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  #51  
Old 10-13-2017, 03:03 PM
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I don't know what the boys get-but I hope they get every cent-they earned it. I wish I could have given more but-I had to by 5 new tires, buy a new bed and switch car insurance that Saturday.
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  #52  
Old 10-13-2017, 04:35 PM
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I went the whole route in scouting, Cub Scout, Boy Scouts, Eagle Scout, Order of the Arrow, Asst Scout Master, then Scout Master of several different troops in different locals. Scouting played a significant role in my formative years because my Dad was active duty military and frequently deployed. Scouting gave me that male influence. It also developed outdoor skills and woodcraft that I carried the rest of my life. My Scout leaders were active military and so I learned a lot more than what was in the Boy Scout Handbook. My first shooting skills and gun safety were learned in the Scouts. Self motivation, perseverance and self determination was developed as well as leadership skills. The things I learned, I tried to impart in the youngsters in my charge as a Scout Master.

To me, Scouting was never a game of achieving the most merit badges but rather learning all the woodcraft and skills that I could. I had some really great teachers, real men, not some metro-sexual geek. I hope that I too passed along valuable skills and attitudes. The photos of my Eagle Award are of the framed certificate that hung in my Dad's office until his death, I had no idea they meant so much to him.

Society has changed so much in my lifetime, some days its hard to recognize as the same world. Antifas, SJW's, pissants that don't stand for the national anthem, activist that disrupt military funerals, clowns that desecrate monuments, college professors that espouse communism, and on and on. The social justice activist are creating such confusion in our societies establishments be it the military, the Boy Scouts or college campuses. Youngsters can't even be sure of their gender identity.

Personally, I wish things were different. I won't be around too much longer so it really doesn't matter what I think. Just hope future citizens enjoy the world that they created.
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  #53  
Old 10-13-2017, 05:18 PM
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There is too much competition today, too may distractions and a perceived lack of relevance to scouting. I see that it will continue to lose membership despite their accomadations and join the Odd Fellows, Freemasonry and other fraternal organizations as shadows of their former selves. Your opinion may vary.
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  #54  
Old 10-13-2017, 05:53 PM
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Default I believe that...

I believe that some girls will also want an all girl program and will say that girls should spend time away from the distraction of boys. I think a compromise would be to merge a lot of activities and combine the merit badges w/o altering them. Keep the awards the way they are. Whoever WANTS to pursue an award like the 50 miler or some such, go for it. I haven't thought this through, but military academies are taking women and letting the try out for the toughest jobs.

I was a Star Scout and really loved the program but our leadership got corrupted in giving out undeserved reward to try to increase the prestige (or the APPEARANCE of prestige) of the whole troop. This was stated to the entire troop as a good way to boost our standing. I was dissatisfied for some other reasons, but that was the icing on the cake and plain dam wrong and dishonorable.
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Old 10-13-2017, 06:11 PM
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In the Corps there re now women serving in the infantry. That is the toughest MOS you can have in the non special force units. A couple weeks ago the first woman to complete the Corp’s OCS and then InfantrymOfficers School graduated and is now serving at Camp Pendleton as an Infantry Officer. In the Corps we do not have mans infantry and a womans Infantry. We just have Infantry. I think the Scouts should adopt that concept. Male or female, you are a Scout is the way I think it should be.

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Old 10-13-2017, 06:58 PM
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When I was a Boy Scout, we would have overnight camping trips about once a month, but in the Summer, we had The Big Hike. We backpacked through the Sierra Nevada Mountains, and everything we would need was carried on our backs. Knowing the girls in my school, none would have completed The Big Hike. I doubt that any of the girls would have even wanted to attempt it. We earned our 50 Miler, although we hiked a lot more than 50 miles. There was pride in what we achieved. And if I had to do it over again, I would do it on the back of a horse, leading a pack horse.

By the way, is the 50 Miler Award still embossed on leather?
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  #57  
Old 10-13-2017, 07:09 PM
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Default COED WILL BE A WIN/WIN IN MY BOOK.

