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  #1  
Old 06-27-2014, 10:26 AM
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Default NEW Alliant BE-86 powder

Thought you would find this interesting......I just purchased some of this powder from a distributor. When I went to the Alliant website there was no load data published so I called Alliant and talked with Dwayne. He told me that this powder was not supposed to have been released for retail until the load data had been published on-line so someone dropped the ball on the release protocol. The data is available in the new 2014 Alliant manual but it has not been published on the internet yet. I asked him if it was similar to UNIQUE. He checked different bullet weights and could not find data for any bullet that would be the same. They are sending my a new 2014 manual. I have read a lot of BS about BE-86 being the same as UNIQUE but it is not; it is a powder of it's own entity.
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Old 06-27-2014, 10:49 AM
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Data can be found online here. Either download or view.

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide


After scanning some of the data, what they have "conveniently" done is not list data for the same bullets with BE-86 and Unique and some of their other powders so it's hard to compare. Maybe they did not have all the others to test at the time?

Supposed to have less flash. Would like to see it on a the infamous burn rate chart!

Last edited by Rule3; 06-27-2014 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 06-27-2014, 11:21 AM
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Any way you might be able to post a "maco" picture of the powder for us to see ?

I was wondering if it was like Bullseye ......or flake like as the slower powders ......or even 2400.

Glad to see you got a real early Christmas present !!!
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Old 06-27-2014, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rule3 View Post
Data can be found online here. Either download or view.

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide


After scanning some of the data, what they have "conveniently" done is not list data for the same bullets with BE-86 and Unique and some of their other powders so it's hard to compare. Maybe they did not have all the others to test at the time?

Supposed to have less flash. Would like to see it on a the infamous burn rate chart!
DATA is not available on line. The manual that contains the data can be ordered from Alliant by filling out an on-line form. That's a big difference.
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Old 06-27-2014, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirgknight View Post
DATA is not available on line. The manual that contains the data can be ordered from Alliant by filling out an on-line form. That's a big difference.
Or you can click on "View the Reloader's Guide" or "Download the Reloader's Guide", between the image of the 2014 Reloader's Guide cover and the online form. So, no the data can't be directly accessed (yet) online, but it is definitely available online.

According to the 2014 Alliant Handloader's Guide (which I just downloaded), burning rate of BE-86 is slower than Unique, faster than Power Pistol.

Last edited by TripleLock; 06-27-2014 at 12:04 PM.
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Old 06-27-2014, 11:58 AM
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I'd like to see where BE-86 sets on a burn rate chart.

.

Last edited by JBnTx; 06-27-2014 at 12:06 PM.
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Old 06-27-2014, 12:07 PM
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I had thought BE86 was a "new-improved" Bullseye powder.
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Old 06-27-2014, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TripleLock View Post
Or you can click on "View the Reloader's Guide" or "Download the Reloader's Guide", between the image of the 2014 Reloader's Guide cover and the online form. So, no the data can't be directly accessed (yet) online, but it is definitely available online.

This. The .pdf available for download is the exact book they will mail you. It's nice they've branched out on bullets with BE86 but as noted makes it hard to compare it to other powders.
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Old 06-27-2014, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirgknight View Post
DATA is not available on line. The manual that contains the data can be ordered from Alliant by filling out an on-line form. That's a big difference.
Yes it is. I just looked at it No waiting for the mail.

Go to the link and look under the Alliant symbol clicky either link.

Either VIEW or DOWNLOAD
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Old 06-27-2014, 06:20 PM
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All I need to do is find a dealer within reasonable distance who has it in stock! >***, sniffle<
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Old 06-27-2014, 06:22 PM
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Ooops! The blocker didn't like that word, signifying a crying sound! Sorry!
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Old 06-27-2014, 06:28 PM
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Am I the only one that's really tired of new powders that keep coming out during a great powder famine? Can we just fire up the factory to produce some of the best sellers until the shelves are flooded with them? PLEASE?
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Old 06-27-2014, 06:29 PM
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By the by:

Alliant Powder - BE-86

The special extruded flake formulation results in excellent ballistics in a wide array of centerfire pistol loads, with high energy, an ideal burn speed and less flash. It meters well and is available in 1- and 8-pound canisters. Like all Alliant Powder offerings, BE-86 provides superior lot-to-lot consistency.
Improved flow
Contains flash suppressant
High energy
Lot-to-lot consistency
Versatile performance

Principal Purpose: Handgun loads

Remarks:
Excellent for 9mm and .40 S&W.
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  #14  
Old 06-27-2014, 07:25 PM
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Default 9mm and .40???

