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  #51  
Old 02-20-2012, 09:25 PM
mkk41 mkk41 is offline
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Originally Posted by 336A View Post
mkk41, do you have any .401 ammo to go with the gun? how about a pic or two.
My pleasure Sir!



When I bought it , it came with a half fired box of original ammo. Probably only ever fired 25 times then. I now have about 300rds 'in use' and probably 250rd/5 boxes of virgin Herters brass(actually made by Norma of Sweden). They're great guns , made by the old world German firm of J.P. Sauer. Easily as strong as a Ruger Blackhawk. They were also available in .357 and .44 magnums. Fun gun to shoot , and always draw interest. Jacketed 10mm bullets work great.(as does a 10mm carbide sizer die!) I occasionally find 180gr JSPs used for .38/40 WCF ammo , but usually stick with hardcast lead. I know others who have had extra cylinders reamed for 38/40 WCF.
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  #52  
Old 02-29-2012, 04:45 PM
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Started out with a .357 Magnum Model 19 in 1970 and then went to a 6.5" 29-2 in 1973....1974 was a Model 58 but didn't get a 57 until about 1978/9. In 1980 I won the Revolver Division in the North Texas Regional IPSC shoot outside Dallas with that 57. I've been nothing but a .41 revolver man since...

Although .44s shot well for me the .41s just shoot a lot better. Even with full loads I can shoot all day long...something that becomes unpleasant with .44s...

These are three different .41 300-305 grain bullets. They get loaded with 19.0 grains of H110 and have been shot in 57s, Blackhawks and a custom Gary Reeder SA.



This was 6 rounds from a 657 using the 305s which is the center rounds... POA for the first round was at the patch and went just over the top of the plate as the gun is sighted in for 220s. The other 5 are using a 6 o'clock hold at 50 yards. About a 4" group...good enough for deer hunting...




No tellin' why the .41 shoots better for me than .44s or .45s so I just stay with that...makes reloading a lot easier...

Bob

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  #53  
Old 02-29-2012, 05:02 PM
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Default .401 Herters...

Best article I ever saw on this round...a S&W N-frame would have been great....and of course one has to ask why other than ego didn't Smith and Colt chamber this great round....

Herter's .401 PowerMag
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  #54  
Old 02-29-2012, 05:12 PM
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A few more .41 links...

Heavy Bullets in the 41 Mag

41magnum

41 Magnum Data
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  #55  
Old 02-29-2012, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by GF1 View Post
The real kicker for me in the discussion/argument is that .41 caliber is the perfect size for the N frame Smith. The .44 (or really, .429) Magnum is oversize for that revolver, IMO...
An old wives' tale, that I tend to agree with, to some extent. I can't say I have the engineering background to pass judgment on the matter, though.

I have found Model 57s less troublesome over the years than 29s. The 57s had the benefit of being able to start with a clean sheet of paper, so to speak. Much that was learned in building the 29 could be incorporated into that gun, with no need to be concerned about existing dimensions that carried over from the 44 Special. That is the main difference I see between the two guns. To say the .41 is a better round seems a bit fanciful. The cartridge is just a 44 Magnum that is a tiny bit smaller. The gun is where I see the difference.
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  #56  
Old 02-29-2012, 05:38 PM
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Here's my chance to speak my mind on this subject. Being 61 years old, I can still remember the introductry ads employed by S&W in Outdoor Life in the spring of 1964 when I was in the 7th grade. A big M57 4" firing a round with sparks flying everywhere. The 41 Magnum was introduced, not to compete with the 44 Magnum, but to replace the 357 Magnum(and more importantly, the 38 Special) in the hands of police officers, deputies and troopers that were on the front lines dealing with criminals in cars and shoot outs. As formerly stated, Keith, Jordan, and even Skeeter, had a hand at convincing Mr. Hellstrom to come out with the M58 as a lawman,s gun which put big medium velocity bullet down range to better the 38 Special and without all of the 357's noise and blast. The 210 gr. lead police load did exactly this. Never mind that the 44 Special and 45 Colt had been doing this for decades. Everyone knew that these were not modern police rounds. The M58 did all of this in a traditional inexpensive package. No, younger readers, it was not the semi auto craze of the late 80's and early 90's that spelled the doom of the 41 Magnum. The 41 Magnum is a professional shooters gun, a gun a trained officer can learn to shoot very effectively if he wants to. Most officers are not shooters and at the time had just fell in love with the petite M19 357, which is and was a fine handgun. Everyone else was fine with a m10 or M15 in 38 special if it was an issue gun. Back in the sixties, departments didn't upgrade guns every 5 years just to have the newest toy. By the time the auto craze came about the 41 magnum was finished as a police round, due to the Magnum loading and the Magnum stigma applied. I've been around 41 Magnums since the mid sixties. A school chum's Dad had a 6 1/2" Blackhawk that we shot with handloads and I've had more S&W's that I can remember. Presently, I have 10 S&W's, 2 Rugers, and a Marlin carbine and have alway been well satisfied with just about any M57. I agree that they are the perfect match, cartridge to frame size. I've never seen an abused M57 and the early guns match any M29 in fit and finish. To me, it boils down to this, the 41 Magnum is just a more user friendly cartridge if one wants a magnum N frame. I prefer a 44 Special for shooting .429 bullets. I just got in 1000 Starline brass(41) today that I ordered last week, so components are not hard to get. Bob!
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  #57  
Old 02-29-2012, 07:54 PM
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Here is some more good reading on the .41 magnum. Take particular notice at the distances these animals were taken at as well as bullet performance. A bigger caliber would have done no better.