We are already seeing more women hunting & shooting. Alienating 50% of the population just does not make sense, aside from being downright discriminatory. Females could be the shot in the arm our hunting/fishing/camping/2nd amendment rights could use about now. In ANY large population be it coed or single sex there's gonna be some hanky panky. Deal with it.
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Old 10-13-2017, 08:13 PM
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Talking CUZ OF THE OLD WEAKER SEX THING AND ALL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jag312 View Post
When I was a Boy Scout, we would have overnight camping trips about once a month, but in the Summer, we had The Big Hike. We backpacked through the Sierra Nevada Mountains, and everything we would need was carried on our backs. Knowing the girls in my school, none would have completed The Big Hike. I doubt that any of the girls would have even wanted to attempt it. We earned our 50 Miler, although we hiked a lot more than 50 miles. There was pride in what we achieved. And if I had to do it over again, I would do it on the back of a horse, leading a pack horse.

By the way, is the 50 Miler Award still embossed on leather?
YES, surely a girl would fall & sprain an ankle in the first 1/2 mile or so just like in the old tv shows right. I'm pretty sure about any of the women that compete in the iron"man" competitions would consider a 50 miler a stroll in the park. Try giving birth. Been to a gym lately? Some of those broa, er lady's are pretty buff.

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  #59  
Old 10-13-2017, 08:36 PM
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Never did 50 miles packing over several days. Certainly never did it with a boat. Have done 20 miles in one day carrying everything including a few rocks to get the weight up so that everyone was carrying 1/3 of their body weight. Stone Mountain is a stretch of the ankle if you go up in a hurry. For our Scout troop, we all finished together. Some of us ended up sharing a bit of the rocks. But all of us arrived together. All the extra rocks were delivered.

Many years later, I've done a bunch of cross country running. My daughters have done cross country. My youngest daughter can run me into the ground. Even years ago, she would leave me in the dust. When she had her baby she went back to running to loose weight. She called me one morning to say that she had done a 4.49 mile. Give her a pack with 1/3 of her body weight and she'll very likely leave us all gasping for air when we hit the hills! Of course part of my slowness will be that I have a tender ankle ... turned it severely a little over a year ago. She on the other hand has no injuries to speak of! All those years of jumping and running ... no injuries. Glad she is not as clumsy as am I. Sincerely. bruce.
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  #60  
Old 10-13-2017, 08:45 PM
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In the Corps there re now women serving in the infantry. That is the toughest MOS you can have in the non special force units. A couple weeks ago the first woman to complete the Corp’s OCS and then InfantrymOfficers School graduated and is not I’m Camp Pendleton as an Infantry Officer. In the Corps we do not have mans infantry and a womans Infantry. We just have Infantry. I think the Scouts should adopt that concept. Male or female, you are a Scout is the way I think it should be.
The problem here is that Scouts are minors and Soldiers are adults. The adults can have sex with whomever they choose, but keeping the minors from ruining their lives can be pretty difficult when you start having overnight events with them mixed together.

I'm all for women doing outdoor activities, whatever they want to do, including fishing, hunting, shooting, etc. Just keep the kids as kids until they turn 18.
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Old 10-13-2017, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
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The problem here is that Scouts are minors and Soldiers are adults. The adults can have sex with whomever they choose, but keeping the minors from ruining their lives can be pretty difficult when you start having overnight events with them mixed together.

I'm all for women doing outdoor activities, whatever they want to do, including fishing, hunting, shooting, etc. Just keep the kids as kids until they turn 18.
We live in different worlds I think. Do you really believe that men and women Marines are having a lot of sex together? If you do, your imagination is out of control. As for scouts do you really believe that mingling boys and girls in a combined activity will result in an increase in sexual behavior? I hope not, but if you do, I think you need some help.
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Old 10-13-2017, 09:44 PM
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This should not be looked at as more or better opportunities for
the girls. That should not enter in to it, that's why it is called
the BOY SCOUTS.
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Old 10-13-2017, 09:54 PM
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Default About all that they can't do....

Most females lack the same upper body strength as males but if they are in shape and willing there's no reason they can't participate in the same activities boys do. The big hikes and all are optional IF you want to do them. I was thinking about getting my 50 miler but didn't pursue it. That's no reason for me not to have been in the Scouts. We didn't have any big wilderness here either, but we hiked and camped and did all the Scout things. I think that there is enough in common in camping, woodsmanship, hobbies, teamwork and everything that Scouts do.

I'm wouldn't choose it, but faced with a decision I'm in favor of it.

