With summer here, I find this the most comfortable way to carry my 442. yeah, I know, slow on the draw and all that...but I'm more concerned with having it on me than needing a quick draw...and I'm around so many kids all day with Dino and Ava, this is the only way it goes completely undetected....

Renegade cozy partner...very comfortable and very concealable...those are straight leg levis....try that with a molded leather holster....

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

Nice shoes...

__________________
Centennial Every Day

Converse All Stars?!

__________________
Remove mittenz B4 typing!

Those are some cool old skool kicks, I like 'em!


I also like ankle holsters. I wear my j-frame in one when working in the hospital, scrub pants don't allow many options. Been using one for a couple of years now, never had a problem, never been outed.

__________________
Don't kiss smiling dogs!

WOW.... Sip wears jeans?

I agree with the utility of ankle holsters, Sip. There are times when your type of clothing just won't permit anything else. On occasion, I've used this DeSantis rig. I routinely buy my Levis with the "boot cut" so as to allow for easier concealment and draw.

With more formal clothing, I've found it helps to use a thin black sock on the foot to which the ankle holster will be attached. Then affix the holster, put on another black sock and pull it up to cover all but the grip of the gun. If your pants ride up, it will just look like you have a lumpy sock if anyone notices. The inner sock helps to prevent chafing. If you sit and cross your legs, keep your gun foot on the floor.

I remember seeing The French Connection years ago, and it was a surprise to see "Popeye Doyle" utilize one as a backup gun holster. Even to most folks today, I suspect it would be a surprise to see a gun drawn from one. Not fast, but as you say, it's always there when you need it. Seated at a table or sitting in a car with seat belts, it could be just the ticket in an emergency.

John

__________________
- Cogito, ergo armatus sum -

Count me in on this one, ankle rig in summer rocks in 95 degree GA weather. I carry a J Frame (Ankle Glove) like Sip and a M&P40c (Ankle Lite). I can carry either with straight leg Levis.



Levis 505 in this pic.

Cheers,
Sam

__________________
Beware the man with one gun...

Glad to see you both have good ankle rigs...the wide bands are the way to go...no Uncle Mikes nylon strap junk......

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

+1 on the Renegade rig, Sip. As a matter of fact, I think I purchased mine a while back on your specific recommendation. Very comfortable and concealable.

See? I can come in handy besides jokes....

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

I ankle carry everyday, usually a Model 49, sometimes a Model 60. I spend a lot of time in a car for work, and it's the quickest way to get to a firearm when seatbelted in a car that I've found. Don't have to worry about it sliding off the seat or getting to it in a glove compartment or console.

How's that work with shorts? 100 degrees here today. Not wearing my Wranglers. For sure.

Out
West

I talked to a retired cop the other day who told me that he used to ankle carry with the firearm pointed up. Just picked up his leg to draw. Not sure what to think of that and haven't tried it. Any advice on this method from those more experienced than me?

__________________
NRA Patron
MSSA Life Member

I have a Renegade holster like Sip's, best on the market IMO....however, I abandoned ankle carry when I came face to face with an escapee and my only gun was on my ankle.....I had practiced drawing a LOT from the leg, but when I needed it, time was NOT my friend....no more is my only gun carried that way..
I do think it is a great way to carry in the car, easy to draw as has been mentioned....

Wow. I don't think I would do that. I have seen guys carry on the strong side ankle with the gun "backwards" from normal, that is, the butt forward.

__________________
Centennial Every Day

Nobody has ever noticed that I'm carrying my M&P 340 in a DeSantis ankle holster



KO

So where does one find these Renegade ankle holsters? One size fits all or are they tailored to a specific gun?

I also liked your tennys Sip.

__________________
Don't tread on me

If you want that outfit to work you really need to get some leather sandals.

__________________
Don't kiss smiling dogs!

I'm a shorts guy too so ankle carry wouldn't work for me... I can remember a movie starring Steve McQueen as a modern day bounty hunter named Popeye or something like that and he carried some kind of a 1911 on his ankle but it was tapped there and not in a holster... Not a real fast draw deal... Later, Dave

__________________
I didn't do it. Nobody saw me.

This, Ladies and Gentlemen, is a picture of a man who dresses himself without female input.

