Rant Alert! Dodge Charger lug nuts?

[Farmer17]

So I go to change the flat tire on my daughters 2006 Dodge Charger and the factory lug wrench won't fit the nuts on the aluminum wheel. I look in the owners manual and it shows the lug wrench fitting on the nuts but it is not even close. So I drive to Auto Zone and tell them the problem and they look up on their computer and sell me a 4-way wrench that will definitely fit the car. It's 21mm and I try again and it's still too small. I call the Dealer and the service guy said the lug nuts have polished aluminum covers on them and they swell because of heat so I need a bigger wrench. I drive 30 minutes back to Auto Zone and trade the wrench in on a 22mm and take the first lug nut off and the nut is jammed in the end of the wrench, and I beat on it with a hammer and screw driver for 15 minutes before I get it out. The aluminum cover is totally mangled, then I take off two more lug nuts and the last two the wrench won't fit on. I call a different Dodge dealer and service tech and he tells me to try to take the lug nuts off with a socket, and I said "Really? you can't make a car that the factory lug wrench works?" He said "I'm sorry sir I didn't design it". I hang up and then I realize I have a Ryobi battery air compressor in my tool kit, so 5 minutes later the tire is inflated and I take it to a Firestone store and they fix the flat in 30 minutes.

Am I doing something wrong, is it really that hard to change a flat tire on a Dodge?

[rwsmith]

You should be able to fit a socket with a handle and maybe a bit of a cheater.

I had the same problem with a Cadillac that was screwed INTO the dam hub. Not into the HOLE, but into the hub so you couldn't get a wrench on it. These air wrenches wheel places use are ridiculous. I asked a guy one time not to drive them so tight. He said that the wrench was set. Yeah, I know it's set. Way to high.

I weigh 232 pounds and I have to STAND on the handle and bounce to get ones that would come off loose.

You can get a T-handle for sockets. I used one of those on my water heater.

[DWalt]

I saw a T-lug wrench once which took 1/2" drive sockets, so they do exist. I often use a 1/2" ratchet with socket as a lug wrench, but a T-handle is better for leverage. I have a folding T-handle wrench I bought at Harbor freight, and really like it as it stores much more easily in my wheel well.

[allthumbs]

And they still use them ! One of the 1st things I did on my 2014 Challenger was change the lug nuts, I highly recommend gorilla lug nuts.

[finesse_r]

I thought the lug nut technology was mastered 40 or 50 years ago. Well progress as time marches on.

[Alk8944]

Didn't any of the people you spoke with tell you that the wheel-nut covers are strictly decorative and should be removed before trying to remove the nuts?????? If not they should have! If the wheels were stock, not after-market, odds are the wrench that came with the vehicle would have fit the nuts after removing the nut covers!

[allthumbs]

Originally Posted by Alk8944

Didn't any of the people you spoke with tell you that the wheel-nut covers are strictly decorative and should be removed before trying to remove the nuts?????? If not they should have! If the wheels were stock, not after-market, odds are the wrench that came with the vehicle would have fit the nuts after removing the nut covers!

I helped a person pulled over with a flat knowing this but most people have no clue or something handy to get that tin cover off.

[steveno]

I have never had to used the lug wrench in my 2004 Colorado so I don't know if it works. I do keep a 19 mm deep well socket with a 4 inch extension and used with a 24 inch breaker bar.

[Yorkie Man]

Does anyone remember when Dodge had left hand threaded lug nuts? Plenty of broken studs if you couldn't see the "L" stamped in the center of the stud.

[sw282]

Lug nuts on a Chrysler?? Never again...l had a 66 Barracuda once.
Flat tire on the passenger l jack this sucker up and WRING the first
2 OFF! What is going 0n?? So l call my lead pusher at the tire shop..
He tells me the old Barracudas have LEFT HAND threads on the
passenger side.. Who ever designed that?? Wonder how YUGO nuts
were threaded?? OK, now l have 2 broken studs...An unsafe wheel
drum.. And l am late for work..l take it to the lead junkie and BOZO
pulls the drum. Lays it down and proceeds to CRACK the drum with
a hammer and chisel...He tried to knock the old studs out with no
support behind the stud. Ever try and find a brake for a 17 year old
off brand..After almost a week we located one off a 65 Dodge Lancer.
lt really was a neat old car...Bought used as a second car, Even made a
GREAT camper.. Lay back seat down, and panel to the trunk. Sleep out
under the STARS...

