The thread about a member's M-1935-S prompts me to wonder what the current French military pistol is. I know they adopted the Beretta 92-G some years ago, but that it is being replaced by a SIG design, also used by the Gendarmerie. Some of the SIG's have plastiic frames. Excuse me, polymer... Some units have supposedly had P-226's for some time.


If Anglaispierre or anyone else who might know sees this, what are they and most cops there using now? I presume that GIGN has everyhing, or at least, anything they want.

BTW, Anglaispierre hasn't posted in some time, Anyone know if he's okay?

Oh: I've seen a photo of a French policewoman with a Ruger SP-101. Def. a SP, not a Manurhin MR-88, which is based on the former Security-Six. Don't know if it was a .38 or a .357.

Another good reason for the US Armed Services to return to the 45 ACP 1911

I picture one of those cartoon guns that shoot out the white flag.

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Curent French service pistol, at least for the Army, is the old MAC 50. With their military budget, they're probably not going to replace it anytime soon. Anyone who has one of the MAC 50s that came back from Vietnam by a couple of different means, better hang onto it as they aren't going to get any less scarce (I have, two; gloat, gloat).

All agencies under the Ministry of the Interior, and the Gendarmerie (which is under the Ministry of Defense) use the SIG P 2022. Somewhere I have a pictue of one belonging to some poor Gendarme. It was wet and he put it in the oven to dry and then forgot about it. The frame is a blob. The Gendarmerie had MAC G1s, the French version of the Beretta 92 although no one else adopted them. They had nothing but trouble with them and have since gotten rid of them.

I'm not sure what the Armée de l'Aire (Air Force) or the Marine (Navy) are using,but I can find out if you desire. The forces are small, and probably don't have too many pistols. The GIGN: Groupe d'Intervention de la Gendarmerie National (Gendarmerie SWAT Team) and the other GIs use about whatever they want, but the quantities are minimal.

Never been shot and only dropped once....

Got a bunch of French soldiers here at Bagram, I will ask one of them today at lunch.

Do they still sell antique guns at the bazeer and can you still ship them back to the States? I bought a couple of Snider-Enfields there back in 2004-2007.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Peyton-

Thanks. I appreciate that.

Smallarmsoftheworld.com (formerly Small Arms Review magazine) is a good resource for this sort of thing.

They have a regular contributor, Jean Huon, who writes about French small arms, including the M1935s and the M1950.

On another board I visit someone mentioned a recent trip to Verdun and standing in the Ossuary, that is a good way to gauge the fighting qualities of French Soldiers. A big part of their problem in WWII is they had been bled white in WWI and really hadn't recovered. Also since there has been no French immigration into this country there is no French vote.
Rant over.

Here's a picture of my PA 50. It has Trausch grips. I bought them in the US but they come with pistols reworked at the arsenals.

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Sorry for delay in responding, I accosted a French Officer on the Bagram Airfield sidewalk yesterday. I explained I was a member of gun enthusiat club and was curious about what weapons the NATO members used. He seemed happy to cooperate, pulled his pistol out of the holster, cleared it and let me examine it. He stated the French Army uses the MAC Mle 1950, a 9mm single stack magazine and all steel. He said it is over 50 years old and goes bang everytime he pulls the trigger. I said thanks for his time, I did not say I was older than the pistol!!
Here is what WIKI says about it.
MAC Mle 1950 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thanks, peyton.

It is a little disappointing as a sidearm in the the sense that it is very similar to the Hi-Power with less capacity and perhaps velocity.

Does The Legion Estranger (Forign Legion) use the same arms that the regular French army does....I read a book authored by a now millionaire ex Legionare talk about his five years in the Legion and some of the advantages and the dis-advantaged of being a Legionaire. I really don't consider them to be eager to surrender to anybody. I lent the book to somebody and it has not been returned, or I would have mentioned the title....The writer was english and was a international business man when he wrote the book......Very interesting outlook on a very legendnary fighting outfit. And I migh add their not always in line thinking with the French government. Maybe somebody on this site could explain the role the Legion plays in the modern world stage..................

Legionare...... by Simon Murray...I just looked it up....Very good read, about the Legion from a Englishmans view point.

Their real problem in WWII was that their top "leadership" was inept to the nth degree, both strategically and tactically.

Swap the French and Finnish commands and you'd have a Soviet walkover of Finland and a bloody humiliation for Hitler in France.

To the best of my knowledge the FF uses standard French Army issue, and has since before WWI, although dubious junk like the St. Etienne machine gun has often been dumped on them because they were stationed in low priority backwaters like North Africa until a real fight started. Once they got to France, they got what was then modern equipment.

You can't compare the Foreign Legion to the rest of the French Army. They're volunteers, and until relatively recently, foreigners, usually with no place else to go. During WWII, the FF was essentially a German army that divided in two like an amoeba and fought a civil war with itself.

Why less velocity? The caliber (same) and barrel length are very comparable. I imagine that French 9mmP is loaded to about NATO specs. It also had to work well in the MAT- 49 SMG.

