148 HBWC loads for .38 spl snub-nose?

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borealis

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I am wanting to start work on some practice loads for a snub-nose .38 Spl. I recently bought. Can anyone here suggest any 148gr. HBWC loads that would be reasonably accurate and efficient for a gun sporting a barrel less than 2 inches? This gun does shoot well. Some of the factory loads I've pushed through it have given me groups consistently smaller than 2.5 inches at ranges between 7 and 15 yds.

What I have on hand at the moment is:

1 - Speer 148 gr HBWC (500 ct)
2 - W231, Unique or HS-6 powders
3 - plenty of once fired brass (mostly Rem. or Federal)
4 - 3 hundred Rem. 1-1/2 small pistol primers.

Thanks in advance.
 
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HBWC don't like to be puhed hard, and can come apart if you do.
Suggest 231 at 3 gr max as very suitable for your application.
 
I load 3.2 grains of Unique with a Berry's HB wadcutter. Very accurate out of my 686, low recoil.

Wife loves shooting them.
 
hey borealis s2harry, I have a few ideas for you. First what type gun you got? A 13 oz scandium 38 or all steel. They dont recomend lead bullets in the Scandium guns recoil will pull the bullets out and the cylinder wont turn.
*Do you have a reloading manual? Never reload without one you need information on how to reload.
*Dont use data that is not publshed by a manufacturer or you may blow your gun up.
*Dont load hbwc hot the skirt will blow off. Use bevel base wadcutters for hotter loads. Use 125 gr cowboy round nose lead for easier loading in cylinder.
On the Hogdon website is a reloading data page. I got these loads from there.
For the 148 hbwc, velocity is for 4-6" barrel.
1. 3.5 gr 231 869 fps to 4.0 gr 231 956 fps.
2. 4.5 gr HS6 816 fps to 5.2 gr HS6 942fps
3. Unique is not recomended for hbwc by Alliant.

* Be careful always double check the powder in the cases with a flashlight. A double charge may blow your gun up. Look to see the powder is the same level in all cases before you seat the bullets.
*One last time get a reloading manual and read it first you may blow your gun up.
 
I was composing almost this very same question last night --- And here it is :cool:

A friend and I used to reload everything we shot 40 years ago. He moved and I gave him everything but my .38 brass. I haven't loaded anything in the interim but now have two 38s - A 4" Mod 10 and a 1 7/8" 49 that my wife and I have been shooting a lot lately :)
So here's the thing..... I know that the 4" M10 will drive nails with 148 HBWCs & 2.8gr of Bullseye, but last night I read somewhere (should have bookmarked it) that this is NOT a very good load for a snubby :(

Is that true :confused:
If it is, what is a good load for that bullet and powder for the 49 ---- Or should I be using a different powder or bullet or both for the snub?

I'd really like to keep this as simple (OK - Cheap) as possible. My plan is to get a single stage press and to keep the components as basic as I possibly can -- At least for now :D
 
I have use the "old standard" 38 Special target load of 2.7 gr. Bullseye with the Remington 148 gr. LHBWC and Rem 1.5 for many years in a wide variety of revolvers as well as my Model 52. Bullet is seated flush with a very light roll crimp. Excellent accuracy and light recoil.
 
Hey DeadAye when you read 2.8 bullseye and hbwc was not good for a snubbie, what was the reason? Bullets pulling out of the cases?Hbwc are not a good defense load when you load them hot youll blow off the hollow base. You can load a bevel base lead wadcutter hotter and have a blunt bullet that shoots well. But reloading a 5 shot with wadcutters would be slow even with the chambers chamfered. I shoot a model 36 with factory hbwc and it shoots 2" at 50 feet so I see no problem with your load. Harry
 
Thanks to all for the well considered input. I've got a better idea which way I want to go with these loads now.

s2harry,
Thanks for keeping the safety concerns up front. My revolver has a stainless steel cylinder. But no, I don't intend to push the 148gr HBWC too hard. These are intended as practice/target loads only. I had already heard in the past that the skirts might separate on these bullets if they were driven too fast. I own the Hornady, Lyman (49th ed), and current Hodgdon reloading manuals and consult them regularly. What I wasn't finding was some data and information relating to loading these bullets for snub-nose revolvers. Most of my current data was for 4 to 7.7 inch barrels. I know that the load data provided in the books will clock slower speeds over my chronograph when I shoot them through a less than 2 inch barrel, but what I'm really looking for is the efficiency "sweet spot" for 148gr HBWCs through a snubbie. ...By the way, you mentioned using a flashlight to check for double-charge mistakes. I've been using an LED headlamp like the skiers and mushers use up here during the dark winter months. Mine is comfortable to wear and works like a charm - even for peering down those long .45-70 cartridges that I reload. They are fairly easy to find online for those that don't live in places where winter sports are commonplace.
 
