I've been shooting & reloading for right on three years now. Generally 2 or 3 sessions a month. I shoot mostly moly coated "black" bullets & plated. Had my checkup recently & had them run my blood for lead.

Doc called last week. Said not to worry about it. Level was "normal."

Got a package from the health dept. today that said my level was 18ug/Dl (micrograms/deciliter). Did some research & found that 25ug/Dl was enough for an "occupational incident" and that 2ug/Dl was "normal." I'm not really impressed with my doctor.

I always thought I was fairly careful but after this wakeup call I gave it some serious thought.

OK.
1. No more brass tumbling indoors. It makes a dusty mess that I'm pretty sure isn't good.

2. I usually wear blue nitrile gloves when reloading, handling dirty brass & when emptying cleaned brass. That will now be "ALWAYS." And a mask while dumping media out of the cases.

3. No more shorts at the indoor range. My knees are usually black from policing my brass. I'm sure that black dust has a goodly amount of lead in it.

4. Gloves for policing brass. I'm a sweeper & scooper. My hands are usually black after a session. I always wash immediately after but pretty sure I'm absorbing some.

5. Range clothes go right in the washer.

Anybody have other suggestions? Thoughts?

Shoot outdoor ranges.

I have a buddy that shot indoors regularly and ended up with too much lead in his system. (Two of his friends as well.) The air filtration system didn't work properly.

The overload is temporary, but it could have long term effects, he's fine now and no longer shoots indoor unless he has to, even then, it's only once in a blue moon.

I started working with lead in 1979 as a cable splicer. We worked mainly on lead sheathed cables, made splice cases, soldered them closed with acetylene torches in manholes, splice pits (holes in the ground) and aerial platforms. Many times we had to 'card off' the oxidation from old lead cables that had sat in manholes or the ground for decades. I've been shooting since I was 5, reloading since I was 20 and casting bullets since I was 30, I'm 51 now.
The last time i had my lead levels checked was about 4 years ago, they were completely normal.
You really don't have to get too worked up about lead exposure if you use common sense, don't hang your head over the lead pot, shoot in a well ventilated area, wash your hands after handling lead. It's that simple. Lead has to be ingested either by breathing or swallowing food contaminated by your dirty hands. You are in greater danger driving to the range than you are by casting or reloading.
Don't cast indoors and I avoid indoor ranges is some more good advice.
Having said that I have to admit I have known two people over the years who had severe lead poisoning, one cast bullets in his basement for about 20 years and the other was a commercial caster who also did it indoors. The treatment for it did not sound good at all, so it can happen, but using basic common sense it's just something you don't need to worry about.
RD

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Got a Phd from Hard Knocks U

"I have a buddy that shot indoors regularly and ended up with too much lead in his system."

Primers can put lead in the air, and yes the dust from your tumble is another rich source.
Good old vitamin C has been shone to reduce blood Pb levels, it couldn't hurt so it maybe a good maintenance plan. I'm not saying it will cure lead poisoning.

Shooting indoors is probably one of the worst culprits, but I made a personal decision a long time ago to purchase cast bullets rather than to cast them myself, just for this very reason. I monitor my lead level and for the most part it seems to always stay at the high end of normal (just under 10) but from time to time it has increased to as much as 14. Not an alarming number, but I need to start going to the outdoor range more than I go to the indoor one. Our indoor Range does not have adequate ventilation as I have recently come to find out the hard way.

Chief38

First, get some Escatech Dlead hand soap.
Second, I now wear 3M N100 respirators while shooting at our very poorly ventilated indoor range.

My level was 46 this fall, first time I've been tested in 3 years also. I'm going to get retested in April or May.

I've tested twice in the last 10 years. Both times it was "zero".....but I have an outdoor range, and follow some of the basic handling/washing/don't eat with lead on your fingers hints.

So far so good.

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Dum vivimus Vivamas

Because of this issue I've started wearing disposable gloves while picking brass and reloading. I use Citric Acid for cleaning brass. I also carry mini wipes for cleaning my hands after shooting (outdoor range only). Good information. An ounce of prevention....