RugerForum.com :: View topic - ELK & THE 41 BISLEY

RugerForum.com :: View topic - Bull Moose with the Ruger 41 Magnum

I just got some .41 mag starline brass too roadranger.

SuperMan how well do those SSK bullets shoot through Rugers?

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  #58  
Old 03-01-2012, 09:52 PM
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i like the 44 - heres a crappy pic of one of them - a power mag 44 -
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  #59  
Old 03-01-2012, 11:37 PM
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I wanted blued and nickeled N frame S&Ws in 4 and 6 inch barrel configurations.

So I have blued 4 and 6 inch M29-2s and nickeled 4 and 6 inch M57s..................this gives me an excuse to reload different calibers that probably will do the same thing.

But the guns are purty!!
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  #60  
Old 03-02-2013, 02:56 PM
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Default .41 vs .44

Wow, what a great question. I have owned 2 .44s and 2 .41s. I live in Alaska so I lean to the heavier loaded .44, but when in bear country while fishing I carry a 12 GA with an 18.5 in barrel and slugs. But the two handguns are remarkable. For recoil the .41 is a tad less out the end of my Blackhawk, but even a little less with my Taurus model 44 in .44 Mag with its ported barrel compared to the Redhawk with no porting. Both are stout kickers, but with the .44 I can also shoot .44 Specials for home defense, and I keep a few bird shot rounds in my backpack just in case I am stranded and need to shoot a grouse or hare and want some meat left to roast, and unless there is a new load I'm not aware of, that isn't possible with the .41. Two great loads, but I think it's the Ford vs Chevy, or picking your favorite team to root for thing - pick the one you choose - both are winners. Great question for this forum.
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  #61  
Old 03-02-2013, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by FordTruckGuy View Post
The story goes like this.

The 41 mag was set to debut and the ballistics were fabulous. Then suddenly, the movie Dirty Harry came out in 1971. Then the line by Harry Calahan (Clint Eastwood) went like this: I know what you're thinking. "Did he fire six shots or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk? Once the audience heard that line, the 44 magnum sales skyrocketed over night. You couldn't find a model 29 anywhere. They were just gone said a friend of mine that owned a gun shop back then. That friend of mine is 73 today. And what was left on the shelves? You quessed it. The .41 magnum says my friend.

The .41 magnum has superior ballistics, however because of the fact that nobody wanted a .41, research to develop different bullets stopped. That is why there is such a small selection of .41.

In my opinion the .41 is a better performer that the .44. I have shot both for 30+ years. If one of the bullet manufacterers would begin developing performance bullets for the .41, I believe it would begin gaining popularity.

One last note. When the movie Dirty Harry was being filmed, the first half of the movie was shot with a .41 magnum. The second half, they finally got the .44 magnum and finished the movie with the real gun.

two areas not accurate...
1) the 41 mag.was released years prior to dirty harry
2) the dirty harry movie was filmed entirely with a 29-2 that was made for the movie in the S&W parts room
the 41 mag.story has been around forever but simply is not true
2)
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  #62  
Old 03-02-2013, 03:30 PM
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So, i have been doing alot of research on the above 2 cartridges. From what I can find, up to 240gr bullets the 41 mag can do everything the 44mag can and sometimes a little better depending on the powder. The 44 mag has the advantage as far as heavier bullets go - 265gr and up. If what I am reading and finding is true, why isn't the 41 more popular? Seems to be superior to the 44mag in standard weights and lighter weights. Once you get above that the 44 shines but then you could go with the 45colt or 454casull and do the same and better. Seems like the 41mag just came around a little too late. definetly a better round though!
I think you answered your own question.