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Old 10-13-2017, 10:10 PM
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I too was a Cub Scout and then a Boy Scout and loved my time in the Scouts until I found girls and guns. I do not think that it will be the same having girls in the troops. When was the last time that you heard of a boy that wanted to join a girls sport team or Girl Scouts or other activity.
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Old 10-13-2017, 10:14 PM
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I don't know of many teen age girls wanting to be tapped for the O/A and sleeping in the woods by themselves with no flashlight or tent. Just a change of clothes and a sleeping bag was all we were allowed to take. Of course they may not do that anymore, but that's how they did it 25 years ago.
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Old 10-14-2017, 12:55 AM
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I'm an Eagle Scout and even now - in my seventies - I'm very proud of it. I was Order of the Arrow, spent a summer at Philmont in '56, went to the national jamboree in '57. Later I served as Cubmaster, Scoutmaster, and merit badge councilor. My two sons are also Eagle Scouts. Interesting to me that we say "I AM an Eagle Scout" - not "I WAS an Eagle Scout". We carry it with us the rest of our life.
Another thing we carry with us the rest of our life is the ability to have valuable relationships with guys. We hunt together, fish together, talk cars with each other, swap jokes together, drink beer together, and form bonds with each other about our families and our lives. Having said that, let me say that I value relationships that I have with women equally. I love their different points of views, their sensitivities, their enlightening insights and their understanding nature. I have some dear friends who happen to be women and others who happen to be men. I value their friendship - all of them.
Scouting was very influential in my learning how to be with men. How to work with them, form bonds with them, be friends with them, enjoy their company, respect them and be respected by them. Those lessons have served me well throughout my life. And how did I learn how to be with women? Not from scouting, but from my family, my teachers, and from my wife. I've learned how to form bonds with them, be friends with them, respect them, enjoy their company, and be respected by them.
So what's my point? Scouting can teach boys how to be men. It works. Don't fix it.

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Old 10-14-2017, 05:03 AM
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This can all be summed up in two words, the end.
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Old 10-14-2017, 07:57 AM
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Default MAKING EAGLE SCOUT IS QUITE AN ACHIEVEMENT.

I believe the correct term would be Scouting can make a better person & that person makes himself (with guidance, hard work, taught values) into a good man or woman. What is or isn't between their legs has little to do with it, what's between their ears matters more.
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Old 10-14-2017, 08:30 AM
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As an interesting side note, a Girl Scout Troop gets a quarter for every box of cookies they sell. On the other hand, a Boy Scout Troop gets 30-40% of the popcorn gross. The more expensive the item, the more the Troop keeps. Granted, a $20 box of microwave popcorn is more expensive than a $4 box of cookies, but $1.25 vs. $6 is significant.

Let's talk about money. Don't know a thing about Girl Scout fund raising. Do know a bit about Boy Scout fund raising. In a week or so we'll be selling doughnuts ... $10/box. Each boy will sell six boxes to pay his portion of various annual costs. We adult leaders expect to sell a whole lot more. I plan on picking up the phone and using e-mail to contact various VFD, Sheriff and Police Depts. and EMT's and ask them to buy at least one box each. In this area that will sell a fair amount of high calorie doughnuts. I am also selling BBQ tickets to help the family of a little 1 yr. old girl who has had three very serious heart surgeries. When she is strong enough, she'll have more surgery. She is still alive b/c lots of people have done things for her that no child should ever have to face.

Some complain about where the money goes. They complain about Boy Scouts b/c they decide that everyone should live on minimum wage ... it's all for the boys mentality. Same sort of thing is heard about helping children like that little girl. Folks act like the ones doing the work should donate their services. Never have seen to many say the same thing about those who sell tires/gas for school buses, shoes/socks for boys/girls, etc. You get my drift.

The dear sweet world of my youth is gone. It isn't ever coming back. When I was a boy, my parents once upon a time world of pre-WWII America was a figment of a Norman Rockwell memory. Few boys/girls of today will ever face a charging bear or spend time lost in a wilderness. All of them will face the challenges of a rapidly changing world. Many of them will do so without the support and encouragement of a intact family led by a stable employed father and mother.