Prevention is the best cure, and my bi-annual lead level tests always come back at next to nothing, so I must be doing things pretty close to right.

I shoot mostly revolvers these days, so I eject my fired brass into coffee cans at the outdoor range.
When I fire one of the four pistols I still have in my collection, I wear exam gloves when I pick up the brass.
In either case, I carry Esca-Tech D-Lead wet/dry hand cleaner in my range bag and clean my hands after packing up my stuff and again after putting it in the the car.
https://www.esca-tech.com/ProductDet...ductnum=4455ES

My fired brass is stored in fairly well sealed plastic coffee cans until I get around to preparing it for reloading.
My first reloading step is washing the brass. This gets rid of most, if not all, of the lead residue.
Basically, I avoid touching lead contaminated brass.

The brass is, or is almost, lead free when it goes into the tumbler, but I add polish and dryer sheets to the media, which, among other things, keeps the dust to a minimum.

I do handle lead bullets with my bare hands while reloading, but use the D-Lead hand cleaner before taking a break and wash them thoroughly when I'm finished reloading.
If the lead levels in my blood was an issue, I'd use gloves, but it isn't and I prefer to be able to feel what my fingers are doing. YMMV.

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Age + Treachery = JohnnieB

Fishslayer was the recipient of 1000 of my lead Mastercast bullets this week. Since my first blood lead check showed an unbelieveable level of 44 ug/dl. This after only 2 years of shooting and 1 year of reloading. A review of my hygenic and operational procedures has shown me how improvements can be made very easily. What I've decided to do is:

Started 1000 units Vitamin C immediately

No shooting or reloading for 3 months (that won't be easy) then retest.

When I do start again, No more tumbling inside the garage, it's all moved outside.

No more brass separation by dumping the mix over an open caldron and bucket. Bought a Cabela's media separator for $0 using my Club points.

No more depriming on the Lee press prior to tumbling. The Lee works just fine, but there is always that black dust left around the press area and the spent primers collecting in an open tupperware. Depriming will be done on the LNL AP as the tube goes right up to the bottom of the case. Spent primers are directed to a water filled milk jug, so no dust anymore.

Start wearing gloves during all reloading operations, really didn't do this before.

Bought a HEPA respirator for all home based reloading activities.

Bought the D-Lead soap and wipes, wiped down my entire reloading area with the wipes.

Make sure I don't go back into the house with any shirt/pants/socks that I wore reloading.

Swore off lead bullets for the time being. Have lots of Berry's and will be buying Precision and/or Precision Delta at least for the near future.

Make sure I get a lane at the range with positive ventilation and wear a mask. Like Fishslayer, wear gloves at the range. Talked to them about this last week.

Other things I am considering include moving to ultrasonic or Thumlers with steel pins, lead free primers ($$$ and only available in small pistol), at least that way there's no dust to deal with.

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S&W15-22 RIA 1911
CZ75B SR9

Sweeping up on an indoor range is a major souce of airbourne contamination being breathed in, so much so that some indoor ranges forbid customers doing it. Range cleanup should be done while wearing a gas mask, not a little "painter's mask."
Your lungs are perfect absorbers and should be protected from lead salts and finely divided lead.

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Science plus Art

My lead level is high as well. I found out about 2 months ago.Most shooters/reloaders probably have an elevated lead level and dont know it. It doesnt show signs until you have it bad.

My level is 21.7 it is up from 18 months ago at 8. From all the reading and talking to the doctor normal is below 20. Most adults have below 10. They prefer it under 10. At 25-30 they want to send you to a specialist to lower your lead levels.

I have traced it back to tumbling brass. I will be retested in april. I have gone shooting once since then and wore a mask. I have not reloaded and wont until april and only if my levels go down.

I have though about this long and hard and this is what I will probably do:

Only outdoor shooting for me

1. No more tumbling brass
2. Liquid tumbling if I prep my brass
3. Buy preped brass 308 and 223
4. shoot surplus for plinking
5. Buy loaded pistol ammo
6. If I cant buy loaded pistol ammo buy plated or copper projectiles
7. Hand wipes in the shooting bag
9. Gloves while shooting and picking up brass
10. Wear a mask and apron while shooting/reloading/and handling brass
11. Cloths should not go in the washer with other family members cloths
12. wash your reloading bench with a wet rag and toss it
13. liquid swiffer the floor

The problem is the dust. That can sneak up on you.

