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Old 08-01-2016, 03:15 PM
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Smile Church Security Detail Advice

Hi:
Those member who are part of their Church's Security Detail:
I have been asked to be a member of the Church Security Detail for the early Sunday service at the Church my wife and I have started attending. For the early Sunday Church service there is but one member (a retired LEO) and He would like a partner. This early Sunday service is casual dress.
For the Forum Members that are Church Security, how do you do the security ?

Thanks,
Jimmy
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Old 08-01-2016, 04:20 PM
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I would be up in the balcony sitting alongside the organ with an AR leaning beside it. Just in case. It reduces the possibility of being outgunned.
I guess this reflects my outrage that church security is a serious consideration.
Jim
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Old 08-01-2016, 07:10 PM
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I'm surprised they haven't requested all CCL participants to identify themselves so they could make sure they are evenly dispersed around the church.
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Old 08-01-2016, 11:45 PM
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Default Keep an eye on the crowd.......

Especially newcomers. We put people in the back of the church where they can see to take care of 'situations'. It's not just 'security'. We've had a woman pass out. One mentally disturbed guy had a slight tantrum. So far, no big surprises.
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Old 08-02-2016, 12:34 AM
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We had a local officer come do a security survey of our church & then he presented his findings at a business meeting. He pointed out things as simple as labeling entry/exit ways inside & out; we can now tell 1st responders what door to come to & they can find it from outside. This officer teaches a similar to our ALLERT known as Citizen Response to Active Shooter (CRASE) & gave a quick overview of it.

We can't have an armed security detail, unless they are trained by DPS & our insurance didn't want the liability. So we have a welcoming committee; & some of them are licensed to carry. Every Sunday, 2 of us stand outside the sanctuary; greet people & hand out bulletins. We insure only the 2 main entry points are unlocked after church starts; we have radio communication with the nursery; 1 walks the parking lot on a regular basis and 1 is outside the sanctuary at all times.

We're a small country church with about 100 attending on Sundays. We have 3 active LEO, 2 retired LEO, and our pastor & at least half of our deacons are LTC & do so regularly. Many of the congregation are LTC but only about 5 do so on a regular basis in church.
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Old 08-02-2016, 05:02 AM
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I headed up security for about 8 years at our small church.

Some ideas for service security:
1) forget the cars! people are more important. If car vandalism becomes a problem that needs dealt with, get a Uniformed Special Duty Officer.
2)the number of attacks on the speaker have risen sharply, both pastoral staff and guest speakers. Talk the managing board into making access to the podium very limited from the audience, then have somebody qualified seated close buy to intercept attackers.
3)the ushers/greeters need to do more than shake hands and show people where to sit. They really are the ones that give you a heads up about strange behavior. We try to seat them in a few seats in from the isle and have a friendly large person "befriend" and sit with them, put them at ease, and signal for assistance if things get out of line.
4) know the local law and church policy on CCW in your church. Ohio requires non-LEO's to have permission to carry in church, I knew every regular member that had CCW permit and permission, these were all a source of comfort and back-up.
5) somebody needs to be in an over watch position. I had a seat up in a balcony. and could see every person during church. this caused the teenagers to behave a bit better too.


The last bit of advice is the sickest part. Church/ Sunday School, has become a place to abduct children. Most common is non custodial parents. Trained teachers and nursery staff is you defense from perverts, and vengeful family. NEVER RELEASE A CHILD TO ANYONE THAT DIDN"T BRING THEM!!!


Panhandlers and people with physical needs like that, are a function for the Deacons or Elders, know who handles that for when the need arises. Our church got requests about once or twice a month on Sundays. Not always a scam, but most real needs come during the week. The "Need" for gas money being number 1! Set it up that nobody gives out cash, even for real needs. We had $10 gift cards for Gas, Groceries, and A Restaurant. When the Deacons needed to help people, no cash was given. (this all came from the benevolence funds, almost every church has one).

Have fun serving you new corrugation, you will meet a lot of great people.

Ivan
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Old 08-02-2016, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyj View Post
Hi:
Those member who are part of their Church's Security Detail:
I have been asked to be a member of the Church Security Detail for the early Sunday service at the Church my wife and I have started attending. For the early Sunday Church service there is but one member (a retired LEO) and He would like a partner. This early Sunday service is casual dress.
For the Forum Members that are Church Security, how do you do the security ?

Thanks,
Jimmy
Hi our church really does not have a set policy as of yet. I typically get up at the beginning of praise and worship., and walk the exterior perimeter ensure all doors are locked from the outside and scan the parking lot. Then I return in through the main entrance doors close off all classroom doors and turn off the lights in those rooms. This is also good time to ensure all coffee pots are turned off. Then I return inside the sanctuary and sit towards the window where traffic enters the church parking lot and keep a eye on any cars that pull in during the worship service. I am a CCW and do carry concealed during worship service as do several more of our church members including a couple ushers. This leaves the main entrance doors unlocked from the outside so anyone running late can still enter but if I see a car enter the parking lot I do not recognize i will get up and go investigate. I think your church is wise in working towards a security detail. I think unfortunately in this present age we all need to take a lesson from Nehemiah. Work / Worship while keeping a sword in our other hand.
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Old 08-02-2016, 07:18 AM
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Jimmy,

I am on our Church's security team, our SOP is the same as any other venue.

Posted observer(s) front and rear entrances, etc....

I do carry discreetly, a S&W 39 with 115gr +P+. But, thinking on upgrading to a 10mm.