I haven't ankle carried for years. I guess having my Dad's M60 go skipping across the pavement when I ran with it in an ankle holster kinda turned me off to that. Still, some day I may try it again, but not today. It's about 92 in Iowa.
Jim

Look! It's Magnum PU!

__________________
Centennial Every Day

“sipowicz”:

I was glad to see that you broached the subject of Ankle Rigs as this time of the year, they can be an ideal way for some people to carry if their gun, their physical condition, their mode of dress, their environmental conditions, and their expected activities while wearing it, allow for its use.

Generally, the gun has to be of reasonable dimensions for this application as size, weight and protruding surfaces all come into play here. So does the amount of available “space” on the lower leg because a huge gun overhanging a skinny leg/ankle can be problematic in-and-of itself. Oversize (large diameter) ankles can also be problematic for some holster designs but a number of manufacturers are now offering extenders that can address this issue. One doesn’t have to be an athlete to use an ankle holster but you do need to be able to reach the gun from a standing position with whatever technique you use and you need to do so both quickly and fluidly so if back, knee, shoulder, or arm issues impede such a movement, you might want to think twice about this design.

Obviously, one’s pant leg not only must be capable of accommodating the carried firearm but it must also allow the gun to be exposed in an unencumbered movement to allow for the removal of it from the holster during the “draw”. However, the wearer’s concerns should extend beyond that. For while these first two issues are often related to size, you should also make sure that style (cuffs and cuff stitching can be a problem regarding any snags; and how some dress pants “break” against the shoe top can be either very helpful or somewhat disadvantageous) and the material used (it has to be slick enough not to drag on the gun – a problem for different reasons both while carrying and producing the firearm; and the “weight” or “hand” of the fabric involved can cause printing just as badly as too tight a design) work in your favor and not against it.

Unless the user is serious about weapon maintenance, ankle rigs might not be the best choice in extremely dusty areas. And that dust can come from all kinds of things (sand, loose dirt, debris on the ground, etc.). I always tell people if their shoes are always getting dirty or covered with a film of some sort that you find yourself regularly wiping off, you need to think twice about such a rig unless you are a really careful about keeping the gun clean. Standing water can be an issue too, if it rains a lot where you are or if the ground and/or ground cover is either puddled or wet, that can be a problem as well.

Finally, your activity can be an issue. For while a decent ankle holster can be used from a variety of walking, standing or seated positions (and a properly designed and correctly worn one should allow for at least some running and racing up and down stairs), such a holster might not be a good choice if your are riding a bicycle, climbing over stuff, or even just stepping over and maneuvering around things a lot.

There’s more, like the condition of one’s socks and where on the “ankle” the holster might be best worn, but my real reason for responding here was because of what I believe is your unjust and incorrect characterization of the Uncle Mike’s ankle holster as “junk”; and by default (although it is not mentioned) the BLACKHAWK! model as well for it parallels the Michaels design to some degree.

The “wide bands” that you feel are desirous (and might well be for your build and application) are not useable (at all) by many people due to the shape of their legs and are not favorable to others due to either actual or imagined comfort issues.

The leg “shape” matters can be two pronged. Some people simply don’t have enough room vertically to accommodate a wide strap; especially if the user has a large calf or if this portion of their leg is not that long. But almost everybody has some issue of fit and support because of the way their legs are contoured.

The traditional wide bands tend to represent not a better way of doing things but because of the period in time to which they date, they tend to be an example of an easier way of doing things (for the manufacturer and not the wearer). That is because in the past (from which this design springs), it was simpler to cut the wraparound piece from a straight (and often stock size) piece of leather, elastic or fabric. The problem is that when such a linear piece of material is wrapped around the leg, it generally resembles a cylinder whereas most (granted not all) legs taper in the area around which the harness is wrapped in a way that more closely resembles a funnel or inverted cone.

That means that most people who utilize a straight line design (especially those who employ a leather or fabric harness – even those leather or fabric harnesses with an elasticized closure) will find that the top of the harness makes most, if not all, of the significant contact; almost like a straight line along its top if the leg has a more typical, dramatic top-to-bottom taper. Note that people with less taper, thicker lower legs, and (not to be insulting) fatter lower legs, have less of an issue if they are willing to really snug up the design into the flesh.

