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Old 11-24-2009, 07:01 PM
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Default .44 Mag + Cast Bullets = lots of leading for me

Hey guys, excellent site, been a lurker for awhile. I have a 29-2 and a 629-5 Mountain Gun that I would like to shoot cast from, mainly the Mt Gun. It shoots 240gr jacketed bullets excellent, cast is bad because of leading. I have tried bullseye, Unique, and 2400 with numerous charges with some type of commercial cast and I ordered some Mount Baldy 250gr Keith bullets and I get leading every time. The bullseye load doesn't lead as bad, but it still leads up after 10-15 rounds, the Mount Baldy bullets, I get smeared lead after 1 shot. According to my measurements my throats are .4295", for the guys who shot cast in the S&W's, how do you do it?? I really wanted to get the Mt Gun for a deer/hog packing pistol with the hopes of cast but right now I am using the 240XTP and the Nosler 240 JSP.


Thanks
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Old 11-24-2009, 07:23 PM
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This is a broad brush answer. I don't load for the 44 but what you have there is to soft a bullet with to high pressure/velocity. Mt. Baldy is a soft bullet by design for the older large chamber throats revolvers.

Try talking to Bob Palermo at Penn Bullets.com. He'll be all over you situation and will set you straight with the right bullet. He is a gem to deal with.

Bob
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Old 11-24-2009, 07:23 PM
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Sounds like a size problem. Maybe the cyl is sizing them smaller than the bbl. Or they are too small to start with. Slug your bbl or have a gunsmith do it. Bullets should be about .001 or.002 larger than the groove dia. If the cyl is smaller than the bbl, have them reamed to correct size.
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Old 11-24-2009, 07:31 PM
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I forgot to mention I fired a cheap cast with 6grs of 2400 into phone books, actually not really into them as it bounced back and smacked me in the shin, but anyway. I have the slug and from the reading I have done Smith uses a 5 groove barrel and it is really difficult to read the slug with just calipers. I have tried and I keep getting .427, I am pretty sure that is wrong.
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Old 11-24-2009, 07:47 PM
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Lube your cast bullets!
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Old 11-24-2009, 07:50 PM
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I went to the Mt Baldy website. Which bullet are you using? The listing under 'smokeless" lists a BHN of 18 which should be hard enough.
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Old 11-24-2009, 08:13 PM
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You have a size problem unless you are using some insane propellant charge. I can drive unlimited numbers of 265 grain soft cast bullets over 15-16 grains of 2400 with no leading from my 29-2. I have gone up to 19 grains but don't enjoy the beating.
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Old 11-24-2009, 08:31 PM
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It's possible that you have a barrel that needs to be lapped. I have had occasions where that helped. I use a gas check bullet when I shoot cast bullets in my 29. Its a little more trouble, but I don't have any leading problems.

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Old 11-24-2009, 08:57 PM
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Undersized bullet, not enough or wrong lube, too high a velocity or something not right with the cylinder throats.

The leading isn't caused because the bullet is scooting, it is caused by gas cutting- the hot gases are being able to get around the base of the bullet and are acting like a blow torch!

I have gotten great results from cast bullets in the .430 to .432 range, but finding a good mould that throws this large can be a problem too- I always got my bullets from a friend that cast them...but now I've taken up casting and finding the right moulds can be like finding the proverbial needle in a haystack!
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Old 11-24-2009, 08:59 PM
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They are lubed.

I am using the Mount Baldy bullets for revolvers - 11BHN bullets sized at .430"


I have used everything from 15-20grs of 2400 and 7.0-10.0grs of Unique and a massive dose of 5.0-6.0grs of Bullseye. The leading is usually the first 1-2" of barrel from the forcing cone up, the cone has been recut and smoothed out also, I had my smith recut it to a better angle and he polished it out smooth.

Should I try gas checked bullets?

Last edited by Bearcat74; 11-24-2009 at 09:01 PM.
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Old 11-24-2009, 09:15 PM
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Wink This isn't a difficult problem

You are using too soft of a bullet for the powder charges you're using. That Mt. Baldy bullet is soft and will perform best with a fast powder like Bullseye at around 750 fps. If you want to shoot hotter loads you need a true hard cast bullet (widely available). Gas checks are fine but not necessary if you stay below 1,200 fps.