I think Swiss ammo was/is loaded to just about original specs, a bullet at 1050 FPS, low for today. Most other armies use hotter loadings.

The grip looks very comfortable, although I've never seen or held one.

The Legion is indeed not known for giving up. They are mostly German and British today, and they went through Saddam Hussein's forces like a hot scimitar through warm butter. Their role is to provide French power abroad without having French regular troops having to be risked outside their homeland.

My son interviewed some Legionnaires while in France and was impressed.

If you saw the old TV series about Capt. Gallant of the Foreign Legion in the 1950's, the weapons were what you'd expect in France. The soldiers were real Legionnnaires stationed in Algeria, I think.
Maybe Tunisia? Photos of them in news coverage shows the same weapons, plus many US .30 carbines.

For some reason, most of the remaining US M-3 Trench Knives from WW II were furnished to France after the M-4 carbine bayonet was adopted here. That's a major reason why the original M-3's are hard to find now.

The .30 Carbine was a favorite of the French during their actions in French Indochina (Vietnam) after WWII. Because it was light and handy for jungle fighting, I guess. One can still run across .30 Carbine ammunition having French headstamps. But it had corrosive priming. Go figure why, when no one else loaded it with corrosive primers.

Look how long our 1911's and Model 10's served...and in some cases are making a comeback. If it works, it works.

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The Last Standing Knight

The MAC 50 is built like a tank: very strong and reliable. That's one of the reasons it's still functioning and in service after all those years. French 9mm ammo is HOT; it was originally made for the MAT 49 SMG and did not stint on either the fps or the psi. The MAC 50 was designed to habitually take that kind of abuse.

French military ammo wasn't non corrosive until about 1970. While I have a great admiration for French weapons, I don't for French ammo. For example: once I had a stripper clip for the Hotchkiss 8mm MG, the ammo was headstamped in the 1950s. I fired the Balle N rounds in a Berthier I had at the time, modified for Balle N. Fired 15 rounds: one went off normally, one was a dud, and the others gave hangfires; at least that lot was uniform.

I agree with the "built like a tank" assessment. Before I approached the French officer I had to think how the best way to ask to examine his pistol. I am normally very polite to soldiers, having been one for 22 years, plus most of them are young. I did not want to walk up and insult him or his country by assuming what type of pistol they use, heck at first I thought maybe Berretta,or Sig Sauer but definitely not H&K!!
Across the theater I have seen a lot of firearms from different nations. The US soldiers that never leave the FOB treat their rifles/machine guns like they are an encumbrance, they have never had to rely on them for protection. They are dirty and not maintained at all. I did not originate the phrase: "Your either at the of the point spear or in the rear with the gear" but it certainly applies.

When I was in Kosovo, I encountered a Greek Army officer carrying a Colt .45. I asked him about it and he did the same as the French officer-he drew it, cleared it, and let me examine it. IIRC, it was a 1916 era 1911.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

HUH? Please tell me you're joking about US Soldiers sloppy maintenance of weapons...

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The Last Standing Knight

He's probably serious. Remember Jessica Lynch's unit in Iraq?

Most USAF personnel I knew while in service were also pretty casual abut guns. Some wore them just because they had to, like paymasters. I met one OSI agent who had very limited understanding of revolvers and concealment holsters. I was surprised to learn this, as we were at the time assisting Secret Service agents with protecting the President.

Many military personnel are not especially weapons-oriented, and an interest in guns is regarded with suspicion in many units.The anti-gun culture and certain other things that I can't speak of here are behind this, I think.

Just found this posting entirely by chance. Nice to be missed. I have posted a few times in the last month or so. I certainly am OK thanks.

I recently visited the local gendarmerie in connection with the renewal of my permit. I asked the gendarme dealing with my case what he had. It was a SIG Pro.

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Kill it, cook it, eat it.

Anglaispierre-

I guess the SIG Pro is their 2022?

Glad to see you back and okay. Was afraid you'd eaten some bad pate de foie gras or something.

You beat me to it!

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Vaya con Dios

Most French military weapons I've seen have been shot numerous times, often at close range and sometimes against an overwhelming enemy. The French army has courage, their political leadership in WW II perhaps not so much.

Guys in my unit used to scrub their M-16 barrels with Comet to avoid getting dinged during stupid "whie glove" inspections.

Though I find much to disagree with the French politically and socially in current times, it would do us all well to remember that if not for the French there's a good chance we might still be English subjects. Now if you want to argue that currently being socialist slaves was a not good trade . . . wrong forum

I used to be cavalier about bashing the French, but it's really unworthy cheap shots. We'd better pull for them and hope they haven't lost their own country to the Islamic tide . . . what happens there eventually winds up on our beach . . .

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This^

Dont forget where the statue of LIBERTY came from and the fact that many heads of countries ran like little school girls when the German war machine came knocking.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

I hope no one took my post seriously.

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Dum vivo cano