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  #1  
Old 09-24-2011, 10:31 AM
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Default .357 load for wild hog hunting?

Hello all-
I've never hunted with a handgun before, but may start this year. We have an overabundance of wild hogs which are nuisance animals, to say the least. Will a 357 load in a M686-3 with a 4" barrel be adequate for wild pigs? I've read they are very difficult to bring down. If so, I'd like some recommendations as to bullet type, weight, and powder charges (preferably Unique or W231). Commentary as to why a recommendation is made is very welcome (ie. cast bullet vs. jacketed bullet, etc.). I want to be safe, and be an ethical hunter as well. Thanks in advance!! Texasjarhead.
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Old 09-24-2011, 10:58 AM
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you need a bigger boat. you can kill a hog with a .357 if everything is right. most people i know use rifles for a reason. hogs are tough & can be dangerous. if thats all you have use a good bullet, 180 xtp's come to mind. hth.
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Old 09-24-2011, 10:59 AM
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I'm no big fan of hardcast bullets. They punch a tiny little hole, don't do much tissue damage, and the animal has to bleed out through that small hole which can take a while. Not a whole lot more effective than an arrow.

But, this is perhaps the one case where I would consider them, seeing that hogs have a thick gristle pad that you have to get through to reach some vitals. I don't see the .357 as a great 'bone breaker', but if anything will break a bone, a hardcast will. The usual for the .357 is 180 grain.

Try some other stuff too (like Hornady XTP), and let us know how it works!
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Old 09-24-2011, 11:17 AM
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There's several factors here: how big are the hogs, what kind of attitude do they have, what's the range and what's the realistic range that you're accurate (4-6 inch groups)with your pistol and the loads-from a realistic shooting position? Your ability to shoot groups from a bench don't matter unless you cart said bench into the field and shoot from it.

I don't think you're going to get satisfactory hunting loads with either Unique or 231, but the edge would have to go to Unique. 100 odd pound Javalinas are an entirely different matter from 200+ pound feral hogs. If I just had to give this a try, I think I'd be looking at bullets from 170-200 grains. Elmer Keith designed 173 grain.357 bullets for a reason. And practice, practice, practice and more practice.
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Old 09-24-2011, 02:54 PM
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Sometimes I wonder about how many hogs have been killed to form some opinions. Most of the hogs in Texas are just feral hogs and aren't any harder to kill than what was killed for eating purposes on the farm. Most of them were dispatched with a .22 short.

A cast bullet in a .30-30 is sufficient to do the job and so is 00 buckshot. I think I've killed the last three with 00 buck around midnight, when visibility was less than optimal. This hog was killed by three 00 pellets in the area behind the ribs to the hams (aft of where the 870 is).



He ran about 40 yards and was found as in the picture.

BTW, to answer your question about a .357 load, a Keith 170 LSWC should be more than enough to do the job, but you could always just use a knife, like they do in Mississippi!

Last edited by Paul5388; 09-24-2011 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 09-24-2011, 05:23 PM
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Good feedback from all. Paul-I'm only a few counties away from you, and your comments and picture were very timely.

Thanks to all!
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Old 09-24-2011, 06:14 PM
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IMO using a short barrel .357 Magnum revolver on wild hogs is ill advised. (and I really like the .357 Magnum for most jobs) BUT, if you were to use one I would suggest a 180gr WFNGC Cast Performance bullet over a stiff charge of W296 or Lil'Gun. That bullet will punch through a hog fairly well...
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Old 09-24-2011, 07:32 PM
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Pig Hunting from a Helicopter [[[ Music by JAG Camp ]]] - YouTube

I presume this is buckshot. Seems very effective, but the hogs don't seem huge. Probably more effective when fired from above? You don't have a helicopter, do you?

Last edited by off road; 09-24-2011 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 09-24-2011, 08:34 PM
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That's not as easy as it looks. I've seen that video before but it's still fun to watch again...
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Old 09-24-2011, 08:59 PM
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i too hunt boars...and would not even consider a 357...i use a 500 and 44 mag.a hotly loaded 41 mag.would be my minimum...
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Old 09-24-2011, 09:33 PM
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These were done in with a 12 gauge and bird shot.



And another buckshot pig.



And another buckshot pig.



All of these buckshot pigs were killed in my front yard.

These were killed with either cast in .30-30 at about 1500 fps or reduced loads in .243.