[Farmer17]

Originally Posted by Alk8944

Didn't any of the people you spoke with tell you that the wheel-nut covers are strictly decorative and should be removed before trying to remove the nuts?????? If not they should have! If the wheels were stock, not after-market, odds are the wrench that came with the vehicle would have fit the nuts after removing the nut covers!

That's the problem the covers won't come off! One of them would actually just spin on the lug nut, and no screwdriver or knife blade can even get underneath the covers to remove them. The guy at the Firestone store who changed the flat said "its an easy solution, just buy aftermarket chrome steel lug nuts from Auto Zone". So you spend $30,000 on a new Dodge and you immediately have to spend a $100 on aftermarket lug nuts. Makes me wonder what else Dodge did that is going to haunt me?

[Tom S.]

Originally Posted by Yorkie Man

Does anyone remember when Dodge had left hand threaded lug nuts? Plenty of broken studs if you couldn't see the "L" stamped in the center of the stud.

The engineering brilliance behind that idea was forward rotation wouldn't cause the lugs nuts to loosen. Perhaps Chrysler engineers back then didn't know you could apply torque principles to lug nuts?

[arjay]

Originally Posted by Yorkie Man

Does anyone remember when Dodge had left hand threaded lug nuts? Plenty of broken studs if you couldn't see the "L" stamped in the center of the stud.

Snapped two studs on the family bus as a kid trying to change a flat.Pop was thrilled

[Bullet Bob]

What I can't figure out is why auto manufacturers continue to supply manuals with their cars, since it's very obvious nobody reads them.

I belong to a couple of car forums, and I'm often bemused by queries that indicate instructions are a sealed unit. And the shamelessness of the posters - I would be embarrassed to ask something indicating I couldn't or wouldn't read, but that's not the way of most of the world. It's not a youth thing; I had an old friend (who died a couple of years ago) who never read anything. He depended entirely on word of mouth from people "who knew about things".

As to why wheel nut covers are suddenly popular, I have no clue. My new VW GTI has them, but there's a tool in the kit to remove them. My young salesman was stunned to see me look inside the tool kit before I bought the car to make sure everything was there. He said he had never had anyone do that before! The internet is great, I downloaded the manual before I picked out the car so I'd be familiar with it.

[bearman49709]

Originally Posted by rwsmith

You should be able to fit a socket with a handle and maybe a bit of a cheater.

I had the same problem with a Cadillac that was screwed INTO the dam hub. Not into the HOLE, but into the hub so you couldn't get a wrench on it. These air wrenches wheel places use are ridiculous. I asked a guy one time not to drive them so tight. He said that the wrench was set. Yeah, I know it's set. Way to high.

I weigh 232 pounds and I have to STAND on the handle and bounce to get ones that would come off loose.

You can get a T-handle for sockets. I used one of those on my water heater.

Never had a lug nut put on by any impact wrench I couldn't break free with one hand.Then again I've bent many of the old bumper jack handle/ lug nut wrench's with one hand while trying to remove lug nuts.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

You'd think an aluminum decorative lug nut cover would be designed to be removed to change the wheel?

For the first time in 16 years my truck got a flat tire. Easter Sunday. Walked out to the garage in the morning and there it was... flat. Sure enough there's a screw in the tire.

What to do... where's that tire plug kit I bought an eon ago? Oh yeah... used it on the Camry about 10 years back and never replaced it. Got a couple cans of Fix-a-Flat.... eh that'll just make a mess and probably won't work anyway. The floor jack is starring at me like it's never been used for anything other than lifting the ride mower. I have an air impact wrench and deep impact sockets but then I'll have to wrestle with the spare tire under the truck... sigh. I'm thinking that maybe I'll just go back to bed, but then get to wondering how far I might be able to drive if I inflated the tire. I fill it up to 35lbs and go inside for a cup of coffee while congratulating myself on avoiding any work. 10 minutes later the tire is at 30lbs. I'm good.

