This morning, I caught this on the news ( channel to remain anonymous ). Quote; " The Covid vaccine distribution to municipalities will not cost the tax payers. The Government will pick up the tab". I nearly choked on my Rice Chex. !!!

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John

.gov is paying for it with money that's been printed out of thin air, AKA deficit spending, so it really may not cost us anything. Our kids and grandkids are another story.

The thing that caught my eye is that the Pfizer vaccine makes people feel sick enough they're concerned about people coming back for the second shot in 21 days.

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Vegan by proxy.

I don't buy the early version of a newly released firearm, you know, til they get the bugs worked out.

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- Change it back -

My wife will get it first (age, underlying health) and I'll get it as soon as they offer it - I don't want that disease. Some family have had, and the ones who noticed symptoms were just hammered. None died, thank God.

I'd be happy to have my insurance pay, or even pay cash.

So, how long is the immunity from the vaccination(s) supposed to last? Maybe I missed it, as i can't recall anyone talking about that small detail.

Despite what media is implying, even with the "free" vaccines, 'rona isn't going away.

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Thread Killer.

Great job getting this to the people. Warp speed indeed.

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Sure you did

I have VERY mixed feelings about this vaccine. At thin point, I simply do not trust ANYTHING I read about the Covid other than it is still out there and can seriously mess you up to the point of death. I'm scared that the vaccine may have side effects-am scared about the speed with which it had been pushed through, and quite frankly do not trust it. Sorry but I just don't trust it. WIll I take it?????? Jury is still out on that. My son is a registered Nurse and does work on the COvid ICU's and tells me it is a horrible way to go. I'm 65 so am what the young'uns refer to as "old" and therefore at high risk so I have a decision to make down the line. My wife sheres the same feelings as I do.

I like the above poster's idea of letting the wife be the Beta tester though
"Honey I love you so much that I think you should take the vaccine and I'll wait until there is more". Then if she doesn't get some horrible adverse reaction, I'll consider getting the shot. Only problem is that I suspect she is thinking the same thing

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Forum consigliere

Do you have a link to that issue?
Thx
RT

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Have Fun/Stay Safe

I've come across several recent news reports that say it is not yet known for how long the vaccines will provide immunity. Perhaps it will be an annual thing, like flu shots?

Re the virus going away, everything I have read says that despite the introduction of the vaccine, to get enough people vaccinated and immune — has to be something like 80% of the population — to develop herd immunity will take a good part of next year, at least, so masks and social distancing will need to be maintained into the third quarter, if not beyond.

As for me, I will take the vaccine when it becomes available to me. I believe the government scientists/experts who say that while the speed of development has been unprecedented, safety has not and will not be compromised.

Trump Covid vaccine czar: Side effects '''significantly noticeable''' in up to 15% of recipients

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Sure you did

That's helpful - thank you.

I'm at the point where I don't believe anything I'm being told I need to believe.

History has shown that the greatest threat to the average person is their own government. Our government has a history of lying to us. They tell us they had/have to do it for our own good when/if they get busted - or they investigate themselves and find they've done nothing wrong. Add to that a media that doesn't report hard news or even have real journalists - instead we have activists pushing a narrative and we don't get the real truth.

All I know is that I'm not signing up to be a beta tester nor a guinea pig for a rushed product that is injected into my body that I'm being told by the very people that I don't trust is "safe".

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Thread Killer.

I am 69 and have lung issues and when I can get it I will.
Vaccines have done away with polio, small pox and would eliminate measles if it wasn't for the antis.

The world population has exploded since the advent of vaccines 1796 (cow pox used to give small pox immunity) has gone from 1 billion in 1800 to 2 billion in 1927 (127 years) to 7.5 billion now (less than 100yearrs . Vaccines, medicine and sanitation are the main reason.

Read the testing data. Moderna gave it to 1/2 of its 30.000 group and the data safety and monitoring board (not the government) didn't identify "any significant safety concerns. That data didn't come from the government it came from science.

But, no I don't trust the government either. But, first in line are the health care workers, if the Dr and nurses take it with no problems I will go for it too. If the are still for it after they take it I call it the" Big Clue".

I take those odds any day. safer than driving the Lincoln 100 miles to the big clinic. Safer than getting the virus for me, thats for sure.

I really have to vacillate about this new vaccine/s. I'm 75 have a bunch of serious health problems, so to do or not to do is the question.

As of this time I'm leaning to be a test dummy for this procedure.

This is a very big topic on a couple other forums I'm on and also family, with the crew I travel with up here at the lake. This conundrum seems to be a damned if you do and damned if you don't. Reading/watching all I can see that talks about it, but the bottom line is as I'm considered by some folks to be of sound mind the choice is mine.

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14 S&W Revs none with locks!