There are two fundamental causes of leading: 1. Soft bullets going too fast; and 2. Hard cast bullets going too slow. All the other ideas mentioned in this thread are only useful after you've paid heed to rules 1 and 2.
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Old 11-24-2009, 09:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearcat74 View Post
I forgot to mention I fired a cheap cast with 6grs of 2400 into phone books, actually not really into them as it bounced back and smacked me in the shin, but anyway. I have the slug and from the reading I have done Smith uses a 5 groove barrel and it is really difficult to read the slug with just calipers. I have tried and I keep getting .427, I am pretty sure that is wrong.
Bearcat,

To find out what you need to know you don't have to actually measure it. There are two things to check, an un-fired bullet in the cylinder throats is first. A bullet should pass through the throat with little or no resistance, but not too loose. Second, slug your barrel and try the slug in the throats. You will need a quite soft bullet to do this as it needs to be able to expand to fit the barrel. Once you have a slug try it in the throats. This should also pass through the throats but can have slightly more resistance which indicates the groove diameter and throat diameters are close. If the slug won't fit the throats then they are tighter than the barrel and need to be opened up.

There are several reasons people have with commercial cast bullets. Most are sized to nominal diameters, .44 bullets typically .429. This is actually too small for many revolvers and there is gas blowby. Another problem is most of the lubes on commercial bullets are more intended to be pretty and stay on the bullets during handling instead of being chosen for their lubricating qualities. Finally, most commercial cast bullets are entirely too hard for revolvers. Many are 20 Brinell or harder. Except for the very highest pressure loads a hardness of 12-15 Brinell is better than harder.

Here are three things to do. First, after determining if the bore or throats are larger and the throats enlarged if needed, slug the throats and measure the slug. Order bullets from a company which lets you select the sizing diameter and order bullets no more than .001 smaller than your throats. Second, if they don't use a soft lubricant, but a bottle of Lee Liquid Alox and tumble lube the bullets before loading. Third, settle for loads in the 25-30,000 PSI range and velocities not more than 1250 FPS. Chances are you will be a lot happier with cast bullets.
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Old 11-24-2009, 09:50 PM
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I've seen later production 629s with chamber throats as tight as .428.....my quick solution is ream those throats to .431. Coincidentally the size used in the early 4 & 5 screw .44 Maggies
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:03 PM
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I wouldn't do anything to the gun. It is much easier to do stuff to the bullets.

I shoot Keith and 200gr LRNFP bullets from my 629 5" bbl with no leading at all. I cast my own too and in that regard you are hampered. You are at the mercy of someone else when it comes to alloy, harness, lube and size, I'm not.

You need to answer some questions first before I can make any suggestions. You said the bullets you have are 18bhn(or someone did). What is the Bullseye load? How fast do you want to drive these bullets, what velocity are you trying to achieve?

I want you to ask yourself this one question: "Why is the Bullseye load the one that leads the least?"

The biggest cause of leading with CAST bullets is not too much velocity, but too little pressure. Folks try to get a paper punching round with too hard of a bullet. Throw in that it may not fit the bore and VIOLA you have a leading mess.

I have known lots of folks that get leading with purchased bullets at 800fps and with the same ones get none at 1000fps.

If it was me, and you need to be especially thankful you aren't me, I would push those babies just a little harder.

6gr of 2400 isn't a published load anywhere that I know of for the 44Mag. Where did you get it?

What manual are you using to get your load from?

I think I gave you enough questions to answer.
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Old 11-24-2009, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tell Sackett View Post
I wouldn't do anything to the gun. It is much easier to do stuff to the bullets.

I shoot Keith and 200gr LRNFP bullets from my 629 5" bbl with no leading at all. I cast my own too and in that regard you are hampered. You are at the mercy of someone else when it comes to alloy, harness, lube and size, I'm not.

You need to answer some questions first before I can make any suggestions. You said the bullets you have are 18bhn(or someone did). What is the Bullseye load? How fast do you want to drive these bullets, what velocity are you trying to achieve?