A cast .30-30 150 gr at 1500 fps doesn't have as much energy as a 170 gr Keith at 1420 fps.
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Old 09-24-2011, 11:15 PM
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Okay, we are possibly talking about two different animals here folks so, let us clarify.

Feral pigs are not the same as wild boar. The wild boar hunting that goes on is usually on a ranch of some kind and you are shooting at, well, most of the time, Russian hogs. Russian hogs are not that hard to kill either BUT, large, mature boars can have a tough "plate" around the neck to front leg area. It is there to protect them from deep cuts during fights with other boar.

Feral pigs may not have that same "plate" and hey, there are girls that crawl up on them and stick them with knives. How hard can it be?

I have been on two hog hunts. On either hunt, my 44Mag Marlin worked just fine. The first one was shot on the run, at 40 yards, going from my right to left. Kind of natural, really. Dropped right there. 250lb sow. Son #2 took one with a 30/06 and so did the wife. They too, DRT.

Second hunt, same type of rifle, Hornady 240gr XTP @ 1800fps. Shot long ways through a 150lb wild pig from in front of left shoulder through to right rear leg. Oh, it was about 50 yards or so, but it completely destroyed the rear quarter of the animal.

So, not too hard to kill. If you are going for ones over 200lbs and you aren't sure what kind of shot you are going to get, take a rifle. A good handgun cartridge carbine, like Paul uses in 357Mag or one like my Marlin or Ruger in 44Mag will work just fine. Kills the animal dead, while some may not care because they are pest, I do. I want a clean kill. No sense in anything suffering even if you don't eat it.

We are planning on another trip soon, maybe early next year. If we do, I will post pictures and relay the story so we all can enjoy it. Do a search of this section of the forum too, I have other threads about my previous hunts.

Lots of fun, stalking them is a rush. Wife went on the second hunt with me too. She is my best friend and hunting "buddy".
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Old 09-24-2011, 11:51 PM
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As far as I know, you can tell what it has been mixed with by the color. Some degree of Russian will tend to make a dark, almost black pig. The lighter colors are just feral hogs. Of course, I believe the OP was talking about Texas pigs, not some other part of the world. So, I believe there's some validity to what I have experienced with less than powerful loads.

#1 son said today that there are some rootings in the upper end of the pond, where the water isn't anymore. The lack of rain has dried things up pretty severely, so most sightings will probably be closer to a water source.

I'm pretty sure a 170 gr Keith will shoot from stem to stern on most hogs encountered around here, but it'll probably need to be a little hotter than what most people are shooting for .357 Mag, i.e above 1300 fps.
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Old 09-25-2011, 12:12 AM
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I do not know about russian. But I can testify that in Florida a 180gr JSP from a 686 will put down a feral pig if shot in the breadbasket. I have seen 158gr HPs flatten and fail to effectively penetrate when striking the shoulder blade or skull at an angle.

However I'm sure they grow 'em bigger in Texas
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Old 09-25-2011, 01:16 AM
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I don't suppose anyone said anything about Texas hogs being bigger, but they sure must be more plentiful.
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Old 09-25-2011, 07:26 AM
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Texas is an oddity as far as hogs go. Seems to be a two edged sword with their problem. It is a BIG industry and a BIG pain in the neck, from what I have heard. I have followed it some on the net. Some want them gone, some want them there for the sport and money it brings in.

Paul, what I was talking about wasn't necessarily the feral hogs of Texas. There are lots of folks that go to ranches, even in Texas, where they raise Russian boar for sport. Some folks are talking about what they need to take those and they are much different than the normal feral pig.

A domestic pig can become completely feral in a very short time, months if I remember correctly. Then, with litters upwards of 6 to 8, can propagate pretty quickly. Like I said earlier though, being humane is a big point with me. I want enough gun to take one cleanly. This really depends on your skill level, hunting abilities and basic competency with your firearm.
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Old 09-25-2011, 08:01 AM
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If your intent is to kill them because they are a nuisance or to eat (yumm) rather than handgun hunt them for the sport, and a 357 Mag is what you want to use, I think a Marlin lever action in 357 Mag would be ideal. A good heavy for caliber (170gr+) hardcast WFNGC bullet loaded with a full charge of Lil'Gun or WW296 would be just dandy. Plenty of penetration and wound channel power there, with lots of velocity gain over the 4" revolver. Plus greater hit potential in the right area. No doubt a 4" 686 will work with the right load, circumstances and skill on the part of the hunter, but the other is likely more effective. Besides, if you are going to use a handgun against wild hogs, it should be a single action! It is Texas afterall, so if it ain't a levergun, a single action gets there in style.

