I have a S&W K38 that is over 40 year old and has had quite a bit of use but never had much of a leading problem. Recently I bought some Hornady 148 gr HBWC and loaded them with 2.7 gr Bullseye powder. I made the OAL 1.170 and used a crimp 0.372. Unfortunately I got quite a bit of leading in the first 1/2 inch of the barrel. and the accuracy from my Ransom Rest was poor. I am a Bullseye shooter so accuracy is my main goal. I had read on many forums that this was considered a very accurate load so I am looking for suggestions as to what I have to change to get this resolved

What ammunition have you been shooting in the K38?

My first step would be to be ABSOLUTELY sure ALL the lead and copper was removed from the barrel. Then fire some fouling shots and try the accuracy test again.

Remingon HBWC are messy looking, but I have gotten better results with them. YMMV

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Science plus Art

I Size them the same size as the end of the cylinder. I am using 3.1 in my wheel guns without a problem. We shoot hbwcs every weekend. I have 3D--Remington--& Star hbwcs. A button nose will shoot as good in some guns. I like to have to push mine through. 1/2 thousandth over should work also. One batch of Remington I bought measured .360 and had to resize to work in my automatic. The last ones measure .357. Try to stay below 830 fps. Try to push a .358 jacketed bullet through the cylinder. I cant push one through mine. Is yours like a 15-3 or a 14-2- 6 inch? I have one made in 1950 & one from 1959 that requires a .358 bullet. Cylinder gap ok?

Yes I'm sure the gun was perfectly clean when we started the test. In a test on the previous day I used Remington Target Round nose and got pretty good accuracy and no leading.

Check to make sure your cylinder is locking up correctly and hasn't become misaligned. Make sure the face of you cylinder is clean and not dragging the forcing cone. If you don't have a forcing cone reamer, get one and make sure it is very clean. Check with Hornady and ascertain if you may have received a batch with softer than normal lead.

Many times leading at the beginning, or chamber end of the barrel indicates bullets too small in diameter (even skirted bullets). Soft lead can be easily swaged down when seating in a tight case (You're not using a Lee FCD are you?). Pull a loaded bullet and measure. Another thought, mebbe up the charge to 3.0 gr. and perhaps that will expand the skirt enough to stop the leading...

I'm not a bullseye shooter, but I shoot a lot of lead in other pistol calibers. Some thoughts:
Chamber throats (and bullets) should ideally be
.005 to .01" over groove diameter. Undersize bullets will tend to lead the beginning of the barrel (as stated by Mikld above)
Pushing soft lead too fast will cause leading (not the case with you)
Too mild a load will not obturate the base of the bullet. Gas will leak past and cause leading. (I don't think this is your problem either).
Some revolvers just don't like certain bullet/powder combinations. I call it the "x" factor. I've shot handloads that were great in one gun and horrible in the next. It happens.
Try varying the charge or another powder. If nothing works, don't buy those pesky bullets again. At least not for this K.

Not sure if your shooting HBWC's that are dead soft and swaged or harder but you might consider the following. Most soft swaged HBWC's are used in bullseye mid-range competition in semi-autos. 2.7 gr of BE is close to a standard target load so you're not pushing the bullet too fast. Some tight revolvers can shoot HBWC pretty well but most I've seen and owned can't. They prefer DEWC's on the harder side.

Soft lead or swaged hollow base wadcutters resemble an air gun pellet with a skirt at the base. To shoot this type of bullet in revolver it has to jump the cylinder gap. The bullet has left the chamber with hot gas driving it toward the barrel cone but during this brief time and distance in the gap the lead skirt is completely unsupported and hot gas pressure is forcing it open. Forcing it to open up beyond the bore diameter and at the same time expose more of the bullet's base to flame. It then slams into the forcing cone where I suspect the base of the bullet has melted and will skid a ways into the barrel before engaging the rifling. This is a recipe for leading.

I would look closely at your bullet hardness and design the think about changing to a hard cast DEWC that is properly sized to your gun. I used to shoot a lot of Bullseye with my 14 and always shot DEWC's which out of a Ransom rest printed very tight.

Good luck

I think this makes a lot of sense. I don't shoot WC's and never would have thought of this. My understanding was that HBWC's and bullseye were the default combo in revolvers in this caliber.

I used to shoot PPC (7 to 50 yards) with a six inch .38 special and always used swagged HBWCs, as did 99% of the other competitors. I shot reloads in practice and Remington factory loads in competition. Never experienced the issue you describe except when revolver had not been properly cleaned, or there was a misalignment between the cylinder and forcing cone. All things being equal, and if you have never experienced this issue before, I would again recommend you check with your bullet manufacture to ascertain if you got a soft batch. I still reload and shoot Hornady bullets in my .38s all the time with no issues.

Suck that load up to a OAL of 1.15".............
and try a light, medium and heavy crimp with that load to see what happens.

I went as much as a OAL of 1.20" and tested 14 powders with the Speer 148 HBwc....

Bullseye at 2.7 works in all my weapons.
Good luck.

I use the Hornady HBWC with 2.8 gr Bullseye. I get a little bit of leading, but nothing serious. I tend to not clean my gun much, I think more damage is done by over cleaning guns and scoring the muzzle with the rod than by shooting them. I get excellent accuracy.

Bullseye does burn a bit warm (in temperature). If you have W231/HP38, I have found that 3.2 gr works almost as well, and burns cooler with less leading.

Even with the possibly slightly more leading with Bullseye, I have settled on it for my load. I used up the last of my W231 a long time ago.

I wonder if your problem could be with crimp damaging the bullet? I apply just barely enough to remove the case flare. I don't go far enough to actually apply a roll crimp.

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Common sense isn't so common.

That is almost a 'standard' load for target shooting. I use the Speer and Hornadys swaged jobs and they are both very good.

Leading points to gases getting past the bullet seal and normally HBWCs have no problem fitting the barrel.
I wonder if a slightly hotter load would expand the skirt better?

If not there's something happening to the bullet before it gets past the forcing cone.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

As a few others have mentioned, I'd suggest trying no crimp. Use a taper crimp die if you have one. You don't need a crimp with that fast powder anyway & it may be damaging the soft lead bullet's shape. Worth a try.

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Waiting for the break of day

I found that when shooting HBWC no matter, what you will always get a certain amount of leading not only in the barrel, but in the forcing cone and in the cylinder charge holes also. The Lewis Lead remover makes quick work of removing all lead with no big effort. IMHO if you shoot lead WC's - get the LLR!! Sold at Brownell's.

.372 isn't really a crimp. It's just getting the OD down to where the round will chamber. That's what I get with my RCBS die set to "seat without crimping". So I think you're OK there and your OAL is good too.

As others have said, try 3.0 and see what happens. The 2.7 grs. isn't cast in stone, and your scale could be a smidge off. If no joy there I'd switch to DEWCs, hard cast.

I switched to DEWCs many years ago because they are a heck of a lot cheaper, and less prone to leading, for me.

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USAF, 69-92
Vietnam, 72-73

One thing about reloading, you never know what load a weapon will like with the 148gr style bullet, target loads.

I have one J frame that like w231.....
one J frame that likes Bullseye....
and a K frame that likes Red Dot for fac dup target loads.

Two like the HBwc, while best groups out of another revolver come with a BBwc style bullet at the little longer OAL.

My new 686 6" is a garbage can.........
it likes any thing you put into it.

Good shooting.