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Old 04-19-2014, 10:56 AM
feralmerril feralmerril is offline
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Default Why do they cover their faces?

Its been a growing thing. Years ago you never seen it. Now we see many military operations and some swat world wide cover their faces. None did it in past wars or operations. I suppose some would say its done to protect them and their family's at home. I say BS. I think its because they are ashamed. Did it not start with terrorists? Do we need to copy them? Its shameful when Americans do it!
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:04 AM
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Considering the mentality of the terrorist..
I don't blame them.

"What ? You trying to stop me from hurting other people?"
"I'll kill you and your family to"

After watching the movie "Taken" 1 & 2
You just can't reasoning with some.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:06 AM
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Feral I'm like you-I suspect they have their reasons but it concerns me. Our police are becoming more and more military like rather than staying policeman and is scares me sometimes. I have voiced this concern to lots of policemen and while I can understand special units being all decked out, the whole force Years back our small town police chief showed up at a high school football game wearing that black and white urban camo pants with a black T shirt emblazoned POLICE. Hell even the probation officers show up in court wearing their 511 pants, boots with full belt rig. I'm thinking about getting some of those 511 pants with a black tee shirt emblazoned with "First response lawyer-nobody talks, everybody walks".
But then again lots of stuff bothers me today.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:13 AM
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Our little town doesn't have many cops - Maybe 8 when things are good. And that's for all three shifts.
I asked the Chief why the mil look?

IF something happens at the school or one of the banks there won't be time to hunt up equipment - We want it with us RIGHT THEN.

Makes sense -- The nearest help is at minimum 7 minutes away with a cop car going at full tilt. Even then the cop would have to be at the west edge of the next town and the trouble at the east side of here. ANYWHERE else and the roads are really curvy with 90 degree turns here and there.....
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:13 AM
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With current face recognition and search engines it would be very easy to find information about family members, publish it in social networks to organize protests or worse... I can see the value - to protect their families...


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Old 04-19-2014, 11:23 AM
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Merrill, you and CajunLawyer raise some good points here.

I want our police forces to be as safe at what they do as possible. They're the thin blue line for all of us.

It is disturbing, though, that we are edging more into military-style garb, weaponry, and tactics, and it bothers me too.

Yes, the terrorist aspect is at the root of it, I think. But there has to be a line somewhere, with protection of our police officers and their ability to do their jobs properly on one side, and reasonable limitations on their actions on the other.

In one way, there's not much difference, I think, between a police officer wearing a mask, and one wearing a helmet with a dark visor over his face. The first protects only his identity; the other protects his identity and his face/head. I can stomach the helmet and visor much better than the mask, though.

Maybe most of us here are of a certain age where only the bad guys wore the masks, and we have a hard time getting used to the idea of the good guys needing them too.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:34 AM
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We did see it with the Ku Klux Klan and seems I have seen western movies where some local groups were running off squatters and would hide their faces. I think the biggest reason really is some halfwit thinking that it is suppose to "Terrorize" people. With me personally, it would have the opposite reaction. If I seen someone with a ski mask coming up my driveway or anywhere else I would be scrambling for my nearest gun. (Unless it was 40 below).
What does irk or bother me is when it is done by our tax paid LEO, I think they have crossed the line and are immature wannabe`s brought up on action movies.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:35 AM
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My neighbor is a current SWAT sniper and another good friend is former SWAT. I asked them, "Why do you cover your faces?" The answer: "Intimidation, pure and simple."

I guess that makes sense, but personally, if some dude approached me with his face covered, I'd be prone to shoot. My friends had a response for that, too. They said, "You wouldn't have time. We'd be coming at you too fast. That's all part of it...intimidation and move quickly."
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:50 AM
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My next question might be "Why do you all shave your heads and wear those space alien sun glass`s?" But then in my time they wore aviator sun glass`s and had mustaches. Wonder who starts these trends?
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:06 PM
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Shaved heads and mustaches are a trend. I don't shave my head but I keep it really really short. For me it's about being too lazy to go to the barbershop every week or two however short hair is a + in a fight. Something less to grab onto.

