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Old 06-27-2017, 08:36 PM
JLPiccard JLPiccard is offline
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Default Very short trip to the range today

So, I stopped by my favorite shooting range today for a bit of stress relief. I got checked in, and almost had my station set up when I thought I saw some glass shattering out of the corner of my eye. Turning my head, I saw a 2nd light bulb shattering in a lane at the other end of the range. The RO was on a bathroom break, so I called a cease fire. I started over to the idiot shooting out light bulbs, when another person turned around - with their gun in hand - and flashed me with their muzzle. About that time, the RO comes back on the range - takes one look at me and sees the guy flashing me, and kicks him off the range immediately. After all that, I pointed at the lane where the glass was all over the floor. As the RO was kicking that guy off the range, I decided to pack my stuff up and head out.

Now, I need some stress relief from my stress relief - lol. When I got out to the front counter, the owner of the gun store / range apologized profusely. He thanked me as I was trying to resolve the issue, and gave me an additional one year on my membership for free. I do know the first idiot has been banned permanently from the range, and the 2nd guy has been told he can't come back for 2 months. Quite an eventful day.
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Old 06-27-2017, 08:57 PM
pawngal pawngal is online now
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Wow, that was a daily double.
If it was me I'd need a drink, a double.

Seriously, thank you for trying to resolve a dangerous situation.
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:02 PM
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I would think that the range couild press charges against the bulb shooter. Some people like that might benefit from some stiff penalties.

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Andy
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:04 PM
Ivan the Butcher Ivan the Butcher is offline
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I'm glad your range takes safety seriously! Our club only gives it lip service.

Ivan
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:24 PM
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Good job! I was working as a Range Safety Officer Sunday, and a father with his 10 year old was "teaching" him to shoot a 22 LR AR clone, which he had built. Every other round was a light strike which irritated the kid and me. I asked what the issue was and the guy said, "I don't know, but it's happened a lot". I suggested he take it home and clean the bolt, check function, etc. and the guy agreed. They then headed to the pistol range to join the wife/mom who was shooting a Glock 26 quite well.

I hung around to watch because the dad made me nervous and the kid was a brat. They proceeded to try to teach the kid to shoot the Glock, for the first time, but dad set it up with an extended, aftermarket mag. This time FTF happened several times, and after some discussion with me they began to pack up and go home to clean things. As the dad headed down range to retrieve the target, the kid/brat reached for the cleared and holstered pistol on the range table, leading me to yell loudly.

They left with the dad trying to tell me that he appreciated my intervention, and me telling him he should teach his kid the basic 4 firearm safety rules before returning to teach him anything else.

What a day!
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:26 PM
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So if they left why not stay and shoot?

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Old 06-27-2017, 09:30 PM
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So if they left why not stay and shoot?

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RSOs can't shoot while on duty...or I would have.
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:31 PM
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Wow, hell of a range visit you had there!
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:40 PM
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RSOs can't shoot while on duty...or I would have.
Sorry I meant the OP.

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Old 06-27-2017, 10:03 PM
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I was at the outdoor range on Sunday

100 yard range is for rifles

One 25 yard range for rimfire handguns

Another 25 yord rang for centerfire handguns

A final "practice range" for handguns and shotguns where you can move around and walk towards target while shooting
The practice range is posted no centerfire rifles and it's in the club rules

When I went to take my shotgun to the practice range the people using it were firing 5.56 AR type rifles. I mentioned that I did not think these were allowed on the practice range and left.

I mentioned this to the range officer on the way out.

Don't like to be a spoil sport but there is a good reason for no rifles on the practice range.
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Old 06-27-2017, 10:13 PM
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So if they left why not stay and shoot?

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Mainly, it was just the frame of mind I was in at the particular moment. I just needed some time to calm down, and wouldn't have enjoyed it until I had calmed down somewhat. It was one of those times when I just felt the need to walk away for a while.
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Old 06-27-2017, 10:50 PM
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Wow! Sounds like quite a day.

