Hello reloaders,

I'm loading .38 spl Delta precision 148 gr HBWC bullets, I'm very satisfied with them except that they are very gummy with lubricants when shipped from factory. Therefore my Lee bullet seating die also gets gummy and needs frequent cleaning. I used to reload 158gr Speer round node and these bullets were very clean. I don't know why Delta precision puts so much lubricant on their bullets....

Do you guys somehow clean these greasy bullets to remove the excess lubricant before seating the bullets? If yes, how do you clean them?

Regards,

Guy -

Sorry, I'm not familiar with this company.

Maybe you could put the bullets in a case cleaner but that would certainly take some experimentation to determine how long to clean them as you don't want to completely remove the lube. You also might have problems with the media sticking to the bullets instead of the media cleaning them though.

Earlier this week, I've loaded some 38 Specials with the following 148 gr HBWC bullets:

Remington
Hornady
Zero

The Remingtons were a mess to reload (really wish now I hadn't bought 2,000 of them) but the Hornadys were clean and easy to seat. I've read the Remingtons are very accurate but I don't think I'll buy anymore due to the mess in reloading them.

The Zeros were easy to load (no mess, no fuss...) but seem to be fairly soft and I had to modify my seater plug (RCBS WC seater plug) to keep it from deforming the outside edge of the bullet as the bullet was seated (the sharp edge of the seater plug was pushing into the outer edge of the bullet leaving two ridges with a valley in between). I don't think it would affect accuracy but it looked bad.

I basically took a bullet I removed from a 22LR cartrigde, placed it in the cavity on the WC seater plug and then put the plug longways in my vise (with brass jaw liners) and squeezed the bullet until it was flat with the end of the seater plug and the modification results in seating the Zero 148 HBWC bullet without deformation. I don't know how long the modification will last but it's working for the moment.

I contemplated filling the cavity of the seater plug with epoxy and then trying to shape the contour of the epoxy to match the face of the bullet but that seemed to be more trouble than it was worth.

Long story short, I think either the Hornady or the Zero 148 gr HBWC bullets, depending on which one is more accurate and/or leads the barrel less, will be the ones I'll feed through my model 52s in the future.

bls

Delta Precision IMHO is the BEST for making the 148 HBWC round...I have shot all many many times and the consistancy and accuracy is far superior in Deltas bullets.They cater to the PPC world here in the south.

I can't answer the reason for the extra lube (as I know other companies do this as well) but call and ask them...they have always been excellent for products and customer service.

Jason Oliver

Actually, the company is Precision Delta, and they make arguably one of the best HBWC's.
Sounds like you ordered the less expensive lube ones. You need to spend the extra $6. per IK and get the "match lube" version (ML). It's a powdery, teflon-like substance. No mess, no issues.
Precision Delta bought the old Star manufacturing tooling after they went out of business. Star was the "gold standard" for both .38 and .45 in Bullseye competition. Their .45 caliber 185gr. LSWCHP was considered by many to be the best lead head available, and Precision Delta also produces these. Again, just remember to order the match lube.

__________________
NCY in the PR of NJ

Try wiping them off with a rag and mineral spirits.

I use Hornady 38 special dies in my Dillion 550. I have loaded thousands of HBWC some of which were gummy with lube. Never had the problem you are describing. Are you belling your cases a slight bit?

To NCY54: thanks a lot for the information. My next batch will be ML (match lube). It is worth the extra $6 for sure. Thanks again.

To Harrison: yes I'm belling enough so that, using my fingers, I can very lightly push in the bullet into the brass until it goes in about 1/32 to 1/16 of an inch. As a test, I then turn the bullet down so it faces the ground, and the bullet stays in. I took this advice from the Speer reloading manual. My problem is the lube escapes a bit from the sides as I seat the bullets and after a while I have to clean the die (Lee) more often than I should. I also have to wipe every round after seating since some lube gets on the outside of the brass.

"gummy"/greasy wadcutters
A friend gave me this solution to the problem, 35 years ago:
A cigar box and baby powder.
Put the bullets in and sprinkle baby powder on them. Shake the box. The powder will collect on the bullets.