I want you to ask yourself this one question: "Why is the Bullseye load the one that leads the least?"

The biggest cause of leading with CAST bullets is not too much velocity, but too little pressure. Folks try to get a paper punching round with too hard of a bullet. Throw in that it may not fit the bore and VIOLA you have a leading mess.

I have known lots of folks that get leading with purchased bullets at 800fps and with the same ones get none at 1000fps.

If it was me, and you need to be especially thankful you aren't me, I would push those babies just a little harder.

6gr of 2400 isn't a published load anywhere that I know of for the 44Mag. Where did you get it?

What manual are you using to get your load from?

I think I gave you enough questions to answer.

The bullseye load was commercial cast over 5-6grs, both shot good until leading, bullet was a 240gr SWC. It was a plinker and a favorite of Elmer Keith. Velocity didn't matter because it was going to be a paper masher. I figured it leaded the least because it was slow.

The Mt. Baldy bullets were rated to 1500fps 11BHN with no gas check, that is from the maker. I was wanting 1000-1100fps, no need to go crazy. I figure when I worked my way up to 20grs of 2400 that would certainly be in that range, or better. Mt. Baldy recommended 10grs of Unique or 20-21grs of 2400.

The 6grs of 2400 was to simply push a bullet out of the barrel so it would be slugged and I would not have to dig deep into the books to get it back, no way in the world was that for anything but that one slug.

I have a Speer, Hornady, 2 Noslers, a Lee, and a Sierra manual, I have went to the powder manufactures websites, I have contacted bullet companies all for load data. Plus, reading online for loads.
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Old 11-25-2009, 12:16 AM
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Pressure determines alloy hardness more than velocity. Learn to cast your own bullets and alloy your own metal to the hardness you need. Hard lube looks good and stays with the bullet, but doesnt perform so great. Try some Lee liquid Alox, it works wonders.
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Old 11-25-2009, 01:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearcat74 View Post

I have used everything from 15-20grs of 2400 and 7.0-10.0grs of Unique and a massive dose of 5.0-6.0grs of Bullseye. The leading is usually the first 1-2" of barrel from the forcing cone up, the cone has been recut and smoothed out also, I had my smith recut it to a better angle and he polished it out smooth.
I believe your loads are not heavy enough, or your bullets are too hard...with a caveat: I think your throats are sizing the bullet down too much, and you don't have enough pressure to cause the bullet to obturate to the bore until it's well into the barrel. Softer bullets and/or more pressure is the fix.

I had this same issue with my RCBS 44-250-K and 7 grain of Bullseye. I was water dropping the bullets, making them too hard. Softer bullets (aircooled) resolved the issue immediately.

I'd suggest checking you chamber throats. If they size down the bullet WAY too much, then it doesn't matter what bullet you use short of a hollow base, they're not going to slug up well.
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Old 11-25-2009, 03:38 AM
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I've never used Mt. Baldy bullets, so I don't know much about them. Is the bullet you are using a true Keith design with a flat base, or is it a pseudo-Keith bullet that many commercial cast outfits sell that have a bevel base? I've found that bevel base bullets ALWAYS lead. (Hot gas gets in between the beveled base and the barrel and melts the edge of the base depositing it on your barrel.) Flat base bullets usually don't lead if they are of the proper diameter, proper hardness (softer if you are pushing them slow, and harder if you are pushing them fast) and have a good (meaning SOFT) lube. Lube that seems like a hard wax (crayon-like) usually doesn't work very well. Also, are you SURE that the stuff you are seeing in your barrel is lead? I've known people who have mistaken lube streaks in the barrel for leading. Like someone else in this thread said, if your cylinder throats are smaller than your barrel diameter, you are going to have an awful hard time getting your gun to not lead unless you open your cylinder throats up to groove diameter or 0.001" larger. Also, how smooth is your barrel? Some guns with lots of tooling marks in the barrel tend to lead. If this is the problem, you can try fire-lapping your barrel.