I had one of those "bad frame of mind" days - but not nearly as dramatic as yours: There were about 5 guys shooting ARs. They'd come to the range with a TON of magazines all loaded up. They set up water bottles on the 100 yd range. I had paper targets on that same target rail.

They're hootin' and hollerin' and making all sorts of noise - yelling so they could hear with their ear protection on. The spray of water from their bottle hits was coming into my field of view as I was trying to settle down and take shots. They were emptying and replacing magazines almost as fast as they could. They weren't violating any range rules but they were being annoying in general and more specifically all of their laughing and joking around was making me wonder if they were really paying attention to what was going on and was there an increased chance of a muzzle sweep or something like that.

Me shooting became more of a burden to me than packing up and going home. It just wasn't fun.

It sounds like the only "mistake" the range made was having the RO leave while on a hot range. But beyond that, it sure sounds like they handled the situation well in terms of making it right for you. I'm glad it worked out well!

OR
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Old 06-27-2017, 11:08 PM
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Glad you made it home safely !!
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Old 06-27-2017, 11:32 PM
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Default At least you had an RO....

At our ranges in the state forests it is a free for all. It's dangerous to take a trip out there. No RO.

THOUGH:

They have just upgraded one of the ranges into what it should be, with different ranges for different weapons AND A RANGE OFFICER. It was GREAT being there.
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Old 06-28-2017, 04:48 PM
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At our ranges in the state forests it is a free for all. It's dangerous to take a trip out there. No RO.

THOUGH:

They have just upgraded one of the ranges into what it should be, with different ranges for different weapons AND A RANGE OFFICER. It was GREAT being there.
Georgia DNR has 2 RSO - staffed shooting ranges within driving distance of me. One is really nice - the one at the Clybel Wildlife Management Area. It's about a 2 hour drive for me to get to that one, but well worth the drive. The RSO's are really on top of things there. I know I've seen a lot of folks from SC on the occasions I have visited that range.
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Old 06-28-2017, 05:06 PM
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I don't go to my range for stress relief because I work there and what little stress I have in my life comes from there.

Last lines of my safety/procedures speech: " All firearms remain in the shooting stall unless they are holstered or cased, do not come this side of the yellow line on the floor with an uncased or unholstered firearm for any reason"

What happens? Guy walks back into lobby, comes to counter, points a gun at my belly and ask what he should do about the live round stuck in the chamber!
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Old 06-28-2017, 05:19 PM
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I don't go to my range for stress relief because I work there and what little stress I have in my life comes from there.

Last lines of my safety/procedures speech: " All firearms remain in the shooting stall unless they are holstered or cased, do not come this side of the yellow line on the floor with an uncased or unholstered firearm for any reason"

What happens? Guy walks back into lobby, comes to counter, points a gun at my belly and ask what he should do about the live round stuck in the chamber!
Yikes.

I don't know how you guys deal with having to deal that kind of thing day in and day out.
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Old 06-28-2017, 05:41 PM
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Yikes.

I don't know how you guys deal with having to deal that kind of thing day in and day out.
The counter-balance to those types are the honestly ignorant but willing/wanting to learn types. I enjoy passing on what little knowledge I have and helping people pick out a gun that meets their needs/wants. Or the good old boy types that know what they are talking about as opposed to the know it alls.
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Old 06-28-2017, 11:41 PM
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Was he shooting the lights intentionally?
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Old 06-29-2017, 06:36 AM
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I'd have banned them both. And then taken a long look inward and worked up a procedure for range officers to get covered during breaks.
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Old 06-29-2017, 07:58 AM
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Was he shooting the lights intentionally?
I can't say definitely whether it was intentional, but given the distance between the target holders and the lights it would be awfully difficult to hit the lights if you are aiming anywhere on the target. If it wasn't intentional, the guy needs a heavy dose of training.

