Smelting Wheel Weights

[Skip Sackett]

Well, as most of you know, I ain't none too smart!

I proved it again today by smelting a 5 gallon bucket of wheel weights. What's so dumb about that you ask? Just that it was one of the hottest days of the year is all!
It did take me almost 1 hour to do them so now I am safely inside in the air conditioning!

At any rate, I haven't posted any videos in a while and the last time I had my smelting setup on, I had an aluminum pot on them. Since then, I have purchased a nice cast iron pot from a garage sale for nearly nothing and a few different ingot moulds.

The videos and pictures are pretty self explanatory. After watching the videos I will have a bit more information at the bottom of this post.

Close up of waste:



Click on picture to start videos:









The final outcome from this 5 gallon bucket of lead was 113# of lead ingots. This material can be cast as is and make fine bullets. If they are water quenched from the mold, the BHN will clime into the 22BHN area. That would make them hard enough for serious velocity work!

The amount of scrap was 25#. That means that there was somewhere near 138 - 140lbs in this bucket. That being said, it gives us a return rate of 87%. Not too bad. If I would have kept some of the questionable wheel weights, not sure if they were zinc or not, it would have been near 90%.

Now, let's say I paid $10 for that bucket of lead. @ 113# *7000 that gives us 791000gr of lead to work with. @ 160gr that give us 4943.75 bullets. @ $10 per 4943.75 bullets that makes each bullet cost $0.00202275600505689001264222503161. Multiply that times 500 and a box of bulk 160gr bullets costs me a whopping $1.02(rounded) for that many. Take the cost to $30 for the same bucket and it raises the cost to $3.06 per 500!

Of course the cost goes up for a 230gr 45ACP bullet. All the way to $0.0087231352718078381795195954488 or $4.362(rounded) for 500!

More to follow!

[Skip Sackett]

Last video. Took a long time to get this one on the webi!

[Dale53]

Neither rain nor snow, nor HEAT OF THE DAY....

Good show, Smith Crazy!!

I would encourage ANYONE who is interested to jump in with both feet. It'll never be cheaper!!

Dale53

[Skip Sackett]

Thank you Dale.
Coming from someone of your caliber, pun intended, that's one of the nicest complements a guy could get!

[jhvaughan2]

Thanks for the very informative post. Looking at your math, I would have rounded your cost of bullet materials to

You make it look tempting. How much would you estimate the start up costs? (Inc. burner and propane. I don't have either.)

[ColColt]

Up until recently I had been out of reloading for some time but I have a Lyman thermostatically controlled pot I use to melt lead in and it worked admirably.

I don't know about today but use to I could buy pure virgin lead in 5# ingots and get my Linotype for mixing with lead from the local printers for-catch this...25 cents a pound! I still have about 40 pounds of lead and maybe the same in Linotype. A 50/50 mix made a pretty decent bullet.

CAUTION: Don't wear slip flops or sandals while melting lead like I did one! You can't shake hot lead off your toe quick enough.

[Hunt200]

I melted up about 60 lbs. the other day. I have about 200 lbs. sorted and ready to go and another 150 that needs to be sorted. My goal is a half ton by the end of summer!!!

[Skip Sackett]

The tools used in this video cost little. I had them or they were used when I got them.

The last ingot moulds I got were $17 and that was kind of high. Worth it but, kinda high.

The turkey fryer can be had from just about any store, Wally World included. Mine cost about $60. The cast iron pot was $5 from a yard sale, if I remember correctly(I am getting older you know! )

The spoons came from GFS. They are "slotted" serving spoons and were maybe $5.

Not sure about the propane tank. Had it for a grill that went bad! I used to be able to charge them for about a buck. Now it is $10 or more, whatever the going rate is.

Use cast iron or aluminum ingot moulds. Steel ones are a bit tricky to use because lead sticks to them, just like in wheel weights!

They can be "smoked" with an acetylene torch or candle and they are cheaper. I just didn't have much luck with them. Probably something to do with patience!

At any rate, this is just to "smelt" in. I wouldn't use setup to cast with, although one could. If using this method to do both, you would need to flux the pot after melting and use a ladle to pour with.

From all I have seen, that would make it much more time consuming to cast bullets. Maybe for small batches.

Dom,
I got over 450lbs for $30 a while back. I haven't even gotten close to getting all of that smelted yet. Although, the wife is wanting to get part of her garage back!

[cjw3]

Originally Posted by ColColt

Up until recently I had been out of reloading for some time but I have a Lyman thermostatically controlled pot I use to melt lead in and it worked admirably.

I don't know about today but use to I could buy pure virgin lead in 5# ingots and get my Linotype for mixing with lead from the local printers for-catch this...25 cents a pound! I still have about 40 pounds of lead and maybe the same in Linotype. A 50/50 mix made a pretty decent bullet.

CAUTION: Don't wear flip flops or sandals while melting lead like I did one! You can't shake hot lead off your toe quick enough.

Or bedroom shoes.

Don't ask how I know.

[ElToro]

i will keep my eye out for that equipment cheap. i gradually want to get into reloading.

can you "grease" the moulds so the ingots slip out easily ?

i dont think tire shops around here will sell the lead.

[Skip Sackett]

Originally Posted by ElToro

i will keep my eye out for that equipment cheap. i gradually want to get into reloading.

can you "grease" the moulds so the ingots slip out easily ?

i dont think tire shops around here will sell the lead.

Smoking them would be best. No added contaminants. By the way, @ 650*F what kind of grease would work without melting? Once melted and trapped in liquid lead, I don't think that is such a good idea!

I do know that water and lead don't mix. Both by reading and experientially!