The .44 Magnum can do everything the .41 Magnum can do and more. That said, why limit yourself to a .41 Magnum.

Apart from its defense load, the 210 grain at around 950 fps, I have no other use for the .41 Magnum. And the .40 S&W has pretty much taken over the spot for a self-defense cartridge for those who want more than the 9mm/38 Special +P, but who cannot handle a .45 ACP or who want more capacity than the .45 ACP.
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  #63  
Old 03-03-2013, 12:07 AM
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Default 41's &44's

Was on "the job" for 34 years, carried revolvers for the first 15 as a duty weapon and continued to carry them on and off as a off duty weapon for the next 19, and now carry them everyday as I am retired. I carried a M-58 when I was a motor cop for a Highway patrol in the South West back in the early 80's, I also carried a 4" M-29. I was pretty much the "lone ranger" a lot of times out there on the highway and I wanted something that I could shoot thru automobiles if necessary. In my dept. if you qual'ed master three consec. times, you could carry what you wanted as long as you could qual with it.
I always had confidence in the 41 and 44 mag in that role.
I also shot ISHMA with the 44 mag in a 7 1/2" super blackhawk for years, it had quite a bit of steam even out to those 55lb 200 yard rams. You had to knock them down to score.
I have harvested deer with the 41 mag and 44 mag as well as a stoutly loaded 45LC. They all produced one shot kills when bullet placement was good. In my book they are good tools in the tool box.
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  #64  
Old 03-03-2013, 12:25 AM
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Default That's just it

The .41 magnum was made to give a little more than the .357 , but less than the .44. The .41 was almost as heavy as a .44 mag and still had plenty of kick so there seemed to be no real advantage for police departments to adopt it. It sold but without official adoption it wasn't a very big hit.
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Old 03-03-2013, 07:36 AM
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Talking 41 versus 44

As far as the argument on flatter shooting goes, I would say Hornady threw some **** in the game with the FTX bullets.
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  #66  
Old 03-03-2013, 09:57 AM
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All I know is I shot my .41 Blackhawk a lot better than I shot my buddy's .44 Blackhawk. So if rounds on target count for anything, in my hands, the .41 wins.
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  #67  
Old 03-03-2013, 02:49 PM
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The 41 mag is a good round, but you pretty much max out @ 220gr, not enough powder cap for heavier bullets. The 44mag easily runs the 24-250gr bullets & you have the advantage of real heavy wt 300-310gr if needed. The 41/220gr has an SD of 178, less than the 240gr/44 @ 186, no real comparison as the 44mag pushes those heavier bullet faster. The 41mag will always be a niche/cult round but a good one. I wish I could find a nice M58.
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  #68  
Old 03-03-2013, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by fredj338 View Post
The 41 mag is a good round, but you pretty much max out @ 220gr, not enough powder cap for heavier bullets. The 44mag easily runs the 24-250gr bullets & you have the advantage fo real hevy wt 300-310gr if needed. The 1/220gr has an SD of 178, less than the 240gr 44 @ 186, no real comparison as the 44mag pushes those heavier bullet faster. The 41mag will always be a niche/cult round but a good one.
There are several bullets heavier than 220 grain for the 41. I've seen 295 grain bullets and I load 265 grain bullets at 1400 fps out of my 41 mag Redhawk.
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  #69  
Old 03-03-2013, 04:33 PM
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Your ALL right. Some facts some beliefs some opinions. I think the question is wrong. .41vs.44 should be .357vs.41 The .41 mag starts at 210gr and goes up generally. the .357 starts at 125gr and stops at 180 generally but some go 200gr so even that is below the .41 mag factory loads. The rub really is with factory ammo. So there isn't any argument really, just what argument you make yourself. Factory ammo limits your choices reloading lets you utilize the full potential of any round. What kind of gun you want? if 357 is enough ok if 41 is enough ok if 44 is what you want use it.

