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01-04-2014, 10:35 PM
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Colorado employer here. Random UA shows positive for MJ you are history. On-the-job injury with lab tests positive for MJ, you just lost 1/2 your medical costs and 100% of your wage losses and rehab expenses.
Some union shops may have other provisions in their contracts. I'm sure there will be a new specialization of W/C lawyers dealing with the medical expenses and rehab expenses, etc.
But the point remains, if you're doped you are screwed.
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01-04-2014, 10:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadin
I wonder if with all the license fees, production costs, purity inspections, storefront requirements, taxes, etc., etc., it will turn out to be cheaper to just buy your weed from the corner pusher.
(Kind of like buying cigarettes on the Indian reservation.)
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Couple of days ago the local newspaper (Pueblo Chieftain) published an interview with a local dope dealer of 20 years experience. Salient points:
1. With all the taxes and fees imposed by the state and local governments the legal pot will be significantly higher in price than the illicit street products.
2. The bogus (IMO) "medical marijuana" suppliers of the past few years have been the source of much of the local supplies of high-grade dope.
3. Most dealers have a core of regular customers who will continue dealing with the known and trusted source, at lower cost than the new "legal" recreational MJ dealers.
4. Established dealers will continue to provide enhanced customer service, providing regular home delivery just like the pizza guys.
I think that the major impact will be out-of-state people coming here for the wicked thrill of legally purchasing their dope in a shopping center storefront, then buzzing themselves for a night or two at the local motels.
Personally, I'm stocking up on Doritos and bean dip, offering free delivery at any time of day. Cash only, of course.
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01-04-2014, 11:26 PM
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"Do people die because of its effect ? Well, sure and from a lot of other things."
I've been told that cannabis is a "gate way" drug!
We may see a lot of cannabis users move up to aspirin!
I read where over 200 people died from aspirin last year...
wonder how many over dose deaths they had from cannabis?
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01-04-2014, 11:52 PM
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Doesn't ANYONE realize that making weed legal and under the control of govt. regulation will have zero effect on the Mexican suppliers?
Violators of the law will continue to find a consumer, and the cartel operators who get put out of the MJ biz will take up robbery, hijacking and kidnapping.
Ending prohibition in the 30's didn't get rid of the bootleggers, it just moved them into heroin, coke and pills, hijacking and robbery.
A criminal isn't going straight because the government changed a law. It's their nature! Criminals aren't out to perform a service to mankind, they're out to make money without working.
We, more than anyone, should know that from gun regulations.
So skip the "it'll end the cartels" talking point. All it (state control) does is change the voting demographic in Colorado, and that is all it was meant to do.
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01-05-2014, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old TexMex
Doesn't ANYONE realize that making weed legal and under the control of govt. regulation will have zero effect on the Mexican suppliers?
Violators of the law will continue to find a consumer, and the cartel operators who get put out of the MJ biz will take up robbery, hijacking and kidnapping.
Ending prohibition in the 30's didn't get rid of the bootleggers, it just moved them into heroin, coke and pills, hijacking and robbery.
A criminal isn't going straight because the government changed a law. It's their nature! Criminals aren't out to perform a service to mankind, they're out to make money without working.
We, more than anyone, should know that from gun regulations.
So skip the "it'll end the cartels" talking point. All it (state control) does is change the voting demographic in Colorado, and that is all it was meant to do.
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Legalize MJ nationally and regulate it like alcohol and tobacco and the criminals will get out of the MJ business. Unless I missed something, the cartels and street gangs are not dealing in black market booze and cigs outside of some trucks hijacked by Italians in the NY/NJ area.
I just bought 3oz of my favorite chewing tobacco for $2.89. Can you even get half an oz of weed for under $50? Turn over a few thousand acres of prime KY/NC tobacco fields to legitimate MJ production and the cartels won't be able to compete.
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01-05-2014, 12:15 AM
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"Can you even get half an oz of weed for under $50?"
Average Ohio price today for High Quality.. $359.55/0z.
