up with the money, he'd already shown himself as a champ, and become one of the family, and we were able to stretch and afford it.


And the vet was right. Jim has had absolutely, positively no problems since that day, and has never looked back. [Which makes up for the eight weeks that my wife and I took turns sleeping on an air mattress in the basement next to him in his crate. He wasn't allowed to climb stairs for that long.]



[Side note: a neighbor decided to have the same procedure done on her beautiful Gordon Setter. Contrary to instructions, she let it swim in their pool less than a week after surgery...incision got infected. She had the vet take the leg. Two weeks later, she had the vet put the dog down. And went on to complain to all that the surgery didn't work, and the vet was useless!]



I hope this helps, and forgive me if I sound preachy...


Len

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Thanks Len for that very good info. We're going to get a second opinion and if that indicates surgery, then we'll see what we can do. She's a wonderful dog and only a year old...Think good thoughts for us please!

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I used to be disgusted..

The sad part is how the cost of these surgeries has skyrocketed even though they have become much more common.

Our Vet, who always impresses us with his honesty chalks it up to greed and playing on the emotions of loving pet owners.

Something that may help is "stretching" the affected legs out, basically 'til they are straight. This may be more effective for small dogs, but could very well work for larger dogs, as well. I have an 8 year old Papillon which, for no apparent reason, suddenly started limping on a rear leg very badly a year or so ago. I took him to my vet, who recognized the patella problem immediately. He straightened out his leg, and the limp and pain dissipated rapidly. He said this is usually a genetic problem, and was surprised that it had never occurred before. He said that if the problem kept up, or got worse, surgery was the only cure. It has not recurred, but that is due to the fact that, since he was a puppy, he would stretch not only his back, but alternately stretch each rear leg out nearly straight several times a day. He still does this, and there has not been a recurrence of the problem. It is probable that, if stretching the leg out (gently, of course) works, the dog could be taught to stretch his legs on command. Sure hope your dog gets better, that is a painful problem.

I'll chime in as this is my profession...as I've mentioned on here before I am a veterinarian and in fact I am a board-certified specialist in surgery. All I do is referral surgery. Smokin Iron I won't get into a debate with you but I take offense at your assertion that surgery is expensive because vets are greedy. You have no idea the expense involved in maintaining the staff, facility, equipment, and training to do this type of procedure.

Len's info and advice was pretty much spot on. I recommend extreme caution with ANY form of aspirin because it does significantly increase the risk of GI ulcers. Weight reduction and control always help whether you elect surgery or not, and recovery is much better if Kimber is not overweight.

Knee problems (patella luxation and anterior cruciate ligament injury) are THE most common orthopedic problems in dogs. Patella luxation is usually due to a slight deformity in the limb alignment that allows the patella or kneecap to slide or pop out of the groove. Trauma can make it more pronounced but rarely is trauma the primary cause. If left uncorrected over time the cartilage in the knee gets gradually worn away and this leads to progressive and irreversible arthritis. Many dogs do survive and get along without surgery, but getting the surgery when they are young is almost always best. If done correctly by a veterinary surgeon with some experience the surgery is usually very successful. Prognosis for the most severely deformed dogs (referred to as grade 4 patella lux...make sure you ask your vet the grade) is not as good. Surgery usually involves making the groove on the femur deeper and cutting the front if the shin bone to allow better alignment of the patellar tendon and thus the patella.

Bottom line is do not feel guilty if you can't afford the surgery immediately. This problem is not an emergency and waiting a few months to save up for it probably won't make a big difference in the long term prognosis...waiting years might!

If you are getting a second opinion (never a bad idea) I would strongly suggest you seek a specialist or at least someone with a lot of experience in orthopedics and not a random general practice veterinarian based on low cost...like everything else in life you tend to get what you pay for!

Finally, although most of the advice I read here was helpful do not make decisions based on Internet forums! Listen to the veterinarians that have actually EXAMINED your dog...Despite what Smokin Iron may have you believe, veterinarians are not just greedy *******s. See...I wrote all that and didn't even charge you a dime! (My PayPal is.....

I have a 75 pound Black Mouth Curr with the same problem, my vet prescribed 150mg of NOVOX a day, it is an anti-inflammatory drug.
I cannot afford the surgery (she also has a torn ligament in her other leg and has hip diplasia) that would cost $3,500 with NO guarantees.

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"Life is short, hunt hard"

I have had two of these surgeries done on a great pyrenees. One by an orthopedic specialist, another by a local vet that also does sugery. Both worked out well but the specialist surgery was a much faster recovery. Yes it is expensive, but we could afford it and the increased time with this pet was worth it to us. You have to decide the value for your family. Thanks to the Vet for the input on this.

Thanks to all for the advice, took Kimber for a second opinion. The vet was recommended by the rescue organization she came from, Chowsplus. He does a lot of orthopedic surgery and determined that:
it is Luxating Patella in both knees
Grade 3 in left and Grade 2 in right.
So, surgery is scheduled early in August for only the left. The right knee is strong enough to support her while she limps, so it should be ok for now. I hate to think of a second surgery down the road, but I'll burn that bridge when i come to it.
6-8 weeks of crating and walking on a short leash and she should be walking normally. She may never be an athletic dog, but she's a great companion and has a champion's heart!
Thanks again for all the advice and support.
Rob

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I used to be disgusted..

See if there is a vet in your area who does acupuncture on dogs, my vet is certified for animal acupuncture, and has worked wonders for my older dogs. Might help. She is a saint in her care for pets!

Our rotti tore his Acl a few years ago. We had the surgery done to repair the knee. The cost was just under 1800.00. This included three surgeries and all the rays and meds. I do not think this was a bad price.

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It is what it is.

So, Kimber had her surgery to correct the luxating patella on 8/1. The surgery went wonderfully well according to the orthopedic specialist we found. Now we're carefully observing the 6-8 weeks of convalescence and rehab. She is on a short leash for potty breaks and kept in check in the house as well. Time will tell, but she's already using the leg more than she did before..She even doesn't seem to mind the Cone of Shame, leaning her head down to help us put it on! (So she doesn't lick the staples which come out on Tuesday) Such a good dog...

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I used to be disgusted..

Rob, excellent news! I was wondering how things were going.

I think you'll be impressed and amazed with the results. I can tell you the most difficult thing to grasp now will be that way before the convalescence/rehab phase is over, the dog will seem perfectly healthy!

When you have a chance, you need to post a picture of your dog, so we can see who we've been hearing about!

Continued good luck to you,

Len

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Qui me amat, amet et canem meum

Len, because you asked:

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I used to be disgusted..

Great news! She's a happy looking young lady.

Tell her the Cone of Shame is just for a little while.

Thanks for the update on Kimber! She looks like a pretty happy girl! Follow the rehab advice and she'll be going strong in no time!
BCD