Anyone ever tried to improve Lee rifle dies?

[Jellybean]

After the last Lee thread I started thinking about thier rifle dies. Years ago I did a side by side comparison between Lee and RCBS dies and found the RCBS to be more accurate, so ever since I bought RCBS dies if accuracy was a major concern. But I never did examine them to see if their was any room for improvement, until recently, and I think they may have some potential.

I happened to have a few pieces of 7.62X39 brass on the bench that was all prepared except primers, powder and bullets, so I took half of them and loaded them with the dies as is, then modified the seating die and loaded the other half. I don't know if I'll ever get to shoot these but I did check them with a Sinclair concentricity gauge and noticed that the amount of runout was a bit less, and much more consistent, after the modification.

Before I get my hopes up too high I'm going to pull out a larger pile of some other caliber to see if I can get the same results, and hopefully even shoot them.

The modification was to the seating die only. The bullet seating plug is very loose, which they seem pretty proud about, but I'm thinking it needs to be centered and with as little play as possible. I used masking tape to correct it for now, but if it does work I might have to look for something more permanant.

So, has anyone else experimented with them, and if so, what were the results?

[FTG-05]

The only mod I've ever done to any of my dies, including Lee, Hornady, or Dillon carbide dies) is to take a small rod with a 1/2" slut cut in one end, and then use a piece of 400-600 grit sandpaper to smooth and polish the inside of the die.

I do this mostly on my rifle dies and it's worked good for me.

Hope this helps.

Good luck.

[Jellybean]

FTG-05, thanks, do you see a noticble difference after polishing, and have you ever gone finer, such as using emery cloth? Also, how does it affect the carbide rings in carbide dies?

[kingranch]

I’ve never even thought about improving Lee dies but I’ve used Lee die parts to “improve” Hornady’s New Dimension FL 30-30 sizer die.

[Culina]

Nope, my plan is to not have any of their products.

[Jellybean]

Originally Posted by kingranch

I’ve never even thought about improving Lee dies but I’ve used Lee die parts to “improve” Hornady’s New Dimension FL 30-30 sizer die.

I just looked at Hornadys website, are they using Lees decapping system? When I start working with the other calibers I'm going to check this over for possible runout problems too.

Kurac, plan "A" is always the best.

[FTG-05]

Originally Posted by Jellybean

FTG-05, thanks, do you see a noticble difference after polishing, and have you ever gone finer, such as using emery cloth? Also, how does it affect the carbide rings in carbide dies?

To me, they looked brighter and smoother for sure - how that played out in making it easier to resize rifle (or pistol) brass, I have no idea. I have to believe it does, but have nothing to prove it.

Actually, now that you mention it, I don't recall what grit level I stopped at. I know I start with high/very fine grit levels and I do have very fine emery cloth. Basically, I wasn't after removing metal, just the finest, smoothest surface I could get.

I saw less affect on the carbide dies *probably* due to their hardness but also the fact that they seemed smoother than their tool steel counterparts.

Hope this helps.

Good luck.

[Jellybean]

FTG-05, thank you, it sounds interesting and might have to be a future project.

[mkk41]

No thanks. No sense in polishing a ****. Been a toolmaker myself for almost 30yrs. Just buy good dies to start with. I prefer Redding , but would never turn down a set of used RCBS dies when they're usually half price. Used RCBS are better than any new Lee die. The only set of Lee I bought new (45/70) and used ONCE (20rds) , I gave away as soon as I found a set of used RCBS ($15) at a gunshow , and a sucker to take the Lees. If they stayed on my bench any longer , I would have just thrown them in the trash.

[CAL.ADAM]

buy redding you dont need to improve them.Buy once cry once

[Jellybean]

Originally Posted by mkk41

I prefer Redding , but would never turn down a set of used RCBS dies when they're usually half price. Used RCBS are better than any new Lee die.

And once in awhile you can find used Lee die sets for about $5, which means after the store makes a few dollars the guy that traded them in didn't get a dime for them. So instead of giving them away, I'm going to see if I can make them a little better. Unfortunately the only store around that sold a lot of used reloading equipment is gone now, the ones that are left either don't carry reloading stuff or say they won't sell them when they can sell new and make more money.

By the way, I had to tweak the new, old stock, Lee bullet molds that I got for $5 too. I bought all of them I could.

[mkk41]

Aside from poorly/cheaply designed , I don't like that ya have to readjust them every time because the cheap set rings don't lock and the o-ring they try to use as a 'friction lock' on the die body , give a false feel when screwed down in the press. I have split and set-screw ring equipped dies that I haven't had to readjust in 25yrs. They use low quality steel. Might be a mid to high carbon , but definately a low chromium contest as they seem to rust very quickly from humidity. Way faster than RCBS.

Lots of good second hand dies on Ebay and gunstuff auction sites. Redding , Herters(made by Redding) , RCBS , Hornady/Pacific , Lyman , C-H.

Plus , no matter if you're the original or 10th owner , RCBS will polish , repair or replace any die , regardless of age.

[Jellybean]

mkk41, ...and not to mention all the aluminum parts and the poor machining on some internal parts, that's all reasons they are cheaper than their competition. And if anyone doubts your rust comments, I have some proof to back it up.

By the way, I've never had a need to send anything back to RCBS, new or used. I went green long before it was popular with all the liberals.

[kingranch]

The only thing I don’t like about Lee die sets are their shellholders. They seem to be oversized when it comes to holding brass in place and undersized when it comes to “clipping” in into the ram of the press like RC and Redding. They also have a tendency to spin around during reloading. No wonder they're giving them away for “free” with every set of their dies! As far as their aluminum locking rings and 0rings…that part I’ve never had any problem with and it works quite well…IMO.

[mkk41]

Redding shellholders are about the same size as RCBS , and they're finely knurled on the OD. Nice feature.

[mkk41]

Not to bash on Lee products too harshly. They do well for their low cost. I've been using an original Auto-Prime since they first came out. Broke 2 levers , but they replaced them. I still like it better than any that have come along since.

[kingranch]

Originally Posted by mkk41

... I've been using an original Auto-Prime since they first came out...

I, too, been using it since 15 years or so. Not only using it as intended but also using it as a flip tray! Must've been thousands and thousands of primers loaded into a primer pickup tubes so far and still going strong! Never broke a thing on it including the see thru plastic cover despite all that poking with the pickup tubes.

[Jellybean]

Originally Posted by mkk41

Not to bash on Lee products too harshly.

I'm sure not many agree with me, but there is a big difference between bashing and giving an honest opinion or evaluation.

[Engineer1911]

Oncce I learned, the best improvement for Lee rifle dies is an RCBS die set. Recycle or trash the lee dies.