Oh.. it's $236.16 in Colorado.
Last edited by 1morethan8; 01-05-2014 at 12:22 AM.
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01-05-2014, 12:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coltle6920
Personally,I believe the Leftist intentions of legalizing marijuana in Colorado...
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I agree that most people on the legalization of marijuana issue probably fall in the blue camp, but the idea to let people do with their bodies as they please and not to lock people up for putting substances of their choosing into their bodies, so long as they don't infringe on the rights of others, is as much libertarian (like me) than leftist.
I'm curious to see how DUI laws will be impacted by this. It's difficult to prove that someone is under the influence when they are pulled over. To my knowledge there is no equivalent to the breathalyzer for marijuana, and blood/urine/hair tests would not test for current intoxication. I wonder what provisions the state has enacted for this eventuality, I guess you can still lock them up for reckless driving or some such.
Also, with regards to "medical marijuana" I'm not sure if the bogus was referring to the medicinal uses for cannabis or not, but if so, the evidence strongly indicates it has a number of uses both in its natural form as well as its derivatives. I believe synthetic derivatives of the efficacious compounds in marijuana would probably be a better option clinically, but that's one of many unfortunate side-effects from the war on drugs, possessing these compounds for medical research purposes [to develop new drugs for the clinics] is near impossible. I'm not advocating we go all do drugs, but the research and therapeutic applications of LSD and cannaboids, to name a few, are very interesting and were an exciting field back when they were first isolated and characterized.
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01-05-2014, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1morethan8
"Can you even get half an oz of weed for under $50?"
Average Ohio price today for High Quality.. $359.55/0z.
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Yup, you can tell I don't smoke the stuff. But seeing that price, I'm might have to talk the fiance into turning our basement into a grow room! LOL
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01-05-2014, 12:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBus660R
Legalize MJ nationally and regulate it like alcohol and tobacco and the criminals will get out of the MJ business. Unless I missed something, the cartels and street gangs are not dealing in black market booze and cigs outside of some trucks hijacked by Italians in the NY/NJ area.
I just bought 3oz of my favorite chewing tobacco for $2.89. Can you even get half an oz of weed for under $50? Turn over a few thousand acres of prime KY/NC tobacco fields to legitimate MJ production and the cartels won't be able to compete.
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Sarcasm ignored. However, the point is that you won't make criminals into square johns by legalizing, so skip the talking point
that it will. Criminals will do something else. Weed heads may be happy, the vote in colorado will be blue, but criminals will continue to commit crime.
You may think cartel members are only capable of the weed business, but that isn't how they think, and it isn't even their main business anymore.
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01-05-2014, 12:31 AM
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“In strict medical terms marijuana is far safer than many foods we commonly consume. For example, eating 10 raw potatoes can result in a toxic response. By comparison, it is physically impossible to eat enough marijuana to induce death. Marijuana in its natural form is one of the safest therapeutically active substances known to man. By any measure of rational analysis marijuana can be safely used within the supervised routine of medical care. - DEA Administrative Law Judge - Francis Young”
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01-05-2014, 12:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old TexMex
Sarcasm ignored. However, the point is that you won't make criminals into square johns by legalizing, so skip the talking point
that it will. Criminals will do something else. Weed heads may be happy, the vote in colorado will be blue, but criminals will continue to commit crime.
You may think cartel members are only capable of the weed business, but that isn't how they think, and it isn't even their main business anymore.
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I'm not saying legalizing it will make all the problems go away. I'm not a dunderhead who's baked my brain. But I am saying with this particular subject, we can make significant economic changes. Cut spending on the penal side by a decent amount, raise a bunch through taxes, and use that substantial change in revenue to invest in things like a better border fence and more tools to go after the cartels penchant for smuggling humans, coke, heroin, and whatever else they may be into. Did repealing Prohibition end the Mob? Of course not. Was it good overall? Sure seems we're better off. Haven't seen too many Valentine's Day Massacres over alcohol distribution since then.