Boy Scouting is adapting to and seeking to remain relevant in that changing world. The cost of programming is a significant challenge. Troop 47 held its second meeting last night. We are starting at ground zero. We have an US flat, a BSA flag, four manuals and five boys. Last night we were teaching the boys about how to properly handle the flags, etc. The boys are various races. Some have a father present in their lives. Some have just a mother. One boy has Asperger's syndrome. They are as addicted to electronic devices as my generation was to dirt bikes and stereo systems.

Back when I was first starting in Boy Scouts, there were those who complained about the costs of uniforms, books, camping equipment, BSA marked axes/knives, etc. Said it was just a way to make money. Maybe right. Nowadays ... maybe still true. Maybe. As a Scout I sold a lot of doughnuts, light bulbs, etc. We collected green pine cones for some company that paid good money for them. The adult leaders bought stuff for us, spent money on us, saw to it that we could share the experience, values, training and development that was and is today Boy Scouting.

The Scout representative and his wife who have helped us get Troop 47 up and running are fine people. He is a 10 yr. USMC veteran who now works with the BSA. Talked with his wife. Found out she has done a bit of the AT and been out at Philmont. Cool. They are not making a fortune in salary/benefits. Look to me like just a fine young couple who are precisely the sort of people boys and girls need to see, spend time with and learn from. It'll cost money. Hardly anything in this world that doesn't cost money. Sincerely. bruce.
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Old 10-14-2017, 11:06 AM
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When I was a Boy Scout, we would have overnight camping trips about once a month, but in the Summer, we had The Big Hike. We backpacked through the Sierra Nevada Mountains, and everything we would need was carried on our backs. Knowing the girls in my school, none would have completed The Big Hike. I doubt that any of the girls would have even wanted to attempt it. We earned our 50 Miler, although we hiked a lot more than 50 miles. There was pride in what we achieved. And if I had to do it over again, I would do it on the back of a horse, leading a pack horse.

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Originally Posted by nachogrande View Post
YES, surely a girl would fall & sprain an ankle in the first 1/2 mile or so just like in the old tv shows right. I'm pretty sure about any of the women that compete in the iron"man" competitions would consider a 50 miler a stroll in the park. Try giving birth. Been to a gym lately? Some of those broa, er lady's are pretty buff.
When I was talking about what my scout troop called The Big Hike, I was referring to 12 and 13 year old girls. Most of the boys in my school couldn't make it, and I know none of the girls in my school could do it. You are thinking of adult women.

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Old 10-14-2017, 11:12 AM
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I'm kind of on the fence about this. Don't know where I'm going but here are some random thoughts.

I believe that boys and girls should have the same opportunities across the board. They should be able to interact with each other outside of our education system and outside the home.

If girls were allowed to join, who is it going to hurt? If it's because of tradition or we are so set in our ways that we can't see clearly, who is going to be hurt by that?

If a boy or girl isn't getting the guidance they need at home and have the opportunity to do so with Scouting isn't that a win for our society?

As a youngster I was a member of church youth group. All male and female church members still in high school were allowed to attend. We met every Sunday afternoon for brief fellowship and then went out on the town. We went bowling or to the zoo or elsewhere followed by dinner. Twice a year we went shooting at an outdoor range and once a year we went on a weekend camping trip. Of course we had a chaperone but we never had any problems. A few of the boys and girls were romantically involved but those relationships were kept separate even though everyone knew about it.

Every one of us kids came from decent homes with decent parents who taught respect and family values. But the things I learned with my friends outside of the home was just as important.

I have known a few women that I would trust more than some of the men I have met. They may have been physically weaker but they made up for it with heart and desire.
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Old 10-14-2017, 11:26 AM
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Kanewpadle,

I think you got over the fence with your post. I think it was an exceptionally cogent response. If you read my post above, I think we should simply drop the gender designations when it comes to Scouts. Let’s just have Scouts.
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Old 10-14-2017, 11:39 AM
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Talking ANYONE I WANT,WISH THAT WERE TRUE.

[QUOTE=Toolguy; Scouts are minors and Soldiers are adults. The adults can have sex with whomever they choose.

Just keep the kids as kids until they turn 18.[/QUOTE]

Keeping kids as kids until they are 18 y/o??? That ship sailed a longtime ago if it ever existed. My "innocence" was lost & eyes opened greatly riding the school bus in 7th grade. Today with the interweb who knows? An awful lot of "kids" enlist in the military before they turn 21 and are legal to drink, never mind that the human brain is not fully developed yet (in most cases) until beyond that age. So there are "kids" in the military. IMO many people (me ) never reach adulthood mentally, EVER. The way I see it scouting can offer both sexes a great deal & our society as a whole in the process.