Who's open on Easter Sunday? Walmart is open on Thanksgiving so why not Easter, right? Sure enough... they're open and so is the auto service department. Eh.... maybe I'll just go inside and watch TV and deal with this Monday. Good idea.

Monday I fill the tire to 40lbs and ride on down to Stevie Ray's Midnight Oil at exit 11 in Ooltewah. I see Stevie and tell him I miss listening to his Saturday radio auto repair show from years ago. He chuckles and asks what's up. Stevie's boys fix the tire and says I'm good to go no charge... spread the word. So that's what I did.

[Nevada Ed]

Well at least your Dodge had a spare tire that worked......... didn't it ?? !!
I had a heck of an bummer moment on my first flat !!
How do things like that happen ?

Did love the old 340 Plymouth Duster, though.

[Rule3]

AAA........

About as much fun as the one locking lug nut on my alloy wheels I removed them and put the regular one back on. I don't live in a wheel snatching area. If they want it they take the whole vehicle!

[Bekeart]

Originally Posted by Yorkie Man

Does anyone remember when Dodge had left hand threaded lug nuts? Plenty of broken studs if you couldn't see the "L" stamped in the center of the stud.

NOT always the case.

Back in the early 60's I had a 56 Dodge had some of the left hand threaded studs on drivers side stamped L and some stamped R. Same confusing mixture on the passenger side with right handed threads.

Dealer and shop crew just scratched their heads. Obviously stamping and threading were done at different times.

Bekeart

[bigchuck83]

I work in a tire shop and deal with this all the time, the factory lug nuts have caps that are oversized and will make it difficult to remove them. Some Chevrolet vehicles use similar ones. Whoever designed them should be tortured on a daily basis.

[DWFAN]

Here's the down and dirty about those lug nuts. It took Chrysler two years to figure this out.I was working in a Dodge dealership at the time.
Water got underneath the caps, froze and expanded the caps. Thus the wrench won't fit. Chrysler was replacing them while under warranty but after that tough luck. One tech had the bright idea of sealing the edge of the chrome cover with red Loc tight. Problem solved. Those lug nuts aren't cheap either. Imagine having to replace all of them at one time.

DW

[BruceB]

I had to listen to my 85+ year old neighbor rant last night about his flat tire experience on his reasonably new Mercedes C-Class sedan.

Gets a flat, opens trunk, lifts cover over spare tire well, no spare! He's good and PO'd, calls his dealer and goes off on them cheating him out of his spare tire. They tell him "sorry, we don't supply spare tires any more". After a couple of more calls to other dealers and a regional office, they offered him the free optional pressure can with sealant to re-inflate his flat tire. No spares any more, even though the tire well is still there.

He's getting rid of the car as fast as he can, I think to buy a small Lincoln that DOES have a spare tire !

Edit: He traded it today for an Audi, with a spare tire

[snake803]

Originally Posted by BruceB

I had to listen to my 85+ year old neighbor rant last night about his flat tire experience on his reasonably new Mercedes C-Class sedan.

Gets a flat, opens trunk, lifts cover over spare tire well, no spare! He's good and PO'd, calls his dealer and goes off on them cheating him out of his spare tire. They tell him "sorry, we don't supply spare tires any more". After a couple of more calls to other dealers and a regional office, they offered him the free optional pressure can with sealant to re-inflate his flat tire. No spares any more, even though the tire well is still there.

He's getting rid of the car as fast as he can, I think to buy a small Lincoln that DOES have a spare tire !

Edit: He traded it today for an Audi, with a spare tire

2007 F-250, 20" goodyears (4).. hit a pot hole and busted the side wall, both sides... Went to the tire place, they had to order a replacement.. "We put your spare on and you should be OK for two days. Oh by they way, If the ride is a bit unusual, It's because the spare is a 17" 'er".. Come to find out, the depression in the spare tire well is designed for a 17" spare...A 20" assembly wont fit... How's that for a $65k king ranch?????
Done with rant..
JIM.......................