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01-05-2014, 12:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old TexMex
Sarcasm ignored. However, the point is that you won't make criminals into square johns by legalizing, so skip the talking point
that it will. Criminals will do something else. Weed heads may be happy, the vote in colorado will be blue, but criminals will continue to commit crime.
You may think cartel members are only capable of the weed business, but that isn't how they think, and it isn't even their main business anymore.
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So, it would make no difference if cannabis was legal or not.
With all the good medical things that cannabis can be used for..
what's the problem making it legal?
What if you could grow and make your own medicine from a plant in the back yard that would treat or cure most diseases? And it's a long list?
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01-05-2014, 12:42 AM
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Glad you see my point regarding the cure-all talking point so often put forward by many advocates.
My first post in this recent exchange was specific in that. I couldn't care about theory, all I know is there are still massacres that make valentines day small potato. I haven't said I was against legalization. That's up to the voters.
Sorry if I sound cynical.
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01-05-2014, 01:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old TexMex
Glad you see my point regarding the cure-all talking point so often put forward by many advocates.
My first post in this recent exchange was specific in that. I couldn't care about theory, all I know is there are still massacres that make valentines day small potato. I haven't said I was against legalization. That's up to the voters.
Sorry if I sound cynical.
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I get the cynicism. How's that saying go about all laws starting with good intent? LOL
My theoretical legalization scenario goes something like this
A: Must be grown in the USA, no foreign supplies allowed.
B: Farms and greenhouses must be owned by an individual (or family) and go through a licensing process. Can not be corporate owned!
C: Corporations can be involved on the processing side, if RJ Reynolds wants to come out with a MjArlboro, I'm all for it.
D: No advertising period, not on TV, not in print, no billboards, etc...
E: Age limits same as alcohol.
F: Develop a testing protocol that can determine intoxication (and not just general usage) like what we have with BAC for alcohol.
G: Definitely allow personal growing. Similar to home brewing/winemaking. I know this works against the taxation angle, but I'd rather have a million home growers here in the US buying supplies from their local garden store for their own stash than a bunch of illegals camping in soCal National Forests running an illegal weed farm that puts LEOs at risk and sends the profits south of the border.
Really not too far off what we already do with alcohol and tobacco with much stricter advertising and a slight socialist twist to it on the growing side. I know it'll never happen. My plan would piss everyone off except the end user, so no politician would vote for it in Congress. Not enough profit potential for big corporations, probably violates WTO regulations, and certainly hurts the corporations that profit from the war on drugs (private prisons, drug testing companies, etc..).
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01-05-2014, 01:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old TexMex
Sarcasm ignored. However, the point is that you won't make criminals into square johns by legalizing, so skip the talking point
that it will. Criminals will do something else. Weed heads may be happy, the vote in colorado will be blue, but criminals will continue to commit crime.
You may think cartel members are only capable of the weed business, but that isn't how they think, and it isn't even their main business anymore.
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You keep making the same 'points' with little evidence to back them up. The burden of proof is not met on most of your claims and telling us to skip the talking point while not addressing thoroughly it is a little absurd.
Lets take your argument that criminals are born that way and therefore will move to some other crime if the economic incentive to sell marijuana is removed. See "Transitions From Prison To Community: Understanding Individual Pathways" by Visher in which the recidivism rate is estimated at 70%. A habitual criminal, which you generalize to include all criminals, bad from birth, would always commit another crime, so since the recidivism rate is not 100% that's at least ~30% of criminals who are either rehabilitated or perhaps were criminals due to circumstances such as vast black market profits rather than being born bad. Also with the number of bogus laws in this nation, more than likely we are all breaking some law right now, but that doesn't mean we are defective.