Wearing masks is not just about intimidating. It also hides the identity of a undercover agent, if there was one. If he's the only one wearing a mask it's easy to know who he is, to those being arrested. Besides that criminal do threaten police officers and their families. Even prison officers get hits put on them. As for soldiers (this can potentially apply to cops) look at who they are fighting. Just look at Theo Van Gough. He was a Dutch film maker who's views weren't liked by Islamic fundamentalists. He was captured, shot and beheaded on the streets of Holland in broad daylight in front of witnesses. There are people out there that will prove a point regardless of consequences. Now, they might not be able to capture a SF member but their families are a whole different story. And this is not even talking about cartels who put hits out on cops

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Old 04-19-2014, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arik View Post
Besides that criminal do threaten police officers and their families.
I agree that those are probably the reasons, but I still call BS.

I taught school for 24 years. I was threatened dozens of times. At least four times, there was reason to take those threats very seriously. I was once ordered by the administrators to lock myself in my room, because an irate parent was on the way to the school to do me bodily harm. I ignored the order, and taught my classes.

I had to confront and disarm students (mostly knives and box cutters, never a firearm) at least several times a year.

I never had the option of wearing a mask to disguise my identity.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:21 PM
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I agree but if your job is arresting cartel members and taking large amounts of drugs of the streets the threats tend to be a little more serious especially when they have shown over and over that they kill cops and their families across the border.

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Old 04-19-2014, 12:23 PM
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Well guys, with all the LEO on this site, there HAS to be some of you that has went through swat training. What was said to you or taught to you on the matter? Seems to me I even seen a short shot of it with that controversy with Bundy and the BLM in Bunkerville Nevada the other day. In that case I would have wanted to hide my face too were I ordered to face off that crowd.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:27 PM
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When I suited up and put my balaclava "mask " on, it was to protect me from spitting, fire, cuts, and never for intimination. Mine were made from nomex same as when I was a volenteer firefighter, just not as thick.
I still wear one in the cold when hunting.

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Old 04-19-2014, 12:32 PM
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I thought it had to do with the rise in the number of cases of acne.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:46 PM
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Old Fashion Cop:
I like to look like a POLICE OFFICER.
1. Neat short haircut
2. Clean Shaven
3. Clean, neat uniform, fresh laundried, with creases.
4. Freshly shined black plain toed shoes/boots
5. Uniform Hat (no baseball cap)
6. Socks same color of uniform pants
7. Shined badge and brass
8. Gun Belt that doesn't sag
9. clean trimmed fingernails
10. LOOK SHARP, BE SHARP ! ITS ALL ABOUT OFFICERS PRESENCES
*** I was once a Swat "Marksman" (by gone era) and even on call out, I looked like a POLICE OFFICER.
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feralmerril View Post
My next question might be "Why do you all shave your heads and wear those space alien sun glass`s?" But then in my time they wore aviator sun glass`s and had mustaches. Wonder who starts these trends?
I asked a young'un that one day and he asked if I'd rather have the aviator Ray-bans and the 70's porn star mustache instead?
I thought a minute and said "you look just fine"
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:08 PM
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Now Russian troops doing their replay of Munich in the Ukraine are doing the same, which is a new and sinister twist. Maybe it makes it easier to herd people into boxcars?

In the US (anywhere?) anything coming at you in a mask is up to NO good.

Honest men don't wear masks.

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Old 04-19-2014, 01:14 PM
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Could part of this trend of dress, and equipment, be due to so many grants pouring in from uncle sugar ?
A little burg near me got one of those Sherman tank looking vehicles not too long back, that, although it cost a fortune to operate and maintain, the hacks- in-charge, claimed, "did not cost us a dime", as though, if it comes from the federal pocket, it is no longer coming out of ours.
mulepacker hit on the" intimidation" factor. It seems to be a new trend.
Even read a while back, about how much the front profile of crotch rocket motorcycles are designed to look as though they are a "scowling" face for, intimidation factor.
What ever it takes to keep the bad folks in line.
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:20 PM
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Now I know why I am scared of surgeons!
Even all the newer cars look like mad fish attacking us!
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bat Guano View Post
Now Russian troops doing their replay of Munich in the Ukraine are doing the same, which is a new and sinister twist. Maybe it makes it easier to herd people into boxcars?

In the US (anywhere?) anything coming at you in a mask is up to NO good.

Honest men don't wear masks.