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Old 10-14-2017, 01:29 PM
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I believe that boys and girls should have the same opportunities across the board. They should be able to interact with each other outside of our education system and outside the home.
There are a zillion activities boys and girls share outside the home and school. You illustrated one in your post.

Why deprive boys the choice and opportunity of an all-boys learning environment when there are so many other co-ed activities to chose from?

------------

Here's some words from the CEO of the Girl Scouts of the Southern Appalachians in my neck of the woods.

“What I will say about Girl Scouts is we will continue to be the pre-eminent leadership experience for girls, as we have been for 105 years. The Boy Scouts do a great job teaching young men to be leaders. They’ve been doing that for 107 years, and my sons are Eagle Scouts. So I appreciate the work of Boy Scouts


"But as a Girl Scout and as a mother of boys, I see tremendous value in single-sex organizations providing leadership experiences for youth. And so we at Girl Scouts will focus on that work and continue to do that work in the future.”

-----

Girl Scouts of Middle Tennessee CEO Agenia Clark

Middle Tennessee's Boy Scouts council was one of the fastest-growing in the nation last year. It added over 1,000 kids to the program in Middle Tennessee.

The region's Girl Scouts council has also seen unprecedented growth, Clark said, and is also one of the fastest-growing in the nation.

The demand for both programs is evident, she said.

"The development of children is unique for boys and girls, and that’s why we have boy scouts and girl scouts," Clark said.

-----------------

Why are these women wrong?

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Old 10-14-2017, 02:23 PM
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I have no problem with it, but if they are going to admit girls, they need to change their name to Scouts of America, not the Boy Scouts. The Times are always changing.

John
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Old 10-14-2017, 03:16 PM
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If the BSA has come up with this to bolster their membership
due to soft enrollment it is going to blow up in their face. I would
guess this will cause a severe drop in new enrollments and will
probably cause kids to drop out. Especially in the conservative
regions of the country where the Scouts remain solid.
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Old 10-14-2017, 04:21 PM
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Default "WHY ARE THESE WOMEN WRONG?"

Here's some words from the CEO of the Girl Scouts of the Southern Appalachians in my neck of the woods.

[I]“What I will experience for girls, as we have been for 105 years. The Boy Scouts do a great job teaching young men to be leaders. They’ve been doing that for 107 years, and my sons are Eagle Scouts. So I appreciate the work of Boy Scouts say about Girl Scouts is we will continue to be the pre-eminent leadership.



Why are these women wrong?[/QUOTE]

IMO It's because those statements contradict each other. BSA & GSA each train THEIR genders to be the future leaders, SO which gender gets top billing? Crazy idea, how about the best PERSON for the job?
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Old 10-14-2017, 04:22 PM
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As a youngster I was a member of church youth group. All male and female church members still in high school were allowed to attend. We met every Sunday afternoon for brief fellowship and then went out on the town. We went bowling or to the zoo or elsewhere followed by dinner. Twice a year we went shooting at an outdoor range and once a year we went on a weekend camping trip. Of course we had a chaperone but we never had any problems. A few of the boys and girls were romantically involved but those relationships were kept separate even though everyone knew about it. .
When my son was in high school the church youth group went on a week long camping trip through Minnesota and canoeing in the Boundary Waters/Quetico. Boys and girls, no problems.

When my daughter was in high school the Science Club had yearly camping trips all over the United States.,, usually 8-10 days, fantastic opportunity for the kids. They tent camped mostly in National Parks. She got to see probably 1/2 of the National Parks in the western US. One year her steady boyfriend at the time was there also. Teenage boys & girls, again, no problems.

I think we can all agree that there are times the boys & girls should have separate activities and times they should be together. The problem is which & when. I doubt there is a textbook/one size fits all answer.
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Old 10-14-2017, 04:44 PM
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I'm kind of surprised the Boy Scouts are still around. I see Cub Scouts every now and then selling popcorn (I always buy some) but I figured most 16 year old boys would rather be caught dead than in a Boy Scout uniform.

I never made it past Webelos myself.