Furthermore, since you fail to challenge the claim based on an economic perspective, I will assume you agree in general with the whole supply-demand argument already given, you're counterclaim is that it will simply reallocate criminals into another black market as you did in your example about bootleggers. First, prove that all or most bootleggers moved into another illegal exercise as you claim and generalize that to the current situation. Second, you talk about a transition of non-violent offenders into violent offenders because all criminals are the same in your world view. Again not proven, and a good chunk of psychology work would disagree with you, this has been studied in detail in domestic abusers. Also, since it is a black market, the only way to settle disputes is with violence, so the fact that it is illegal might be contributing to the violence you speak of. Third, even if all of the above is true, it doesn't mean that it should be illegal. Prohibition as you pointed out (still don't think your claims are all true but lets say they are) did all of those things, but that doesn't imply we should have kept prohibition.
As for the cartel point, the nice thing about the argument given is that it applies to many of the ways organized crime raises revenue (drugs other than marijuana, prostitution, illegal gambling and so on) . As a medical professional, I abhor drug use, but it's time for us to get realistic, prohibition doesn't work and the current war on drugs with mandatory sentencing laws and militarized police forces simply increases the profits for those willing to take the risk. I've met my fair share of people who are involved in the trade and they aren't scarface or dahmer, they are some looser trying to make a quick buck.
But the stats being used to discuss marijuana being safe are misleading, you can eat or consume alot of it and it won't kill you, its LD50 is absurd, so is LSDs for that matter, but long term use and high dose short term use does have negative effects that are difficult to measure. That being said, it is safer than alcohol though in alot of ways, the weed not the acid
Last edited by jmmitc06; 01-05-2014 at 01:09 AM.
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01-05-2014, 01:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmitc06
You keep making the same 'points' with little evidence to back them up. The burden of proof is not met on most of your claims and telling us to skip the talking point while not addressing thoroughly it is a little absurd.
Lets take your argument that criminals are born that way and therefore will move to some other crime if the economic incentive to sell marijuana is removed. See "Transitions From Prison To Community: Understanding Individual Pathways" by Visher in which the recidivism rate is estimated at 70%. A habitual criminal, which you generalize to include all criminals, bad from birth, would always commit another crime, so since the recidivism rate is not 100% that's at least ~30% of criminals who are either rehabilitated or perhaps were criminals due to circumstances such as vast black market profits rather than being born bad. Also with the number of bogus laws in this nation, more than likely we are all breaking some law right now, but that doesn't mean we are defective.
Furthermore, since you fail to challenge the claim based on an economic perspective, I will assume you agree in general with the whole supply-demand argument already given, you're counterclaim is that it will simply reallocate criminals into another black market as you did in your example about bootleggers. First, prove that all or most bootleggers moved into another illegal exercise as you claim and generalize that to the current situation. Second, you talk about a transition of non-violent offenders into violent offenders because all criminals are the same in your world view. Again not proven, and a good chunk of psychology work would disagree with you, this has been studied in detail in domestic abusers. Also, since it is a black market, the only way to settle disputes is with violence, so the fact that it is illegal might be contributing to the violence you speak of. Third, even if all of the above is true, it doesn't mean that it should be illegal. Prohibition as you pointed out (still don't think your claims are all true but lets say they are) did all of those things, but that doesn't imply we should have kept prohibition.
As for the cartel point, the nice thing about the argument given is that it applies to many of the ways organized crime raises revenue (drugs other than marijuana, prostitution, illegal gambling and so on) . As a medical professional, I abhor drug use, but it's time for us to get realistic, prohibition doesn't work and the current war on drugs with mandatory sentencing laws and militarized police forces simply increases the profits for those willing to take the risk. I've met my fair share of people who are involved in the trade and they aren't scarface or dahmer, they are some looser trying to make a quick buck.
But the stats being used to discuss marijuana being safe are misleading, you can eat or consume alot of it and it won't kill you, its LD50 is absurd, so is LSDs for that matter, but long term use and high dose short term use does have negative effects that are difficult to measure. That being said, it is safer than alcohol though in alot of ways, the weed not the acid
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You keep trying to start an argument. I'm not.
