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08-13-2010, 01:34 PM
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questions about k-38
I am looking for tips on bullet types and sources for a revolver I recently acquired. I am an active and experienced rifle reloader, but I have never reloaded for a handgun before. I recently acquired a very clean k-38 combat masterpiece and I am pretty excited to start reloading for it. I have shot a couple of boxes of factory ammo through it and it seems to be a real good shooter.
I would like to start by developing a plinker load that I can use to fifty yards. Something accurate and affordable to shoot so I can get some mileage with this gun. I have some Unique powder on hand, and I am thinking maybe cast bullets. Eventually I want to cast my own, but I will start by buying some to figure out what might work best.
TIPS?
Thanks, Pete
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08-13-2010, 02:14 PM
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I like to use 4.5 Unique with 158 gr SWC lead bullets in my 1955 vintage K-38. I have also used 148 gr wadcutters with 2.8 Bullseye for a soft target load.
Hope this helps.
Steve
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08-13-2010, 05:06 PM
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I use a lot of Unique but not often in .38 special.
My most common loads for the .38's are:
3.0 grains WC-231 with 148 grain DEWC or HBWC seated flush
4.2 grains WC-231 with 158 grain LSWC or LRN
Both loads shoot exceptionally well in my K-38s as well as many other .38 special revolvers.
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08-13-2010, 05:33 PM
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My "goto" load for any 38spl is a 158gr +/- over 3.5gr of Bullseye.
I shot against a fellow in a plate competition and he used 4.5gr of Unique under the same weight bullet. Anything less than 4.5gr and there will be problems with unburnt powder, at least that was his opinion.
There are tons of powder that make the ole' K-38 sing. I like SR4756 for +P loads. HS-6 is a favorite for others. Titegroup is used by many but has so little case fill, I stay away from it. W231/HP-38 is another excellent choice for both target and +P loads.
The old load of 2.7gr of Bullseye under a 148gr HBWC is supposed to be "THE" accuracy load for the Masterpiece. Never have loaded them though so, this is just by way of hearsay.
Hope this helps! Have fun and be safe!
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08-13-2010, 06:05 PM
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My old favorite was 4.0 gr. of 231 under a lswc, but I'm switching to Bullseye instead of the 231 and have not worked up any favorites in the .38s yet. When I have felt like shooting I've been using my .41s.
Anyway, as far as your bullet choice, lead is a good way to go for accuracy and economy and can be good for other reasons too, depending on what you want. Round nose, wadcutter and semi-wadcutters can all be very accurate but they have different purposes. All are good for plinking or killing tin cans, ( I can't believe I just went back and edited that for the liberals).
Lead Round Nose, are good for fast relaoding and are great for long distance shooting and small game/varmint hunting. They are my favorite all-purpose bullet as long as scoring rings or my life aren't involved.
Wadcutters are a good choice for slow loads because they will stabilize at lower velocities and hollow based wadcutters are better yet because of their "front heavy" design and their ability to obturate at lower pressures. They are a nice choice for paper punching because their sharp corners cut nice full diameter holes in paper, which round nose bullets don't do. They also make a good self defense bullet, as long as you don't have to reload, and are also good for hunting small game.
Semi-wadcutters have a sharp shoulder that will still cut a nice clean hole in paper, but they are easier to load during timed paper punching events. They are also be a good design for hunting, usually, and are probably shot by more people than the other designs. They are a good design for self defense with proper alloys and can be reloaded easier if need be. (by "reloaded" I'm referring to recharging the chambers, not the handloading of ammunition.
There are other choices too, such as round balls, spire points and truncated cones, but the above three are used most and are more easily available.
Last edited by Jellybean; 08-13-2010 at 06:10 PM.
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08-13-2010, 06:19 PM
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My K-38 is a M14-2 from 1962. I just shot it the other day with 6.5 gr of SR 4756 to see if the same bullet/load would shoot well in a King Cobra. The K-38 shot fine, with all four shots hitting the spinner, the King Cobra didn't score a single hit.
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08-13-2010, 11:23 PM
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Thanks for all the info!