Well, actually, he needs a heavy dose of training either way - lol.
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Old 06-29-2017, 08:14 AM
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I avoid any ranges with ROs. I'd rather be muzzle swept. When it happens .....and I can only think of ONE time that it happened.....I simply ask the person to be careful and pay attention.

"My friend, can you be careful where you point the muzzle!" That's all it took. ROs on the other hand are either annoying and opinionated or act like nazis. I have a range within walking distance unfortunately it has ROs. Last time I was there was probably 10 years ago. I got yelled at for having my foot touching the red line we're supposed to stay behind when not shooting. I wasn't over it, I wasn't on it I was just almost touching it. Then I couldn't shoot at two targets on my target stand. Couldn't pick up brass because they bounced in front of the gun. This was the last time. The time before I needed to be told I can't shoot my gun at that distance because it was designed for close in. I was shooting 25 yards with a Walther PPS. Of course came the "polymer sucks and you need.....".

Yeah not thanks! I'll take getting possibly muzzle swept one or twice in 20 years over RO any day

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Old 06-29-2017, 08:21 AM
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So judgemental! In some cases, banning folks from a range is just the opposite of what we should be doing. Perhaps a half hour of mandatory remedial training is what is called for. We're losing enough shooters on a daily basis as it is. Many folks don't have the same background we have. It's up to us knowledgeable folks to improve that situation. Try to turn a negative situation into a positive one. But, don't be a **** about it. If some "know it all" gives lip or attitude, feel free to take appropriate measures.

I don't think it's wise to cross someone that is known to have gun(s). Now, if we could just get those folks with compensators banned from the range, I'd be a happy man.
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Old 06-29-2017, 11:12 AM
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I can understand some of Arik's comments, having been involved in USPSA competition, and my home range being the site of many USPSA Regional and National matches I have met many very fine conscientious RO's, and unfortunately I have also met several boisterous, loud mouth, know it all's that act as if every single movement on their range must be under their personal supervision and every move is followed by loud calls of "foot fault", "180", etc, etc. for every competitor, even the super squad, so as to draw attention to himself. It got so bad I no longer compete in USPSA.
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Old 06-29-2017, 11:46 AM
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I'm a member of a very nice 600 acre private shooting range just 17 minutes away from my house. It's got nine skeet ranges, black powder, archery, 300 yard sillouette range, 500 yard rifle range, .22 range, plinking plates, cowboy action shooting, IPSC three gun, and sight-in range. We have a digital code entry and cameras all over the place, and nearly every thing out there has bullet holes in it. Signs, buildings, chairs, roofs, trash cans, out houses, and I'm there pretty often and all the people I see and talk to appear to be responsible and safe shooters so I have absolutely no idea who has done all the vandalism and negligent shooting.

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Old 06-29-2017, 12:20 PM
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Over the years I've shot at public ranges, ranges that require purchase of a membership and private clubs.

Public ranges tend to have a lot of problems as described in the OP because anyone can wander up to the firing line and start shooting. A lot of membership ranges aren't much different. Pretty much anyone can wander up to the firing line and start shooting if they have enough money in their pocket to buy a membership.

Our private club tries to prevent unsafe behavior from ever reaching the firing line.

Membership application requires sponsorship by a current member of no less than three years. No one wants to sponsor an idiot. Waiting list is about two years. Once approved (not all are), there's a required safety orientation that takes a couple hours in addition to walking the properly of a half dozen separate ranges over several acres to understand how things work and rules that govern each range. An additional form equivalent to a 4473 is also required to be on file. Once all that is done and fees paid, an electronic gate card is issued that allows 365 day unlimited access for shooting from 30 minutes before dawn to 30 minutes after dusk. You are now allowed on the firing line. We have no ROs but have cameras everywhere. Most folks are as excited to finally become a member as they are attentive to following the rules because no one wants to get booted after the time, effort and expense of becoming a member.

It works for us. Our members aren't perfect but we do pretty well.

