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Old 07-24-2018, 10:23 AM
ischia ischia is offline
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Default Found in wall.....Loaded too...After 70 years.

Friend told of contractor recently finding a loaded .38 SPL(S&W or Colt) during a home remodel. He was working on the job at the time so more that one person knows about the find for sure. It is a SPD marked(police issue?) loaded,one round fired, case not removed. The contractor researched previous owners of the home and found that in 1948 it was owned by a SPD detective who's wife suddenly disappeared back then. The contractor did not tell the home owner. Yes, I would call that theft. What would you do?

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Old 07-24-2018, 10:30 AM
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I'd call it evidence...………….
As would I
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Old 07-24-2018, 10:37 AM
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Best call it third hand information for now.
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Old 07-24-2018, 10:38 AM
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Would you turn the contractor in then? My friend could be fired and at close to retirement not very likely to get another job at his age. I say let the local press have the story. It would do far more good will for the contractor's business rating that any cash value of the revolver. Great story though.

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Old 07-24-2018, 10:49 AM
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That's theft, of a firearm. Any items discovered by workers during home construction are property of the homeowner. Found firearms are a special category that are usually required to be turned over to local PD. But if no legitimate owner can be found or it is found to not be evidence in a crime, it becomes property of the homeowner.

Also, as already stated. It could be evidence to a crime.
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:00 AM
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The value of an old PD surplus revolver is not near that of solving the loss of a persons life - if that indeed is what happened. Turning it into the local PD and hypothesizing about the former owner and the mystery of his disappearing wife could result in a half century old cold case being solved. Now that is a story with some value!!
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:00 AM
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Contractors working on property owned by others have a fundamental duty to preserve and protect that property on behalf of the owners. Anything found on the property is owned by the property owners, period. The contractor was allowed entry to the property for the purposes spelled out in the contractual agreement, and no other purposes. Taking the revolver was a theft, and since the theft occurred within a dwelling there might also be a charge of burglary (depending on state laws; here in Colorado the law specifies that entering into or remaining upon the property of another for the purpose of committing a crime other than trespass can be construed as burglary).

Regardless, the contractor is certainly exposed to possibly serious criminal charges, and since he has told at least one other person about the incident it will only become increasingly likely that everything will come to light.

Best recommendation I can offer is for the contractor to explain everything to the property owner and return the revolver to that owner, then cooperate fully with the property owner's wishes on any reporting to be done to authorities.
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:04 AM
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If he hid the murder weapon in the wall, wonder where he hid the body?
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:13 AM
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Anybody can do anything they want as long as they are willing to suffer the consequences. That contractor made two errors; he considered taking the gun then he did take it. Just plain stupid.
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:16 AM
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Wow.. there a lots of bear traps in this one. IMHO I'd stay away, period. Gee made for TV from the pages of the forum.
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:19 AM
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I'd say the contractor just committed larceny and your friend is guilty of 'aiding and abetting', which could make him as guilty as the contractor.
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:26 AM
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....and now that we all know about it are we accessories to a possible crime scene??

Sounds like a basis for a good movie.
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Old 07-24-2018, 11:38 AM
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Default AGREED, PROPERTY OF THE HOMEOWNER.

Was there a body in there too? I'll take the gun, you can have the body.
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Old 07-24-2018, 12:02 PM
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....and now that we all know about it are we accessories to a possible crime scene??

Sounds like a basis for a good movie.
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Old 07-24-2018, 12:20 PM
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Watched it....and I don't have a C L U E !
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Old 07-24-2018, 12:27 PM
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A little of topic but close enough. ...locally we had an unsolved disappearance of a woman. The husband was a suspect but nothing could be proven. After he died, the house was being renovated and her body was discovered in a false wall.

The contractor called the police.

In Cluttered Home, a Dark Secret 3 Decades Old - The New York Times

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Old 07-24-2018, 12:30 PM
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Makes you wonder how many other things said contractor has stolen . . .
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Old 07-24-2018, 12:36 PM
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Finders Keepers is not recognized law.
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Old 07-24-2018, 12:54 PM
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The contractor is apparently a ****** bag of epic proportion and deserves charges brought against him to the fullest extent of the law! I hate a thief.
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Old 07-24-2018, 01:43 PM
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A little of topic but close enough. ...locally we had an unsolved disappearance of a woman. The husband was a suspect but nothing could be proven. After he died, the house was being renovated and her body was discovered in a false wall.