Alfalfa is suppose to clean the blood. I have been eating it for 2 months with multi vitamins. The Alfalfa cleans metals from the blood, kidneys and liver.


http://www.dewsworld.com/Fherb_Alfalfa.html

http://www.dietsite.com/dt/Alternati...bs/alfalfa.htm

I thought I was being very careful and when I found out I was pissed.

Good luck

32 whatevers several years ago when shooting competition indoors every week with a practice session during it as well.

Economy dropped like a rock in 2008 and that cut out a bunch of shooting. Not so much for me, but others lost jobs and dropped out.

I shot some lead but mostly plated indoors. Still, every primer has lead in the compound and that cloud of smoke around you when you shoot rapid fire is absorbed into your lungs pretty well. If you leave the indoor range with a "sweetish" taste in your mouth, that means you got at least some exposure.


Last time my blood was checked it was down to 20 whatevers. I was supposed to have it checked at the last physical but something happened at the doc's so..............

p.s. I was still casting while it was falling, by the way, so I am pretty sure that wasn't the issue in it getting up in the first point.

Thanks for all the replies.

John, when we talked I hadn't received my package from the health dept. I was going by what my doctor told me. I may be seing another doctor next time. Those Master Cast will get loaded but be on the back burner till I find an outdoor range.

I think I'm going to be giving my brass a Lemi Shine rinse prior to tumbling. I tried it awhile back & decided it was too much a PITA. At the moment it seems a reasonable precaution. The Lemi Shine cleans really well but if left too long it can leach the copper (or is it the zinc?) out of the brass & weaken it.

I'm going to continue shooting indoors and see what the levels are in 6 months. If my brass handling precautions don't bring the levels down I guess I'll have to find an outdoor range.

EDIT: Are the DeLead soap & wipes significantly better than plain soap & water?

THe indoor range & the tumbling indoors is probably 90% of your problem. I shoot lead bullets almost exclusively, rarely indoors, less than 3x a year. My lead level last year was single digits. Stop those two things, eat more grapefruit & calcium & things will get better. BTW, I cast my own too, it's the indoor range.

calcium very good point. The body cant distinguish between lead and calcium. So if you are calcium deficient the body will absorb the lead looking for calcium. Eat spinach as well. It is a green leaf that cleans the blood and has calcium.

You dont want it to get into the bones. Then it is stored for many many years. Then if you break a bone or other factors it can be released in the blood again.



THe indoor range & the tumbling indoors is probably 90% of your problem
I agree with this. I would/am going liquid tumbling to make sure.

I try to stick with the simple idea that if I'm in a dust heavy operation like sweeping up or tumbling cases then I either set up enough of an air movement with fans and/or take it outside. I set up a box fan in the garage, open the garge door, and keep the dust blowing out. I also do the dryer sheet trick that cuts down a chunk of the dust created. If I'm sweeping and I don't see the dust cloud being active about moving out and away from me then I set up more fans or just stop.

I usually buy Winchester primers, but I have a few times now bought some lead free primers that I think were CCI. They seem to be pretty rare still. I think moving to the lead free primers is a better idea for all and once the market moves them into mass main production then they will cost roughly the same as standard lead cloud producing primers.

Indoor ranges... If you don't feel at least a gentle breeze from their air handling equipment then they are slacking or just don't care how much you or even they themselves are breathing into the lungs.

Read this


Lead Exposure in Adults - A Guide for Health Care Providers

This has a good feel for the situation

No, the chelation ingredient is EDTA. Any soap with this (most have it) will remove the lead.

Ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There is a really long thread sometime back on lead exposure. From what you have stated, it seems you main source of exposure is inhalation.(indoor range and tumbling) You are not going to absorb much through your hands and skin. Tumbling brass, especially with one that has a slotted top will spread dust everywhere. I taped mine with duct tape.

