I am not a LEO. If I were in a busy place (like a mall at Christmas) and I was armed and heard shots, do I go toward the shooting or do I take cover?

I understand that if you are a LEO and you are in your jurisdiction you are always considered on duty.

I understand there was at least one armed bystander at the Gabrielle Giffords shooting in AZ. He later said he didn't pull his weapon, but at one point saw someone with a pistol in their hand. it turns out that the person he saw had just disarmed the shooter.

If you display a weapon in a situation like that you risk being identified as a shooter. Another risk (as in AZ) is shooting someone who has disarmed the shooter or another (innocent) armed citizen. Finally in OR, the Police were on the scene in one minute. If an armed citizen was displaying a weapon he could be taken for a shooter.

I think in OR it was a two level Mall and shop owners lowered their security gates. This seems like the right thing to do.

I believe if I actually saw the shooter and I was armed I would get involved, but a mall is a big place with many exits. If I heard shooting it seems like the prudent thing to do is head for an exit or to stay within a shop that has lowered the security door

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Luke 22:36

depends on where you are in the mix.
if you see the shooter, take him. if you don't, try to determine where he'll be coming from and keep an eye on it. Meanwhile, try to gather as many as you can and get em out an exit, even if you have to make one smashing a window. Guard their egress.

but at no time is it a good idea to charge in towards the gunfire.
he's got his high ground and is searching for emerging targets ... like you.
odds are he'll have a few through you before you even see him.

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it just needs more voltage

One of those things that civilians who go armed naturally think about and should realistically consider, but one I choose to be circumspect about discussing publicly. Prudence, responsibility and duty to the innocent and your loved ones . . . a lot of complex issues to consider.

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Qui plantavit curabit

I think the key here is (my opinion) we carry for self defense, so I would hunker down with as many people in a gated store; or gather people the direct them to and exit. I would hope that if I had to take a shot I was able to know beyond a reasonable doubt I was shooting the perp. As I am not LE I would not go looking for the perp, Would not want to add to the confusion.

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Carpriver.

Take COVER, or EXIT, and remember all you can, TO BE A GOOD WITNESS.

YOU ARE NOT LAW ENFORCEMENT!!!!!

As a CIVILIAN, you could pull a firearm, AND a LEO in the area

just might SHOOT AND KILL YOU.

Accident YES, but your attempted heroics have GOTTEN YOU KILLED.

Law Enforcement has better Accidental Liability Insurance and a whole Government Legal Team behind them than you.

Inaccuracy, Ricochets, and innocent people you could harm will haunt you.

Think of your family and loved ones, TRAINED LEO'S have difficulty with the scenario.

Reality happens quickly, in a classroom setting you can analyze things and learn, not here though.

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NRA Pistol/Rifle Inst. RSO

If you can get your family and yourself the hell outta there.......Do so.


If'n I heard gunfire in a public place such as your hypothetical...

I guess I'd ease on down that'da way....I wouldn't run anywhere to mabee get shot or shot at, besides running draws attention to yourself.

Maybe use any cover or concealment you encounter along the way, as you close the distance to determine the source of the disturbance and what action if any, you may be able to apply.

By the way, I've been thrust into a like situations several years ago...Too long a story to relate here,
But I did advance at a quick walk as I remember.



Edited to say;

My current training is in responding to active shooter(s)
and Officer down rescue.

(I think it's just my personal nature to keep on goin forward.)

Su Amigo,
Dave

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"IN GOD WE TRUST"

My first duty is to my wife and daughter. They need to get to a safe place, and I need to be sure they get there. If I didn't see the first shot with my own eyes, my weapon stays holstered and my girls and I seek cover.

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Insert short witty words here

Get as many civilians out the exits as possible.
Apply 30 years of training/tatics and search and eliminate the threat.
When the PO-PO arrives the arena is THEIRS and I'm just a hunker downed civy...with ID out Gun put away.

I think most here if armed would do something in lieu of innocent folks being gunned down....ex-law or John Q.
IMOP

At 64 years of age and carrying one or two j-frames, I am going to try to get just as far away from an active shooter as I can. If I see the shooter, he is in range, and he has an AR-15, a shotgun, any kind of long gun, or even a hi-cap handgun, I AM NOT going to confront him or try a shot at him unless he starts directly threatening me or mine.

I carry my guns to defend against muggers, thieves, junkies, carjackers, etc. who directly threaten me or mine. I am not going to confront a madman who has superior firepower at his disposal unless I have no choice.

Always a good read.
Commentary by Evan Marshall

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Georgia On My Mind

Got to agree with everyone mentioning the shooter probably has superior firepower. Evacuate as safely as possible, or barricade somewhere until the pros arrive. I hope to never be in that position. And if I am then I hope I can maintain rational thought.

My resume doesn't have "Hero" listed on it, nor should my tombstone. I hear shots, I try to assess the location of the threat, then take cover, while looking for an exit route. If cornered (in a store, etc.) and the threat is directly threatening myself or my loved ones, self defense is in order. I don't go looking for trouble ... ever. If it looks for me, I will deal with it accordingly.

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I'm with the banned ...

Hypothetically speaking; I'd see if I could run a 4.4 40 (yards) the OTHER way. (repeat as necessary until you're home).

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But then, what do I know?

Ditto-My first duty is to get my wife, grandkids etc. to safety-If blocked-fight my way through-but get them clear-Second save others. I think these situations are confusing at best-and you won't have any idea what is going on-sorting out the hostile target-among the clutter of panicked people may be very difficult. Move out of the kill zone-the law enforcement people will hunt for the fool.

First thing is take cover, because if you're in a mall and shooting breaks out, there's fixin to be a stampede of people getting the heck out of there. You don' want to be trampled. Then try to get to an exit or go in a store and lay low.

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Wayne
Torn & Frayed

Regardless of what you THINK,you ain't gonna KNOW until the hypothetical becomes reality.
f.t.

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South Carolina-God's country

I'd bet most would find religion.

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Dum vivo cano

I agree with this sentiment, until the rubber meets the road many people have no way of knowing how they will react.

My wife and I have discussed many different scenarios, this being one of them. Being on the same page with the ones you care about should help alleviate some of the worry. You will at least know how your loved ones "should" act. But, until you are in that situation, it is all a guessing game for most people.

bob

I fathered four sons and had a pretty good run. Seems that with too many people already thinking of tucking tail and running that I had best go see if I can help solve the problem. Public service and all that. It is not playing hero. It is simply doing what you are supposed to do. I have little faith in a prompt law enfircement response anyway.

I carry a firearm for self protection. Pretty much everyone else in that mall had the right to do the same. If my family nor myself aren't in eminent danger, I see little need to put myself there. I'm leaving.

I will also say that I naturally avoid large crowds like the plague. I never really knew why. Maybe things like this are part of the reason.

I didn't survive one combat tour in Iraq and two in Afghanistan, plus two more "visits" to Afghanistan in the reserve to die in a mall. I carry a gun for self protection... not to be a hero.

Call me a coward or selfish or whatever, but my concern is for my loved ones.

Maybe one hypothetical scenario in which I would take the shot is if I KNEW there was only one shooter and I KNEW I had a safe clear shot.. and I KNEW there were no LEOs around to mistake me for a bad guy.... And so on and so forth.

This is indeed a vey hypothetical scenario because I avoid the mall at all costs.

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- The Federalist #46 -