The contractor called the police.

In Cluttered Home, a Dark Secret 3 Decades Old - The New York Times
SHE SAID she wanted a space of her own, & thus the first SHE-SHED was born.
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Old 07-24-2018, 01:46 PM
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I know that what the guy did was technically against the law, but I have to admit that stealing something from someone who didn't even realize they owned it in the first place really does seem like a victimless crime. The current owner paid for a house and some land. He or she probably didn't consider any firearms that were sealed up behind the walls when they signed the deed. Hell, if the mortgage isn't paid off maybe the bank is entitled to it?

Reminds me of the case I heard about related to my numismatics hobby. A contractor found a HUGE cache of Depression-era paper money stashed behind a wall during a renovation. Not only was the face value of the cash worth a ton, but the collectible value was through the roof, too. All these bills were brown seal and silver certificate notes, etc.

So, the contractor decides to "do the right thing" and tell the homeowner. They can't agree on a split, so it goes to court. Then the heirs of the person to who hid the money in the first place got involved. Know who was legally entitled to the money? The heirs of the person who hid the cash.

Whatever happened to . . . the fight over money found in wall of West Side home? | cleveland.com

So, if you go by that particular court ruling, this gun belongs to whoever happens to be the heir of the person who stashed it there in the first place.

Last edited by charles_the_hammer; 07-24-2018 at 01:49 PM.
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Old 07-24-2018, 01:47 PM
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Nacho, that's as horrible as something I would say.

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Old 07-24-2018, 01:56 PM
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Call Matlock.
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Old 07-24-2018, 02:22 PM
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Default THE CONTRACTOR DID IT...

He then planted the evidence.
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Old 07-24-2018, 02:42 PM
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The last general I worked for in the 'Force said, "Do the right thing even if no one's looking."

If the OP's friend were my friend, future job or no, that's what I'd tell him. The contractor is a dirtball by any large-scale measurement and the OP's friend is an accessory. He doesn't deserve to work in folks' homes, and he deserves to be called out for his crime. Go back and read post # 18.
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Old 07-24-2018, 02:47 PM
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Could I quietly have my gun back and let's just keep this between ourselves, ok?
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Old 07-24-2018, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles_the_hammer View Post
So, if you go by that particular court ruling, this gun belongs to whoever happens to be the heir of the person who stashed it there in the first place.
Interesting story. But it seems to me a case of the party represented by the better lawyers — did the homeowner and the contractor even have lawyers? — winning the judgement. I don’t think it is a question of settled law, tho it might be in Ohio, I suppose.

It does make the point that if you find yourself in a legal embroiglio, best lawyer up pronto!

And I agree with those who think the contractor who stole — that is the correct word — the gun is a thief. (That the homeowner was not aware of the gun’s presence is irrelevant, I believe.)

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Old 07-24-2018, 03:02 PM
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The OP didn't say the contractor kept the gun, but by asking if it's theft I assume that is the case.

When you purchase a piece of real estate, you own everything within the lot lines including stuff buried underneath the ground, even stuff you don't know is there so the "murder weapon" belongs to the current homeowner, but should be handed over to the "SPD" to solve the old cold case.
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Old 07-24-2018, 03:48 PM
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I know that what the guy did was technically against the law, but I have to admit that stealing something from someone who didn't even realize they owned it in the first place really does seem like a victimless crime.
Wait, what ? ? ?
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Old 07-24-2018, 03:52 PM
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Back in my teens I had a friend whose father was a general jack-of-all-trades and did home remodeling, building demolition and many other similar types of work. I was aware he had found numerous guns (rifles and pistols, I saw them) he had found during demolition work. As far as I know he always kept what he found. I specifically remember one as I shot it - A Walther .22 Olympia Pistole match pistol. It was in sad shape but it still fired.

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Old 07-24-2018, 04:02 PM
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"Friend told of contractor recently finding a loaded .38 SPL(S&W or Colt) during a home remodel." Makes me wonder where exactly he found it, behind the wall or under a pillow.