I remember the police load for the 41mag was supposed to be a cure all but over penetration was cause for concern. In my opinion insufficient training was the problem with magnums. The four CHP officers killed in Valencia 1970 had the right gun for the job. Tactics and not having your head on a swivel got them killed. FMJs and car bodies was what the 357 was made for. Just think of all the cops that died because of the low powered .38 special. When its time to pull your gun you need power.

You cant say 45 is better than 44 and 41 over 44 and 357 and so forth. They all got their place. You want to toss your model 27s cause they aren't .41s? Hell no! and then you'd have to get rid of your model 10s and on and on and on......
Don't use the word "better" there not better... there different.
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Old 03-03-2013, 04:37 PM
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Oh I forgot..the .41 that really gets to me is the Blackhawk .41 mag. that is allot of juice in a small package
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Old 03-03-2013, 09:04 PM
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My reply about 41 vs 44 came out different than it started out. I was just trying to compare factory bullet weights and then went off on some different idea. I think the 357 and 41 mag are closer for a comparison. The 41 just isnt popular with some people. Factory jacketed bullets were not as good in the 70s. Now you have very good jacketed bullets and heavy cast bullets. Some writers used to say that there was no need for the 41 but it looks perfect to me. It does not matter that you can load the 44 mag down. If powder does not fill the case then it will get erratic pressures and velocity will vary shot to shot. Enter the 41 maybe it has just the right combination to fill where the 357 is straining with 180-200 gr bullets yet is more efficient than the 44 for bullets less than 250gr. Also some folks got small hands and just how much can you hang onto?
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Old 03-03-2013, 10:30 PM
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There are several bullets heavier than 220 grain for the 41. I've seen 295 grain bullets and I load 265 grain bullets at 1400 fps out of my 41 mag Redhawk.
Never said their were not heavier bullets available, just that the 41mag case doesn't really have enough powder room to push them fast enough IMO. So accuracy may suffer as well as reduced terminal performance. A 265gr/41 would be close to a 280gr/44 in SD, but the 44 will be going faster.
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Old 03-04-2013, 09:14 AM
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Never said their were not heavier bullets available, just that the 41mag case doesn't really have enough powder room to push them fast enough IMO. So accuracy may suffer as well as reduced terminal performance. A 265gr/41 would be close to a 280gr/44 in SD, but the 44 will be going faster.
Fred...did you read post 52 above... Those 300s are going 1300 fps...and accuracy at least practical accuracy for game killing doesn't suffer at all...

Bob
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:00 PM
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I like my 44mag's but i love my 41mag's too. I have more 44mag's than 41mags but that will soon change in time.

I'm man enough to own and shoot the 44's but i like having more choices in calibers to play with.

The 41mag was developed for law inforcement who wanted something more powerful than the 357mag. I guess it caught on with some but not everyone. Its like the 10mm auto its there but not everyone likes it because its too hard to handle while the 40cal is a lesser round power and recoil wise.

The 41mag seems to have less recoil to me over the 44mag even with a 4" barrel.

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Old 03-04-2013, 07:25 PM
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I've own two of each (all Rugers') over the last twenty years. The biggest difference for me is I've killed nine deer with a .44 Redhawk and never a deer with the .41 mag. The .41 does recoil a lot less and is much more fun to shoot.

Jerry
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Old 12-30-2013, 03:00 PM
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Default Model 57 .41 mag

I picked up a model 57 .41 mag a few days ago. Waiting for the brass and bullets to show up so I can start working up some loads. I haven't shot one of these yet but I think I'm going to be happy.
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Old 12-30-2013, 04:17 PM
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You will be. Just don't expect miracles. Sometimes .41 people let their enthusiasm get away from them and will lead you to think the .41 walks on water. 57s are fine revolvers (and I like them!)... but not magical!
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Old 12-30-2013, 04:41 PM
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Ford vs. Chevy, blondes or redheads, .41 vs .44, ..this discussion could go on forever. Wider selection of lead for the .44, the 41 shoots flatter, other than that whatever you hit with either one won't know the difference.
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Old 12-30-2013, 06:27 PM
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It sort of feels like "Night of the Living Dead" with these old threads popping up.

Anyway, since this is a reloading forum, there is no significant difference between the .41 and .44 mags. Even though the .41 mag is my favorite cartridge and the .44 mag isn't second, it doesn't have anything to do with ballistics. The .44 is ever so slightly larger and will be ever so slightly better, at most things...but not all. But for most purposes, there is nothing one will do that the other can't, and that includes bird shot, multi-balls, and etc., etc., etc.