Last edited by whelenshooter; 11-25-2009 at 03:44 AM.
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:33 AM
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Bearcat: Most (not all) revolvers will lead the barrel the first few inches of rifling. This is caused by the torqueing of the barrel into the reciever. The torqueing (stress) creates a restriction in the bore of .0001 to as much as .005 in some guns just beyond the forcing cone. Also, roll engraving (warning stamps, logos and such), and areas where sights are mounted, dovetails cut, etc, can cause the same types of restrictions. This is normal to the manufacture of most guns. I shoot only cast bullets at mid range to higher velocities. If I have a barrel that is exhibiting leading, I usually hand lap or firelap the barrel, but, keep in mind that all the information stated by others (above) is also necessary to cast bullet accuracy and reduced leading. If you go to: beartoothbullets.com, you can contact Marshall Stanton. He has put together a firelapping kit with explicit instructions. I have used this kit on a number of occasions with excellent results. I sure saves time, and one heck of a lot of elbow grease!!! The only other alternative is to shoot a FMJ type of bullet. Sierra makes a very nice fully jacketed truncated cone 44 bullet of 250 grains that would perform very well for the purpose you are looking for, and would act just as a hard cast does when meeting flesh and bone....one big hole in...one big hole out! Good Luck!
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Old 11-25-2009, 08:04 AM
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Bear,
Thanks for the response. Let me see if I can help. One thing I forgot that was mentioned by Vanilla is throat to bore size differences. If the throats are smaller than the bore, you got troubles no matter what you do with the bullets. I doubt that is the problem but, hey, it's possible.

If those bullets are 11BHN and are .001" to .003" bigger than your throats/bore you should be able to get a load that doesn't lead.

As far as bevel based bullets go, I drive them in a Marlin 1894CB in 357Mag in excess of 1800fps with virtually no leading, some flakes after 50 rounds but easily cleaned with a standard brush and wet patches.

The powders you have should give good results with cast bullets.

Here is a picture of what Keith said about Sixgun Loads:

Now you will notice that he doesn't say too much about a Bullseye load for the 44Mag, special yes, and there may be more information available elsewhere to that regard, I'm not sure.

Try this though, if you will. Check the size of the bullets. Do they fall through the cylinder throats? Is all of the copper fouling out of the bore? Even though it is not seen, it can reek havoc with lead bullets. If you are sure that it is all out, let me give you a suggestion. Take the maximum load of Bullseye for that bullet and caliber and run about 50 round of it down that firearm.

If the bullets are big/soft enough, the Bullseye load will generated the highest pressure in the shortest amount of time which should cause the bullet to obturate and seal off the gases.

Have you ever heard of Lee Liquid Alox? There have been folks that coat their "store bought" bullets in it to keep leading from happening when shooting "gallery" loads. You may want to do the same.

Hope this helps. Keep us posted.
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Old 11-25-2009, 08:26 AM
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I think you've got some good advise here. Pay attention to the chamber throats size & DO be sure the slugs will drop through. Additional taper to the forcing cone might not hurt but really should not be necessary.

I used to be in the business of casting & selling machine cast bullets. Frankly, commercial cast bullets can not be very hard cast & still commercially saleable because of cost.
The liquid bullet lube came in after I shut down my business but I have heard of folks who swear by over lubing with the liquid right over the commercial lubed bullet product.

True "hard cast" can be driven to very high velocity. Such speciality bullets, hardness tested, would not lead significantly. These are the bullets that Keith & others worked with.

My suggestion is to find someone with a proven load that does lead unduely in their guns... and try it in yours to determine if it's the gun or load. Since both your guns do this, I suspect it maybe the load or something about your proceedure.