My 148 GRAIN .38 Special loads

2.8 grains of Bullseye
3.0 grains of 231 [HBW]
 
My pet load for 148-grain HBWC's is 3.2 grains of Win231 with a CCI 500 primer (per the Speer #12 reloading manual).

According to the Speer #12 manual, max load for that 148-grain HBWC is 3.3 grains of Win231, for a velocity of 804 fps. I just use the 3.2 grain load, because a 0.30cc Lee powder dipper happens to have that amount for WIN231, and it speeds up my loading time for a few hundred rounds (I only have a single-stage press, no progressive!). I still weigh about every ten rounds or so, just to be sure. If I do my part, any .38 Special that I own with that load can shoot better than I can, all day long. And the recoil isn't as severe in an Airweight revolver, either.

All that being said, I regularly shoot this load in my Model 638 Airweight snub for practice, and have for about 6 years or so. I've never experienced bullet setback or jump with these loads in that alloy-framed revolver, and as mentioned previously, these rounds need a good roll crimp. But, I DO make sure that I clean the forcing cone area really well, before I use any hot, jacketed +P loads in the snub again.

Your mileage may vary. Try it, you'll like it. ;)

Snub38
 
My favorite 148gr HBWC load is 3.2gr W231/HP-38 with either a CCI-500 or Winchester WSP primer.

A note, I like DEWC bullets a little better than HBWC for a few reasons. Yes the HBWC is a "Classic Bullesye load" but the flat base bullets just seem better to me. I up the charge to 3.4gr/3.5gr W231 with a 148gr DEWC.
 
.38 wadcutters are one of the lost joys of shooting. The gold standard for accuracy with a 148gr WC was always 2.7 grains of Bullseye. I have been loading and shooting this load for years, and it usually gets the best out of any revolver (or my S&W model 52) you shoot it in. 2.8 grains of W231 is nearly as good, and a little bit cleaner burning. My personal preference is Hornady 148gr. HBWC's, but DEWC's do very well also. These loads are a pleasure to shoot, and give amazing accuracy in snubbies also. I have a S&W 60, 640, 649, and a Taurus 85 and they all do fine with this load.
 
Only problem I have run into with 38 snubies is if you go too light, then they apparently won't stabilize. Had a friend coming over with his wife to try out "her" new 38 lightweight snubby. Figured I better load a few rounds a little lighter(158 SWC). Dropped the Bullseye charge by .2 grains. Wouldn't shoot good in her gun or my M10 snubby. Grabbed the standard load(.2 grains more powder) and both shot better than the shooters.
 
Many good 148 HBWC loads out there . Just about any of the faster powders will give an acceptible load . Personally I prefer the Rem & Zero HBWC's & if bought in bulk are much cheaper than the Speer or Hornady HBWC's . The Remington's are soft lead with a messy graphite type lube, usually .359 & shoot like a house afire . Some loads for 148 HBWC are 2.7 - 3.0 Bullseye , 3.0 - 3.2 W231 , 2.9 AA #2 , 2.9 VVN320 , 3.6 VVN340 , 2.5 - 2.8 WST . Velocity for best accuracy is 700 - 720 fps for a swaged HBWC .
 
I bought a box of Speer 148 HBWC's with the intention of loading them backwards as "lead hollowpoints". UNfortunately even warmly loaded over 4.5 gr W231, they didn't want to stabilize. Oh well. I loaded some (normally configured) over 3.6 gr W231 and they shoot fine.
I accidently loaded a half-dozen (as wadcutters) over 4.5 W231 when I forgot to change the rotor in my Little Dandy powder measure before starting loading operations. I shot them one at a time in my model 36 and had no skirt separations or any other problems. I've since loaded a few more and tried them, still no problems.
If I can get to where I trust them not to come apart, I think a souped-up soft wadcutter would make a dandy self-defense load, with the chopping penetration of a blunt bullet and at least the possibility of some limited expansion. I'd buy some Speer BBWC's but they've apparently been discontinued, and most if not all of the available BBWC's or DEWC's are hard cast.
FWIW I think the Speer HBWC design has eveloved over the years. The cavity appears to be a tapered shape (not cylinderical), so that with the resulting thicker skirts it may be that the bullet is less prone to skirt separations than before.
As far as loading them like Speer intended (s HBWC's), I use 3.6 gr W231.
 
Last edited:
Try your 231 at 3.1 and see what happens with the HBwc Speer bullet and try a x-light or medium crimp to see
if your weapon likes one over the other.

My snub 38 did better with Bullseye at 2.7grs for groups at ten feet with a x-light or med. Hvy crimp. with a 1.16" oal
with the Speer HBwc.......... never tried the Rem primer.
Good shooting.
 
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