I took my new to me M14-4 to the range today along with some wadcutter loads. I used Missouri Bullets 148 gr WC's and 3.2 gr Bullseye. I seated the WC's at the crimp grove. this left a very small amount of the bullet sticking out of the case.

The 3.2 gr of Bullseye was the lightest charge I could reliably drop from my RCBS measure. At that charge, the lever action of the measure would go from light to hard whenever it wanted to. It was like some grains of powder were getting caught up in the action. The charge weights were very consistant, though.

This was the scariest load I have ever made. That amount of powder is nothing in the 38 case. I carefully looked into every case with a penlight before seating the bullets.

These loads were very accurate to 25 ft, but incredibly smoky. They were the smokiest loads I have ever shot.

OK, now about the smoke - what were the bullets lubed with, and how? Tumble-lubed ? Lightly or heavily? And what configuration were the bullets? Deep grooves, completely filled? Light, narrow, thin grorves? It all has a bearing, and not all of the "smoke' is due to the selection of Bullseye over any other powder.

Certain kinds of lube perform better at lower pressures and thems than they do at high. Conversely, some perform better high. Smoke is one of the performance criteria.

Flash

Diligence is a good thing when you are handloading. Too many folks aren't careful and/or observant enough, or are doing something else at the same time (watching TV, yapping with someone). Bad things can happen as a result.

Although I have a progressive loader, even after tens of thousands of lightly loaded .38 Special wadcutter loads using Bullseye and W-231, I still feel better about using a wooden loading block and eye-balling all of the cases carefully after the powder is in, and then seating the bullets in my Rock Chucker.

I use a small flashlight to inspect the powder charges, too. I think it's a really good idea.

Just to reassure yourself that you know what you are looking for, intentionally double charge one case in the tray and then compare it to the others with the correct charge. Even with small charges of Bullseye like 2.7/3.2 grains, a double charge can be seen fairly easily if you are paying attention. Just be sure to dump that double charge back in the hopper!

Like flash just said, some bullet lubricants make a lot more smoke and soot than others. The lube makes far more difference than does the powder.

You didn't say if those are hollow base or double ended, but if they are hollow base that would be a fairly stout charge. I only use 2.5-2.7grs with my hollow base wadcutters and the 2.7gr was for my 52 just to help cycle the action better.

smoke.. hmmmm...
I use bullseye too and noticed that I had significantly more smoke then factory loads as well.
I told a freind about it an he said that it was because the insides of the brass were not cleaned.

I have little to no experience reloading (just finished my second batch of 500 for my 45ACP).
I am getting better but I have a long way to go!

I would love to hear some expert reloaders (years of experience) share their insite... thanks!

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)))X~ silvercn ~X(((

Sometimes using old bullet lubricant makes for more smoke than usual. The old lube can separate and the burning oil is what smokes.

Duckloads,
I had problems throwing small charges w/RCBS Uniflow until I got a powder baffle and pistol rotor(smaller volume).
Good Luck, Kevin

I can provide some input for duckloads.

Missouri Bullets doesn't make HBWC's. Everything is cast. I have included their website pic of the bullets being used to help answer the questions asked.

Hmm...we must have been separated at birth.

I also use Bullseye (3.0 grains) with that same bullet...1.24" OAL (case mouth just a little south of the crimping groove)....dispensed from an RCBS powder measure...checked with flashlight....fired from 14-3....very accurate...sort of smoky. Good times.

I find the binding of the powder measure annoying, but the charge weight remains very consistent. I thought I had the pistol rotor someplace but have been unable to locate it.

The small amount of powder can be appreciated when you think about the 2180+ rounds you will get from a pound of it.

Buff's suggestion to throw a double charge and then eyeball it carefully is excellent; I have done this myself on occasion. Once your eye is "set" to a certain level of the powder in the case, any variation will be instantly apparent. I honestly don't believe I have ever failed to inspect the powder level in any metallic cartridge I have loaded, and this is now exceeding 40K+. It is a good habit to have.

thanks for the conversation. I'll call RCBS tomorrow to check on parts that will allow easier small charge "droppings".

Im have always used 2.7 to 2.8 gr. Bullseye behind the Remington 148 gr. LHBWC. In years past I used the old lyman Powder measure. Currently I use a Dillon 550 with the extra small powder bar for very consistent drops. Since selling my S&W 52 I have switched to a 158 gr. LRN bullet for my 38 Special reloads using Trail Boss powder 0- virtually impossible to double charge the case.

FWIW: My RCBS with the pistol rotor will consistently drop 1.9 gr of Bullseye for my .32.

Jeff

Do not be gentle operating your Uniflow. Don't baby the handle. Raise it so it tops out with a "thunk." Lower it firmly to get another "thunk." The extra thumping helps keep the powder flowing and settles the powder in the hopper. Keep the powder level in the hopper consistent- don't run it down to almost nothing before adding more powder. This pretty well eliminates "bridging" and leads to more consistent charges.

Bullseye has been the powder of choice for .38 Special Wadcutters and the .45ACP. Untold numbers of bullseye shooters have fired bullseye and the military has fired millions of .45ACP rounds with Bullseye without any complaints about smoke.
It has only been in the last 10 years that gun powders are judged by:
1) how clean the gun is after firing
2) how much perceived smoke is generated
and, the only one that really has any significance,
3) how precisely it meters
There is no discussion of accuracy (group sizes).
If you don't like Bullseye, try 231/HP38 or AA2 for these applications.
If you can't get the light load you want, don't load the higher load just because you can.
For a revolver, you do not want to shoot HBWC and you want enough of the bullet beyond the case to enter the cylinder throat (which it sounds as though you are doing).
You could ask for only the bottom lube groove to be filled. You need very little lube for this application and the NRA proved decades ago that the smallest amount of lube that kept barrel leading down gave the highest accuracy. In fact, a very light wax coating over the bearing surface works very well for me.

Noylj:

Why shouldn't one use a HBWC in a revolver?

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Pete

Obviously, it has been used for years in revolvers.
However, it is very easy to load just a little hotter than required and the bullet skirt will separate from the main bullet and leave an obstruction in the bore. As a "new" handloader, this is a very easy mistake to make as we are talking about an increase in velocity from 750fps to even just 800fps and you can leave a skirt in your barrel.
With a revolver, you have a small gap where the gas pressure can "blow up" the skirt and then it is squeezed down in the forcing cone. There have been reports of skirts being left in the forcing cone.
It isn't that you shouldn't, as an absolute rule, as it is that you shouldn't use that style of bullet until you know the risks and what is needed to properly reload them.
In most loading manuals, they pass it off a "might happen." I find that is much closer to a "will happen." I simply think that they are something to approach carefully and, if you are getting perfectly satisfactory results with a DEWC or other solid wadcutter, it is best to stay with it.
Now, in my S&W M52, anything except a HBWC is just a waste of time and components. I have "learned" my lesson by finding 10 holes in a target I fired 5 shots at (and that was a load recommended for the M52 and HBWCs).
Pressures are so low, that I can't see blowing up a gun, but a bulged barrel will ruin you day out.

I was curious as to your rationale since a I use Remington 148 HBWC in my model 52-2 and two Model 14s, all with 3.2 gr. of Win 231 with success.

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Pete