That's a lot of food for thought.
Best retards, Pete
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08-14-2010, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smith crazy
My "goto" load for any 38spl is a 158gr +/- over 3.5gr of Bullseye.
I shot against a fellow in a plate competition and he used 4.5gr of Unique under the same weight bullet. Anything less than 4.5gr and there will be problems with unburnt powder, at least that was his opinion.
There are tons of powder that make the ole' K-38 sing. I like SR4756 for +P loads. HS-6 is a favorite for others. Titegroup is used by many but has so little case fill, I stay away from it. W231/HP-38 is another excellent choice for both target and +P loads.
The old load of 2.7gr of Bullseye under a 148gr HBWC is supposed to be "THE" accuracy load for the Masterpiece. Never have loaded them though so, this is just by way of hearsay.
Hope this helps! Have fun and be safe!
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Ditto for Smith Crazy's post, I use the Speer 158 LSWC-HP's with 3.5 of Bullseye and it shoot's very well out of all of my .38 Special's.
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Stay safe people!
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08-14-2010, 10:54 AM
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understanding the terms?
LSWC HP- Does that mean lead semi wad cutter hollow point?
The swc seems to be the most frequently mentioned, does the hollow point add to the defensive capabilities of the bullet?
Also can I assume since gas checks aren't being mentioned that for plinking purposes in a 38 special they aren't necessary? Are they necessary with +p loads?
I don't have any plans to shoot +p for plinking but at some point I will probably want to get my ducks in a row for defense as well but I will save that for another post.
Super thanks people, Pete
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08-14-2010, 11:02 AM
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I think the loads I use in my model 10 and model 15 revolvers (4 to 4.5 gr of 231 under either a 158gr LSWC or LRN bullet) might work well in your gun. The RN bullet doesn't cut the nice clean holes but is very accurate.
BT
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08-14-2010, 02:46 PM
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Beagleye, yes, LSWC-HP is as you stated.
The hollow point does add to the defensive capabilities as long as it works as intended. Hollow points work on the priniciple of weakening the nose to enable it to deform more easily. However they still need a large enough amount of energy and enough resistance to make them work, which doesn't always happen. Also they can get clogged with clothing or other materials which will hamper their effectiveness. If they work, great, if not, then you really haven't lost anything so many people carry them anyway.
When I started casting bullets the rule of thumb I'd heard was that gas checks should be used for anything over 1000fps. Their use in lower pressure loads can actually be dangerous due to the fact that the GC may come off in the barrel and become an obstruction. Their use is still debatable in higher velocity loads. If the bullets are of a good alloy and properly sized to the firearm, and the guns bore is clean with no pits and is properly sized to the cylinder throats you may never see leading at all. However, if gas is able to escape around the bullet, for whatever reason, the gas checks can be used to stop it.
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08-15-2010, 12:36 AM
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I have a 14-2 from about 1965 and I have found that it likes a 148g DEWC from Tn Valley Bullets (Jesse makes great bullets) over 3.2g Bullseye. When I do my part, I can get groups that can be covered up by a quarter at 50 feet.
Remember that anyone's suggestion is merely a starting point. My load works great in my gun. I tried them in my buddy's 4" Diamondback and they made about an 8" group at the same distance off a rest. (The Diamondback got great groups with 158g jacketed round nose factory ammo)
Sometimes a great load isn't so great in a certain gun....
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08-15-2010, 12:00 PM
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Thanks for the lead on that supplier Rawhyde
I think I'll try him. Do you use .356, 7 or 8. Also with the hardness of 12 that he uses, does the rule of thumb on no gas checks below 1000fps still apply or is that number lower.
I am betting Jesse could probably answer those questions but while I got your attention... , and more than one opinion is always better.
Thanks, Pete
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08-15-2010, 01:27 PM
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My box is marked .358 I haven't measured one of them with calipers, but I'll be glad to when I come back home (just walking out the door to go shooting )
I don't have any leading problems using this load (148 DEWC over 3.2 grains of Bullseye), but that load is substantially less than 1000 fps.