LEAD vs JACKETED (bullets) only the facts please

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Still Running Against the Wind

When my Cabela's tumbler died I replaced it with a Lyman. Was pretty surprised to see a slotted top on it. Makes zero sense to me. So I use it with the clear plastic cover from the Cabela's tumbler. Work fine.

I reload and I shoot about once a week at both indoor and outdoor ranges. I've never had my lead level tested but I know we're all exposed to toxins on a daily basis. There are countless chemicals and impurities in our air, water and food.
My family has been benefiting from whole-body nutritional cleansing for over a year and have noticeably improved our overall health. I don't worry as much about lead levels from my hobby knowing that I'm properly cleansing my body from the inside.

This is a very informative post. Just loaded up my tumbler this morning to clean another batch of brass. Have it in my basement, and am going to move it outside. Have a Lyman as well, and with the slotted top it still gets pretty dusty even with a couple cut up dryer sheets. I'll be moving this outside before I run it, hopefully it doesn't have a problem with cold weather--got down to "0" last night. I've got to get some gloves as well, I do immediately wash up after reloading, been using plated bullets so not as much lead exposure, but will be getting lead soon.

There is a lot of lead in the brass from the primers. Tape up the slots on the Lyman cover.(I called them about getting a solid top but noooo.)

It always amazes me why some folks(not you) are so "proud" they never change their tumbling media It is so full of nasty stuff and works so much better when new. It costs pennies.

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Still Running Against the Wind

Rule3, I agree with you on changing the media. I maybe get 2 uses out of a tumbler full of media. Amazed at people who haven't changed it after several. After 2 runs, the corn-cob media I am using is looks almost like coal. Will looking into sealing off the lid of my Lyman--wonder if cling-wrap would work better than tape? Will most certainly be putting mine outside when I run the next batch.

That's another one. I've already disposed of the media that's been in there...well... a looooong time. I use walnut for cleaning. The cob I use for polishing/delubing finished ammo I think is OK.

The walnut will be getting replaced often from now on. It's pretty cheap at the pet store.

I used black duct tape inside and out. It has held for years. I always tumble in the garage and empty it outside.

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Still Running Against the Wind

When I worked at a commercial reloading company we were tested periodically. I was always good, I loaded and ran bullet casting equipment. However, we had an employee who handled brass sorting including case inspection (decapping and swaging pockets). His level became elevated and he had to stop working until it returned to acceptable amount. It seems that airborn particles from primers are the most concern. A small amount of mineral spirits added to walnut media helps keep dust down to a minimum, probably keeps airborn lead down also.

Contaminate absorbtion will also vary quite a bit from person to person. Just like some get colds more readily than others. Seriously, the indoor shooting thing is a real deal killer for me. I have known guys that shoot every week indoors & have become quite sick. Wash your hands, don't eat, smoke or drink while reloading, stop shooting indoors, get some excersize & eat better, the lead poisoning thing is easily dealt with.

Fish -

You live in SD as do I. I would like to invite you to shoot at the SD Police Range on Home & Federal Blvd. It's outdoors, the line does not stop for breaks as there is a tunnel to the 25 yard line targets, it's a really cool range even in inclement weather as it has an over head roof....or during the hot months it's always breezy and it only cost $10 for the entire day to shoot! I know that some of the indoors are $15 an hour and up.

Most folks think that since it's called the SD Police Range that it's for the police only, it's not. The general public is welcome there. They also have classes if you're interested at all.

Been shooting there since the mid 70's. Fresh air, oh yeah!

I was waiting for my next Doctors visit to re-post in this thread.I just had my lead test again and it went down like a freakin submarine. Yea baby. I am back. LOL

When I got my first test it was 8 then I took the next test(14-18 months later) and it was 21.7. The Dr. was concerned because it showed I was exposed. I took my latest test less then a week ago( approx 3.5 months from 2nd test) and got my results back and it was 5.5.

I can say the things I did the most that affected the level to go down was:

1. Locate the source. The tumbling media/dust.

2. I ate a ton of Alfalfa sprouts everyday. This is suppose to clean the blood.

3. I ate spinach ( has calcium) and a dark green to cleanse blood.

4. I ate citrus for vitamin C

5. I took a multi vitamin

6. I took vitamin E

These are the things I did and they worked. Good luck!