My oldest was 7 when we moved to small town Montana. I enrolled him in a local Cub Scout pack, and mentioned it to the Sheriff once. He said - come here, I have something you need to hear.

He played me a tape of my kid's Den Mother making a meth sale to one of his informants. They were going to do a few more buys, then bust her. He also pointed out Den Mom had her current husband as well as her recently paroled ex-husband at the house. They called the ex "the dentist" because once on a meth bender he was sure there were bugs in his teeth and pulled them all out with some pliers.

This was in a town of 2500 people.

No more Scouts for Number One Son, which he was fine with. We did stuff together instead.

I've always been more than mildly distrustful of male Scout leaders (Google "scout leader arrested" sometime) but I thought I was OK with a female. Live and learn.

I think this is the last dying gasp of what is now an outdated institution, like the circus.
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Old 10-14-2017, 04:56 PM
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I'm kind of surprised the Boy Scouts are still around. I see Cub Scouts every now and then selling popcorn (I always buy some) but I figured most 16 year old boys would rather be caught dead than in a Boy Scout uniform.

I never made it past Webelos myself.

My oldest was 7 when we moved to small town Montana. I enrolled him in a local Cub Scout pack, and mentioned it to the Sheriff once. He said - come here, I have something you need to hear.

He played me a tape of my kid's Den Mother making a meth sale to one of his informants. They were going to do a few more buys, then bust her. He also pointed out Den Mom had her current husband as well as her recently paroled ex-husband at the house. They called the ex "the dentist" because once on a meth bender he was sure there were bugs in his teeth and pulled them all out with some pliers.

This was in a town of 2500 people.

No more Scouts for Number One Son, which he was fine with. We did stuff together instead.

I've always been more than mildly distrustful of male Scout leaders (Google "scout leader arrested" sometime) but I thought I was OK with a female. Live and learn.

I think this is the last dying gasp of what is now an outdated institution, like the circus.
I think the idea is great and at one time was very popular but I agree, it seems like a dying institution

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Old 10-14-2017, 05:26 PM
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For one thing the Girl Scouts leader's quote of "...been doing for the last 105 years" is not what we experienced with my daughter. Her experiences were nothing like her mother's, aunt's, or grandmothers, all of who were Girl Scouts.

She would have much rather been camping, hiking, shooting, and the other things her brother was doing, than the make-up parties, fashion discussions, and art-n-craftsy things that she was offered in Girl Scouts.

BTW - She participted in a lot of the Cub Scout activities because the whole family was included.

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Old 10-14-2017, 05:55 PM
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Logan and 4 of his teammates (9-10) are here for burgers and hot dogs after their football game. Thinking of this thread, I asked them if they knew much about the scouts and if they had considered joining.

They had some knowledge of it but had no interest. They said it didn't have much of a cool factor and that between school and year round sports their dance cards were full.

If ya want a straight answer, ask a kid.
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Old 10-14-2017, 10:26 PM
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Talking AGREE RUSTY, NOT A WHOLE LOT OF COOL FACTOR OR STREET CRED.

We all know kids can be cruel with the teasing/bullying. Belonging to a group named "BROWNIE" or WEBLOW is asking for trouble. My Fathers name was Richard & in the 30's to 50's his nickname Dick wasn't a big deal. Times change. Name your kid Dick today & see how that goes at school. Just for the record a must have in a bug out/survival bag for me is a Boy scout handbook. My latest from 1911 even has first aid for apoplexy.

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Old 10-14-2017, 10:31 PM
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Here's a question:

How many here WHO HAVE ACTUALLY PARTICIPATED IN BOY SCOUTS think this is a good idea?
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Old 10-14-2017, 10:45 PM
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This guy makes a few good points.
There’s a place for Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts. Do the Boy Scouts really need to embrace girls? | Fox News
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Old 10-14-2017, 10:55 PM
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I was only a Cub Scout. Kinda lost interest after that. My son wasn't really interested in scouting. Like a lot of other churches, ours has pulled out of BSA. They have started a group in a newish Christian oriented organization called Trail Life USA. I don't know much about it yet, but it sounds like a good alternative.