Su Amigo,
Dave
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Old 08-02-2016, 07:48 PM
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I and a co-worker are the church security. Fortunately we have a very small church and limited access from outside. We also have a male church member patrol the parking lot during services. There is only one entrance into the worship area. My co-worker sits near the door and I'm about mid way up toward the podium. Others in the church carry on occasion, but not reliably and most of our congregation is made up of older folks. I recommend trying to cover as many entry ways as you can and dividing the responsibilities with your retired LEO friend.
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Old 08-02-2016, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keith44spl View Post
Jimmy,

I am on our Church's security team, our SOP is the same as any other venue.

Posted observer(s) front and rear entrances, etc....

I do carry discreetly, a S&W 39 with 115gr +P+. But, thinking on upgrading to a 10mm.


Su Amigo,
Dave
Dave:

Somehow, a 39 just doesn't fit the picture I have in my head from some of your posts!!! Is it at least tastefully engraved? With a hand tooled holster? Just kidding. It's a real shame that we even have to think of stuff like this. When we were growing up the thought that someday we would have to worry about security in a church was unthinkable.

Our little rural church never even locked the doors when I was a kid. My dad was a talented amateur artist, and (before I was born) he painted a larger than life, probably 6'x10' painting of Jesus as the Shepard for the church. No one knew that he was working on it except my mom. He took it over in the middle of Saturday night, and hung it behind the altar. Sunday morning everyone was delighted with it, and it still hangs there today. (That was in 1945). That church was never locked, and I don't remember any problems back then. We live in a different world today for sure.

Today it is locked.

Best Regards, Les
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Last edited by les.b; 08-02-2016 at 08:10 PM.
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Old 08-02-2016, 08:20 PM
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I occasionally attend either a Cowboy church or a Biker church service. No security detail required in either one of those gatherings.
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Old 08-02-2016, 08:42 PM
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Default Church Security

JimmyJ

I'm guessing that the church has a small congregation because there is only one person doing early service security. If that is the case I'm also guessing that your church does not have a balcony. In either case I suggest forgetting the "over-watch" thought because in the event a situation occurs your presence may be needed IMMEDIATELLY. Being in a balcony prevents this. Over-watch is for teams that post someone with a long gun to address any threats and provide intel. I doubt you'll be so equipped...or needed.

For a two man team I would suggest one member located INSIDE, near the main entry point. That way any obvious threat can be addressed quickly. It won't hurt to amble outside now and then to check the parking lot, but cars are a secondary concern...especially to a small force. It also good to get to know the faces of regular attendees so that anyone not a regular will stand out. These people can be discretely observed, without undue alarm.

The second team member should be located in the sanctuary, positioned someplace near the rear so that they can quickly come to YOUR aid if needed. Rotate your assignment each week so that neither misses the service every week.

My church has a membership of over 1500, so we have a security staff of 10+. That is in addition to the FBI, Homeland security and local PD who are in the congregation - all carrying.

Good luck!
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Old 08-02-2016, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comrad View Post
Wow, church going sure ain't what it used to be. I think I'll just stay home and put my hand on the radio.
Same applies to going to work, doctors offices, movie theatres, grocery stores, malls, and others.
Looks like you're going to be spending a lot of time at home!
Oh, wait...same thing applies there too!
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Old 08-02-2016, 09:28 PM
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Brotherhood Mutual - Church Insurance - Home
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Old 08-02-2016, 09:44 PM
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Our church has about 600 members and we always have a paid, uniformed Oklahoma City PD officer inside the entrance at all Sunday services and Thursday night service. Many of us are also on rotation as security area watchers and the request for many more volunteers has gone out recently.
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Old 08-03-2016, 12:33 AM
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I had to give up my position as a member of the security team. Our insurance carrier won't allow official members of that team to carry without a bunch of training and a separate policy rider and other conditions.

So, I'm off the security team but still serve as an usher/greeter. For anyone not on the security team the only rule is you have to be legal to carry (21 years old and have your CPL).
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by les.b View Post
Dave:

Somehow, a 39 just doesn't fit the picture I have in my head from some of your posts!!! Is it at least tastefully engraved? With a hand tooled holster? Just kidding. It's a real shame that we even have to think of stuff like this. When we were growing up the thought that someday we would have to worry about security in a church was unthinkable.

Our little rural church never even locked the doors when I was a kid. My dad was a talented amateur artist, and (before I was born) he painted a larger than life, probably 6'x10' painting of Jesus as the Shepard for the church. No one knew that he was working on it except my mom. He took it over in the middle of Saturday night, and hung it behind the altar. Sunday morning everyone was delighted with it, and it still hangs there today. (That was in 1945). That church was never locked, and I don't remember any problems back then. We live in a different world today for sure.

Today it is locked.

Best Regards, Les

Ah, that little 39 is jest a 'Sunday go to Meeting hideout pistol'.

It is truly sad that a church house door would ever have to be locked for any reason.

But, since the community here has a rather large gov't sponsored
influx of folks from the mid-east and what with the FBI rounding up a few
here and there with ties to Islamic states,
there has been some creditable threats in the area.

So, I felt it prudent to sell my cloak and buy a sword..... I reckon.



Su Amigo,
Dave


.
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Last edited by keith44spl; 08-04-2016 at 10:35 AM.
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:41 PM
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Asked and answered......kinda.

It is amazing that a church security thread can never seem to run well.
It's not complicated- we're talking about securing a building of one size or another containing a crowd of one size or another against a threat of one kind or another.

It doesn't take Doctrinal argument, silly jokes, or spiritual rumination.
Help out, or move along.
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Old 08-04-2016, 12:43 AM
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When the leadership of our church decided they were interested in better security they spent about $100K on cameras, monitors and computers. They also hired a single armed guard for Sunday services. There was no discussion of security being provided by the membership.

Its kind of a liberal outfit. Yet FWIW, no 30.06 signs have been posted.
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