It is a 38 spec snub nose 6 shot with no model number anywhere?

Attached Images

IMG_0137.jpg (117.7 KB, 225 views)

Welcome BACK to the forum.

Looks like a long action .38 Special Military and Police revolver to me (predecessor to the Model 10). List the serial number off the bottom of the butt and we can give you an approximate date of manufacture. My guess is it's pre WWII.

__________________
"I also cook."

The serial number is 292171*
Thanks

I would guess between 1910-'15; others here can probably narrow this down for you. The 2" barrel was not regularly offered at this time, and you may see a different number stamped on the barrel flat above the ejector rod.

If there is a star after the SN, it indicates it was returned to the factory for work; it was put there so the gun could not be sold as new. This often (but not always) means the gun was refinished. You may see a three- or four-digit number stamped on the left grip frame under the stocks, which indicates the month/year the work was done. Possibly for the barrel change?

__________________
Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

If the serial number is 292171 with a star following, then it should date to 1918/19 - too early for that 2" barrel to be original. As noted above, the star typically denotes work of a substantial nature having been performed at the factory, and this might be when it was converted to a snubnose configuration. One thing that bothers me about the photo is that I'm not seeing any caliber marking on the barrel, which if it's a later replacement, ought to be there.

__________________
SWCA #590
"Colligo ergo sum"

The number on the flat of the barrel matches the SN. I pulled the grips and there is indeed a very small 1.45 stamped into the frame. So Alan, does that mean the piece was re-blued by S&W in Jan/1945? Since it is a 38 spec., what do you think would have been the manufacture date?

Thanks for the help!
Jack

Not only reblued, but the barrel was replaced as well. S&W used to renumber new parts so they would be consistent with the frame to which the new parts were being attached.

That's probably a 1917 frame based on the serial number. I would interpret January 1945 as the date it was returned to the factory for work. Note that there is no MADE IN U.S.A. stamp on the right side of the frame. That mark did not appear until the early 1920s. At this time the guns came with four, five, or six-inch barrels.

There may or may not be a small S&W logo on the left side of the frame. At one point during the WWI era and for several months thereafter the company products had no logo on the frame and only the Smith & Wesson name on the barrel.

Does the other side of the barrel have anything stamped on it, perhaps on two lines?

Very cool little gun. The few prewar snubnose M&Ps are rare and pricy. The postwar snubnose M&Ps, which began distribution in 1946, are less expensive than the early ones because more numerous; but they are in demand and more costly than postwar guns with longer barrels. That is a very interesting wartime conversion specimen.

__________________
David Wilson

My guess is that the owner sent a .38 special Military & Police, shipped in the late 19 teens, back to the factory in January 1945 and had a 2" barrel installed.

__________________
John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

I'm a bit surprised that S&W would take on such work while the war was still ongoing.

__________________
SWCA #590
"Colligo ergo sum"

David the only reference to S&W anywhere is on the left side of the barrel in two lines. "Smith & Wesson" and underneath "38 S&W SPC. CTG." The blueing on both sides of the barrel show signs that the piece was carried in a holster on a regular basis. Otherwise it is in remarkably good shape! Any ideas of the value for insurance purposes?

Do you think the grips are original? My wife seems to think the grips are bakelite.

Goony, I have a 1926 .44 that went back to the factory in February 1942. It was renickeled and had new grips fitted. I asked Mr Jinks about it, operating under the same assumption as you-"There's a war going on".

He explained that even with a war, S&W never abandoned their bread and butter- civilian users. Guns needed repairs, upgrades, etc, and the factory provided service.

The Service Department kept busy throughout the war years.

__________________
John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

That's what this forum is all about, always learning something new....

__________________
SWCA #590
"Colligo ergo sum"

They're definitely not original. They have the appearance of Catalin, a trademarked name for a similar resin material popular from the 1930's until after WWII.

__________________
SWCA #590
"Colligo ergo sum"

Goony, I think you're exactly right! Catalin is what John Wayne used on his Colt SA all thru the 30's, 40's and almost 'till his last movie. He would soak them in tea for color.

Catalin is a brand name for a thermosetting plastic popular in the 1930s. Chemically, it's a phenol formaldehyde resin. Catalin is a cast bakelite product, with a different manufacturing process (two-stage process) than other types of bakelite resins (without using fillers such as sawdust or carbon black). Catalin is transparent, near colorless, rather than opaque, brown, so unlike other bakelite phenolics it can be dyed bright colors or even marbled. This has made Catalin more popular than other types of bakelite. In the 1930-50's it quickly replaced most plastic consumer goods.

Catalin is a trademark of the American Catalin Corporation.

Catalin cast bakelite is perhaps the most worldwide recognized plastic used in fashion accessories and fine, expensive jewelry.

__________________
Jim
S&WCA #819

Given that the gun has been rebarreled, and perhaps refinished, it doesn't have a lot
of traditional collector value. $350 to $400 ought to be more than enough for
insurance purposes.

Mike Priwer

You are probably right on the money.
I think that means you could amass an interesting "star" collection of guns with factory upgrades for a modest outlay. Wasn't somebody bemoaning the RM with barrel shortened after the fact?

Thank you all for commenting. I now know the barrel was replaced but, not positive that the piece was reblued. It is a piece that I will keep for it represents a period at S&W when things were done differently.

Semper Fidelis and Roll Tide!