FWIW, for me, the best approach seems to be to pick and carry factory loads as my SD ammo and handload as close to them as possible to that for practice loads.

Like others have said, I don't want to be trying to explain or justify the ballistics of my handloads to a jury. At least with factory ammo I won't be expected to do that.

As others have also said, the lawyers are going to paint anything you do in a negative light, no sense giving them one MORE thing to try to prove you did something wrong - like load up some kind of hot "killer" ammo.

I like this train of thought and I am going to start with copying some factory SD best I can. It's easy enough to get Hornady, Speer, etc. HP for loading and testing. Proper COL with the identical (or VERY close) bullet weight, as you mention, would seem critical. As I mentioned before, I will start with this approach and then decide whether to actually carry my hand loads.

Thanks to the last several posters for getting back on track with the original intent of the thread.

That said, the legal side of the debate is interesting I just didn't want "drift" to far in that area because I know it has been discussed many times in the past.

Great stuff and lots to keep the brain and press working!

(I still can't get the multi-quote function to work??)

I carry factory loaded ammunition designed for self-defense in my carry guns. That being said, I inspect every round before it goes into a cylinder or magazine. Defects do happen.
My practice ammo (except for my issued Glock 23) is reloaded by me.
I load in 100 to 200 round batches with a old Pacific single state press. 99.9 percent of them go bang.
I could probably produce SD ammo for my own use that would meet or exceed the quality of factory ammo. To me, it isn't worth the time. YMMV.

I used to reload my & my wife's carry ammo. I stopped & started buying both of us ammo. Not because of reliability, I have no concerns what so ever with ammo I load. I did it because of these crazy Commonwealth Attorneys in some areas of VA. I've heard horror stories about them accusing people of using "hot reloaded hollow points designed to kill" in carry guns after shootings. Just one less thing to worry about.

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I'm 67. I don't do timeouts.

I tailor each load to the gun they are being used in. My .357 loads for inside the house are really low end. The loads for my J frame .38 are as hot as I can shoot them consistently. The same goes for different sizes/weights of 9mm pistol. I make them so I can practice with a load of similar velocity and recoil, but with a cheaper bullet. I wouldn't kick using proper factory ammo, but I can do the same job a lot cheaper.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

I would not reload my carry ammo. If something happens and the bullet goes through the intended target and hits someone or something else the finger can always be pointed to the ammo manufacturer. Theory of deep pockets. I carry for work and use what they give me. If I carried for personal I would reload to factory specs for training but, still carry factory. If I was the lady in Texas that was convicted for having hollow points I would sue my attorney and get a new trial for ineffective council. That is absolutely stupid. Was this the only liberal prosecutor in Texas. Hollow point stops the fight faster and less chance of going through bad guy and into someone else.

If I understand correctly a Texas DA tried a woman for murder/manslaughter after a shooting in which someone with a RO against them kicked the door sown and was hitting her? I can't imagine a DA getting re-elected under those circumstances in any state of the Union let alone getting as far as a jury trial. Was this a civil matter from the dead persons extended family? I see no benefit if the wife did the shooting.

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Front sight and squeeze

My reloading goals for pistol were two-fold. First, I wanted to find loads using different powders that were close in velocity and energy to factory target/plinking loads. I usually end up settling on good target loads that fall under the energy and velocity of factory ammo, and are more pleasant to shoot a lot of. Second, I try to find loads that duplicate the energy and velocity of the best defense loads. Not that I want to use them for defense, but I want to have the data in a pile in case someday I have no other choice. I usually use XTPs because they are readily available and generally a very high quality product. I try to keep 500 XTPs on hand for each caliber for that day when I may have to make my own.

I usually carry Federal HSTs in my defense pistols, but in 380, the XTPs seem to be top performers. I still buy those already loaded. I think you could potentially get yourself in a tough spot if you loaded your handloads hotter than is readily available, or used something exotic, even if it was a factory round. I don't think there would be much to say if your handloads did not outperform factory ammunition in terms of velocity or energy. I play it safe though.

Luckily, I think our local law enforcement also uses HSTs, so I could point to that as what reasonable and well informed persons choose for self defense.

Mike

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NRA Certified Pistol Inst.

Remember it's a lawyers job to take black and white and make it gray. I was called for possible jury duty once some years ago in a case where a man had shot his wife. in the jury selection process I was ask was I familiar with firearms, after my yes reply it advanced to handguns specifically. When I replied yes, the defense lawyer immediately ask the judge to strike me from the jury pool. I later found out his argument for innocence for his client after the gun discharged "accidentally", sort real of a reach for an older 1911 with all the safeties they have.

Groo here
I guess I am "very" old school.
I would carry my loads "if" there was not a factory load that fit the
conditions.
I don't shoot factory at the range except to check sights/function.
Factory is loaded to a constant so "if it did work, it will work"
I DO NOT shoot full power to practice except in the lesser
cartridges. , 32, 38,357[in larger frame guns.
Practice is just that "practice" heavy loads [SD anyway] are not needed
nor wanted.
Grip, sight picture,trigger control etc are what you are after.
The heaver the load the faster you wear out and that screws
up your "practice"
The revolver can shoot "mouse fart" loads so a "few" heavies
can be shot at the end.
Auto rounds have a much smaller range because the load needs to work the slide, so the difference between target and full "whup" is less.
You will react as you have trained regardless of the
lightness or heaviness of a given load,shooting the same place,at the same speed. [ every notice when you shoot both revolvers and autos
that you shoot both at the same speed? ]

How many documented times has this actually come up in court?
Out of ALL of the shooting related cases over the past 50 years?

And how the (insert word of choice here) do they even know the cartridges were hand loaded? One Remington case looks much like another after it is fired.

I load what I carry, which is usually lead SWC or WFN, aka hunting or target ammo. I don't have any "factory" ammo, I don't even have any jacketed bullets for pistols, and haven't had any for many years.

The best defensive ammo is what is in your gun.

OK, I love this forum and it makes my day when I get to read whatever Engineer1911 has to say.

~~

I've given this subject about 30 seconds worth of intense thought in the past. I'm a simple man, and a very cheap *** too. Here is my S.O.P:

My SD is a full size Kimber 1911 in .45acp. I can much more accurately shoot this fine gun than I can my prized 686 in double action.

My SD ammo is Federal Hydra-Shok 230 gr. JHP. I've fired a whopping total of 30 rounds of this, for a feel of recoil, gage of accuracy, and test whether my Kimber liked to feed them. Now, this gun has been 100% reliable with whatever ammo or handload I feed it, over 5k rounds or so, so I have no problem with this round. Recoil no big deal either. The only pain I felt was in the wallet, at $1.40 a shot.

So- I simply look on the back of the Hydra-Shok box, note that the muzzle velocity was near 900fps; note that my two favorite and most accurate 230 gr. (14 cents per shot) handloads are 880 and 850fps respectively. It's hard to tell the difference between my store-bought SD ammo and my practice stuff, except for the smell.

I carry my 32s&w long M31-1 and considered hand loading as most factory loads are wimpy.

Then I found Buffalobore SD loads and decided I couldn't improve on them enough to matter.

So I practice with cheap factory ammo and carry BB.

I'd say it depends on the caliber and price a what is available from the factories.

I have carried handloads in my self defense gun. Fortunately, I have never needed to use them.