I am down to my last few ounces of A#5 for 38 Special loads.
I would like HP38 but the only powders my local shop had were 8 pound jugs of Red Dot and 800X and a pound of Lil Gun.
I load 125 gr plated bullets. I do have some Trail Boss, but have decided that even a full load doesn't produce enough pressure for plated bullets. Accuracy was poor and some evidence of key holing.
Lil Gun doesn't seem to have any application for 38 Special.
The Red Dot loads I have found have been for lead bullets.
I have used 700X for mild .357 Magnum loads, but no experience with 800X. The gun store did find a load in the Hornady Book for 125gr JHP. I am not really happy about having to buy 8 pounds of powder ($170) that may be of marginal use, but that may be my only option these days. The only other option I can think of involves using a time machine!
Is there a problem using 800X other than poor metering? I load about 200 rounds a month, and could use a dipper if necessary, instead of my Uniflow. I am talking about range ammo for a M67 and a M640.

Best,
Rick

For my light target loads in the .38 Special, I use Clays powder - it is accurate for me and is very clean. Among the many other choices, I like 231 and AutoComp.

Ed

4 grains of 231 behind a 158 grain lead SWC seems to perform well for me.

I've had good luck target shooting a .38 Special with 3.5 grains of Trail Boss and a Hornady 125 grain XTP jacketed hollow point. YMMV.

__________________
"Liberty or Death"

I've never shot plated bullets, but are they that much different than lead?

Check Alliant Powder's website for data on the Red Dot.
Go to the Product-Red Dot, then View all recipes. Shows regular and plus P loads.

As for plated bullets- they have more friction in the barrel than lubed lead so low end jacketed data is recommended. You can use cast bullet data to, just keep velocity up above minimums. Don't want to stick a bullet in the barrel.

__________________
Virtue,Liberty & Independence

I have used 3.5 gr of Winchester 231 and 148 gr lead wadcutters for target shooting and plinking for years as my primary 38spl load. These shoot great and are easy on both the gun and the brass.
Jim

I'd buy a big jug of Red Dot if I could. I've heard a lot of negatives about Green Dot, though I've never tried it myself (because I've heard a lot of negatives about it!)

Update: Alliant only lists Red Dot loads for lead, I'll have to check my old books, I'm sure it was more versatile than that.

If those were my choices and I needed powder, it would be Red Dot.

Green Dot powder, perhaps among other Alliant "Dot" powders, underwent a composition change 11 years ago to make it cleaner-burning and those changes may have brought about the revisions to the loading data. Jugs of the newer powder have "Cleaner Burning" on the label.

Ed

I've shot red dot out of 38. It's not real clean and tends to "spit" burning powder but has a suitable burn rate to do an OK job for range plinking. That said, I'm not sure I'd want to buy an 8# jug of it for 38 loading. That's a big investment in a powder that you'll likely never love for your purpose.

If it were me, I'd hold out for a pound of Clays, W231 or Bullseye (in that order).
FWIW, I only load Clays in 38 these days.

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Dave

Can you find any Unique? If so I would suggest picking up 1 or 2 lbs. to "tide your over" until Accurate # 5 becomes available again.

BTW, 5.6 grains of Unique loaded to an overall length of 1.425 inch will produce a velocity of 850 fps. with your plated bullets and it's a very stable load. Meaning it's not position sensitive. However, low flash it aint. You may find that blast ring from the B/C gap to be a bit distracting but it's not at all harmful at a range with lane dividers. They call Unique Flaming Dirt for a reason and I've found it a high flash powder in everything I shoot.

Notes: The 125 grain HSM and Ranier plated bullets I've used have both measured in at 0.510 inch. I've also checked the length of the 125 grain Hornady XTP and that particular bullet measures at 0.540 inch. Which is why I'm loading my 125 grain plated bullets 0.030 inch shorter that what you will find listed for the Hornady XTP.

I'll also note that the B/c gap on my 67-1 checks at a slightly loose 0.006 inch. So, it's not an excessive gap but I can tell you that my loads featuring Unique have a blast ring that could be considered rather impressive.

I'll also warn you that you'll probably find that you have to hand weigh each charge of Unique. My experience with this powder is that it won't meter reliably in my powder measure and when I tested for metering I found loads that ran as much as 1/2 grain high or low. I have found that a "heaping" dip using a Lee 0.7cc dipper will be pretty close to 5.6 grains and that is a help in trickling a charge.

That's my default .38 Special load, it's accurate with modest recoil...