Best Wishes,
Russ
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Old 11-25-2009, 05:35 PM
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11BHN is softer than wheel weights. I suspect anything over 900-1000 FPS you'd run into leading problems. I'd recommend only loading to .44 Special velocities with those bullets. Hard cast will give you a little more FPS before leading problems develop. If you use GC bullets you shouldn't have any problems. Bottom line is using cast bullets in a magnum caliber is tricky and if you want real magnum velocities using cast bullets you are religated to GC bullets.
Cast bullet reference on lead alloy's, min / max pressure, lube, shrinkage,
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Old 11-25-2009, 06:54 PM
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There is a formula for determining minimum pressure for obturation. It is 3X480XBHN. In this instance, that would mean, 1440X11 or 15840psi. That would mean that the MINIMUM pressure would be right for that bullet. This is what you need to remember when trying to determine what kind of load a bullet is designed for. It may help when determining your load.
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlen View Post
if you want real magnum velocities using cast bullets you are religated to GC bullets.
Hardly the truth, unless you consider 1400 fps a not a magnum velocity for .44 Magnum.
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Old 11-25-2009, 08:08 PM
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tlen; You are correct...gas checks are an indespenable aid to accuracy with cast bullets, and, Fryxell's articles are well worth the read for those that are "serious" about using cast bullets in their guns. Also a good source for cast bullet info is Veral Smith, and Richard Lee. A stop by two websites: Beartooth Bullets, and Montana Bullet Works will also yield a great deal of information on what it takes to get a cast bullet to shoot well.

The groundwork was done years ago, and there is no reason that anyone cannot get cast bullets to shoot in thier guns, as long as the gun is suitable for the job, and the bullets are suitable for the velocities that they are being pushed. I have a rifle that pushes a 325 grain slug at 2200 fps. The accuracy is impecable, and there is not one hint of leading. I shoot nothing but cast bullets in my 44 magnums, and again the accuracy is excellent, and leading (if any) is so minimal, that a stroke or two with a brass brush is all that is needed to clean the bore. I set my guns up for cast bullets, and all I shoot is cast bullets.

This is not rocket science...there is a step by step procedure to getting it right and if it is followed you cannot get it wrong! When every thing comes together, it is a beautiful thing to behold!!!
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Old 11-26-2009, 08:49 AM
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Default Make sure your cast bullet have enough tin.........

In my 629 6 inch I get no leading with a 16 to 1 mix of lead/tin and I pan lube using beeswax,Parafin,and vasaline. I size them to .429 and load with 6gr red dot with Win lg mag primers and get no leading. Granted they are only 890 fps. When using lead ,keep it slow and make them hard and you should get the same results. The bullets I use come from a lee mould 240 gr RN. No gas check.

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Old 11-28-2009, 02:34 PM
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The chamber throats are too small. They are swaging the bullet down to 0.429" then the bullet bumps up after some severe gas cutting at the forcing cone. I can assume the leding is in the first 1-2" of bbl? That is undersized. You'll need to lap the chamber throats to at elast the groove dia. or slightly larger, 0.430" woud be the smallest. Slugging your bore is important. but the chambers are where the bullet is getting sized down. Also, if you use the horrible LFCD to crimp, it can further reduce the diameter of the bullet & cause leading.
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Old 11-28-2009, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearcat74 View Post
The bullseye load was commercial cast over 5-6grs, both shot good until leading, bullet was a 240gr SWC. It was a plinker and a favorite of Elmer Keith. Velocity didn't matter because it was going to be a paper masher. I figured it leaded the least because it was slow.

The Mt. Baldy bullets were rated to 1500fps 11BHN with no gas check, that is from the maker. I was wanting 1000-1100fps, no need to go crazy. I figure when I worked my way up to 20grs of 2400 that would certainly be in that range, or better. Mt. Baldy recommended 10grs of Unique or 20-21grs of 2400.

The 6grs of 2400 was to simply push a bullet out of the barrel so it would be slugged and I would not have to dig deep into the books to get it back, no way in the world was that for anything but that one slug.

I have a Speer, Hornady, 2 Noslers, a Lee, and a Sierra manual, I have went to the powder manufactures websites, I have contacted bullet companies all for load data. Plus, reading online for loads.
You can NOT slug a barrel by firing a bullet thru it. The bullet will expand slightly on leaving the muzzle as well as impact. To accurate slug a bore, drive a soft, lubricated lead ball or oversize fishing sinker down the bbl. from the muzzle, carefully w/ a brass rod. Measure the wides part, that is your groove dia. Then have the chamber throats lapped to match or just slightly, 0.001" smaller. Size your cast bullets or buy them 0.001" over your groove/throat size. I size my 44s to 0.430". Even cast using 50/50 ww/lead mix, about 10BHN, they will run to 1200fps w/o any appreciable leading.
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Old 11-28-2009, 04:13 PM
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My 696 had extreme leading no matter what I tried. It didn't affect the accuracy, but it was a pain to clean. I tried copper plated bullets from Xtreme and that solved the problem,and I still have razor sharp accuracy.
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Old 11-28-2009, 04:29 PM
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Sorry I have been away for awhile, been hunting.