[preserving-freedom]

I took a couple of 5 gallon buckets out today on a hunt for wheel weights. I picked up 140 lbs from your a local super center. Didn't cost me a dime!

I also have another place that will sell me 5 gallon buckets full for $20 each.

Stock pile!!!

I have never cast, but I'm guessing that it won't be long....

[ColColt]

Time was when you get get lead from plumbers. That's where I got most of mine. I can't vouch for that today, however.

Getting ingots out should be fairly simple. I never had any problem with just turning my trays upside down once cooled and they fell right out.

[preserving-freedom]

Here are a sample of the weights I got today. Which are ok to use, and which ones need pitched?

[Mike, SC Hunter]

I skip the ingot step entirely. I use a cast iron pot that holds about 16 lbs. of lead on a propane gas burner. I place 4 molds around the pot as the melt completes. Then I flux and skim with a metal kitchen ladle into a coffee can. By this time the molds are up to temperature and I start casting into a 4 slotted wood catch box that I built. When one mold gets too hot I put it down and go to the next one. An so -on back to the first one. I can turn out a quanity of 4 different kinds of bullets in a relativy short period of time. I keep a ton or so of WW's on hand at any one time. This setup is alot faster than any electric furnace. To me smelting into ingots is time that could go for something else. My $0.02.

[Hunt200]

Originally Posted by preserving-freedom

Here are a sample of the weights I got today. Which are ok to use, and which ones need pitched?

The one is the upper left looks like zinc to me, but I would suggest you sort them all, I will tell you the tips I got from the good fellers here and there.

Take a pair of diagonal cutters and test each one, they will dent the lead ones and slide right off the zinc ones. You can also scrape them on concrete, the lead ones will scrape and the zinc will not. Once you checked a few zinc ones you will see how easy it is to tell they are zinc or steel. Also after a while you can tell which ones are zinc because most of them are kind of riveted to the clip.

You can also keep your temp below the melting point of zinc which is around 780 degrees, lead melts at about 620 degrees. The steel, zinc and clips will float to the top and can be skimmed off.

Don't forget to flux the mix before pouring the ingots, this will save some time when you get to the bullet casting part.

[preserving-freedom]

Thanks Hunt!

I went out and checked those weights with a side cutter. You were right about the top left one. It is riveted on, and is zinc. So is the third one down on the left and both sets of flat ones on the right.

The other ones were soft. Guess I better get to sorting.

Thanks!

[Skip Sackett]

Usually, the flat ones are pure lead. Hunt has given good advice about both them and side cutters. He said one more thing that needs to be noted, rivets. If the weight part is riveted to the clip part it must be something other than lead 'cause lead sticks to steel! No need for rivets!

I use the temperature method. Once I did get fooled and got a bad batch of lead in the process. I let the temperature get up to almost 800*F in the turkey fryer. I tried to cast with it but the zinc makes it almost impossible to get bullet fill out.

Live and learn!

One reason I preform this step is really pretty simple, the wife likes ingots in the garage and not so much with dirty wheel weights.

She sees the value of the weights, she likes to help cast, load and shoot. For a time she was my automatic case feeder for my SDBs. Only caught her fingers once or twice!

So, call me stupid or henpecked if you want, don't care. Been married to the mother of my 5 children for over 30 years. Seems to work!

Another reason to cast ingots for me is that it can be done outside. Since I live in a subdivision, I don't want to cast bullets outside. Nosey neighbors!

One more reason is that I cast bullets inside in the winter. Well, in the garage anyway. That means that I have to open the door if I am smelting because of the dirt smoke and such. If I do this outside when I cast inside there is almost no smoke. Opening the door is fine until it is -10*F here in the great white north!

[Mike, SC Hunter]

I understand.

[imashooter2]

Originally Posted by preserving-freedom

Here are a sample of the weights I got today. Which are ok to use, and which ones need pitched?

Using this matrix:

1 2
3 4
5 6
7 8

Numbers 1 and 4 are steel. They have "Fe" molded into them.

Numbers 2, 3 and 5 I can't tell. Unless painted weights have Pb (lead), Zn (zinc) or Fe (steel) molded into them for positive ID they need to be checked. I use the diagonal cutters method.

Numbers 6, 7 and 8 have the dull gray look of aged lead.

As a general rule, anything that has welded or riveted on clips is steel or zinc. Unfortunately, I've been seeing a LOT of molded on clips in both steel and zinc lately.

[michael thornton]

i find the bad ones on the bottom of my pot, they melt at higher temps.

[fredj338]

Originally Posted by preserving-freedom

Here are a sample of the weights I got today. Which are ok to use, and which ones need pitched?

It's hard top tell just by looking. Some guide lines: if it has a clip riveted on, it's either steel or zinc. If the weight won't dent or cut w/ wire cutters, it's NOT lead based & NOT suitable for casting. If you keep your melt below 700deg, the zinc will not melt & the steel floats to the top. Other numbers or letters other than Fe or Zn mean nothig about the alloy but what kind of wheel they go on & many are painted now.
One used to be able to get ww from the tire shops for free. Now expect to pay at least $20/3-5gal bucket. Expect a lot more than 15% waste & it's only going to get worse as states either ban lead ww, like Kalif, NJ & soon to be Washington & Oregon, or the large ww manuf stop making them. Kalif tire shops probably buy more ww than half the other states combined. So ww manuf nation wide are switching over to non lead sooner than later I'm afraid. All EUro cars come have non lead ww from the factory, US cars sooner than later. Last 3gal bucket I got here was 35% non useable + the clips after melting, call it 60% useable. Berm mining will soon be the last resort for cheap or free lead alloy.