This statement I made is fact. My experience is that criminal behavior of CARTEL will not cease as a result of legalization. I do not care to argue with you over the internet about the price of snuff, domestic abuse, LSD, alcohol, eating weed, or anything else you seem to care about. Believe the smugglers will stop smuggling and go back to their beanfields if you want. It won't happen.
I repeat, I have no opinion on legalization, it is up to the voters.
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01-05-2014, 01:26 AM
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Quote:
For example, eating 10 raw potatoes can result in a toxic response. By comparison, it is physically impossible to eat enough marijuana to induce death.
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I think eating 10 raw potatoes falls into the physical impossibility realm for me.
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01-05-2014, 01:38 AM
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There's no requirement here in Colorado pertaining to having any kind of clearances-as arjay pointed out, if ANY employer (regardless of the type of business) has a policy that you can't use pot, are found out to do so you can be fired without any complications.
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01-05-2014, 01:41 AM
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The basic answer is Yes, they can. The topic has been in the local news a lot and the general consensus is Yes.
If the company has a policy against drug use, they make the rules for their employees to observe. It isn't much different than hospitals that disallow tabacco smoking by employees. If the company is in more than just Colorado -- all states -- then, they can abide by federal law and treat all employees equally.
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01-05-2014, 01:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S&W Fan
There's no requirement here in Colorado pertaining to having any kind of clearances-as arjay pointed out, if ANY employer (regardless of the type of business) has a policy that you can't use pot, are found out to do so you can be fired without any complications.
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With Colorado being a "employment-at-will" state..
you can be let go at any time without reason.
You don't even need to pee in a cup!
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01-05-2014, 02:06 AM
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01-05-2014, 02:14 AM
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Beautiful pictures there.
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01-05-2014, 02:20 AM
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01-05-2014, 02:29 AM
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I hope I don't ever need it for that disease, but I know it eased the cancer suffering of my first wife, in Mexico City- (where it is legal BTW).
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01-05-2014, 02:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmitc06
... As a medical professional, I abhor drug use...
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That seems really, really ironic to me.
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01-05-2014, 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Old TexMex
I hope I don't ever need it for that disease, but I know it eased the cancer suffering of my first wife, in Mexico City- (where it is legal BTW).
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Yes, it will kill pain.
He wasn't taking the oil for pain. He was taking it to try and cure his prostate cancer.. and to this point he has.
He is a Biochemist, graduated from the University of Houston and did his Graduate Work at Baylor Medical School. Dennis worked as a Cancer Researcher at the MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston.
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01-05-2014, 02:40 AM
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Originally Posted by SgtLumpy
That seems really, really ironic to me.
Sgt Lumpy
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To change this.. you must add the FDA label.
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01-05-2014, 02:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1morethan8
Yes, it will kill pain.
He wasn't taking the oil for pain. He was taking it to try and cure his prostate cancer.. and to this point he has.
He is a Biochemist, graduated from the University of Houston and did his Graduate Work at Baylor Medical School. Dennis worked as a Cancer Researcher at the MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston.
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I read the blog. I'm actually familiar with the procedure. My wife used it for Nausea relief from chemo (30 yrs ago). Last trip for me to MD anderson was six yrs ago.
I wasn't a researcher, either...
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Last edited by Old TexMex; 01-05-2014 at 02:50 AM.
Reason: Clarification
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01-05-2014, 02:46 AM
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On My Dime...
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Originally Posted by Krell1
I'd like to answer but I just did a couple doobies and now I'm at burger king ordering the entire menu.
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Using an EBT card?
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01-05-2014, 02:51 AM
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I'd like to understand the logic that allows card carrying pot smokers to have open stores, coffee shops and brownie bakeries with hooka lounges here in Maine's biggest city, but if I light up a Marlboro within 50' of the dope den's front door I go to jail.
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01-05-2014, 03:11 AM
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The push to prevent kids from starting and to convince us old nicotine fiends to quit has really gone over the top.We are seeing the same mentality towards people who over eat.
The Puritan ethic is going nuts again.