We should not confuse the terms "immunity" and "resistance". A vaccine stimulates the body's ability to prevent infection by specific viral agents, thus resulting in antibody production and developing resistance.

Immunity means a total inability to become infected, likely to become a genetic trait passed on to offspring.

Covid-19 is a corona virus, as are the common cold and all variants of flu viruses. These viruses are constantly mutating and adapting to facilitate survival within any available host. That is why there has never been a cure for the common cold, and flu immunizations are constantly changing to deal with new strains of virus.

Covid, in one form or another, is here to stay. There is no magic bullet cure, and any immunization effort will require repetition in order to have any usefulness. There will always be cases of illness, and there will always be deaths, just as there are with influenza outbreaks every year and throughout the world.

Even after successful inoculation resulting in individual resistance to infection, a person can still carry the virus and pass it on to anyone with whom there is contact.

I am 66 and in great shape. I have had two previous lung diseases, no current problems. My doctor in Denver told me to not be first in line for the vacinne. All of the data is on healthy people, it will take a while to get data on the rest who have some underlying conditions.

I'm 65, had 3 different cancers, and I will wait. My life hasn't really been all that affected by the beer virus.

I'm OK with this but imagine the outrage if it was proposed by...ummm... "someone else."

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics...247217141.html

Polio and small pox have returned to North America, including highly resistant strains. The source is believed to be immigrants from parts of the world that were never provided the vaccines commonly used here until we saw these diseases disappear from our population. Now we have millions of younger folks who are becoming infected with these "conquered" diseases, and medical resources having only limited resources to combat these new strains.

Keep in mind vaccines are going out to healthcare systems and workers first. The general population is further towards the back of the line.

From Who
As of April 14, 1978, no cases of smallpox have been reported to the World Health Organization (WHO) from anywhere in the world since the last case had onset of rash on October 26, 1977, in Merka town, Somalia.

It is believed that it now only exists in labs

Where did you hear of a small pox infection?????

There has not been a case of polio originating in the USA since 1979. However, the virus has been brought into the country by travelers with polio. The last time this happened was in 1993.

That was 27 years ago.

Resistance, immunity, whatever you want to call it, the point being, no one is saying nor even questioning how long it lasts after being vaccinated.

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Thread Killer.

Immunization can be compared to a training program. Introduction of dead or attenuated virus is introduced to the body to stimulate auto-immune response, production of antibodies, and providing a target for the white blood cells to recognize and overcome.

A certain percentage of those immunized will become ill with the disease, and some may die. The goal is to succeed with the majority of the population. The duration of effectiveness will vary from short-term to very long-term, but none of those inoculated will be protected from future mutations of the virus (those will require new vaccines).

I seriously doubt that even the most successful applications will result in more than annual effectiveness.

Often when someone claims that “no one is (whatever)”, you’re just not looking hard enough, or hardly at all. Even a cursory search produces lots of articles and discussions on the subject.

Of course the question is very much on everybody’s mind. The main problem seems to be that a question about time can only be answered with data gathered over time, and we haven’t had that yet.

Here’s a representative blurb from “Nature”:

“Lasting immunity?
One key unanswered question is how long the vaccine’s effectiveness will last. On the basis of when the trial started and previously published data on immune responses in early-stage trials, many trial participants are likely to still have high levels of protective antibodies in their blood, says Rafi Ahmed, an immunologist at Emory University in Atlanta, Georgia. “To me, the main question is what about six months later, or even three months later,” he says.

There will be a chance to answer that question if the trial continues for several more months, says Ahmed. Answers could also come from analysis of the immune responses of people who took part in early-stage trials of the Pfizer vaccine, some of whom might have been given the vaccine up to six months ago. And although little is known about the vaccine’s long-term effectiveness, that is unlikely to hold up its use, says Ahmed. “I don’t think we should say, ‘Well, I’ll only take a vaccine that protects me for five years.’ I mean, that could be crazy.”

I'll take mine after Congress/Members and Senators
take theirs.

Swedens attempt at combating the virus through herd immunity has been a now self admitted mistake, their deaths per capital much higher than their European neighbors who implemented restrictions.
Regarding herd immunity, there is a reason why millions died before smallpox vaccinations, an equal amount crippled by polio before same. Herd immunity is not a panacea or an answer, it is the occasional outcome of a relatively small number of community spread virus's that tend towards the non lethal.
Regarding vaccinations, the first injection of two I received for shingles, reccomended for all older adults (had a stepfather who suffered miserably with it), was quite painful, couldn't lift my arm for two days and felt feverish, whereas the the second was a breeze. A small price to pay to avoid the diseases themselves.
Regarding the virus itself, US now has evidence that Covid was here in the US as early as December 2019, verified by checking samples from Red Cross blood drives during that month. And the rest of the world is discovering the same, this virus was out and about late last year, and there is zero likelihood the Chinese didn't know that..
The Chinese government is nothing more than a bunch of ruthless gangsters making billions if not trillions by ruthlessly plundering and controlling their country under the guise of communism. When this is all over, they will be responsible for more deaths than the sum of all wars in the past 100 years. And we'll still be buying their cheap **** at Walmart.