I switched years ago to plated version of HBWC They are made by
Berrys bullets and are sold at cabelas or can be purchased direct
from Berrys on their web site.
I also shoot a lot of Raniers, but last time I checked they only had
DEWC and I like the HBWC.
The cigar box trick would work , but I am not sure of the abrasiveness
of baby powder, it is talc which is a mineral.
How about corn starch ?
Or open up the wallet and get plated, they seem just as accurate and a lot cleaner.
I also load them to shoot in 357 mag and up the powder a mite, and yes I mean 357 cases, I don't shoot 38s out of my 357s

buy a tumbler and some corn cob... they come out looking new, and dry as a popcorn fart.

I have had my dies gum up and I find that WD-40 and a paper towel do a great job of cleaning them up.

Just to add some info to the Precision Delta/Star lube story that I posted earlier in the thread, Star used to sell their regular (messy) lube with the bullets in a tube to keep the mess to a minimum. While many reloaders complained, others felt that the lube was part of the amazing accuracy of the bullets, and put up with the inconvenience.
The match lube eventually became the preferred way to go and commanded the premium price.
I've tried Remington HBWC's, but the messy, gritty lube negates any perceived gain in accuracy, IMO. Hornady HBWC's use a nice powdery lube that is a bit like the PD match lube, but are more expensive and no more accurate, again IMO.
I've tried both the Ranier plated DEWC's and the Berry's plated HBWC's, and both are OK up to 25 yd's, but don't hack it at 50. They sure are clean, though.
BTW, load in the .38 is 2.8 BE or 3.1 W231. YMMV, as they say.

__________________
NCY in the PR of NJ

Hornady made HBWC with a white powder type lube. Ypu might see if they still do.

Yes, I agree with you [ncy54], Precision Delta HBWC are very accurate and is the favorite of the PPC community in Montreal. Would be nice if we could match these nice bullets with BE (Bullseye) powder, but we simply cannot find BE in our region, so we use W231 and TiteGroup for now.

I inherited some old Speer (I think) swedged 158 gr. 38 cal bullets from my dad years ago. They were dry from age. I have the Lyman 150 gr. bullet mold. Was working up some +p loadings for 38 special. Got some leading. Bought some Lee Alox to relube the swedged bullets. Mixed 50% Johnson's paste wax, 40% Lee Alox, 10% mineral spirits. Found a quart can of Motor Mica in my stash. Baby Powder will work also. Tumbled everything in a old butter bowl. Took them out the range yesterday and no leading. Now I think I am going to use the Motor Mica on everything to keep them from sticking together. Dies came out looking clean.

Its a matter of hardness of the lube IMHO. Harder lubes require a heater during installation. The softer ones are not necessarily bad, but like you I dislike the mess.

After taking to a few PPC people, one trick commonly used for these bullets (or others that have too much greasy lube to your liking) is to lay the bullets on an old towel and heat them up a bit with a electric paint remover (heat gun). As you heat them up with a side to side movement, they will quickly become shiny. This is your cue to stop. Shake them up in the towel and let them cool down before touching them.

Thanks all for your inputs,
Regards,
Guy -

Try flaring your casemouth a little more.....

Now THAT is useful information! I've got tons of the Star 148gr. HBWC that I bought at close-out from Penn Bullets at probably the last OGCA show at the Cleveland IX Center.

The Star bullets are simply superlative out of my Giles .38 Special M1911. It's nice to know that somebody's still making bullets of comparable quality.

I've used the Speer 148gr. HBWC and really liked them. They use some sort of dry lube that doesn't gum up the dies at all and they seem to shoot really clean. I'd still be using them, but they seem to be hard to find. I had some on back order from Midway and finally gave up after the ETA got put off for the third time. If you can locate some, they're worth trying IMHO.

thanks "Harrison" and "ShovelWrench". I'm belling a bit more since I started this thread and the gummy mess has improved.
BR,
Guy -

The old remington 148 gr. LHBWC from the 1960's were manageable but the new ones are much dirtier. Star used to make a great 148 gr. LSWC with a white moly lube much like theior 45 cal 185 gr. LSWCHP's/ I wish that Star was still in business.

As ncy54 said, Precision Delta wadcutters shoot well when matched with 3.1 grs. WW 231. When you can find them, the Speer wadcutters also shoot good. I found that with the 231 load and Precision bullets, my loads with once-fired cases will closely match Federal/WW factory loads, and those are really good.

And the customer service at Precision Delta is great. Nice folks to work with, and they go out of their way to help. Phil Hemphill uses their ammo, and that says a lot.