(e/t/a -- I would add though that if you do try a Marlin 1894, or a Win 94 or Browning 92 for that matter, be mindful of cartridge OAL if using 357 Mag with heavy for caliber bullets in it. Some will not feed well. No such trouble with a 686, or even better a Model 27!)
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Old 09-25-2011, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAdoublegunner View Post
Besides, if you are going to use a handgun against wild hogs, it should be a single action! It is Texas afterall, so if it ain't a levergun, a single action gets there in style.
Ahhhhh, how refreshing to have a like minded fellow come along!
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Old 09-25-2011, 10:27 AM
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Thanks again to all. This has been a most interesting as well as informative discussion. I'm not positive, but I believe my part of Texas has the feral, escaped domestic pigs AND some Russian boars which were introduced in the 1950's. Since it's better to be safe than sorry, and an ethical hunter, I believe my best bet based on all the comments is to use my Model 94 Winchester as my primary, and my Smith 686 as my backup. Better to have too much than not enough.
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Old 09-25-2011, 12:53 PM
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Texas, if you need any help, let me know. I will gather up the platoon, (the wife and I) and be right down!

Well, after about a 20 hour drive that is!

Semper Fi!
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Old 09-25-2011, 01:10 PM
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Not to sidetrack this discussion, but I am very interested since we have been talking about going to Ga and hog hunting with my nephew who moved there.

I was thinking of picking up a model 29 for this. (I have always wanted one, so this is just the excuse). Sounds like it is enough gun if properly loaded.

My question, though, is the meat worth eating or is particularly gamey? If you do eat them, do you typically smoke the bacon, hams etc or eat it as is?

TD
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Old 09-25-2011, 03:58 PM
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TD,
The meat taste is area specific. Just like our deer here in Northern Indiana. They are grain fed and there is no gamey taste at all. Go into the backwoods of Northern Minnesota, different story.

We have harvested several and I will tell you this, the wilder they are, the more they eat naturally from the woods, the gamier they taste. From the ones in Oklahoma, which were on a feeding system and ate mostly corn, to the ones in Tennessee, that ate grubs and acorns and such, there was a world of difference in taste.

To be honest, we have them all ground up into sausage with a mild seasoning and everything is good. Never smoked the bacon or hams.

It will depend on what you want from your hogs though. You can have it made into anything you want.

Have fun though!

Don't believe what you hear about them though. They are smart, can see well and have a nose like a blood hound. Working them on the stalk can be a ton of fun!

Be safe though! Have fun!
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Old 09-25-2011, 06:00 PM
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A revolver w/4" bbl would be adequate but not ideal.

The first feral pig I ever shot took two hits from a 308 to stay down permanently. Kind of made me skittish and the next time I wondered if I needed a bigger rifle . Fortunately, about two years later a friend convinced me to try feral pig with a Marlin in 357 magnum. I had a blast and went out afterwards and bought an 1894C. I hunted pigs with that Marlin until California went soft on the condor. After I figure out a good load for the 140 gr Barnes, I'll probably use it again.
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Old 09-25-2011, 08:26 PM
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I feel a .357 or .44 Magnum levergun is the perfect cure for a hog/pig hunt. It's fast on running game, holds a lot of rounds and it's short for in the woods. What's not to like?
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Old 09-26-2011, 03:51 PM
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I killed my one and only hog earlier this year. I used a 240 gr. SWC with a stiff charge of 2400 in my Mountain Gun (the Elmer Keith load). A friend used his Guide Gun with my .45-70 heavy handloads and a .45 Colt Blackhawk with my heavy LBT handloads. All bullets completely penetrated the 300 lb. hogs. Another party was using Winchester 12 gauge 3" magnum slugs which failed to completely penetrate the head and neck with two shots (the slugs were too soft for the velocity) but did get the job done. The most instant kill was actually with an AK-47 using heavy steel jacketed Russian softpoints which I suspect were not so soft after all. One round behind the shoulder completely penetrated and dropped it instantly. If you can put a good .357 bullet where it needs to go, it will get the job done.