__________________
"Shall not be infringed"

Trail Boss is best with lead bullets..........

800-x is like Unique and burns best with the top end velocity. It is slower and you can use more powder but please use data for this powder.

Since Red is slower than Bullseye it can be used with the same data for target loads with Bullseye data and the 125 Jhp max is 4.6 for the 38 special.........Bullseye is 4.4 grs.

I have loaded and shot thousands of 125grn Xtreme plated bullets out of my 38 Special revolvers.

I have 5 pounds of 800X on hand and I do all my loading with a Hornady Lock n Load AP. The 800X metered so inconsistently with the Hornady measure that I gave up on it and bought 8 pounds of HP38, which I am still working through. So unfortunately, I have no experience with shooting 800X, I can tell you that if you're using a similar Hornady setup to what I am using, expect 800X to be inconsistent from round to round.

I have settled in on 5.0 grains of HP38 with a 125grn plated bullet and a C.O.A.L. of 1.43. This is on the hotter side of standard pressure but it is very accurate and shoots great in all my K frames.

I also have some 700X and some Clays (just Clays, not Universal or International). I have yet to try those powders but I will once I run out of the HP38. To be honest I've been so pleased with the HP38 that I may just keep buying more of it. It's a very versatile powder.

Haven't used X800 or Lil Gun but I have shot a few 158 gr LSWC using Red Dot. For me 3.2 gr. to 3.6 gr.will give me 2" groups at 10 yds. with a 6" barrel. I have data on other powders but you didn't mention them being available.

I shop at the same LGS as you and found the same selection last Sunday when I snagged a Model 36 "flat latch". I recently bought three one pound cans of Trail Boss and settled on a load of 4.0 grains over a Berry's plated 158 grain bullet. I use this load in .38 Special and .357 Magnum in a Model 27, and 66, three Model 14's, two Model 15's and four different "J" frames. I get satisfactory results in all of them. Move up to a 158 grain plated bullet and see what happens YMMV.

De Oppresso Liber

We must be talking about Skagit Arms in Burlington.
I was there the day after you.
I will need to try the 158 gr plated bullets again. My recollection is that they gave me about 6 inch groups at 50 feet with my M67. This was with my hands supported on the bench and using my 70 year old eyes as best as I still can. I was using the maximum recommended load. I wanted Trail Boss to work well, as it seems very safe and shouldn't be position sensitive at all, since it completely fills up the case.
With Universal, I have shot 1.5 inch groups off the rest. I have been saving the rest of the TB should I ever get to shoot somewhere I can use soft lead bullets.

Best,
Rick

This is interesting.
I wasn't sure that TB would even get a jacketed bullet out of the barrel.
It seems others are getting better results with TB than I have experienced, with other than lead bullets.

Best,
Rick

They are somewhat between lead and jacketed.
My indoor range won't allow lead.
I think they take more pressure to get a good seal.


Best,
Rick

you may find loads for 800x with that weight of bullet, but it works best at higher pressures. nice in the auto calibers for hotter loads. doesn't measure very well either. red dot is an old shotgun powder used in trap and skeet loads. it will work for the loads you are wanting, but their are better powders out there.

Red Dot will get you good speeds at 3.5-4.0g with a 125g plated bullet. Plated bullets can be loaded to between lead and fmj data (usually, they behave more like cast lead bullets). I've shot 125g lead bullets with Red Dot and 3.0g will give you "pop gun" recoil @ 700 fps while 4.0g will make it feel more like a real 38 special @ 870fps out of a 4" Ruger Service Six. It will get you close to Unique velocities and just like Unique, it likes to burn at the higher end of the load to stay clean.

800X is also good powder, but the flakes are very large and won't meter worth a darn in most powder measures. It was meant for use in shotgun bushings where you drop 15-20 grains at a time and 1/2 grain difference is unimportant.

I'd get the Red Dot. In fact I bought 8 pounds of Red Dot in January, but I shoot shotgun and I'm 3/4 done with this jug. For you, at 4g per shot, that jug should be good for 14,000 rounds! Even if you don't find it to be your best performing powder, you now have a backup powder for the next panic.

What I want to know is where are you guys even FINDING powder? Been calling around here for two days and haven't found any. Checked all the usual online places and it's all gone. Want to find some for pistol(231) and small rifle (748). It's just not out there. Mike.

There's a shop local to me that has most of the popular Alliant powders, including Bullseye, Unique, 2400, and all of the "dot" powders in both 1 and 4 pound jugs stacked to the ceiling in their back room.