But reloading wasn't a consideration in the development of the .41 mag., it was a marketing scheme. The main focus for law enforcement at the time the .41 was introduced was the "police" load, it was "the" best cartridge for police use ever developed, so the story went. S&W could have easily made a load for the 29 that did the exact same thing, but that wouldn't have sold as many new guns. The problem was the guns were too big and heavy for many law enforcement officers, and not just the females, which I believe was the reason it didn't become the success they thought it would, not to mention that many departments, and individual officers, chose the jacketed "hunting" load for various reasons.

But now we have the .40 S&W, which is the latest and greatest law enforcement cartridge we ever had. The fact that it's ballistics are nearly identical to a cartridge that is over 130 years old doesn't really matter, as long as it sells.
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Old 12-30-2013, 06:54 PM
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I recently looked into same - thinking which I'd prefer - the 44 magnum or the 41 magnum.
I decided I'd prefer the 41 BUT when checked ammo availibility and price I couldn't find either so for now I'm staying with my 357 magnum and might reconsider the 41 sometime in the future.
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Old 12-30-2013, 08:04 PM
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Personally, I would LOVE to add an M57 to my collection.

I have a 4" M29-2 and a 6.5" M629-6 Classic and like them alot....

But, I am just enamored with the 41 lately.... It's on "the list".

When I was getting ready to buy my very first Smith, I passed on a 6" M57 in excellent shape in favor of a brand new 686. I had never heard of the 41 mag before that day. I was not reloading at that time either so limited factory ammo had an influence on my decision that day. Hind sight is 20/20 and I would like to go back in time and kick my own rear end for passing on that old gem!

In the short time I have been a member here (and consequently that is how long it's been since I bought my first Smith) I have learned soooooo much and have had my eyes open to a wide variety of S&W revolvers that in some cases I never knew existed. It's been a great ride, but the downside is, this place is going to get me into alot of trouble with the Missus! LOL! Just when it seems my collection is complete, another model finds it's way onto my "list".... I guess it never ends.
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Old 12-30-2013, 08:08 PM
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For factory ammo, there are fewer choices available for 41 mag than for 44 mag.

But for basic SWC ammo, 41 Mag isn't much more, if any more, expensive.

Check the prices for simple SWC practice ammo on Ammoseek.com.

Fancy SD or hunting ammo is over priced for either.
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:04 PM
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Have posted this before as to factory .41 ammo...as to availability try finding .44 Special. A few weeks ago was in one of the biggest shops in the NE...they had 5 kinds of .41...no .44, no .357 and no .45 Colt...sometimes different is better...


Remington
210 JSP

Wincehster
175 Silvertip
240 Platinum Tip

Speer
210 DeepCurl

Federal
250 CastCore
180 Barnes
210 JHP
210 Fusion
210 Swift A-Frame

CorBon
170 JHC
210 JHC
250 WFN Hardcast
180 Barnes DPX

Buffalo Bore
170 JHC
265 Hardcast
180 Barnes
230 Keith

Hornady
210 FlexTip
210 XTP

Georgia Arms
210 XTP
210 LSWC (Target Load)
200 Remington JHP
210 DeepCurl HP

DoubleTap
210 JHP
180 Barnes
250 Hardcast WFN

HSM
210 SWC
230 Keith GC
210XTP

Barnes
180 HP

Grizzly
250 Hardcast WFN
210 JSP

Bitterroot Valley
210 JHP
210 Cast

Maine Cartridge Company
210 plated

Appalachian Ammo Co.
210 plated
210 LSWC
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:11 PM
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Have posted this before as to factory .41 ammo...as to availability try finding .44 Special. A few weeks ago was in one of the biggest shops in the NE...they had 5 kinds of .41...no .44, no .357 and no .45 Colt...sometimes different is better...

Georgia Arms
210 LSWC (Target Load)
I just got my first 41 Mag (657-3 Classic Hunter) and bought a few hundred rounds of this GA load -- at under 50 cents per round.

It uses Starline Brass and I figure I can accumulate some brass to reload.
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:25 PM
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During the Great Scare of 2012-13, I found plenty of 41 mag brass at Bass Pro Shops. No 44, no 9mm, no 40, no 223.... Goes against the grain of "buy one of these popular calibers - EVERYONE has ammo for them!"
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:29 PM
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During the Great Scare of 2012-13, I found plenty of 41 mag brass at Bass Pro Shops. No 44, no 9mm, no 40, no 223.... Goes against the grain of "buy one of these popular calibers - EVERYONE has ammo for them!"