I had a chance to buy a Colt Python 6" stainless for $250.00 off a house painter and passed.
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Old 07-24-2018, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles_the_hammer View Post
I know that what the guy did was technically against the law, but I have to admit that stealing something from someone who didn't even realize they owned it in the first place really does seem like a victimless crime. The current owner paid for a house and some land. He or she probably didn't consider any firearms that were sealed up behind the walls when they signed the deed. Hell, if the mortgage isn't paid off maybe the bank is entitled to it?

Reminds me of the case I heard about related to my numismatics hobby. A contractor found a HUGE cache of Depression-era paper money stashed behind a wall during a renovation. Not only was the face value of the cash worth a ton, but the collectible value was through the roof, too. All these bills were brown seal and silver certificate notes, etc.

So, the contractor decides to "do the right thing" and tell the homeowner. They can't agree on a split, so it goes to court. Then the heirs of the person to who hid the money in the first place got involved. Know who was legally entitled to the money? The heirs of the person who hid the cash.

Whatever happened to . . . the fight over money found in wall of West Side home? | cleveland.com

So, if you go by that particular court ruling, this gun belongs to whoever happens to be the heir of the person who stashed it there in the first place.
One's true CHARACTER is what someone does when nobody else is looking! Still a thief!
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Old 07-24-2018, 04:05 PM
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This is a Theft and possibly more.
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Old 07-24-2018, 05:00 PM
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I know that what the guy did was technically against the law, but....
This line of reasoning really need go no further. At most, delete “technically.”

When you know something is wrong, it generally is.
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Old 07-24-2018, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SC_Mike View Post
"Friend told of contractor recently finding a loaded .38 SPL(S&W or Colt) during a home remodel." Makes me wonder where exactly he found it, behind the wall or under a pillow.

I had a chance to buy a Colt Python 6" stainless for $250.00 off a house painter and passed.
I sold my Browning HP to a good friend back in 1985. It, along with a Blackhawk, were stolen by painters, now that you mention it... (Of course, he should have had them locked up securely rather than just hidden behind a bookcase...)
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Old 07-24-2018, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by 03hemi View Post
One's true CHARACTER is what someone does when nobody else is looking! Still a thief!
Seems there are those who are challenged with the concept of right and wrong.
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Old 07-24-2018, 08:08 PM
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The way I was brought up is a thief is a thief, no matter what he steals. Stealing is stealing. Trying to justify theft is just as wrong. I can't tolerate a thief.
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Old 07-24-2018, 08:18 PM
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Holy Sea Lawyering Batman!!

I would like to think I would turn it in, but you never really know what you will do until you are actually put in the situation.

FTR- I wore a badge for a portion of my life and cops are like everybody else. A vast majority are great folks, but there a few bad apples out there. I have a great story about a call I took as a desk officer one day... A guy who was a Plumber from Jersey Called in. A real nice guy with a thick accent. FUUGGIIITTAAABBBOOUUUTTIITTT! Anyhow he proceeds to tell me how one of our officers pulled him over for Reckless driving. I guess the officer struck a deal with him on the side of the road because he needed some plumbing done at is house. The plumber is like " Hey!! I know how it works and I am cool with that, but now this guy has me at his mother in laws house etc... that is too much!!" I replied "Uh no sir. That is not how it works." I put him in touch with IA. I still get a chuckle over that one. Brings a smile to my face. :-)
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Old 07-24-2018, 08:28 PM
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I agree. Can't abide thieves. This contractor should do what's right and return this firearm to the person who stashed it behind that wall. He should go to the county courthouse and look for the property deed, then the local library to check the obituaries, then find the closest living relative to the former homeowner and return this firearm to them that they had no clue they even owned. Check Find A Grave or Ancestry dot com. This person obviously thought a lot of this weapon or they wouldn't have gone though the trouble to keep it in such a safe place. It's important that this family heirloom be returned to it's rightful owner instead of the current homeowner who has obviously attempted to swindle a free gun in the wall when they bought the home.

After exhausting all efforts to locate either the original owner or closest living relative, I would then invoke the law of "Finder's Keepers, Losers Weepers".
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by charles_the_hammer View Post
I agree. Can't abide thieves. This contractor should do what's right and return this firearm to the person who stashed it behind that wall. He should go to the county courthouse and look for the property deed, then the local library to check the obituaries, then find the closest living relative to the former homeowner and return this firearm to them that they had no clue they even owned. Check Find A Grave or Ancestry dot com. This person obviously thought a lot of this weapon or they wouldn't have gone though the trouble to keep it in such a safe place. It's important that this family heirloom be returned to it's rightful owner instead of the current homeowner who has obviously attempted to swindle a free gun in the wall when they bought the home.