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Old 06-29-2017, 03:00 PM
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I tactfully make safety corrections when needed, usually well received. Occasionally get the goober who says he knows all about gun safety as he has never had an incident. I tell him that's great, but the rules are in place not only for his safety, but also for others to not only be safe, but to FEEL safe while on the range and don't want to be around people who don't play by the same rules
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Old 06-29-2017, 03:06 PM
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ROs are like traffic cops. They enforce the rules so everyone can be safe. I wonder if someone who shoots out lights at the range trashes his own place ? And I have zero tolerance for rude and inconsiderate people.
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Old 06-29-2017, 03:28 PM
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Reinforces my reasons why I wear body armor to the range.
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Old 06-29-2017, 03:33 PM
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I read all 28 posts. Thanks to the shooting Gods on high for allowing me to live as long as I have with my own range. In all the years I have only asked 2 people to leave. I am indeed blessed and I take seriously the obligation of taking in like minded people to shoot and learn together.
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Old 06-29-2017, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLPiccard View Post
Georgia DNR has 2 RSO - staffed shooting ranges within driving distance of me. One is really nice - the one at the Clybel Wildlife Management Area. It's about a 2 hour drive for me to get to that one, but well worth the drive. The RSO's are really on top of things there. I know I've seen a lot of folks from SC on the occasions I have visited that range.
Thanks! I had no idea we had even 1 RSO range among the DNR sites. What is the other one?
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Old 06-29-2017, 03:49 PM
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Reinforces my reasons why I wear body armor to the range.
I'm not as prepared as you are but I never go to a range without a trauma bag that is sufficient to handle penetrating wounds and a sucking chest wound.
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Old 06-29-2017, 03:52 PM
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After a round from a DE 44 magnum hit the wall next to me from the shooter in lane 4 who was NOT following safety rules, I won't hit the range without tshirt style body armor.
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Old 06-29-2017, 04:06 PM
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I am not stating that the Reno Range is tuff on safety but.......

I do not think the guy shooting the lights out, would have left
the range with that weapon he used..........
until he returned with the money for the damage caused.

The other guy might be sitting it out until a Sheriff came to haul his butt off
for the paper work on any pressed charges.

Most people here don't like a gun waved in their face !!
All muzzles are to be pointed down range only!!
What don't you understand about that rule ?

I will not get into the legal stuff.........


Glad you worked things out and stayed safe.
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  #35  
Old 06-29-2017, 07:01 PM
JLPiccard JLPiccard is offline
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Originally Posted by PPS1980 View Post
Thanks! I had no idea we had even 1 RSO range among the DNR sites. What is the other one?
The other one that is within driving distance from me is the Wilson Shoals WMA shooting range. That one is just north of Gainesville.

There may be others - these 2 are just the 2 that I know have an RSO on duty.

You do need a GORP pass or some other qualifying license to use them - but it's fairly cheap. I got a 1 year GORP for something around $20.

Last edited by JLPiccard; 06-29-2017 at 07:03 PM.
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Old 06-29-2017, 10:19 PM
Whitwabit Whitwabit is offline
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Originally Posted by Ivan the Butcher View Post
I'm glad your range takes safety seriously! Our club only gives it lip service.

Ivan
The two ranges I go to do .. the indoor range has a list of a couple of people not allowed on the range anymore because of safety violations or dis-obeying the RO on duty .. I've also seen the RO give a warning that if not complied with would have resulted in a ban .. before joining you have to watch a 15 minute movie on what is allowed and not allowed and what will happen if you don't follow the rules .. they are also posted on large poster board in large letters in several places and on every range !!

Most of the safety violations have been from newer shooters from what I have seen personally .. doing something they just didn't think about .. such as turning off the range pointing at someone when a failure occurs while shooting!! pointing a firearm at someone with out thinking the violation I have most often seen occur ..

the out door Range I belong to has just put cameras on all 7 of the ranges after some vandalism and some members violating others members rights (bullying a young man and his son that were shooting) .. I think some have been banned there too ..