[Yorkie Man]

I'll tell you my story about the genius of the automobile industry.
In February of 1979 I took delivery of a new Chevrolet K-10 4wd pickup truck. I ordered this truck in December of 1978. The only options I ordered were a 350v-8, auto transmission, rear bumper, snow tires and a spare tire. Yes you had to order a tire to go with the bare wheel that came with the truck.

It had snowed before i got the truck and soon after I was driving down a gravel road near my house one night and stopped to make my bladder a little lighter. As I walked by the left front fender I heard a hissing sound which turned out to be the left front tire loosing air from a defect in the sidewall. I backed up to the edge of the paved road and set about changing the tire. The spare was located under the back of the bed in a rack that had a padlock to prevent theft. In their ultimate wisdom they had installed a plastic cover over the key portion of the lock to keep out road debris. No only did it keep out debris it held in water which had turned to ice given the temperature. Her I am laying on the sloppy ground in the dark trying to get the key into the lock which was to no avail. Fortunately I hadn't heeded the Surgeon General's warning regarding cigarettes yet and I had a Bic lighter in pocket. These lighters were only designed to light a smoke not thaw out anything and by the time it had it was red hot, burnt the **** out of my hand. I managed to get the lock of which I promptly threw as far as my arm would allow. The lighter was trash also and it was laid to rest close to the lock.

God love those engineers.

[Texasgordo]

I had a 2002 Dodge Ram with factory 20" wheels. Each wheel had 1 lugnut that required a special socket to remove. The problem was that the special socket stripped out really easy. I ended up replacing the anti theft lugnuts with regular ones.

[Farmer17]

One more rant about locking lug nuts, my 2004 Nissan Titan came from the dealer with them, I think they charged me $85 extra and I bet the dealer cost was under 15 bucks. Anyway I was doing an out of town construction project in a tiny town about 100 miles away and starting to drive home on a Friday afternoon. I get a flat and I'm dead tired and it was about the hottest day of the summer, but I get out and start to take the wheel off and the top of the locking lug nut breaks off! I try everything to get that lug nut off including beating on it with a hammer for 30 minutes so I walk into town and its getting late and nearly everything is closed. Luckily someone sees me and asked if I need help and they happen to have a small sledge hammer and they beat on it for about 30 minutes and bust off the broken lug nut.

[Tom S.]

My neighbor's son bought a used Ford Bronco that had a wheel lock lug on each wheel, which he only discovered when he got a flat tire. No corresponding socket was provided with the truck when he bought it. I gave him an air tank to inflate the tire so he could drive over to my house, then welded old lug nuts to each of the locks. Off they came and were replaced by stock lug nuts.

[Comrad]

You had a spare, luxury!

Welcome to the new Mopar spare.

[JJEH]

Lug nuts can be a can of worms, especially if pre-owners messed with aftermarket wheels, locks, nuts, etc.

I got Sunex impact sockets that feature a hard plastic sleeve so you son't scratch your rims. Guess what, with the aftermarket aluminum rims on my Ram I had to take that sleeve off. It simply wouldn't fit. Anyway, weren't expensive rims so I didn't really care, just saying that it can be tricky. And then we haven't talked about thread size, open end/closed end, shaft length, seat style, etc.

I changed my wheels and nuts and now I'm happy

[NYlakesider]

As far as this old time gear head is concerned locking lugs are not worth the money. Many people lose the key! Then getting them off is no problem if you know how to do it, but the average car owner does not. I know how but I will not put it into print!

A thief or a person with some basic car knowledge can remove the lugs just about as fast as he had the key. I will not waste my money buying lockers and the wheels and tires on my Vette can be over a $1,000 apiece. Park smart and if the worst happens (which is not that common) insurance will take care of it. Note most people never have a problem but the companies that sell locks will try to make you believe they do happen a lot!

As far as the reverse threads on the Chrysler products, I worked in gas station of that era and also had a few Dodges with that setup. No problem if you know what you’re doing!

I have a very complete socket set/s and use a ratchet or breaker bar and socket to change wheels today!