Yep, that can sure work both ways. When you have what "everybody else" has, and everybody else rushes out to stock up on ammo, the only thing left is the stuff "nobody" uses! LOL!


....Who's on first again??
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:48 PM
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During the Great Scare of 2012-13, I found plenty of 41 mag brass at Bass Pro Shops. No 44, no 9mm, no 40, no 223.... Goes against the grain of "buy one of these popular calibers - EVERYONE has ammo for them!"
I used to here people say "buy a 30-30 rifle because you can get ammo everywhere".

About six months ago, I bought a 30-30 and then couldn't even find one box of ammo locally to try it out. Eventually I found some, but not without searching a lot.

Didn't Yogi Bera say something like:

That place got so crowded that no one goes there anymore.
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Old 12-30-2013, 10:16 PM
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The .44 magnum, for those not man enough to handle the .41 magnum.
Dad was a competent handgunner, but for deer hunting he was a double barrel 12 gauge kinda guy. He bought his 1915 Parker Trojan in the early '40's, just before being shipped out to the Pacific theatre. He carried the ole girl and took many deer well into his late seventies, before switching to a handgun.

The Parker was getting kinda heavy to carry around, so he went to the LGS to buy a Model 29, but the salesman convinced him to go with a .41 because he thought Dad could handle it better.

The .41 served him well too. Soon after he got it I bought the dies and loaded every single round he ever fired thru it. His last deer was taken with it.

Dad passed this year and I have become reacquainted with his model 57. I'll take it over my Model 29 any day, but then again maybe I'm just prejudiced
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Old 12-30-2013, 10:21 PM
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A few years ago, round about 1980, my dad told me that a friend of his had a model 57 for sale. At the time, I had a Colt Trooper in .357 and a 6406 in 9mm as my only centerfire handguns.

I remember telling him at the time, that I wasn't interested. Even at that time, I knew that the 44mag was outpacing the 41mag in popularity and available ammunition. I told him I wasn't looking for a large magnum, but if I were, it would be a 44mag. Other than to fill a slot between 357 and 44 mag, very few wanted a 41 mag.

Now, of course, I know that the 57 would be more desirable as a collector piece, but that's only after an additional 35 years perspective, and after buying three 44 mags. Otherwise, I second everything that has already been said about both calibers. Good discussion!
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Old 12-31-2013, 01:34 PM
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I admit, I'm surprised at the number of "factory" offerings in Superman's post. I quit looking at factory ammo a very long time ago, even though I carried several .41s on duty. I still have some various jacketed bullets laying around, including some 180 gr. Speer for the .41 AE's that I used to shoot also, but I also have about a dozen molds that I really prefer to any jacketed bullets I've ever seen. Not to mention they are loaded to the way that I like them, and not the mass market of consumers.
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Old 01-01-2014, 12:51 PM
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JB...I have been looking for some of those 180 grain Speer Gold Dots for over 10 years. I somehow overlooked them when they were being made and by the time I found out about them they had been discontinued.

Sure wish that Speer would come out with an updated version of that bullet that would be just like the .44 200 grain GD bullet with the DEEP hollow cavity that would really expand fast but hold together...that would be a great defensive round run at 1100 fps like the .44 Magnum Short Barrel load is...

We can dream....Bob
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Old 01-01-2014, 04:12 PM
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To my knowledge, Amarillo Tx. PD was the only agency to actually issue the 41 Mag back in the 70s. I was living in Clovis New Mexico at that time and had a friend on the Amarillo PD. They issued the 41 Mag but officers were allowed to carry whatever they could qualify with.

Tom
San Antonio P.D. also issued the Model 58 in the late 60's early 70's.

I picked up my Model 57 during the Dirty Harry craze and there were no 44 Magnums to be found. Now I have some Model 29's and my Model 57, enjoy shooting both calibers and some day I hope to stumble into a Model 58 to round out my 41 Magnum family.
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Old 01-01-2014, 09:22 PM
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Bob,
I wish I'd bought a lot more than I did, and was a little more conservative with what I had. At the time they hit the market I was shooting several .41 magnums and a couple .41 AE conversions. The .41 mag. has great potential for the handloader and that is why it is my favorite all around caliber. Unfortunately the factory bullets available for it are it's biggest detriment due to the fact that they are all for 'Magnum' loads. Speer's 180's were made for the .41 AE, with maximum velocities running about 1100 fps., which made them an excellent choice for defense loads in the magnum, especially if a cannelure was added.

