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Old 05-22-2015, 10:42 AM
Vortec MAX Vortec MAX is offline
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Default 45 ACP semi-wad cutter recommendations please

I like plated bullets and I cannot lie... but I don't like Berry's 200 gr SWC because it does not "cut" clean holes in the target. That was the only reason I bought them. The holes look the same as the 230 gr RN holes.

I don't like bare lead either because I don't like cleaning the lead deposits out of my barrel. So I am asking for recommendations on either plated or coated SWC bullets that forum members have had good experiences with. I want clean holes that are easier to score.

Thanks in advance.

Mike
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Old 05-22-2015, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
I want clean holes that are easier to score.

My first thought is to look at the target you are using. If you are hanging paper targets from a bar, the holes will all look like RN bullets, but a tagboard target on a stiff backer will give cleaner holes.
Still, the nature of plated bullets is that the edges are not as sharp as most lead cast SWC. An NRA scoring plug might help.
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Old 05-22-2015, 10:55 AM
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My good friend shoots nothing but Berry's, what is odd as they didn't offer a SWC in 45acp when I checked and I contacted them and they said they didn't offer it??? Oh well I have been shooting X-Treme 200gr SWC's but same issue, not a sharp enough shoulder to make the clean cuts, must be from the plating covering the edge.

I also agree about the type of paper being used having an effect on the puncture.

I have shot Bayou Bullets Hy-Tek coated and I think they made a bit cleaner of a hole than the plated but not anything like a lead bullet does that I used from Dardas Bullets.

I have more Bayou's coming in 44 cal 240gr in SWC's to try out.

Karl

Last edited by ontargetagain; 05-22-2015 at 10:56 AM.
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Old 05-22-2015, 10:58 AM
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I have been using Bear Creek molly coated bullets for years. I mostly shoot their 200gr hollow base round nose but they also make a 200gr semi wadcutter. It has a sharp edge that likes to get caught on the opening of the chambers. When you have a full moon clip of them it can slow your reloads down quite a bit, they do make nice clean holes if you are using the right paper.
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:07 AM
Vortec MAX Vortec MAX is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ontargetagain View Post
My good friend shoots nothing but Berry's, what is odd as they didn't offer a SWC in 45acp when I checked and I contacted them and they said they didn't offer it???
They are making SWCs now. This is what they look like:



Here is the link to their product page:

45 (.452) 200gr SWC - 500ct

They definitely have a rounded shoulder and not much of a "shelf." I shoot quite a few matches where they use photocopy type paper because it is cheap. However, I get similar results on actual NRA style targets using the thick tan paper.

From what I see so far, this problem is not limited to the Berry's. I might have to use bare lead for paper shoots. I was just hoping there was a plated or coated bullet that would have a sharp shoulder.

Thanks for the replies. Keep them coming.

Mike
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:11 AM
Vortec MAX Vortec MAX is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurac View Post
I have been using Bear Creek molly coated bullets for years. I mostly shoot their 200gr hollow base round nose but they also make a 200gr semi wadcutter. It has a sharp edge that likes to get caught on the opening of the chambers. When you have a full moon clip of them it can slow your reloads down quite a bit, they do make nice clean holes if you are using the right paper.
Does the moly coating prevent leading in the barrel?

Mike
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:20 AM
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I print all my targets on 32 pound paper and it does make a difference. Don
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:32 AM
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Been shooting the old H&G #68, 200 gr SWC for the past 40+ years in the .45 acp. Cuts a very clean hole in the target. With a gun capable of good accuracy I have seen one hole groups of 1 1/2" at 25 yds.

It's my go to load to test accuracy in any .45 acp pistol.

Getting cast bullets to shoot well out of a .45 acp is really an easy proposition. Try some .452" or .453" bullets with a FLAT base. NOT a beveled base you see on most commercially cast slugs. These do not have to be overly hard. Load them in decent .45 cases with Bullseye or WW231 to a target velocity.

Taper crimp without squishing down the bullet diameter. meaning.... crimp enough to hold the bullet firmly, no more.

Should shoot fine without leading.

90% of the time leading is a result of an undersized bullet not sealing the bore, lube that isn't lubricating, or a lousy bullet design allowing gases to sneak past the base. Any or all of these will give you leading.

Most commercially cast bullets...Cast from an overly hard alloy as thats what uninformed buyers feel they need. Bullet lube thats too hard, made to stay in the groove during shipping, not necessarily lube. and a bullet with a beveled base that allows it to fall out of the casting mold easily. yet is a lousy design to seal powder gases at the base of the slug.