The Uncle Mike’s (and subsequently, the current BLACKHAWK!) wraparound harness was intentionally designed on a curve (a radius) so that when it was fastened around the leg it would taper from top to bottom and have a greater potential for matching the taper of the leg and maintaining a greater degree of contact with it, without having to wrench around or purposely misalign a straight line design to do so (which still really doesn’t achieve the desired effect anyway). This was a more costly approach at a manufacturing level as the harnesses need to be punched out rather than cut from a role but Uncle Mike’s was willing to absorb that amount to make the design competitive pricewise with the cheaper and more poorly designed nylon models on the market at the time of its introduction. The problem was that the affordability made a lot people think that it was merely one of those cheaper designs and not something that had actually been engineered for better performance.

Uncle Mike’s also decided to employ their experience with their then-patented, multilayer, laminated nylon-and-foam constructions and they blanked those tapered harnesses out of a foam-filled, dual-sided nylon for both comfort and moisture resistance. They did this in lieu of what was another carryover from many of the older designs and that was the stitching of a sheepskin liner to the so-called “contact” area on the inside of the band at a location behind the holster and at or near the point that (again in the past) is often positioned on to or near the ankle “bone”.

There are several things to consider here. In its day, the sheepskin made sense but it cannot offer the benefits of a properly selected foam. The foam can aid comfort in ways the sheepskin cannot do. The foam can truly resist moisture and doesn’t have the tendency to actually make the wearer sweat in the first place as the sheepskin can do. The foam doesn’t have to contribute to the unnecessary bulk of the complete holster assembly, as is generally the case with the sheepskin. And the foam will not break down (flatten out) as can the sheepskin, ultimately limiting its value over time.

The other thing that the dual-sided nylon harness can do is offer a surface finish that can be comfortable against the skin if it makes contact. It can be made to cling to one’s sock (limiting movement) without abrading it. And it can also offer a surface (including that of the integral holster) that will not drag on the covering pant leg, which could otherwise either give the gun away while wearing or possibly impede its (the pant leg’s) movement during the draw.

All of these things are why Uncle Mike has sold an amazing number of their ankle holsters since it was first introduced and why BLACKHAWK! is doing so well with theirs today. They work well and are comfortable to wear.

In my classes, I try to get people to view things objectively and in reading many of your posts in the past, it has always appeared to me that you generally look at things in a big picture way but here, in this case, I just felt you were wrong to not just dismiss but all but disparage what I feel is a very good design that I (and many others) have used successfully since the 1990’s.

In closing, if I might also make a comment as to where “on the ankle” an ankle holster should be worn, let me point to the pictures that have been posted by you and others previous to my posting this note. There is nothing wrong with positioning as shown but over the last thirty years, I have met way too many people who have worn ankle holsters (of all types including numerous designs not mentioned here so far by any of us) who found even some of the good ones uncomfortable to a point where they abandoned their use.

I believe that a good number of those folks found them uncomfortable because they wore their ankle “holsters” directly on their ankle “bone”. Something perhaps akin to the way Pressure Point Control Techniques employ pressure placed on certain parts of the body to create non-injurious pain at a level to obtain the compliance of the individual upon which they were applied.

Just as for most men, traditional concealment “hip” holsters are designed to be worn just behind the hip (to promote both concealability thru the use of natural sight lines and comfort by not having the gun dig into the hip structure itself), I believe that it can be very beneficial to wear the small-to-midsize firearms normally associated with ankle employment so that their muzzles rest just behind the generally protruding ankle structure. This keeps such gun surfaces from pressing into the bone and in many cases, it also allows the butt of the weapon to follow along toward the rear of the leg; perhaps minimizing its potential to bulge, print through or distort the side of the pant leg.

It is a simple but minor change that for a lot of people can make a world of difference in how the holster “feels” and how well it conceals.

“sipowicz”, I have long respected much of what I’ve read of yours on this site (and we have previously corresponded privately on another matter) but with all due respect, I think that you are a bit off-base in your comments about this design. I hope you take my remarks in the in the positive manner in which they are being offered to you and the others reading this important thread.

I'm not sure of the right term to use about seeing someone wear MY PRIMARY in an ankle rig (traditional backup position), even as their primary... but I'm gratified to see that if I wished to do so, it could work. I'll have to pick up that rig to keep my options open.

__________________
Fast is fine;accurate is final

Sorry if I offended you with my remarks on the UM design..I had one and if was very uncomfortable and flopped around....as did others in my dept. and when I found the Renegade, I bought it and once the others saw how well it worked, they bought one too...maybe there is a good Uncle Mikes design I didn't try or they updated it, but the one I had was unusable as it had a very narrow strap and almost no padding.