[CAJUNLAWYER]

Man you hit a sore spot with me Kids with these impact wrenches think that they need to max them out ant torque down the lug nuts to 1 million ft/lbs. And then tell me I have problems because the aluminum wheels have warped! BRAVO SIERRA!! Or that piss ant little jack they give you with the wanker little lug wrench/handle/ratchet assembly that they expect you to be able to torque off the aforementioned over tightened lug nuts with. And what's with this metric nonsense of American Car/truck lug nuts? Whatever happened with using SAE measurements?
I don't know about you guys, but I carry around in the back of old blue a bottle jack, a couple of 2x4 blocks and a 24" breaker bar with the matching socket for the lugs.

[Krell1]

Any lug nut I ever removed had been previously tightened by a gorilla. I had to put the wrench on and then jump up and down on the handle to get them to break loose. If I had a length of pipe to slide over the handle it would have given me a little more leverage to get them loose. This was in a parking lot in 100 plus temps. So hot I couldn't kneel on the pavement. Cursing and sweating was profuse.

Years back I had a tent camper with a flat tire. In that case, they were not lug nuts but rather bolts that screwed into the hub. They had been on so long that they were rusted in place. I finally got the bolts off then had to hammer the wheel to get it to release. Another sweat and curse tirade.

[NCW Ray]

Originally Posted by snake803

2007 F-250, 20" goodyears (4).. hit a pot hole and busted the side wall, both sides... Went to the tire place, they had to order a replacement.. "We put your spare on and you should be OK for two days. Oh by they way, If the ride is a bit unusual, It's because the spare is a 17" 'er".. Come to find out, the depression in the spare tire well is designed for a 17" spare...A 20" assembly wont fit... How's that for a $65k king ranch?????
Done with rant..
JIM.......................

My 2003 Silverado SS AWD has 20" wheels and has a 17" spare but the diameter of the two is the same. The 17" is a plain steel wheel and isn't as pretty but works fine and is cheaper to make.

[dswancutt]

Originally Posted by bigchuck83

I work in a tire shop and deal with this all the time, the factory lug nuts have caps that are oversized and will make it difficult to remove them. Some Chevrolet vehicles use similar ones. Whoever designed them should be tortured on a daily basis.

Chevy has used a stainless cap on an odd sized lug nut clear back to the 1970's on their pickups with Rally wheels. I have replaced all of them on my fleet with chromed solid lug nuts, but they rust after awhile. Still better than spinning caps.

[Inusuit]

Not lug nuts (my '49 Dodge pickup had those left side/reverse threads BTW). I was 50 miles south of Casper Wyoming. Flat on my 2011 Xterra. Jack that came with the vehicle would not lift high enough to get the tire off. Two 70 year old guys, 95 degrees, no shade. Fortunately, had a couple pieces of 2x6 so made the change. Discovered the original tires on the "Pro 4X" version of the Xterra were 4 ply. Nice. Took the truck to the dealer when I got home. "Well, sir, you must be doing something wrong." Show me. "Uh, the jack won't lift it high enough."

Did a bit of research and discovered that Nissan has known about the problem since aboug 2009. Same jack still comes with the Xterra.

[BUFF]

The cheap, flimsy jacks the car makers supply really piss me off. They usually strip after one use. I have had them strip the first time I used them on Ford Crown Vics. If Ford is paying more then three bucks each to buy them, I would be shocked.

When my department went to car-per-man, one of the fist things I put in the trunk was a floor jack and a breaker bar with a deep socket that fit the lug nuts, plus a few other sizes for motorists' flats.

I ran my department's crime lab for a few years. The field techs (CSI's) were civilians and an earlier captain and undersheriff had taken away their individual trucks and replaced them with pool vehicles, 4 trucks for 8 techs to share. I had great techs, but most were women and when they got a flat, they just drove it back to the lab and took another truck. Sometimes I came in Monday morning and 3 of the 4 trucks had at least one flat apiece. My floor jack got some use then.

My '87 Ford F-250's spare is under the rear of the bed and there is no mechanism to lower it or raise it but your own arms, while laying on your back. I could do it when the truck and I were younger, but probably not now at 63-1/2.

Tires are better than they used to be. That makes me happy.

[Alk8944]

Buff,

WVC by chance, or SSL? Obviously not SLC! We didn't have spares in the cars! Get a flat have dispatch call the shop, give them the car number and the wrecker brought out the correct tire and wheel, changed it for you, and you went on your way.