The thing I liked the most as a kid was called Indian Guides. I'm sure it no longer exists since it's not a PC name, but it was great fun. We learned a lot of the same stuff scouts did, but with an Indian theme. We had to build a totem character for the tribe's totem pole. I remember mine was a gallon tomato sauce can covered with plaster of paris fashioned into a face and painted in wild colors. I attached horns from a cow to it. Instead of merit badges we earned "bear claws," feathers, and beads to add to our necklaces.

Our annual campout was held at the gun club I'm now a member of.

Edited to add: I looked it up online, and Indian Guides still exists. I guess PC hasn't ruined everything yet.
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Old 10-14-2017, 11:15 PM
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The Girl Scouts actually issued a statement that they intend to keep Girl Scouts just for girls.
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Old 10-14-2017, 11:31 PM
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Talking IT'S A PROVEN GENETIC FACT.

Women have smaller feet so they can stand closer to the stove,sink & washer/dryer. Preparing young girls for a life of being the best Housewife they can be seems way too 1950's. Not to take anything away from June Cleaver and Donna Reed. A home economics class would have come in handy for me when I had to learn to cook & sew the hard way, in my 20's.

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Old 10-15-2017, 12:05 AM
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Default I am a bit confused...

the Boy Scouts of America already has a coed group... it is called Venture Scouts... it is open to boys and girls over the age of 14 or 13 if they have completed the 8th grade... if my memory serves me correctly... so letting them into BOY scouts is not really necessary at all... and for the record... I was a Cub Scout and a Webelo with both my mother and father being my leaders... and I was then a leader for my son all the way thru - finally got my chance at being a Boy Scout and am a member of OA... i am very proud that he made Eagle... both of my brothers are Eagles... I was more interested in girls and cars so got a job to pay for one to get the other... besides the leaders at the time were terrible so I was never a Boy Scout... my sister was a Girl Scout and then a leader for my niece and she made it all the way to earn her Gold award... which is the highest level... similar to the Eagle... which her younger brother earned... my littlest nephew is just starting out in Cubs and I am not sure what my little brother - his leader - will be doing with this new turn of events... Scouting has been a part of my entire life.... I am just glad I am not going to have to make the choice of staying or going... I am retired and am planning on staying that way...
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Old 10-15-2017, 05:12 AM
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It's a different world now. Kids see everyone as an equal male or female, black or white.

I think it's a good thing to integrate scouts. I always wondered why our Boy Scout troop didn't do anything with Girl Scouts.

The Girl Scouts had a huge property in my home town, that us boys could not use. Seemed like a waste to me.

My sister would have enjoyed being part of my Boy Scouts troop, she tagged along as much as she could, and a lot of her school friends were in my troop.

FWIW, the Girl Scouts are not happy about the rule change.

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Old 10-15-2017, 09:22 AM
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I was a cub scout, then a boy scout, then an assistant scout master and a scout master, then back to assistant scout master and finally a troop committee member assigned to sit in on the Eagle boards of review. I had over 40 years in scouting. During the time when I was assistant the first time then scoutmaster, our oldest boy was a scout, earning the rank of EAGLE SCOUT. Our youngest scout went thru cub scouts then joined boy scouts but lost interest after a year. He turned out not to be an outdoors person. He is now an I.T. guy at a local college, working under his brother the EAGLE SCOUT.
I also earned Wood Badge and received the District Award of Merit as a leader.
I was also an explorer leader for a co-ed explorer group. There the co-ed seemed right but I'll never be in favor of girls in the boy scouts, and I'm not against girls, I just don't think 11-14 yr old boys should be mixed with girls yet, too young and too inquisitive, let them mature a little before being combined in camping experiences. I realize there would need to be both male and female leaders, but I know young boys, there will be law suits when a 12-13 yr old girl gets pregnant at scout camp. There's no way the leaders could keep that from happening in my opinion, kids will sneak around and do what comes naturally when given the chance.
Bad idea.
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Old 10-15-2017, 09:43 AM
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Eagle Scout and Order of the Arrow here, a long time ago. My experience in scouting was extremely sectarian and un-militaristic. We focused on wilderness skills; woodcraft, desert survival, etc.
I have long disapproved of what has happened to the local troops I am aware of here. They all seem to have been co-opted by a particular church and there is ongoing subtle indoctrination. I can also think of at least two incidents of child abuse in one troop.
If I were looking for a scout troop to put a child in, I wouldn't be able to find one.
Accepting girls seems to me to be an attempt at remaining relevant on the part of an organization that is losing ground. I don't know if that's good, or bad, but I know quite a few young ladies who could kick the average boy's backside on a 50 miler.
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Old 10-15-2017, 10:11 AM
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The Girl Scouts actually issued a statement that they intend to keep Girl Scouts just for girls.
At least somebody still has some guiding principles . . .
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Old 10-15-2017, 10:15 AM
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I left the scouts just before the "life" rank because I foolishly thought it hurt my street cred with the girls. If I was born 45 years later I could have stayed in the scouts and still gotten girls.