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

Yeah but they're "Hollywood" Levi's!

rags

__________________
RIP Shipmate

Just looked at the Uncle Mike's online. It still has a narrow strap but uses a "garter" that sits up higher on the calf to help stabilize it. Seems like one wider strap would be more comfortable.

Old school .....hi-tops or low cut? Looks like low cut.

__________________
Sure you did

Now you've went a little too far! Junk? No, no, no. Cheap "do do" maybe, not "junk".

rags

__________________
RIP Shipmate

Wonder if he's had those since the 70's...

rags

__________________
RIP Shipmate

Low baby....too old to lace high tops...

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

Russ, with the wide elastic band, no strap is needed....also, the Renegade is a pull thru design so no snaps to fumble with. In this case, for me, less is more...

You can order them straight from Renegade in AZ (no website, you must call them) or from vendors....this vendor page shows my model #500...

http://www.gmstactical.com/reanho.html

It also works with laser grips....(pic borrowed from someone else, says #50 but it's a 500)

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

Renegade actually has their own website now but it hards to tell the difference between their different models from their pictures. There are three or four different ones just for the J frames.

Home

It's this one, the 500....

Info 500

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

Think I need to order one. My preferred carry is in a OWB Blackhawk Speed Classic but sometimes keeping it covered or from banging it on things while working is a challenge. This would be a good alternative.

Don't have any sandals....how 'bout cowboy boots? That would really class it up, don't ya think?

KO

It does work quite well, I've always carried ankle in summer. The gun comes in at 30.2 ozs. loaded according to the postal scale at the office. The weight isn't for everyone but it does work out very well.

I would rather have an Ankle Glove (molded leather) for this pistol, it just seems more stable with a heavy pistol like this. Galco does not offer the ankle glove but Desantis does offer a molded one that I haven't got yet.

On shorts days the M&P is normally in a kydex IWB holster. For a J Frame the Ankle Glove is tops, can't speak for the Renegade however Sip's word is good enough for me.

Cheers,
Sam

__________________
Beware the man with one gun...

Haha was thinkin' the same thing, they could use a couple spins thru the washin' machine.

__________________
Sure you did

I am a big fan of ankle holsters. i have worn one for many years. I had an old Safari Land leather holster that I wore for so long, it just wore out. I have a nice WRB nylon one I got at a gun show. It fits my model 36 and If I feel like it I can put my Ruger SP101 in it also when I want .357 firepower. Its not fast draw, but.....its great for getting too when in an automobile....its great for getting too when in a Restaraunt and the bad buys bust in and try to rob everyone... When I was on active duty and on a surveillance, the bad guys spotted our Under Cover Car. We tried to leave and they blocked us in with a couple of cars of their own...I was driving and my partner and I both had ankle guns....one guy came up to us with a metal pipe...(they thought we were rival gangsters not cops) and they got a real surprise when we exited with guns drawn...they were not real bright guys but knew not to take metal pipes to gun fights and they surrendered...both went to jail too.....so ankle guns are accessible given the right situation

I carried in an ankle holster almost daily for 7 years. I don't recall the manufacturer and can't lay my hands on the holster just now, but it was not one of those mentioned so far. It was a heavy grade of cordura nylon with a wide, padded band and a garter. There was even an ammo pouch in which a Bianchi Speed Strip fit perfectly. I normally wore boots then. 6" Wellington uniform boots and later cowboy boots. I carried the holster on the inside of my left leg like "Magnum PU" in the earlier post. That gave easy access with either hand and kept the revolver from banging into things.

It wasn't a quick-draw rig, but it was always there. Usually something else was too, but for all of that time if I was dressed, the ankle rig was with me, usually containing either a Colt Agent or Cobra. The bottom of the pouch finally wore through and the velcro got puny about the same time I didn't feel the need for a BUG or deep concealment.

__________________
I need ammo, not a ride.

I regularly carry a 642 in a Galco Ankle Glove. Extremely comfortable, I often forget that it's there.