[BUFF]

Sheriffs Office/UPD.

When we got new cars, the county fleet specified full size spares, then pulled out the new tires/wheels and put used ones in the trunks for spares.

We had some chases and spikings that went astray and flattened a lot of patrol car tires at the same time. I can only remember one time the county shop would call out one of the tire guys at night and bring us a bunch of spares. We used commercial wreckers on contract if we needed a wrecker to haul a dead roller to the shop.

Nice thing about being a patrol sergeant was the troops would change my flats for me. The last week I drove a Crown Vic I got ran off the road one night, blew out 3 of 4 and had to steal the spares from 2 of my guys. Whole shift showed up and it looked like a pit stop at Daytona as they slapped good tires on my car for me. I had some great crews that took care of me.

[PatriotX]

How's this for backwards thinking ? My Jeep has 4 tires/wheels of the same size on each corner.


The spare tire/wheel provided only clears the REAR BRAKES !!!


This means that if you get a flat in front, you have to jack up the car, switch the front and rear wheels, then install the spare on the rear.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[johngalt]

I carry a 12V air compressor and a can of fix-a-flat in my car.

Both times I have had a 'flat', the pointy object that punctured the tire stayed in, so the tire didn't actually deflate. I had plenty of time to drive to the mechanic and get it fixed. Unfortunately, both were unfixable and required a new tire.

Tire pressure sensors give plenty of advance warning, so now if my tire gets low, my strategy is to use the compressor to inflate the tire. If that alone doesn't keep it inflated long enough to get me to the mechanic or home, then use the can of fix-a-flat and try again.

To heck with jacking up the car and changing a tire on the side of the road!

Especially with my Corvette, which is too low to get a jack underneath and doesn't have a spare anyway. My new car doesn't have a spare either.

[Muss Muggins]

I know a fella who works for a place that rents sets of big fancy expensive wheels for people to put on old Suburbans and Caprice Classics. My buddy's job is to repossess them when the renters miss a weekly payment. He has a pickup truck, two floor jacks, a cordless impact wrench, an endless supply of cinder blocks, and the keys to the locks for nearly every wheel known to mankind. I watched him once. Five minutes and he was gone. Like a one man NASCAR pit crew . . .

[BigBill]

I have a stripped lug nut on my jeep now. Need to drill it out and replace it. I purchased 20 new solid steel chrome lug nuts to replace the two piece ones.

[JJEH]

Originally Posted by Muss Muggins

I know a fella who works for a place that rents sets of big fancy expensive wheels for people to put on old Suburbans and Caprice Classics.

Oh my... people... I can't believe that this is a business, smh.

[NYlakesider]

Originally Posted by JJEH

Oh my... people... I can't believe that this is a business, smh.

Its there, mostly a big city enterprise. Those big wheels and super sized tires do not come cheap. Rent them for a while impress the other folks, return or have them taken back by owner! New renter next week!

[JJEH]

Originally Posted by NYlakesider

Its there, mostly a big city enterprise. Those big wheels and super sized tires do not come cheap. Rent them for a while impress the other folks, return or have them taken back by owner! New renter next week!

That's crazy. If you want it and don't have the cash go finance it. There's nothing wrong with that. But renting? For what? To show off? For a week? And then what? Go back to the factory wheels and tell everyone what? Your precious wheels got stolen? Wow... what a world...

[Muss Muggins]

Originally Posted by NYlakesider

Its there, mostly a big city enterprise. Those big wheels and super sized tires do not come cheap. Rent them for a while impress the other folks, return or have them taken back by owner! New renter next week!

Town of 35,000 has one. Called Rent N Roll . . . .

[NYlakesider]

Originally Posted by JJEH

That's crazy. If you want it and don't have the cash go finance it. There's nothing wrong with that. But renting? For what? To show off? For a week? And then what? Go back to the factory wheels and tell everyone what? Your precious wheels got stolen? Wow... what a world...

Most of the people doing that would have to pay at a very high usury rate to get financing. I will leave it at that!

[JJEH]

Wow, just wow. I'm sorry for my slight drift off the subject here but... I don't know, I just shut up now and get another coffee...