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01-05-2014, 03:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1morethan8
To change this.. you must add the FDA label.
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Not sure if sarcasm but I don't care much for the FDA, they really complicate the research process and are slow to accept new drugs that can be rapidly discovered and developed using modern techniques.
Hopefully there will be more human trials for the anti-neoplastic roles of cannabinoids, the majority of clinical trials are for its use in satiety, anti-emetics and sleep. It is a real shame that if what Dr. Hill suggests is occurring in vivo (unfortunately the biochemical pathway effects he is discussing have only been observed in vitro or in non-human animal models) he should get a study together and get something published in a peer-reviewed journal. I searched for some articles of his regarding this but didn't find any except for the two mentioned on his website which have not been published in a reputable journal.
EDIT:
Since people seem interested in this, here is a really thorough paper describing the system possibly manipulated by this treatment. Warning lots of chemistry talk...
http://www.hindawi.com/journals/ije/2013/259676/
Last edited by jmmitc06; 01-05-2014 at 03:42 AM.
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01-05-2014, 05:14 AM
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Drunk and/or stoned at work is not good for the employee or the company. A man should have the sense that he must be able to perform his job well and safely.
Still, being drunk (I really don't know how to describe this condition) is overlooked in many jobs,
I did not smoke when working---but after work there were so many who got together and we were fine the next day.
I don't care to hear the arguements that it stays in the system longer---I never found it to be a factor in my judgement the next day---and---I would not have done it if I thought it would or did.
I am just saying that the drug itself, as with alcohol, is not the cuplrit. As usual---it is the individual.
I am just telling the real world experience I had with involvement in this past time.
Your opinion is OK with me and you can do it your way.
Blessings
__________________
TEXAS, by GOD
Last edited by williamlayton; 01-05-2014 at 05:18 AM.
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01-05-2014, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paplinker
What about others being exposed to second hand smoke? Will they test positive?
Does anyone think Colorado will see more auto accidents?
Is there any way to prove fault if injured by a drug user?
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Short answer to second hand smoke question - No.
Long answer - I have been exposed to second hand smoke quite often for 20 years and I've never failed a urine test. For the past 4 years I've been getting hair tested once a year for good measure and get random clippings when I hit on the lottery, never had a blip for pot. I did test positive for hydrocodone 4 months after I last took any. I had a prescription so the testing agency contacted our nurse and told her they verified it and passed me.
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01-05-2014, 08:29 AM
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Sooner or later there will be a lawsuit in a marijuana legal state after someone gets fired for testing positive. If alcohol can be consumed while not at work and the employee not have any aftereffects the next day, then why can't marijuana be consumed? I know that some sort of test will have to be developed to determine what level of thc will be considered unacceptable while working or driving.
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01-05-2014, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1morethan8
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Apu being a Hummingbird - YouTube
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01-05-2014, 09:40 AM
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The issue that I see is that traces of marijuana stay in a person's system a lot longer than alcohol.
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01-05-2014, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebago Son
I'd like to understand the logic that allows card carrying pot smokers to have open stores, coffee shops and brownie bakeries with hooka lounges here in Maine's biggest city, but if I light up a Marlboro within 50' of the dope den's front door I go to jail.
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I'll give that logic a try.
First, I don't think you "go to jail" but I'll stipulate to the dramatic effect concept.
An "open store" or "brownie bakery" doesn't subject anyone to offensive smoke. It's just like an "open store" for tobacco. I don't think tobacco addicts are baking their drug into brownies but if they did, perhaps that would be similar. It's the SMOKE that's the offending property.
A "hooka lounge" is no doubt similar to a "cigar lounge" or other place where tobacco smokers are legally allowed to congregate and smoke.
A pot smoker within the same distance from the front door of an establishment is surely in violation of the same thing that a tobacco smoker is under the same situation. Plus the pot smoker is probably in violation if he's smoking ANYwhere in public, not just within 50 feet of something.