I see most other shops getting Alliant powders in with some regularity. Most other powders, including Winchester, IMR and Hogdon powders, are available with some patience, although not always immediately-I typically will see just about everything in stock over a 2-3 week period, although not at the same time nor at the same shop.

I can't speak for your local area, but my experience is that the stuff is definitely out there.

Nothing around here. STL area(actually, IL). At least that I can find.

Do you have a Cabela's out there? I was in the one at Legends a few weeks ago, they even had a few pounds of HP38! Lots of small and large primers too.

I have been playing with some of the newer shotgun powders that seem to still be on the shelf. Such as 20/28, E3, and my local dealer has a few pounds of American Select.

The 20/28 is very close to Unique, just use a little less powder than Unique for the same velocity. The E3 and Clays are pretty close. I am running some 40 S&W Reduced Power Revolver loads using E3 at the moment with 180 RNL Cowboy Action Bullets for the 38-40.
I am planning on experimenting with E3 in my 38 Special 158 RNL loads when I get caught up on 40 S&W.

I would advise to do some research before playing with the newer shotgun powders with Little to No Handgun Data available. I have been having pretty fair luck so far.

Bob

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ICORE MO2908

Over the years the powders I have found most useful in 38 special are Bullseye, Red Dot and Unique.
Unique works well for mid to upper loads (it has a pressure level that has to be reached to burn properly.
For years I tried to load Unique to light "target loads" it doesn't work for that. Bought a can of Bullseye and that is the ticket for light target loads. 148 gr cast wadcutter
I bought a can of Red Dot a while back because it was there and is useful in cast bullet loads in rifle and pistol. It is just a touch slower burning than Bullseye but not as slow as Unique and I rather like it. Have loaded it in 38 spcl, 9mm Luger, and 45acp with no complaints. Sometimes you just have to use what you can get and Red Dot is useful especially with cast bullets...I like it.
Gary

I am real sorry to hear your problems finding powder here in ohio gander mountain ,cabelas who are the last to get a shipment have powder. Fin , feather and fur in ashland ohio also has a full line do any of these places have stores in your area? They all started getting stock about 3 weeks ago. I got 8# of bullseye and a # of unique to replenish my stock Bullseye is my .38 special choice

Powders I use for 38 special include.

1-Bullseye
2-Tightgroup
3-Clays
4-W231
5-2400
6-WST
7-AA#2

My favorites are Clays, (get the best accuracy) and 2400 for my FBI loads.

I want to try Unique and Universal but can't find any around here.

I've been using Universal for .38 since I picked up my model 10 early this year. I've been using it under a home cast 140 gr SWC. Accuracy is very good IMO. Had to go to near max with Uni under JHPs to get acceptable accuracy. Still not as good as the lead SWCs.

The good news/bad news with .38 is that a one pound can will last for 1500 - 1700 rounds. That's good news, if you like the powder, bad news if you don't.

I don't know if you Skagit County boys ever get over to the Pennsula, but I bought some W231 at Doc Neely's in Port Angeles about 6 weeks ago. He had several pound cans of it, plus some other powders. 360-452-2800.
Only been to Skagit Arms once, about a year ago, but left there with a warm & fuzzy feeling due to getting a pretty good deal on a 2" model 12. A nice not-so-common gun which I foolishly traded off for my first round butt model 36 not long after.

Its been about 20 years since I have been that way, on my old motorcycle. Now, I am old, and tend not to stray very far from the flagpole. But, it was a nice road for a bike ride.
I like to think that the powder situation will get better soon.


Best,
Rick

Just Cabalas, and they were out of powder last week.
But, good news. I just found several pounds of A#5 at my LGS in Burlington, WA. They had a shipment of several Accurate powders. Bad news, the A#5 was $24 a pound.
Primers were $40 per thousand.

Best,
Rick

I recently paid $40/1000 for WSP primers, and $30 for a pound of 231. The last time I bought primers or powder was back when they were $10/1000 and $13 a pound, so I didn't know if they were panic-priced or if it was just inflation. But given the recent shortages, I was just glad to find some for sale. FWIW I had a LGS over in Bothell quote me $40 for a pound of HP36 over the phone not long ago.
I miss the old days-- not just the lower prices, but the fact that you could walk into just about any place that sold handloading supplies and everything you wanted was in stock.

4gr Win 231 with 158 gr Berry's FP plated bullet.

Walked into a shop near my home and they had an 8 lb jug of 231 for $200. Looks like the powder supply is starting to improve.