I got a care package from swamprat the other day, a little bag of his bullets and he asked me to try them. I was very skeptical, but I loaded them over 10.0grs of Unique and hit the bench. 20 rounds fired, no real cooling between shots, just enough time to get the hammer back, sight and squeeze. 20 rounds not a single trace of leading, none, zip, zilch. Groups were very good, especially for my raggedy shooting skills. These are going to be the cast bullets for me I do believe. 245gr SWC should be able to handle the meanest deer in the woods.


The reason I used a loaded round to slug the barrel is because that is what the people at Mount Baldy told me to do.


Fredj338, there is leading the first 1-2" of the barrel and there is leading at the end of the barrel. When I tried the MtBaldy's over 21grs of 2400 I was getting strings of lead 2-3" long rolling out of the barrel, it was just smeared down the bore.
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Old 11-29-2009, 06:31 AM
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I am also having a devil of a time with leading in my .44 specials. It has just about whupped me. I've slugged my barrels, measured chamber throats, gone from .429 to .430 bullets, used swaged "cowboy" bullets, used hard cast bullets (18bhn), used flat-based bullets, used bevel-base bullets, run them through three different Smiths, run them through a Colt SAA - all to no avail.

I am not a 1000+ fps guy. I like loads about equal to factory velocity. Generally, I've loaded in the range of 5.6 to 6.5 gr. of unique or Universal Clays using a classic 240 gr. SWC. I figured the soft swaged .430 bullets would cure my problem - they didn't. In fact, they were just as bad if not worse than the harder cast bullets and the .429 bullets I'd tried earlier.

All the leading occurs at the breech end of my barrels, which according to Scovill, means too hard a bullet for the charge or too small a bullet. After trying the .430 swaged bullets, I don't buy it. There is something I'm not catching.

For me, the only thing left is to try soaking them in Alox. If that doesn't work, I'm going to a jacketed or gas-check bullet. I am very frustrated and disappointed. I wanted to cast my own, but won't even begin to try that until I can get the lead out....

Mike
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Old 11-29-2009, 07:25 AM
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durco,
What firearm are you shooting them out of?

There has been only one caliber I have had a leading problem that I couldn't get under control and it was for a semi-auto cartridge.
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  #33  
Old 11-29-2009, 08:30 AM
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I have a question. Why are so many here against the use of a gas checked bullet? I dont mean this as an insult, or anything like that, but, I have had outstanding results with gas checks for many years. Am I missing something?
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Old 11-29-2009, 08:46 AM
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Am I missing something?
Just money!
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Old 11-29-2009, 09:32 AM
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.........at 2.00 per hundred extra (and that would be from a bullet manufacturer....you could do it for less, I believe), I would think that the performance would out weigh the cost. For low end loads a PB is just fine, but, when you start pushing 1000 fps and beyond, the GC sure proves its worth. A buddy of mine was a cast bullet competitor, and had pushed some PB hunting loads to 1850 out of one of his rifles, but, the rifle was modified to shoot cast only, and the bullets alloyed up in the 20+ BHN range...if my memory serves me. The bullets were not brittle though....they were "tough"! That was probably over 35 years ago or so....he has long since passed on, and I dont know what his "secret" alloy was...I was not a cast bullet shooter at the time, but the accuracy and hunting performance of the bullet was one of the things that got me into using cast only in all of my big bore handguns and leverguns...........As a little test, I would like to see somebody shoot a PB and a GC (same bullet) with the same load, in a rifle or handgun and see if anything improves. My experience is that over 1000 fps (I dont shoot anything slower than that), that the GC definately improves ballistic uniformity (chrono), and reduces leading in guns that are not set up for lead only...everything else being equal. I was out at the range yesterday and testing some loads that myself and a couple of buddies are working on (a 405 grain, 1000 fps load for 44 mag revolvers), and had the opportunity to shoot some 250 PB's and GC's at a tad over 1000 fps out of my customized Ruger Super Blackhawk. After I shot the PB's ( and cleaned all the lead out of the barrel), I shot the same number of GC's, and leading was very minimal.....although the accuracy between the two was fairly close (which would be expected at that velocity), with the GC doing a bit better overall. The PB lost accuracy as the leading in the barrel increased, but I would say that the first 5 round groups from each were just about the same. after that, the GC's held group size and the PB's started to deteriorate group size............all interesting stuff.
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Old 11-29-2009, 10:08 AM
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You didn't list the bore diameter or the diameter of the cast bullets or their velocity your shooting but, my guess is the hardness of the cast bullets your shooting is either too hard or too soft?
Steve
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Old 11-29-2009, 12:29 PM
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Why is the Lee FCD a bad thing?