Jesse's bullets also work well for me in .41 Magnum. I use a 210g lead SWC over 14.5g 2400. I think that load is less than 1000 fps, but I don't have a chronograph yet.
Rawhyde
Quote:
Originally Posted by beagleye
I think I'll try him. Do you use .356, 7 or 8. Also with the hardness of 12 that he uses, does the rule of thumb on no gas checks below 1000fps still apply or is that number lower.
I am betting Jesse could probably answer those questions but while I got your attention... , and more than one opinion is always better.
Thanks, Pete
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08-16-2010, 11:19 PM
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I normally shoot .358"-.359" bullets with about 12 BHN. Since they're big enough to fill the throat diameter, I don't get much leading, regardless of the velocity (up to 1450 fps in .357 Mag).
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08-18-2010, 06:03 PM
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It is considered a +P load these days, but I shot a lot of 155 to 160gr RN or SWC over 5grs of Unique. Some folks consider Unique too dirty, but Elmer and Skeeter liked it a lot.
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08-18-2010, 07:33 PM
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I've used many lbs of Unique with a 150 gr LSWC and even a 170 gr LSWC by Lyman. My favorite charge is 5.0 gr of Unique. I'm now done with Unique and have switched to Universal because it flows through my charger better then Unique.
The preferred bullet is probably 150 to 158 gr and I prefer the Keith style to any round nose, they always shot accurately for me out of my .38's.
The 150 gr bullet I use is from a H&G mold. I've done lots of experimenting as I had my own casting business.
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08-18-2010, 09:04 PM
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Joed49,
What kind of charge weights are you using with Universal? Is it correct that you can use generally the same charge weights in .38 Special with Universal that you do with Unique?
Wayne
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11-02-2010, 02:56 AM
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I loaded some 160gr swcs over 5grs Universal. I fired them in conjunction with some Unique loads. I couldn't really tell the differance. Didn't chrono them, though.
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11-23-2011, 05:57 AM
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What to avoid
As a new owner of a K38 masterpiece I wake this thread up...
Are there any bullet types or weights one should avoid?
Is there a a velocity one should try not to exceed?
Plated or jacketed bullets?
Cowboy action bullets, some are very light I understand, what are they capable of?
+P is mentioned as one thing to avoid but then again I understand that +P loads may be very different.
I will only use this gun for different types of target shooting.
Thanks!
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11-23-2011, 11:27 AM
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Swed,
If you actually have a K38 and not a M14, it isn't recommended for +P anyway. That doesn't mean it won't handle it, or that it will blow the gun up, but it does mean it may shorten its usable life.
I prefer to use wadcutter style bullets or something of the 158 gr LSWC type at lower velocities, around 800 fps, in my M14-2. Jacketed or plated bullets in my estimation only increase wear on the gun and raise the cost of shooting over cast bullets. Since I cast my own bullets, I may be biased.
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11-23-2011, 08:17 PM
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It is now a + P load but in the Lyman manuals for many years. 358477 a 158 gr swc over 5.4 gr Unique is my accuracy test for a modern, solid frame revolver. I use it in a K-38 from 1970's with no adverse effects and great accuracy.
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11-23-2011, 11:19 PM
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I have a 6" 14-2 and have come to love the DEWC 147g round in a variety of powders.
How I missed out on using the DEWC for so long I'll never know.
I've shot another favorite 130 RNFP I use in a 627PC, but frankly it doesn't seem to work as accurately in the 14-2. Guess I need more range time!!!
Cast 158 SWC and 158 RN seem to do quite well in limited shooting so far.
So many guns......so little time.....
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11-24-2011, 01:16 AM
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The 38spl,
lyman 358495 148g wc 3.2g bullseye
lyman 358495 or 358477 148g wc or 150g swc 3.2g ww452/trap100
lyman 358311 158g rn 4.2g universal clays
lyman 358311 158g rn 4.7g universal clays (P+)
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11-24-2011, 10:55 AM
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Tags
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38spl, 627pc, bullseye, chronograph, combat masterpiece, k38, m14, masterpiece, model 10, model 14, model 15, skeeter, universal, wadcutter |
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