On a prayer request line from the church one person had died and six more had the COVID-19 in some stage. One other person died from it two days ago.
At my age it would probably get me so unless something adverse comes up, I will take it when and if I get the chance. This stuff is mean and here for the long haul.

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Mighty 90's,Trying 4 a 100!

Yeah, OK. I get what you're saying.

No offense, but I'm not interested that. I don't know how much clearer I can be, but I'm interested in the official, like the .gov or pharma company claims on how long resistance/immunity lasts with their products given how this was rushed. No one is saying or certainly the media doesn't question - at least from what I've read. That's my point. Again. no offense.

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Thread Killer.

The whole world knows who was responsible, and where it came from.


China document leak shows flawed pandemic response - CNN Video

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Sure you did

In other words, no one knows.

So what's the official word from the .gov and/or the the manufacturers themselves?
Since you say that I'm "just not looking hard enough, or hardly at all", your words, perhaps you can find the official claims

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Thread Killer.

People locked themselves up for 8 months trying to avoid a virus...only to inject themselves with an unproven mRNA vaccine?

No thanks, not a lab rat.

I’ll take my chances with the over 99% survival rate of the virus. But..I’m also a lot younger than most of the crowd here. We all have to do what we think is best for us.

Un proven? between the 2 vaccines which both use mRRA, over 3000 people were injected with it (1500 apiece) . Of those 3000 zero died. That is way better odds than a virus that has proven to kill 1 out of 1000 health individuals. Plus, a lot more people are going to be injected before it gets to the general population. The 20 million doses that will be ready before the end of 2020 are not going to be used on the general population, Even those over 65 are not in line for those. If a bunch of health care workers and residents of rest homes survive get it and survive it will be a BIG CLUE as to its safety.

I would take the shot tomorrow if I could get it. Better than 1 in 3000 is safer than chancing the virus for me.

The only way they are going to know how long it is effective is time. Impossible to test for multi year immunity in 6 months. They can only guess.

Where it came from is pretty mute at this point as it is now all over. Where it came from is kind of like getting hit with a bus, does it really matter who had the right of way once your underneath the tires? Might be important to the lawyers and your estate LATER, but while the wheels are on you the important thing is getting them off.

How fast a vaccine will be available to most folks here in cornfields and cows country remains to be seen. I will say that as soon as a vaccine becomes available, whether it be the Pfizer or Moderna version, my wife and I will be getting it as there is no point in waiting around and increasing our chances of getting the virus.

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"In God We Trust"

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Only a cold warrior

And then there were those out there on the news that said they expected to get paid for taking the vaccine.

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Why duck?? It's a 9mm!

Does anyone know the long term side effects of the vaccines produced by and flaunted by big Big Pharma and it's lobbyist to the FDA, U.S. Senators and Congressmen who get kickbacks for rushing a "miracle cure" that is unproven to "prevent" the China Virus?

China Flu affects your lungs.
You drown and die in your own fluids.
Relief Therapeutics Aviptadil RLF-100 is inhaled directly into your lungs to combat and kill the virus cells.

I'm not a pharmacist but before you get the vaccine shots, and you will need at least two just google Relief Therapeutics Aviptadil RLF-100.

RLF-100 was developed in the 1970's and has been used to save the lives of firefighters and smoke inhalation victims using "T-Cells" that our bodies naturally produce.
It's kinda like a fish breaths in water and it's lungs extract enough oxygen to survive in water.
Take the fish out of water it dies cause there is too much oxygen and that is what kills it by "drowning".
The antibodies produced buy the fish to combat the overdose of oxygen causes lungs to fill up with fluid.

I'm a high school dropout.
11th grade education.
Do your own research before you roll up your sleeve.

I heard it on the news this a.m., but here's an article from CUNY that says the same.

"A senior Pfizer executive told the news outlet Stat that side effects from the company’s vaccine appear to be comparable to those of standard adult vaccines but worse than those of the company’s pneumonia vaccine, Prevnar, or typical flu shots.
...
Persuading people who experience those symptoms to return in three to four weeks for a second dose — and a second round of flu-like symptoms — could be a tough sell, Schaffner said."

Pfizer’s Covid-19 Vaccine May Have Unpleasant Side Effects! | Tony's Thoughts

ETA - Just heard on the national news they don't want to vaccinate everyone in a hospital department (e.g. ICU, ER) at the same time because the side effects are severe enough it could result in everyone in the department staying home ill for 1 or 2 days with no one left to staff the units.