How are the Redding Profile Crimp Dies?
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  #38  
Old 11-29-2009, 12:42 PM
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Exclamation Not been my experience! YMMV!

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(and that would be from a bullet manufacturer....you could do it for less, I believe),
Then you would be out not only money but time as well!

I appreciate listening to other's experiences but sometimes mine don't match theirs. This is one of those times.

I don't have one custom gun. Some have slight modifications, such as sights or trigger jobs or chamfered cylinders or other minor polishing jobs, but every one I have had, with the exception of one 9mm, has taken lead bullets and shot well.

Work? Yes. To the gun? NO. It is much easier to change something with the bullet/powder/primer or whatever to make a gun shoot lead than have the gun changed. In my opinion, and that will get you nothing extra in most places, changing the firearm is not needed, neither are gas checks. I drive 12bhn to 18bhn bullets to over 1800fps on a regular basis without leading. Why would I want to add another step to my process? Because of someone else's experience? NOT!
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  #39  
Old 11-29-2009, 01:09 PM
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siiiiiiiiiii

Last edited by sw282; 07-03-2011 at 08:34 AM.
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  #40  
Old 11-29-2009, 01:35 PM
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Tell; What is your definition of "shot well"?
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Old 11-29-2009, 02:50 PM
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Wink No need for one hole groups at 100 yards!

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Tell; What is your definition of "shot well"?
How's this; "Hunting accurate from a 44Mag carbine rifle. 1 1/2" groups @ 100 yards."

Now unless you are hunting scorpions at that distance, 1 1/2" groups are usually much smaller than a kill zone on most animals.

I have a friend that has the same Marlin I do only in stainless steel. He topped it off with a Leupold scope. He shoots jacketed bullets exclusively, they are handloads and the best groups he has ever gotten @ 100 yards is 4" groups.

My rifle shoots just a tad bigger than 1" groups regularly, not every time but often, with jacketed bullets @ 100 yards.

To me, with a 20" to 22" barrel and a 1:38 twist, and nothing done except smoothing the trigger out, is pretty acceptable.

If I want more than that kind of accuracy or if I want it to shoot further out I'll lay down the 44Mag and grab an '06 or something.

Hunting accurate.
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Old 11-29-2009, 03:28 PM
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Tell, Tell, Tell.............email me!!!!
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  #43  
Old 11-29-2009, 05:16 PM
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Question Good enough for what I use it for!

I don't have your email address. Do you want me to PM you?

Are you going to tell me I shouldn't be satisfied with this accuracy?

I don't have the coin, the gunsmithing knowledge nor the desire to do any more to this rifle to make it a benchrest shooter so..................
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Old 11-29-2009, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Tell Sackett View Post
durco,
What firearm are you shooting them out of?

There has been only one caliber I have had a leading problem that I couldn't get under control and it was for a semi-auto cartridge.
1) A 1950 Target 4" circa 1955, 2) a 24-3 4" circa 1983, and 3) a 629 4" on the Smiths.
A 1929 Colt SAA 44 spl, 4-3/4" on the Colt.
Maybe all need some forcing cone work????
Mike
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Old 11-29-2009, 06:40 PM
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Tell; PM sent!
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