Take a look at the factory loads listed above. Although the number has grown quite a bit from when I first started shooting them, most of them are for hunting. There are only a few light bullets available, fewer for the handloader and few that I'd even be interested in. The .41 mag has a lot more potential than the factories realize, and that may be because so many handloaders don't realize it either. But then I still shoot .41 AEs once in a while and wish it would make a comeback too.

In the meantime, if you want a nice light bullet for a .41 anything, casting is the best route, which the more I learned about bullets is my first choice anyway.
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Old 01-01-2014, 09:58 PM
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I picked up a model 57 .41 mag a few days ago. Waiting for the brass and bullets to show up so I can start working up some loads. I haven't shot one of these yet but I think I'm going to be happy.
Get a big jug of 2400, a bunch of 210 grain hard cast or jacketed bullets and have a blast.
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Old 01-01-2014, 09:59 PM
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I have both and my standard load for both is 7.0 of Unique and a cast swc. I realize you can get heavier bullets in the 44, but I don't have a need for such. Several experienced hunters have said that a 200 grain, or a bit more, cast swc at 900fps will totally penetrate any game animal in North America.
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Old 01-02-2014, 04:25 AM
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So, i have been doing alot of research on the above 2 cartridges. From what I can find, up to 240gr bullets the 41 mag can do everything the 44mag can and sometimes a little better depending on the powder. The 44 mag has the advantage as far as heavier bullets go - 265gr and up. If what I am reading and finding is true, why isn't the 41 more popular? Seems to be superior to the 44mag in standard weights and lighter weights. Once you get above that the 44 shines but then you could go with the 45colt or 454casull and do the same and better. Seems like the 41mag just came around a little too late. definetly a better round though!

The .41 mag is .410" versus the .44 mag at .429"....nothing you are likely to shoot can tell the difference in diameter or bullet area....it all comes down to impact kinetic energy.
The .41 Mag suffers ONLY in that it is too close to the .44 Mag and Americans always want bigger...which means the .41 suffers from always being in the shadow of the .44. Also, the .41 has a bit of the "10mm curse" in that it was originally loaded in a "Police Load" which is a mid-range and nothing near what a magnum load is about.
The truth is, if you happen to have a M57 you can handload some seriously powerful slugs and do NOT "need" a .44 to get the ultimate. But...if you were buying from scratch...naturally you'd go for the .44 over the .41 because it's the bigger dog on the block, but the .41 loaded up is statistically identical to the .44 Mag.
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Old 01-02-2014, 10:21 PM
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The original 10mm loads were actually pretty hot and were blamed for cracking 1911 frames, not to mention what they did to the Bren 10. (Wry humor intended.)

They were then reduced a little before the FBI adopted the caliber with "lite" loads. Had the experts at the FBI known of the .41AE at the time, the 10mm may never have had a "police load".
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Old 01-02-2014, 11:04 PM
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The .357 came out in 1934, the .44 magnum in 1956. The .41 Magnum was introduced in 1964.

Perhaps if the .41 had come out before the .44, it would have developed a following. As it was, it was seen as an 'in between' round added on later.
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:51 AM
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I think another negative for the .41 was the lack of a parent "special" cartridge, which was used as a selling point for the other magnums. While the other magnums could chamber and fire several cartridges, the .41 could only handle one. And even though there was a lighter police load, it wasn't light enough for many factory ammo users.

But whatever the reason, it worked out for me. While it was struggling with poor sales, the prices were well below the .44 magnum, which had gained celebrity status. The local PD that issued it dropped it after a short while and went back to the .357. Very few officers bought their duty weapons when offered. The captain on a neighboring dept. that carried his own .41 sold it and went back to a .357. I bought mine about the same time and kept buying more.
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:56 AM
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The .357 came out in 1934, the .44 magnum in 1956. The .41 Magnum was introduced in 1964.

Perhaps if the .41 had come out before the .44, it would have developed a following. As it was, it was seen as an 'in between' round added on later.


That Sir, is an excellent point.

The 357 certainly seems to have retained a following.

Very logically seems as though the 41 was a victim of bad timing rather than perceived inferiority to a larger caliber...

All of that said, I still want one BADLY! And I only found out they existed roughly 3 years ago..
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