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Old 09-26-2011, 04:01 PM
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I was really thinking about switching from buckshot to a .50 BMG Barrett. Got to have something that will penetrate the armor plated hogs you know.
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Old 09-26-2011, 04:43 PM
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I've not killed many hogs, but I can tell you that they are not all that hard to kill, assuming good bullet placement. A .357 may not be optimum, but it will kill them. About a year ago, I worked up a .357 load for my Marlin 1894 carbine, using WW296 powder (same as H110) and 187gr. gas check hardcast bullet from Cast Performance. My load runs 1914 fps. from the carbine, and 1542 fps. from a 6" Ruger Security Six. It is a handful to shoot from a handgun, but it will poke holes through hogs efficiently. I would NOT recommend shooting this load from a K-frame, but L and N frames and Rugers should be fine. Keep in mind, a cast bullet can be run faster than a jacketed bullet of the same weight without getting excessive pressure.
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Old 09-26-2011, 09:56 PM
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Honestly, some of you guys spend too much time behind a keyboard and not enough time hunting hogs. We shoot them here with whatever is at hand. Shot a nice sow with a .17 HMR while squirrel hunting. One shot to the ear flap and she was doing the Curley Shuffle. We hunt squirrels here with a .22 magnum or the .17 so if a hog walks by we can ear hole him.

The problem most folks have is they shoot them behind the shoulder. Nothing back there but a little lung and lots of guts. Hogs should be head shot anyplace from the ear to the base of their neck.

First wild hog I ever killed I shot with a .40 S&W Glock 23. One shot at about 35 yards and it was over. Some cheapy FMJ practice ammo if I remember correctly. Hit him where his neck meets his shoulders. I usually carry a .44 Special, but a good .357 would be fine. Any load, they are not hard to kill if head shot. I'd shoot one with my Super .38 if I came across one while carrying it. Sometimes I carry my Marlin Camp Nine in 9mm and don't feel undergunned at close range.

I guess if I was wanting to choose a specific load for the .357 to hog hunt with, I'd load 158 XTP's over a honking charge of H-110 or 2400 and try that. I just bought some 124 gr. HP/XTP's to load in my Super for the upcoming deer season. We usually kill lots of hogs while deer hunting and this is what I think I'm going to try.
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:53 PM
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This is the exit wound from a 240gr XTP from a Marlin 1894 @ about 1800fps (give or take 50fps) fired from about 50 yards away. The entrance hole was, and I say, was, the right eye.

This one didn't move except to do the "curly shuffle" as well.
I understand there is a hog problem in Texas. I understand that folks just want to kill them, they don't care how or how humane. Okay, and I'm not a tree hugger or anything like that but, still, I want to have a clean kill. I think that is what hunters are all about. Being humane while taking game. I want enough gun/bullet/velocity to make that happen.

If you go below this line, you are going to see blood and gore. Just wanted to warn you!












These were a bit bigger. Still, my sow was taken with a Marlin 1894 too, it just wasn't mine! I borrowed this one then bought my own!
This time though, the hog was running right to left @ 40 yards, I shot offhand and the projectile was a 250gr H&G #503 powered by a healthy charge of WC820, a military surplus powder, still about 1800fps. It hit right behind the shoulder, where their kill zone is, and it dropped, dead right there. Son #2, in the photograph too, shot his with a .30-06 and it dropped right there too.
Shot in about 30ft from one another.

Here:



FWIW

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Old 09-26-2011, 11:51 PM
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Maybe there's a need for some hog anatomy? WILD BOAR ANATOMY, HUNTING WILD BOAR TEXAS, TEXAS HOG HUNTING HEART LUNG SHOT PLACEMNET
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Old 09-27-2011, 05:16 AM
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Are you trying to tell me that none of the shots administered by us in the pictures above were really "kill" shots? Them puppies are in the freezer Paul! (Well, they used to be anyway! )
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Old 09-27-2011, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
It is widely understood or rather misunderstood that a wild boar is some sort of super armored beast that is almost impossible to kill. Amazing campfire stories are told and repeated of how well placed shots on the beast fail to bring them down. It's not that the animals are so tough, rather, the kill zone is so small! ... SO PLACING A SHOT BEHIND THE SHOULDER INTO THE RIB CAGE WILL NOT HIT THE HEART LUNG AREA (PUMP STATION)! SHOTS MUST BE PLACED INTO THE MID SHOULDER REGION OR NECK (neck shot is only for high powered rifles.
That's just to ensure you get your humane kill. I'm still just for extermination, so wherever it's hit is good!
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Old 09-27-2011, 10:21 AM
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As a biologist who partially paid for grad school by guiding on California pigs (seen over 100 shot, maybe 200)., let me throw out some biology and experience:
1. Pigs and boars are the same animals with 36, 37, or 38 chromosomes. The difference is caused by a long chromosome breaking and the "sticky ends" (an actual biological term) staying together.
2. Pigs and bears are not closely related. This is based on molar shape. Pig and bear molars have 4 cusps (bucodont)==same as humans do. Evolved to handle an omnivorous diet.
3. Pigs will develop traits of boars within 2 generations but not in "months". Traits include gristle shield around the shoulders, striped young, "razor-back".