Sgt Lumpy
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01-05-2014, 11:10 AM
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I love the "medicinal" argument to legalize the drug.And there seems to be a legitimate need for that. That may be true for a small group of people, but let's at least be honest, people want to get stoned.There looked to be a whole bunch of "sick" people standing on line in Colorado the other day. I wonder if some of them were ever at their doctors office for any ailment. They all must have been allergic to prescription pills, for their ailments, since they were buying everything but. Unless...... brownies, gum drops and lollypops are used to combat your "allergy" to taking pills.
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Last edited by ladder13; 01-05-2014 at 11:41 AM.
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01-05-2014, 12:32 PM
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I got stoned on the job a few times during my career fighting forest fires. Unknown to me it was being grown illegally on a national forest that caught on fire; I ended up with bloodshot eyes, very hungry, and an illegal smile on my face.
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01-05-2014, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O2Guy
The issue that I see is that traces of marijuana stay in a person's system a lot longer than alcohol.
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There may be traces still in your system but you can function and think a whole lot better the next day after a high than you can a drunk.
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01-05-2014, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangerpat
I got stoned on the job a few times during my career fighting forest fires. Unknown to me it was being grown illegally on a national forest that caught on fire; I ended up with bloodshot eyes, very hungry, and an illegal smile on my face.
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Yeah, you get that
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Halfway and one more step
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01-05-2014, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paplinker
What about others being exposed to second hand smoke? Will they test positive?
Does anyone think Colorado will see more auto accidents?
Is there any way to prove fault if injured by a drug user?
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To answer your first question, I worked installing natural gas pipelines for 27 years and was drug tested regularly. The test is set up by a numbers scale. If you register a very low number the result is considered negative, allowing you to have been in the company of other smokers. A higher number is a positive reading meaning you are the smoker. Drinking large amounts of water will dilute the results but that often requires one more test which must not be diluted or the result is considered positive. For regular users pot can remain in fat cells for up to 30 days.
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01-05-2014, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmmitc06
Not sure if sarcasm but I don't care much for the FDA, they really complicate the research process and are slow to accept new drugs that can be rapidly discovered and developed using modern techniques.
Hopefully there will be more human trials for the anti-neoplastic roles of cannabinoids, the majority of clinical trials are for its use in satiety, anti-emetics and sleep. It is a real shame that if what Dr. Hill suggests is occurring in vivo (unfortunately the biochemical pathway effects he is discussing have only been observed in vitro or in non-human animal models) he should get a study together and get something published in a peer-reviewed journal. I searched for some articles of his regarding this but didn't find any except for the two mentioned on his website which have not been published in a reputable journal.
EDIT:
Since people seem interested in this, here is a really thorough paper describing the system possibly manipulated by this treatment. Warning lots of chemistry talk...
The Endocannabinoid System and Sex Steroid Hormone-Dependent Cancers
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Well.. maybe a little sarcasm.. but not enough to hurt.
Most in the medical field don't like to even talk about drugs and natural medicines that don't have the FDA approval. I guess they think they need to stay inside guide lines because of liability reasons also.
Most of what we see in the media is based on the "party time" and "get high" side. This leads many to think the "medical side" is only a front and only used for a reason to pass legal laws.
Cannabis oil(not hemp seed oil) has been used for thousands of years. Only in the last 10 years has it been brought back into the light as a possible aid or cure for many disease.
Most of the discoveries in the last 10 years has come from the common man and not large research labs.
Dr. Hill has been using "Rick Simpson Oil", and the use of the oil is being noticed by larger labs! GW Pharmaceuticals is a company in the UK who is using the natural oil from the plant.
Their new drug is called "Sativex" and is being used in over in 11 countries. GWPharma - Welcome
Make no mistake, Big Pharma doesn't want you to know how simple a person can make their own medicine from a plant they grew!
This man, Rick Simpson, grew and made oil for anyone who had cancer or other major conditions. It takes about a pound of buds to make 60 grams of the oil which he said is needed to be used over a 3 month period.