Cast CAN shoot very accurately without leading. But the loader has to have a little knowledge on WHAT to load and how beforehand.
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vortec MAX View Post
Does the moly coating prevent leading in the barrel?

Mike
I have experienced zero leading with molly coated bullets, and you get maybe 10% of the smoke associated with conventionally lubed lead. I hear the powder coated bullets are even better so I may have to try those some day.
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:54 AM
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FWIW and an aside; I found leading in my 1911 barrel and then slugged the barrel and sized my bullets accordingly. I experience no leading from my 200 gr. LSWC (H&G mod. 68 clone) when properly sized...
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Old 05-22-2015, 11:56 AM
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Your targets placed on a cardboard backer will help. For informal practice I print my targets on "card-stock". You can buy a ream (150 sheets) for $3 - $4. I also use this card-stock to print pictures on, much cheaper than photo paper.
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Old 05-22-2015, 12:57 PM
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What post 8 -10-&11 said. I make my own 200s hard cast at .452 with a flat base. Zero lead. I like to shoot white foam plates at 25 & 50 at less than .03 cents each. Easy to see the holes. Not counting my time cost is about $6 a 100 on the loaded bullets. Clean holes stapled to plywood or cardboard.

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Old 05-22-2015, 01:20 PM
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I'll second the H&G 68 200gr LSWC.

I've been shooting this round for over 40 years. Back then the standard loading (to make major) was 5.8 grs of 231 and the H&G 68 bullet. This was the load you found in 90% of the serious competitors guns.

I now load the H&G 68 (clone) (purchased from Mastercast in Enon, PA) over 4.2-4.4 grs of Winchester WST. Really a nice shooting load and leaves NO LEADING in the barrel.

Properly sized and correct hardness (of the bullet) will virtually eliminate the leading issue, expecially with a slow round such as the .45 ACP.

Plus, I've always thought that a lead projectile (vs jacketed/plated) was "easier" on the barrel.
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Old 05-22-2015, 01:54 PM
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Hornady's 200 gr swaged LSWC don't lead and cut clean holes if the target has a good stiff backing. I use them with 3.9 gr Bullseye.
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Old 05-22-2015, 04:05 PM
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I've used Missouri "Button" 185-grain SWCs with good success for what you're doing but they aren't coated so if that's important to you, look into Precision Delta's SWCs with their "match" lube. It's dry and so invisible that I had to call to confirm my first box actually had a lubricant on them. They shoot accurately and cut sharp, round holes in my targets.

Ed
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Old 05-22-2015, 07:50 PM
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Default Missouri coated...

Missouri coated SWCs are fantastic.

In addition: I'll take coated over moly any day.
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Old 05-23-2015, 01:09 AM
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Load your ammo to 800 fps and you will get "paper punch" sharp cut holes. I shoot cheap paper targets on a shot out backer board. Fuzzy holes are 'light' powder charges, sharp cut holes were correctly charged.
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Old 05-23-2015, 02:19 AM
Vortec MAX Vortec MAX is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engineer1911 View Post
Load your ammo to 800 fps and you will get "paper punch" sharp cut holes. I shoot cheap paper targets on a shot out backer board. Fuzzy holes are 'light' powder charges, sharp cut holes were correctly charged.
I think it is the bullets in this case. I have attached pics of a couple of targets shot on 3x5 index cards (heavy paper) at extreme velocities:

Mike
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File Type: jpg 200 gr SWC.jpg (62.6 KB, 1 views)
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Old 05-23-2015, 08:15 AM
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I've had good luck with 200gr. SWC coated bullets from Precision Bullets, out of Kemp, Tx:
Welcome to Precision Bullets in Kemp, Texas.

And with Blue Bullets, out of Kernersville, NC:
The Blue Bullets
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Old 05-24-2015, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engineer1911 View Post
Load your ammo to 800 fps and you will get "paper punch" sharp cut holes. I shoot cheap paper targets on a shot out backer board. Fuzzy holes are 'light' powder charges, sharp cut holes were correctly charged.
Bullseye shooter here. Heavier paper means sharp cut holes with SWC, so if you're printing targets on your printer, that's a problem. Also, the quality of your target backer counts. Don't expect clean sharp holes if the target's not supported. That being said, my 625 fps target loads cut sharp holes without being loaded to 825 fps levels. I use my own home cast H&G 68 bullets that have a nice sharp shoulder.

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