4. A pig's heart and lungs are lower in the body than a deer. A normal heart shot MAY hit the vessels above the heart. Also, muscle and fat above the spine may be misleading as will the ridge of hair that they develop.

Experience:
Have seen pigs shot with everything from 22 rimfire to 45-70 and .458. The 45-70 got away (see #4 above-bullet hit the top pf a process on the spine, stunning the animal for about 15 minutes).

The only animal I wounded and ever lost was a sow about 150-175 pounds. Got her in the liver (left a 4" square piece on the ground) with a 300 Win mag. My only excuse was it was a 300 yd running shot and I was comfortable making those at that time. She was in the open. We tracked her 1/2 mile (finding a piece of intestine and lots of blood) through heavy brush and then the trail stop.

Saw a boar with both front legs shot off by a poacher and healed. Saw another with a poacher's arrow in his liver. Watched him stumble across a barley field. Rancher watched him for several weeks. He lived. We've cleaned two with old bullets in their legs that broke the bone and one with a healed broadhead in it (all wrapped up in cartilage). So, not all are poor shots. They are tough. We listened to one fight off a pack of wild dogs one night.

Guns: I recommended a 270 or better=maybe a 25-06 if I knew the hunter was a good shot and we expected to catch the hogs in the open. GOOD QUALITY bullets that retain weight-I used 180 gr Noslers in my 300. Good old 30-06 can't be beat.

Handguns: Having killed maybe 2 dozen, excluding "mercy shots" with handguns: here's my recommendation: .41 magnum, solid, hard cast lead (the 41 seems to penetrate better than a 44). I would probably use a Blackhawk 45 Colt with heavy (300 gr) hardcast, myself. Stay away from hollow points unless hunting for the larder (100 pounds or so). I've twice seen 44 mag 240gr hollow points bounce off a pig's skull. As I write this I have a 180 gr 45 acp load that looks unfired except for rifling grooves and hair stuck in the tip. I shot that one and it went almost completely through a 180 pounder that then tried to eat me. A hardball to the skull dropped him.

Personal use of 357 magnum. I used it on two hogs.The first was a 120 pound boar. My biggest sow, the second, was shot once with a 300 mag (She pivoted as I fired and we took the left rear leg almost completely off), one in the gut with a 357, I then put 5 from the 357 just behind her ear (left a major bruise under the skin). She turned to go after me and as she ran by, my buddy put a 300 mag in her ear. All shots except the first were at under 10 feet. She weighed out at 260 pounds on a cattle scale. I was using a Ruger GP-100 with a 4" barrel and 180 grain handloads with silhouette bullets (exposed, crimped lead at the tip).

Conversely my two largest hogs (a 235 lb 3.5" tusker and a 180 lb, with 4.25" tusks both dropped to one shot=a 180 Nosler through the lungs).

There's my 2 cents for what's it worth==take it or leave it.

Incidentally, I originally wanted to do my MS thesis on wild pig social structure.

Last edited by BearBio; 09-27-2011 at 10:24 AM.
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Old 09-27-2011, 10:40 AM
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I hunt them from tree stands and shoot them in the head with a .357 loaded with 180 grain hard cast gas checked slugs and they drop in their tracks. We keep the backstraps and grind the rest. They really have become a nuisance in some states.