Safety should be Priority 1 in all cases !!
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Old 06-29-2017, 10:59 PM
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bluetopper bluetopper is offline
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Our private outdoor gun club range is owned by the city and we lease the property yearly from them. We've had it since the 70's. No range officer. Just a great place to shoot and only crowded when IDPA and 4H meets are held. With a membership they give you the combination to the gate, come and go as you wish. No other fees other than the membership fee.
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Old 06-29-2017, 11:04 PM
Mike, SC Hunter Mike, SC Hunter is online now
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Originally Posted by Lee's Landing Billy View Post
I read all 28 posts. Thanks to the shooting Gods on high for allowing me to live as long as I have with my own range. In all the years I have only asked 2 people to leave. I am indeed blessed and I take seriously the obligation of taking in like minded people to shoot and learn together.
Me too Billy....I have been blessed with my personal range for a long time. I only allow 3 other people to use it.....Am now in the process of building a skeet range out in the field in front of the house.....Perks of living in the country........
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  #39  
Old 06-30-2017, 04:10 AM
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So judgemental! In some cases, banning folks from a range is just the opposite of what we should be doing. Perhaps a half hour of mandatory remedial training is what is called for. We're losing enough shooters on a daily basis as it is. Many folks don't have the same background we have. It's up to us knowledgeable folks to improve that situation. Try to turn a negative situation into a positive one. But, don't be a **** about it. If some "know it all" gives lip or attitude, feel free to take appropriate measures.
Super. That is not my problem.

When I'm running an event or a range, my responsibility isn't to the larger shooting community. It is similarly not my responsibility to ensure that everyone knows basic gun safety--that's on them. My job is to ensure the safety of all those present first, and then to run a fair, sporting event.

If you're going to point a gun uprange in the manner the OP described, then sorry, I don't want you anywhere near the other people I'm responsible for. Education comes in the form of an explanation for why I'm asking you to leave. This isn't a minor safety violation, it's literally the first step on the path to someone getting hurt or killed (yes, there are greater and lesser safety violations--not wearing eye protection doesn't rank as bad as, say, handling a firearm while someone is downrange).

If you're going to intentionally shoot things that aren't meant to be shot--not to mention shooting over the backstop--same deal.

I'll be polite about it, but they gotta go.

Quote:
I don't think it's wise to cross someone that is known to have gun(s).
So RSO's should allow people to break safety rules because they're armed?

There are a couple smart things to do. Offenders should be allowed to empty their magazines before approaching them, if possible. It's also wise to be friendly to start, and begin by having them step back from the line. Working in pairs is also a good idea. If you detect any hostility--take no chances, call the police. In the time it takes officers to respond, the situation can escalate dramatically. Premature retreat beats the hell out of belated reaction any day of the week.

I also consider it sometimes a wise decision to be armed (depending on the security of the facility, that might be smart whether you're an RSO or not). Take a look at the "interview stance" used by law enforcement--it's a nonthreatening stance that lets you respond quickly to both physical attacks and drawn weapons.



Note the hands are already halfway up and in front of the body--you can deliver a quick shove, or quickly go to your own weapon. The interviewer (red shirt) isn't standing squared to the interviewee--this starts you off with a solid footing. Also note the distance is just about within arm's reach. This positioning gives you an element of range control--you can step out and be out of reach of a punch or a grab, or step in to shove and/or attempt to control the muzzle of a drawn handgun.
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  #40  
Old 06-30-2017, 04:43 AM
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AzShooter AzShooter is offline
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I was at an indoor range today and had to step back from the shooting area to get an RO. The guy next to me had his target at 7 yards and was shooting groups. He started at the top of the target (no problem) and kept shooting groups lower and lower on the paper until he was actually hitting the floor in front of the target.

I was worried about ricochets. The RO stopped him. They were also worried about floor maintenance.
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