After exhausting all efforts to locate either the original owner or closest living relative, I would then invoke the law of "Finder's Keepers, Losers Weepers".
Wow, aren't you just a special kind of.......................... Never mind... SMH
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by 03hemi View Post
One's true CHARACTER is what someone does when nobody else is looking! Still a thief!
I concur wholeheartedly!
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ColbyBruce View Post
Anybody can do anything they want as long as they are willing to suffer the consequences. That contractor made two errors; he considered taking the gun then he did take it. Just plain stupid.
Actually the two mistakes the contractor made were taking the gun and then telling someone he did it. Thinking about doing something , absent anything else, is simply not a crime otherwise a lot of us would be guilty of all kinds of unspeakable crimes
And by not reporting it, the person he told is guilty of Misprision of Felony.

Pesky little things like "the Law"
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by charles_the_hammer View Post
Can't abide thieves.

_________________________________

I would then invoke the law of "Finder's Keepers, Losers Weepers".

Really?
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:38 PM
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Default Louisiana's Law of Treasure....old Law Review Article

From the Civil Code ( yes, THAT one, the one everyone makes fun of)
LA Civ Code 3420 :: CC 3420 — Treasure :: 2011 Louisiana Laws :: US Codes and Statutes :: US Law :: Justia


And here's an article from the LSU Law Review from back in 1960

https://digitalcommons.law.lsu.edu/c...context=lalrev

Have fun
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:46 PM
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You’re not really trying to convince us that the Napoleonic Code represents the rest of the laws of the land . . . ?

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Originally Posted by CAJUNLAWYER View Post
From the Civil Code ( yes, THAT one, the one everyone makes fun of)
LA Civ Code 3420 :: CC 3420 — Treasure :: 2011 Louisiana Laws :: US Codes and Statutes :: US Law :: Justia


And here's an article from the LSU Law Review from back in 1960

https://digitalcommons.law.lsu.edu/c...context=lalrev

Have fun
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Old 07-24-2018, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Retired LTC, USAR View Post
If he hid the murder weapon in the wall, wonder where he hid the body?
In backyard or Septic Tank!
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Old 07-24-2018, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ischia View Post
Friend told of contractor recently finding a loaded .38 SPL(S&W or Colt) during a home remodel. He was working on the job at the time so more that one person knows about the find for sure. It is a SPD marked(police issue?) loaded,one round fired, case not removed. The contractor researched previous owners of the home and found that in 1948 it was owned by a SPD detective who's wife suddenly disappeared back then. The contractor did not tell the home owner. Yes, I would call that theft. What would you do?

Ischia
This is all just hearsay. Not a drop of proof of anything here. And, if it HAD happened as written depends on local gun laws. In NYC, New Jersey, California, Chicago and certain other Gestapo states or cities ... it is a crime. The gun is supposed to be turned in to the PD and that is IT !! NO, exceptions.

In other states the owner of the house just need do a stolen gun check. In Florida, the FDLE has a stolen gun search web page, open to the public. If it is not stolen, it belongs to the owner of the house who might have likely given it to the contractor, I'd bet.

His missing wife ? It's a matter of habeas corpus. No body, no crime. And if he HAD done it, why hide the gun when there's no body (nobody, no one) ?

That was likely a hide out or stash gun in the house. I think EVERYONE keeps a hideout somewhere that only he knows where it is.
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Old 07-24-2018, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by WTN1271 View Post
A little of topic but close enough. ...locally we had an unsolved disappearance of a woman. The husband was a suspect but nothing could be proven. After he died, the house was being renovated and her body was discovered in a false wall.

The contractor called the police.

In Cluttered Home, a Dark Secret 3 Decades Old - The New York Times
Well at least he knew where she was hanging out... Some sick Jealous people out there...

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Old 07-24-2018, 10:57 PM
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I think this guy should go to the cops , explain bad judgment, hand over the evidence and let them continue the original investigation. At worse he will get a slap on the wrist for bad judgment... My 02?

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