Seriously, I pushed my kids to stay in karate to get their black belts at a minimum. I told them it was something they earned on their own and no one could take it away from them. I likened it to becoming an Eagle scout. Every time I said that I regretted my decision to leave before I achieved my Eagle rank.

In my humble opinion, with this decision the BSA has tarnished the hard work and personal achievement of every young man who ever repeated the oath.
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Old 10-15-2017, 10:24 AM
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We live in different worlds I think. Do you really believe that men and women Marines are having a lot of sex together? If you do, your imagination is out of control. As for scouts do you really believe that mingling boys and girls in a combined activity will result in an increase in sexual behavior? I hope not, but if you do, I think you need some help.
I don't need any help. I don't believe that men and women Marines or Army are having rampant sex issues. These are trained and disciplined, responsible adults.

I don't think there is any problem in having girls and boys doing activities together. Actually that is a good thing. The problems arise during extended outings of more than one day. At night when everyone is supposed to be sleeping, but some aren't, is what I'm talking about. When hormones are at an all time high, and kids are wanting to be together, sometimes things get out of hand. Have you never heard of teenage pregnancy? It seems you may be a bit naive about teenage behavior.
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Old 10-15-2017, 11:00 AM
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Identify a respected American institution, subvert it, change it until it no longer resembles what it originally stood for. No more traditional values for you Irrifleman. NFL anyone?
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Old 10-15-2017, 12:36 PM
pawngal pawngal is offline
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All you GUYS worried about teens having sex, if they want it they will find a way, true. Maybe some of you should look back on your misspent youth.
Were you ALL male virgins until you were 20 yrs. old? I highly doubt it.

Teen pregnancy is at its lowest rate in over 20 years.

Scouting and other youth groups (in general) should be a vehicle to give teens a chance to interact with each other without the peer pressure to
"just do it" whether that be sex, drugs, drinking, bullying and whatever.

Are girls going to be fully integrated into the entire Boy Scout program?
I don't think that is the intent.

Just some Sunday thoughts.........
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Old 10-15-2017, 01:42 PM
BLACKHAWKNJ BLACKHAWKNJ is offline
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Boy Scouts was meant to teach boys to become MEN.
Girls Scouts was meant to teach girls to become WOMEN.
I hate to shatter anybody's illusions but there ARE differences.
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Old 10-15-2017, 02:14 PM
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...I don't think girls would have done well in South Denver Troop 88...we met in a church basement...and tried to keep meetings short so we could get down to the real business at hand...playing "sock hockey"...

...we would take our shoes off which made it possible to slide across the church basement floor...made a hockey puck out of aluminum foil...and goals were set up between folding chairs...then we would proceed to batter and bruise each other into bloody pulps...not a thing the girls of our era cared to join into...

...if that wasn't enough...when leaving the meeting...someone would usually yell "dog pile!"...and tackle the guy nearest him...and the rest of us would jump on top and see how high a pile we could form...leaving the guy on the bottom struggling to breath...not a top ambition of those of the feminine gland it seemed...

...political correctness has damaged or ruined a lot of things...scouting will be or has been added to the list...we were so politically incorrect in the 60s that we had a Confederate Flag on our neckerchiefs...
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Old 10-15-2017, 03:58 PM
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raised two boys from tiger to eagle. i was den leader, cubmaster, asst scoutmaster and currently troop secretary. daughter did the girlscouts and got her silver award. IMO, this is a good move. forget about the SJW aspect, i don't think its there. the BSA is a great program, perfectly suited for boys and girls. if they had allowed this when my daughter was growing up, she would have been an eagle, guaranteed. this will open the program up more for families and get more people involved. if more people were exposed to, and lived by the tenants of the oath, law, slogan and motto, this would be a much better world.
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