Remember most adult Americans have less then 10.

20 and above is considered exposed. When you get into 30-40 and above damage and ch-elation therapy is needed.

With Kids they want no more then 4.9 because they are developing.

Lead also enters through the eyes. Those wearing contacts should clean them frequently or purchase daily disposables for use on "range" day.

Oh, and don't pick your nose!!!

Around here indoor ranges are about the only option if I want to shoot regularly. I take prophylactic measure such as Vitamin C (1000 mg/day) and Thiamine (75 mg/day). I also de-prime and wash my brass before tumbling. I never drink when reloading and I only drink from a closed container when at a range. I don't eat during or after either activity without a thorough hand washing.

Still, youse guys got me worried. I am going to have my lead levels checked with my blood work this year so I guess I'll know in a couple of weeks...

I would think in California all indoor ranges would be required to be lead free ammo?? check were you shoot and see what systems they have in place.
Our Sheriffs indoor range is state of the art and is mandated lead free, Another private range allows regular ammo but is positive airflow ventilation.

The supplements are all after the fact, if your range allows lead, then prevention is the only way to avoid it in your system. A hat (ball cap) and as lame as it may look, a lead approved respirator (all though that probably would not be an option)

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Still Running Against the Wind

Just got some interesting news myself and am looking for any information I can get.

Thank you all for sharing!!!

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But then, what do I know?

I belong to Bluecore Shooting Range in the Denver area.

"The entire range area is ventilated by a state of the art ventilation system. A range specific HVAC system replaces the every cubic inch of air every 90 seconds. A negative pressure is created, moving smoke and lead dust away from the firing line towards the back of the bullet trap area."
Yes that is a blurb from their website but it fits with this discussion. I try to shoot there once a week. Come by on a busy Saturday, the range will still smell as if it hasn't been used all day. Due to health reasons I have my lead checked every 3 months and its still less than 7. I do not have any financial interest in Bluecore but if you need a safe indoor range it is one of the best in the Denver area. They allow non-members as walk ins. They also have a 100 yd rifle range indoors.

I have been casting and reloading my own bullets for 43 years and my lead levels are normal. I wash thouroughly after every casting and reloading session. I also harvest lead from shooting ranges without any protection. Wash thouroughly is all I can say.

I really think alot of the issues with lead are overblown. My grandfather worked for National Lead in Tahawus, NY as did most of my family. One uncle worked there for 43 years and passed away this year at the ripe old age of 85. My grandmother used to tell us how every day she would be wiping the dust from the plant off of her window sill. None of the kids turned out with three heads or extra fingers. I remember growing up as a kid putting those lead split shot sinkers on with my teeth. I have been casting bullets for awhile and so far so good with my lead levels and my son's even though he is nowhere near the stuff but I take precautions. When my son was a year old my wife was concerned about his speech so we had him tested, this is done by our local county CPS. They asked alot of questions that if I had known about beforehand they would have been told to buzz off. They asked about lead, guns, me keeping ammo indoors, did I reload my own ammo etc. No questions about lead pain or chemicals, just lead ammo. Wheel weights are also banned in NY now so I have to have my tires balanced more because every mechanic I talk to say the new wheelweights don't work worth a darn compared to lead. Too much PC for too few problems. Is lead toxic, yes. But I do think alot of what we have heard has been blown out of proportion. If you take the proper precautions and don't overdo it you should be ok. I tumble away from everyone, shoot outdoors and have plenty of ventilation when I cast.

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Vaya con Dios

I work at a Nuclear Power Plant. The little bit of lead I'm exposed to while shooting, casting or reloading isn't of much concern!

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Chris
SWCA #2243 SWHF #292

One item that I don't recall seeing on this thread that somebody mentioned to me is;

Precautions when cleaning guns. When cleaning guns, the lead residue in the barrel(s) mixed with solvent may get absorbed into your skin (or lungs via fumes). I used to clean my guns bare-handed (cuz I'm so macho - just kidding) and then wash my hands afterward.

Now I'm wearing those special (solvent proof) gloves when I clean them.