How about .38/.357???
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Old 06-27-2014, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
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How about .38/.357???
There is data in the manual for those also but it is probably "geared" more towards the semi auto high pressure rounds,

Even if it was around I would not run out and buy any.
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Old 06-27-2014, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximumbob54 View Post
Am I the only one that's really tired of new powders that keep coming out during a great powder famine? Can we just fire up the factory to produce some of the best sellers until the shelves are flooded with them? PLEASE?
I agree with you. I just want some Unique and 2400.
I'm too old to be chasing new powders.
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Old 06-27-2014, 10:53 PM
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found the guide.....thanks.
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Old 06-28-2014, 12:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rule3 View Post
Data can be found online here. Either download or view.

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide


After scanning some of the data, what they have "conveniently" done is not list data for the same bullets with BE-86 and Unique and some of their other powders so it's hard to compare. Maybe they did not have all the others to test at the time?

Supposed to have less flash. Would like to see it on a the infamous burn rate chart!
yeah I noticed the switch thing too.
They used to have data for+P 45 with power pistol.
New data, pp was dropped in favor of the new kid in town.

With the powder plight of late, I find these things out of touch with reality.
Why swap and drop when the customer base needs data to load what they can find, rather than what is billed as optimum.
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Old 06-28-2014, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by venomballistics View Post
They used to have data for+P 45 with power pistol.
New data, pp was dropped in favor of the new kid in town.
Alliant's manual have been getting worse each year which disappoints me since I use their powders the most.

They list (3) 45ACP (+P) loads, all BE86. The 230gr JHP (+P) lists 6.9grs/935fps as max & the standard pressure load for the same bullet/components lists as 6.8grs/927fps? Really?

I thought I heard this powder would be closer to Power Pistol but it does appear to be closer to Unique.
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Old 06-28-2014, 01:45 AM
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Tell me about it.
Here's a good one the new 2000 mr powder.
Loads for both 308 and 300 win mag, yet no data for 3006
Stranger still, it's listed for most of the calibers derived from 06.
not sure what they are doing in the lab these days.
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Old 06-28-2014, 08:16 AM
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And

They don't even list 2400 for 357 mag with 158 LSWC'S

Their marriage to Speer is short sighted....they are a powder company.
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Old 06-28-2014, 11:29 AM
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I never cared for Alliants "manual" or data listings. Compared the Hodgdons their listings are very poor.

Plus they could not come up with a better name than BE-86? No confusing there with Bullseye

Actually Power Pistol was Bullseye 84 used by the manufacturers.

Guess they like to spread the Bull.
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Old 06-28-2014, 12:31 PM
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A few months back I found some data some where.. 2014 new.

Only one loading per bullet weigh for the weapons !

the one for a 38 158 lead had a maximum of 982 fps.

I hope they come out with a little more info !!
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Old 06-28-2014, 03:35 PM
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I was told at the NRA show that BE-86 is essentially Powder Pistol with flash suppressors added.

If I had some, I would work up slowly from Power Pistol data and see how it did.
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Old 06-28-2014, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter M. Eick View Post
I was told at the NRA show that BE-86 is essentially Powder Pistol with flash suppressors added.

If I had some, I would work up slowly from Power Pistol data and see how it did.
This is BAD advice!!!!!!!

If BE86 is slower than Unique, and faster than Power Pistol, (and this is what it appears to be) then start with UNIQUE data and work up from there, not from the slower propellant!!!! If you look at what data is available where a relatively direct comparison can be made you will see that BE86 charge weights are lower than Power Pistol for the same bullet weight.
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Old 06-28-2014, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter M. Eick View Post
I was told at the NRA show that BE-86 is essentially Powder Pistol with flash suppressors added.