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Vegan by proxy.

Did some reading and you are correct. Zero polio.

The bigger problems now encountered with illegal immigrants include tuberculosis and small pox, both highly resistant.

I apologize for my error.

And yet you’re giving medical advice . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

That's quite true...but the whole world also sees how the USA has responded -- or failed to respond -- to this situation, and what has resulted.

Let me use an analogy from our shared profession: There is a multi-alarm fire going on right now. It's spreading, not even confined, let alone under control.

Once it's out, there will be ample time to investigate how it started, find the exact point of origin, and fix blame. But first, we have to extinguish it. And knowing that it's arson, and even if we know for certain who the arsonist is, that doesn't excuse us from responsibility for doing our best to extinguish it.

Tell you what Muss,
I'll bet you my expertise in the field of medicine is equal to your expertise of law or law enforcement.

Duly noted . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

You seem to have made a campaign out of all of this, good for you.
While you’re at it you can call all the others who you won’t blame, like the many governors who introduced Covid patients into nursing homes. And the politicians who have not led by example.

Btw, Covid is still very active outside the US.

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Sure you did

The vaccine is pre infection the RLF-100 is post infection and those who got severe infections then rolled up their sleeve( or lungs as it is still ingestion) for it only had an 81% survival rate. I has only been tested on a few people also. Did the research.. I take the vaccine over a maybe survival

RLF-100 is a seat belt that might save you after the wreck. I would rather not get in the wreck That simple and I don't have a HS diploma either. But got on the deans list in college till I left to get my education. I also scored in the 99% in all my testing national scores. So what. The Doctors do know much more than either of us

Choice, that's what make America great bro.
You take the vaccine and I'll wait and see how you do.
Semper Fi

My late FIL, also from the Ozarks, thought doctors were, "..robbin', stealin', sons of (you know)." He refused to follow their instructions and wouldn't take prescribed medicines. I miss him a lot - he was as much a father as an FIL.

Over the span of two careers, I have spent almost 50 years in the field of public safety. Yes, saving lives and protecting people is my calling, as it is or was yours, and if you want to call that a "campaign", that's fine by me.

In my current, second public safety career, as in my first, I have to go to work, and I have to interact with members of the public. I'm a 67 year old cancer survivor, and I have no desire to contract this illness. Furthermore, my ex-wife, the mother of my two sons, is a staff nurse in a large hospital...I don't want her to get sick either. Both of my sons go to work everyday, and I don't want them or their wives or children to get sick...so my "campaign" -- persuading people to accept the science and the truth about this virus -- is also personal.

In the early weeks of this pandemic, there were many honest mistakes by many public officials, things many of them probably wish they could do over again. Others deliberately lied to the public, downplayed what was happening even when they knew better, and refused to set an example for the public of responsible behavior. Still others, as you correctly note, are hypocritical, telling the public to do one thing while they themselves do another. The voters can choose -- or not choose -- to deal with them when the dust settles from this. I choose not to share my opinion of them on here because doing so would violate the Rules.

Despite all that...the fact remains that the USA leads the world in cases and deaths from this illness. That's shameful, and I can't think of any reason for it, other than that we have dropped the ball and failed to act properly.

Who are you persuading? Your daily rants are duly noted, we get it.

Hang on until Jan 20, help is on its way.

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Sure you did

I plead guilty to being an opinionated son-of-a-gun, especially on subjects I'm passionate about. But with all due respect, what have I said that you disagree with? Do you not think this situation is a serious public health emergency? Do you not think we could be doing more to mitigate it?

On the other hand, we do seem to agree that we've not gotten the help we need so far...thanks.

I am waiting. Why because as others said it has been rushed into production without any long term side effects studies. I know several people who have had it. My son for one and he never felt bad a day. Two other friends had it and said their worst symptoms were like a bad cold for three days or so. A former work acquaintance died from it but he had no functioning kidneys due to cancer and was on dialysis several times a week. Covid may be listed as the cause of death but maybe so maybe not. My son who works in health care says his hospitals deaths are for the most part have co morbidity issues.
At this point in time I do not believe anything that the government says and if you quote anything from CNN, ABC, CBS, MSNBC or any other so called media outlets the truth is not on your side.
IMO this virus like most other respiratory viruses is constantly mutating so todays fix may not help with tomorrows problem. Maybe at some point I will be accepting to a more proven solution.

I can't figure out why Americans are blaming America for all the China Flu deaths here in the USA and the world.
China developed the virus, militarized it and released it by accident ? into the Wuhan district population and then halted travel out of the affected district in China but didn't stop Chinese international travel.

Yup...it's Americas fault.