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But then, what do I know?

First a thank you to all who contributed. Good information. I started shooting little over year ago almost exclusively indoors. Living in The OC it is indoors or nothing. I believe we all need to be aware of all the pollution around us, avoid what we can, and taking precautions suggested in this thread make sense. The range I use has positive air pressure system. I can feel it on my back. The targets move in the breeze but I don’t complain. Don’t reload yet but I pick up brass bare handed. Think I’ll start using gloves when handling spent brass. I wash my hands, face, and arms, if in short sleeves, after shooting and wear gloves while cleaning the guns.

High blood lead and shooting indoors is no joke. It was this very thread that got my attention a while ago re. this..

I started shooting indoors a year ago, once a week for 1-2 hours per session. My indoor range has all the requisite positive airflow, filtering, etc. I also have always been very careful; washing hands, not touching face, nose etc., wearing a hat, keeping range clothes separate and straight into the laundry, no eating/drinking etc.

Last May I asked my doc to do a lead level test, she was of the sort of mindset 'why would you ask for that' and I explained the sitch and said 'just humor me', so I had it done. Came back at 23.1, which to me is unacceptable. I stopped shooting there immediately, and just had a second blood draw last Thu, of which I'm awaiting the results, fingers crossed. I also joined a private club with outdoor ranges, no more indoors for me, I don't care how hot or cold it gets..

Now, I also began bugging the RO at my former indoor range, who's a friend, to go get his blood lead level tested. He just called me last night with his results, a 49.

I don't think that if you shoot outdoors and otherwise handle lead and your hygiene around it well this is an issue, but I'm now convinced that shooting indoors, even with all the precautions and state-of-art air handling, is a pretty bad idea. I also think that rimfire semi-auto blowback is about the worst as far as putting the stuff into your face regardless of the environment.

If you read up on the effects/damage of high blood lead level, it is not good. Some of it is irreversable. We face enough health challenges already, this is one you can largely avoid IMHO.

So, take care of yourselves, and always shoot safe all around..

Dave

Thought I would followup... Retested in May and the levels were down to 31 from 46. I continued to shoot my normal indoor practice and match schedule all winter. The only thing I changed was wearing the 3M N100 respirators, which were made for people performing lead abatement.

My blood lead level was tested in April and measured 25.1 *g/dL. That was enough to trigger a notice the the Health Department. My doctor was visibly upset over it but he told be that it was not high enough to be immediately dangerous. I will be retested in September or October.

Annie Oakley died of lead poisoning.

amazingflapjack,

So did John Dillinger, Bonnie/Clyde, and Baby Face Nelson.

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NRA Pistol/Rifle Inst. RSO

I carried lead air gun pellets in my mouth for years for fastest reload when I was a kid. Now that I am grown well at least old 56 I am more carful my job is very poisonious I work with fiberglass and spray paint on big boats for the last 30 years. I imagine lead is the least of my problems. I am still very healthy knock on wood.
Bob

I wanted to update this..

I just got my latest results back, I'm down to 14.7, and that's in just 57 days from the May test. The thing is, I've been spending more total hours shooting, firing more rounds, and handling more ammo in the last 2 months than I was in the 4 preceding months to the May test, all other factors remaining the same. The difference is that it's been all outside shooting over the last 2 months.

Next test is in October, I'm hoping for the same or better reduction. I'm convinced now that in my situation at least, it's from indoor shooting.

Dave

My first test came back at 35. I also got a strange look from the doc when I asked that my lead level be checked. The reason I did was that OSHA had visited my indoor range and made one of the guys that works there stay off the indoor range because his lead level was 31. Really don't understand how mine was 35 and I spent about 2-3 hours there about once a week and he works there every day of his life and his was only 31. Anyway, mine is down to 28 and I made a deal with the doc to not shoot indoors for a month. I will have it checked at the end of August to see what that's done. Looks like it's going to be outdoor shooting for me also. Who would have ever thunk it?

Read this page on the use o f vitamin C. The trick seems to be to reduce the absorption rather than increase the excretion.

Vitamin C (ascorbic acid) and lead levels

Guy-

Thanks, Guy.