If I had some, I would work up slowly from Power Pistol data and see how it did.
Gee, why not use the limited data that they have published??
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Old 06-28-2014, 08:01 PM
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Gee, why not use the limited data that they have published??
Because that's just crazy talk!!!
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Old 06-28-2014, 08:12 PM
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Next thing you know Dillon haters will be mounting Dillons to their reloading benchs.
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Old 06-29-2014, 12:22 AM
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Because that's just crazy talk!!!
I guess, real Men do not need instructions

There should only be one powder. Trail Boss, we don't need no stinking load data for that!
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Old 06-29-2014, 01:14 AM
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Like I have said before, it seems the powder industry is moving towards "newer" powders and retiring the older ones. This is probably a good thing but not for people like me who are adverse to change. Add to that the fact of all the time and components dedicated to working up loads with those powders, well you see what I mean.

When you see old and trusted powders like SR-7625, SR-4756, SR-4759 and even PB being discontinued and newer powders like Lil'Gun, AutoComp, BE-86, CFE-Pistol, Clay Dot and Power Pro 300-MP coming to market we can only guess that's the way the manufacturers are heading.

One note, Alliant seems to have a huge catalog of powders, more than any other company. I don't understand how all the shotgun powders they have can't be an overlap and in excess. They now list 14 shotgun powders and an additional 5 handgun powders. That is a whole bunch of stuff IMO. (not to mention the 14 rifle powders in their catalog too)
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Old 06-29-2014, 10:56 AM
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Rule 3,

They don't have data out for the caliber I am interested in using in. Thus you have to "wing it". That is what I will do when i get some so we can learn.
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Old 06-29-2014, 11:13 AM
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Old powder out, new powder in.............

In the 70's we had Grey B, N2010, 230-P, 450-LS, N2020, 500-HS, AL-7, 630-P etc. etc..................

Some of these had to go to make way for todays "Old Powders".

I would not mind the change over if they produce a true "Magnum Powder" that keeps up with the SR4756, 2400 or the H110 type powders.

Less muzzle flash is a good thing.....if we don't loose fps for it.
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Old 06-29-2014, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter M. Eick View Post
Rule 3,

They don't have data out for the caliber I am interested in using in. Thus you have to "wing it". That is what I will do when i get some so we can learn.
Yes, but were to start??. If we at last had a burn rate we could kinda sorta figure about maybe somewhere to begin Even that is no guarantee.

Perhaps call or e mail them. Most cases if they do not list it it is not a preferred powder for that caliber but with Alliant. who knows.?

I would not base anything on what it is "supposed to be like"

Last edited by Rule3; 06-29-2014 at 01:39 PM.
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Old 06-29-2014, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
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Gee, why not use the limited data that they have published??
Because that isn't what "Experimental Loading" is about! That said, the vast majority of handloaders, especially ones with limited experience(!!!!!!) are well advised to stick to published data as you suggest.
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Old 06-29-2014, 06:34 PM
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Because that isn't what "Experimental Loading" is about! That said, the vast majority of handloaders, especially ones with limited experience(!!!!!!) are well advised to stick to published data as you suggest.
Don't get yourself in a tizzy now.He doesn't even have the powder and if your read the previous posts, Alliant does not list data for the cartridge he wants, so there may be a reason for that.
Difficult to experiment with something you do not have, nor know anything about.
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Old 06-29-2014, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
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He doesn't even have the powder and if your read the previous posts, Alliant does not list data for the cartridge he wants, so there may be a reason for that.
Difficult to experiment with something you do not have, nor know anything about.
Yes, he does have BE-86, read the original post, "I just purchased some of this powder from a distributor."

Based on the statements on the Alliant web-site, BE-86 is suitable for revolver loads, they just haven;t developed much data yet.

OP never mentions what caliber he is interested in! All he said was "When I went to the Alliant website there was no load data published....". You see, I read the OP and know what he said! The problem was he didn't know how to find the information on the Alliant web-site.
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Old 06-30-2014, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alk8944 View Post
Yes, he does have BE-86, read the original post, "I just purchased some of this powder from a distributor."

Based on the statements on the Alliant web-site, BE-86 is suitable for revolver loads, they just haven;t developed much data yet.