A pound of bud would bring over $5,000 on the street.. so what did he charge for the oil and his time growing and making the oil? Nothing.. he gave it away without cost!
Rick no longer lives in Canada. After raids on his property and
court trials he had to leave his country. All for giving his oil away for free! This is a site to look at. It tells the story from the other side!
Phoenix Tears
Phoenix Tears
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01-05-2014, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1morethan8
With Colorado being a "employment-at-will" state..
you can be let go at any time without reason.
You don't even need to pee in a cup!
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We're actually a modified "right to work" state. If the employees of a business are union represented and the required number of employees vote to "close" the shop then you have to join the union to work there. For example my younger son was required to join the union when he worked at a grocery store.
There have been strikes in the past at the Kroeger and Safeway stores, the strikers didn't loose their jobs. The Denver Broncos players went on strike on 1982 along with the rest of the league, cops and firefighters are represented by "associations" yet not all them are members (many but not all).
Anyway, even if the shop is "open" non-members get the benefit of representation in the event of a disciplinary action.
Sorry for being long winded, so the short version is regardless of this, if you violate a company policy you can be dismissed without too much difficulty. Other matters get a little more tricky. If the employer says "no marijuana" and an employee is found to use, that employee can be fired. It's already happened and the court upheld the firing. Brandon Coats was fired in 2010 by Dish Network, he's disabled, uses medical marijuana, fired.
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01-05-2014, 01:16 PM
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Banned
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mstuhr
Howdy,
I want to know about line 5 on the 4473 form "Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?"
Are all those people lined up outside those stores subject to visits from the ATF? It's a federal form and against federal law.
Thanks
Mike
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............................One thing you may want to think about is--MAYBE they passed that stupid law with the Federal Law in mind-in order to keep some others from being able to own or buy guns? .......................................
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01-05-2014, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the ringo kid
............................One thing you may want to think about is--MAYBE they passed that stupid law with the Federal Law in mind-in order to keep some others from being able to own or buy guns? .......................................
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Correct. Give them a little something and take away something big in return. "We'll let you legally buy pot but you won't be able to buy or own firearms."
"Wow! I can buy pot? Sign me up!"
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01-05-2014, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBus660R
Legalize MJ nationally and regulate it like alcohol and tobacco and the criminals will get out of the MJ business. Unless I missed something, the cartels and street gangs are not dealing in black market booze and cigs outside of some trucks hijacked by Italians in the NY/NJ area.
I just bought 3oz of my favorite chewing tobacco for $2.89. Can you even get half an oz of weed for under $50? Turn over a few thousand acres of prime KY/NC tobacco fields to legitimate MJ production and the cartels won't be able to compete.
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No they will not stop selling it and you did miss what he was trying to say. Not in these words but essentially the same meaning is that passing that kind of STUPID,INSANE, IDIOTIC, LAW has lots of ""hidden"" things that will be connected to it one way or another. No matter how some look at it? means they are on a slippery slop downward--only now its full throttle thanks to escapees from a lunatic asylum. Personally, I feel sorry for those in Colorado who have to put up with insane liberal garbage. They are basking in liberal glory and are running amok-at least till 2014.
What's with "Its against the law (now only Federal in this case) that they do NOT understand???/
Last edited by the ringo kid; 01-05-2014 at 01:55 PM.
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01-05-2014, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old TexMex
Sarcasm ignored. However, the point is that you won't make criminals into square johns by legalizing, so skip the talking point
that it will. Criminals will do something else. Weed heads may be happy, the vote in colorado will be blue, but criminals will continue to commit crime.
You may think cartel members are only capable of the weed business, but that isn't how they think, and it isn't even their main business anymore.
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Hi Tex, I wouldnt even bother trying to explain more than once. Neither of our points will be seen no matter how much we try.
PS, no personal attacks meant and this time, I dont mind a thread closed because of me.
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01-05-2014, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1morethan8
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Stoned Hummingbirds, now thats funny.
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