If you grew up on a farm like I did you know that a .22 can kill anything that you butcher for meat, nothing complicated about it, like LC 92 pointed out, "ear shots" with just about any caliber gun will put em down, usually without even the curly shuffle.....
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Old 09-27-2011, 11:52 AM
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Since we're discussing Texas hogs, it might be good to look at this thread on Texas Boars TEXASBOARS.COM :: View topic - VIDEO - HYPER-VELOCITY ROUNDS - WHAT LOAD TO CHOOSE The videos, a pretty good ways down on the page, may help dispel some of the myths of bullets for hog hunting. They do seem to prefer rifles, with some using .300 Win Mags.
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Old 09-27-2011, 01:54 PM
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This may be a rhetorical question but, why would anyone want to kill an animal inhumanely? I get the extermination part but even a rabbit deserves to go quickly or a Texas hare for that matter.

Ever used a 12ga with #9 shot for mouse?


Even rabid dogs deserve to go quickly in my opinion and it gives the firearms junky a reason to get another gun!
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Old 09-27-2011, 02:48 PM
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Yep, I always try for a direct humane hit on roaches, that's why I use Black Flag Insecticide (This stuff just kills me!)
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Old 09-27-2011, 04:39 PM
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One has to take this all with a grain of salt! For instance, a 300 mag is fine if you are in wide open country and your shots are long, but if you are shooting at close range it would be ridiculous.

For me, if I hunt anything at all, I want to do it with a handgun. If it's out of handgun range....well then I had better work on my stalking skills!
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Old 09-27-2011, 04:51 PM
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I have never shot at a hog but this is a very interesting thread. It would seem that a hog is some kind of armored pig and you really need an anti-tank gun to kill one. Yet other posters say a 22LR inside the ear canal will work. I'm confused, but this sure is entertaining! I carry a GP-100 as a woods gun with 125gr JHPs from Black Hills, but it's not for hunting. It just seems that if a .357 will go through a drivers side door, then through a passenger side door but won't go through a hog??? It makes my head hurt thinking about it.

Last edited by Will Carry; 09-27-2011 at 07:58 PM.
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Old 09-27-2011, 05:37 PM
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There were a lot of buffalo killed with .45-70s. I don't think a hog is anywhere close to the same category and I don't think there will any shortage of hogs in the near future (unless the now legal helicopter hunts do it).
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Old 09-27-2011, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Paul5388 View Post
Yep, I always try for a direct humane hit on roaches, that's why I use Black Flag Insecticide (This stuff just kills me!)
Um, Paul, um, well, I don't know just how to say this but.......if Black Flag kills you, then you have the nozzle pointed the wrong way!

As the vernacular of the day would state: "Just sayin' "
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Old 09-27-2011, 07:02 PM
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I haven't had a TV since 1975, but there was a Black Flag commercial in that time period that had a dying cockroach saying,"This stuff just kills me!", as a selling point for killing cucarachas.
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Old 09-27-2011, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ArchAngelCD View Post
IMO using a short barrel .357 Magnum revolver on wild hogs is ill advised. (and I really like the .357 Magnum for most jobs) BUT, if you were to use one I would suggest a 180gr WFNGC Cast Performance bullet over a stiff charge of W296 or Lil'Gun. That bullet will punch through a hog fairly well...
I gotta agree, AACD. I killed a 300lb boar w/ my 8" Colt Python. You DEFINITELY need a hardcast solid to penetrate and break bones. If I hunt boar again, I'll be totin' either my .44 Magnum or my .45 Colt S&W Mountain Gun, loaded with the heaviest hardcast bullets that I can find.......
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Old 09-27-2011, 07:34 PM
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I haven't had a TV since 1975, but there was a Black Flag commercial in that time period that had a dying cockroach saying,"This stuff just kills me!", as a selling point for killing cucarachas.
Well, praise God! I haven't had one since I was that age too! It just so happens to be like, 1985! Old timer! That's when I was your age, 10 years after you were that age! If you get my joke! (Raised 5 kids without a boob tube!)

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Old 09-27-2011, 07:37 PM
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And here I was, thinking 125 gr Sierra JHCs should do the job just fine. I just need to find a hog that's willing to let me experiment on it.
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Old 09-28-2011, 09:31 AM
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I'm not worried about what will kill em, when in the woods with em, I want a gun/load combo that will STOP em, I don't care if it kills them or not.
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Old 09-28-2011, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Fkimble View Post
I'm not worried about what will kill em, when in the woods with em, I want a gun/load combo that will STOP em, I don't care if it kills them or not.
If one attacks you, it ain't gonna stop until you kill it.......
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