OP never mentions what caliber he is interested in! All he said was "When I went to the Alliant website there was no load data published....". You see, I read the OP and know what he said! The problem was he didn't know how to find the information on the Alliant web-site.
You are mixing up the posts. There are a few side tracks going on here.

My post was to Peter which is what I quoted, he does not have the powder and made the comment on "winging it"so we were no longer talking about the OP.
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  #38  
Old 06-30-2014, 02:58 PM
ArchAngelCD ArchAngelCD is offline
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Calm down guys, you are both better than that...
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  #39  
Old 06-30-2014, 06:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rule3 View Post
Don't get yourself in a tizzy now.He doesn't even have the powder and if your read the previous posts, Alliant does not list data for the cartridge he wants, so there may be a reason for that.
Difficult to experiment with something you do not have, nor know anything about.

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Old 07-01-2014, 12:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArchAngelCD View Post

One note, Alliant seems to have a huge catalog of powders, more than any other company. I don't understand how all the shotgun powders they have can't be an overlap and in excess. They now list 14 shotgun powders and an additional 5 handgun powders. That is a whole bunch of stuff IMO. (not to mention the 14 rifle powders in their catalog too)
They must have at least 6 fast burning shotgun powders that all say their primary purpose is 12 gauge target loads. How does one choose? If I ever run out of bullseye, I thought I might try one.
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Old 07-01-2014, 04:31 PM
deanodog deanodog is offline
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Just make more unique....PLEASE...I am ready to quit due to no powder.
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  #42  
Old 07-16-2014, 07:49 PM
Rule3 Rule3 is offline
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Here, this thread was first
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  #43  
Old 07-17-2014, 10:56 AM
Jaymo Jaymo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johngalt View Post
They must have at least 6 fast burning shotgun powders that all say their primary purpose is 12 gauge target loads. How does one choose? If I ever run out of bullseye, I thought I might try one.
I've been using Red Dot as a substitute for Bullseye.
I can get the Dots anywhere and have a lot more of it than BE
I generally use the same amount of RD as BE for a given load.
Sometimes I use 2-3 tenths of a grain more RD, sometimes up to 1/2 grain more. Usually not.

It has worked well fore, as a sub for BE, & it's a lot easier to find.
I may tailor most of my pistol loading to the Dot powders, since they are everywhere.

The Alliant manual shows some screaming .357 and .44 mag loads using the new 300-MP powder.
I have a pound of that.
Still trying to find some BE-86, as it seems to be a good 1000 FPS +\- pistol powder.
Seems like a performance substitute for Unique.

If only PB and 4756 weren't being dropped.
4756 is my favorite powder for hot Specials/light Magnums.
Unique is my second favorite, only because I have a lot more experience with 4756.
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  #44  
Old 07-17-2014, 12:52 PM
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Sort of weird how Bullseye and the w231 type powders have disappeared....................................

I just hope the companies are not making us use the new powders, due to this problem ??
If you get my drift..................
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  #45  
Old 07-20-2014, 08:00 AM
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There should only be one powder. Trail Boss, we don't need no stinking load data for that![/QUOTE]

Nah. Bring back the holy black!
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  #46  
Old 07-20-2014, 05:48 PM
rsrocket1 rsrocket1 is offline
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The problem is you can't get Trail Boss to shoot bullets any faster than airsoft velocities. You may as well use a slingshot . The only difference is that it makes a "bang" rather than a "boing" when flinging the projectile.

I find it crazy that Alliant is working on putting out a new powder when they can't seem to put out enough of what most people want (Unique, Bullseye, Red Dot).
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Old 07-27-2014, 04:51 PM
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Usually the company's data is a little high but they claim 982 fps with a 158 lead........
My test a few days ago with CFE put out 939 fps.

Looks like both "New Powders" are very close to one another.


CFE is just like w231 but slower............ I might have to try out the BE-86, one of these days, hoping it will fill the case up MORE.
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  #48  
Old 07-27-2014, 05:31 PM
sooftwn12 sooftwn12 is offline
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anyone use WW 296 for 357? JS
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  #49  
Old 07-27-2014, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sooftwn12 View Post
anyone use WW 296 for 357? JS
Yes, Win 296 is the same as H110 but this is another topic??

If you have questions on that application you can start another thread.
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