So every firefighter, doctor, skier, hunter, painter, etc are not honest men?
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Old 04-19-2014, 01:58 PM
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I want to respect the police not fear them or be intimidated by them. I would think the former would tend to instigate fewer acts of violence against an officer more than the latter.
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
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Honest men don't wear masks.
Now just hold it right there, sonny...........

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Old 04-19-2014, 02:04 PM
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I wear a camo mask when duck hunting.
I don't hit many, so there are plenty of survivors to seek revenge.
Those little woodies can be awfully sneaky. I'm not even gonna go into what the mallards are capable of.....
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:11 PM
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I'm betting the everyday public would come to the aid of a Cop who needs help that they see in a regular uniform a lot faster than they will to a guy in a mask and a helmet. Who the hell knows who is under that mask? Cop or FEMA thug?

I was proud to be a Cop and it showed. I never even heard the term "back up" until after I left LE. I felt and knew I had the support of the public I served.
I would have never been concerned about what a dash camera would have shown of my actions, in fact I would have welcomed that kind of gimmick.

I had a DUI gal prisoner telling me what she was gonna accuse me of when we got to the jail house. What she didn't know was I had my radio mike button down the entire 45 minute trip to town and every LEO and dispatch center in the State was listening to and recording her. She was kinda meek when she got to listen to herself the next day.

More than once, I would be in a "squishy situation" and some old boy would stop and either just watch or ask if I needed help. Usually those guys had a 30-30 in a gun rack and wouldn't have hesitated to use it if things went south.

I was always glad to see them and thanked them sincerely when things got squared away.

It is sad that things have changed so much over the years. I can't blame the Cops for their attitudes today.

I think things started going down hill when city PDs quit using foot patrols where folks and kids saw Cops every day and knew that they put their non-combat pants on one leg at a time like the rest of us.
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
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Feral I'm like you-I suspect they have their reasons but it concerns me.
Not wanting to be easily identifiable as the respondent in a possible civil suit is certainly a reason.

That mentality goes hand in hand with turning off dash/lapel cams and recorders, and trying to stop people from photographing or videoing them during their public, on the job activities.
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:54 PM
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It might have started with the storming of the Iranian embassy by the SAS in 1980; they were all in black and wore gas masks. Of course, the masks were there for protection because of the CS gas they used. And the black boilersuits had a practical purpose if you're going to be jumping in and out of buildings.

If you remember this, it made the headlines worldwide. Other military and police might have been "inspired"...

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Old 04-19-2014, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
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We did see it with the Ku Klux Klan and seems I have seen western movies where some local groups were running off squatters and would hide their faces.
I believe that Robert Duvall refers to them in "Open Range" as "spook hoods", or words to that effect.
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Old 04-19-2014, 03:08 PM
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so how often does a swat member have to testify in open court? I would bet there isn't any judge going to let them wear their mask in court. I think if the bad guys want to get you and/or your name it can be done without much trouble
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Old 04-19-2014, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
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I'm betting the everyday public would come to the aid of a Cop who needs help that they see in a regular uniform a lot faster than they will to a guy in a mask and a helmet. Who the hell knows who is under that mask? Cop or FEMA thug?

.
No different than cop thugs in uniform. Never know what's going on in his head.

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Old 04-19-2014, 03:16 PM
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OK, Moe--you've got a point there. I suppose we'll be inundated now with pictures of Batman, the Green Hornet, The Shadow, and Lord knows who else...

(I should have posted a caveat excepting American comic book heroes.)

I was a Roy Rogers and Lash La Rue kid,myself.
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Old 04-19-2014, 03:33 PM
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Even in mid evil times with chain and mall (mail?) their faces were covered with iron or metal mesh. In those cases I thought it was to protect their faces from sword or knife cuts? Really though, today it seems to be a fad factor. There are other jobs with the fad factor of dress. For instance, my company once sent me to guard a project where many steel and iron workers were building something. I noticed it seemed almost required to a man of them to wear very loud and bright colored unusual patterns of shirts and baseball caps.
I do suspect the face masks swat and other spook groups etc wear like as badges to terrorize people they are dealing with. As I said earlier, with me, it would have completely the opposite effect.
Remember the sunday comic strip in the 1940`s, "The Phantom"?
https://www.google.com/search?q=the+...w=1366&bih=638

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