I wore a Bianchi leather ankle holster for M37 BUG/OD/CCW for over thirty years. I hated it. The leather ankle strap was either to tight or to loose. The sheepskin wore to the leather and it hurt my ankle. Then I found the Galco Ankle Glove. I have now two, one for my M37 and one for M649. I notice no difference between the two. I wear them comfortably for over eight hours, no problem. I just bought another one on eBay for off hand carry. I have an Uncle Mike's Sidekick that is no where near as comfortable as the Galco. I use a Galco Underwraps Belly Band when I wear cargo shorts. As discussed, neither is a quick draw, but I always have a gat.

I use to ankle carry but shied away because I didn't think I'd be able to get to my weapon in every circumstance. Just look at the thread where the Ohio guy was being pulled from his vehicle. How in the world could you get to your weapon? I'm not saying you shouldn't carry that way if you want to but I prefer mine either on my side for quick draw or in my fanny pack when running. Carry how you feel confortable I'm just blabbing.

I don't care how you carry, you're not going to be able to get to your weapon in every circumstance, every carry set up is a compromise. I prefer to carry strong side OWB but I'm a big guy and would have a very hard time accessing my gun with my weak hand. That's why I carry a BUG that I can access from my weak side when I'm on duty. An ankle holster is one of those things that works when nothing else will, the best of the compromises at the moment.

__________________
Don't kiss smiling dogs!

Ankle carry doesn't work too well for me for a couple of reasons. My arms are so short that my hands can't touch my ankle without standing on one foot or bending over and my shorts are so short they wouldn't cover the gun. I can't find long shorts anywhere

Do any of you guys wear an ankle weight, or second holster with a second gun or knife, or whatever, on the opposite ankle, to balance things out?

I have never felt the need with an airweight...but a second rig would be a great place to carry my cell phone...::

__________________
Thirty characters. Exactly...

Just make sure you grab the correct ankle when the phone rings.

__________________
Centennial Every Day

Sip, give the Cop Ankle Safe a try, it might be a good option for this...Agree with Photoman44, make sure you know which ankle is ringing.

I'm really bad about this when I pocket carry, when the phone rings I often reach for the wrong ringer!!

OK once again this forum has cost me money, this thread prompted me to order a DeSantis Die Hard Ankle Rig for the M&P. Anyone have any experience with this holster, it is the ONLY molded leather ankle holster that I can find from the major manufacturers for a M&P Compact.

Cheers,
Sam

__________________
Beware the man with one gun...

With summer here in GA, ankle carry would look a bit odd on me since I'm in shorts all the time.

When I was still working (and constrained by a uniform policy), I did carry a Glock 27 in an ankle holster for several years as a backup for the G22 on my belt.

They get dusty, dewy, etc. down there, get bumped against things, and are slow/awkward to get to, BUT....a second gun is a second gun, regardless of where it is on you.

They have their place for a backup piece.

I'm gonna hijack Sip's thread for a minute; earlier in the week I ordered a DeSantis Die Hard Ankle Rig for my M&P40c after being a Galco Ankle Glove user for a number of years. Galco doesn't make the Ankle Glove for the M&Pc (it just about has to have something to do with their Glock contract); they do however have their Ankle Lite (soft leather opposed to molded leather of the Ankle Glove) for the M&P which I posted previously in this thread.

The Ankle Lite has never worked as well as the Ankle Glove for my various J-Frames. The pistol just didn't sit as well for me, the fact that it is a heavier pistol has something to do with it I'm sure. The DeSantis holster is the only commercially available molded leather holster that I've been able to find unless I want to go with a custom/semi-custom shop for the work. It is unfortunate that the ankle holsters for the M&P are so limited with a number of departments moving to the M&P; locally Conyers PD and DeKalb PD have both moved from Glock to M&P.

DeSantis Die Hard Ankle Rig


The interesting thing about this holster is that the velcro clasp extends past the edge of the holster as can be seen on the right in the picture above. The holster still has the 2" wide velcro strip on the elastic band, the extension is for those that may where boots with the holster and omits the need to get the boot extender.

So far wearing the holster has been comfortable, the cant is more straight up and down compared to the Galco Ankle Lite and balances very well on the ankle. It has typical new holster stiffness but it should wear out well, the molded holster keeps the M&P much more ridged with is something I've come to like with the Ankle Glove.



It'll be a keeper for now, certainly time will be the ultimate test to check the holsters long term comfort. Updates will came as needed.

Cheers,
Sam

__________________
Beware the man with one gun...