I've been loading pistol rounds for ~25 years using Lee carbide sizing dies. I've always tumbled cases clean before sizing and reloading, almost always in corn cob, usually with a bit of polish added to the media after every few batches and run for a couple of hours to spread it out. I have NEVER lubed a 380, 9mm Mak, 9mm Luger, 38 Special, 357 Mag, 44 Mag, 45 Colt or 45 ACP case using these dies.

I recently discovered the joys of 32 caliber revolvers (accidentally, after buying a Colt Detective Special in 32 to use to fit BK grip adapters - the 32 was cheaper than any of the 38 Special guns I saw, and since all I wanted it for was the grip size and shape . . . ) I now have a 31-1 in 32 S&W Long and a 432PD in H&R Mag, and bought Lee carbide die sets in each size - so I wouldn't have to change seating and crimp settings when loading each size.

Both of the carbide size dies would start off fine, but after only 10-20 rounds would be scratching the cases like crazy. I could clean the carbide ring, ending up with Flitz on a Q-tip spinning in a Dremel tool, but this would only start the process over. Fine at first, but quickly building up some kind of grit that scratched the cases. Effort went up on the press handle as the scratching got worse.

Lee kindly polished each of the dies for me, and after coming back they feel like all of my other carbide dies when sizing a case. But each die came with a note saying that new or highly polished brass could leave particles on the carbide ring, and I should use some lube when using these dies.

As I said, I have never used lube on pistol cases, nor have I ever had this kind of scratching problem with any of the other calibers I've loaded over the years. The 32s are mostly Starline cases, my case brand of choice for a long time. I haven't needed to reload any cases since the dies came back from Lee, so I don't really know if lube will be essential to keep scratching from recurring with the newly polished dies.

But I'm wondering if anybody else has had this experience? And if lube is (effectively) needed, what's the best choice if I want to do a few hundred cases at a go? I don't want to have to clean lube off the cases after sizing (like I have to do with 223, 308, etc cases), as that takes away a WHOLE LOT of the advantages of a progressive press. It looks like Hornady One Shot is something that doesn't have to be wiped off, but I may be misreading things.

Thoughts and suggestions will be appreciated.

I'm fairly new to reloading so take this for what it's worth. I've used both the Hornady titanium nitride coated dies and the Lee carbide dies. Both say lube is not needed as the surface of the sizing ring is slick. After trying it both lubed and unlubed the effort required to run the press is much less when the cases are lubed so that's the way I do it. I line the cases up in a group of 100 and hit them with a little Hornady One Shot on two sides. Doesn't take much at all. I then proceed with loading. Once the 100 rounds are loaded I do wipe each one down as I put them in a box.

I apply a very light "spritz" of diluted water base lube to all my brass, any caliber, even with carbide dies. It makes sizing much smoother

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Still Running Against the Wind

I've been lubing my 45 colt cases lately.It makes resizing easier and it's easy enough using any kind of spray.I just tumble them after sizing instead of before to get it off.

I used to not lube them since I was told I didn't need to. Then I gave it a shot and the dies resize much easier. I do it for all my batches now. Just a spritz into a plastic Baggie filled with cases and then roll them around for a few seconds.

I don't normally lube and I also do not polish the dickens out of my cases. If the cases are just cleaned in walnut hull and don't have residue, that is ready to load. If you have new cases, a little shot of case lube helps. The carbide sizers are not designed for surgically clean bare brass.

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Science plus Art

I suspect that you had some sizing dies that weren't properly polished. Because that is the only explanation I can think of that would cause the problem with scratches you reported.

BTW, my 40 caliber and 380 ACP dies are Lee and my 38 spl/357 Magnum and 45 ACP dies are RCBS. Many times I've sized cases straight out of the range baggie without doing any cleaning or lubrication at all. However, if the cases are really grungy or I find the flaring die is "thumbcuffing" the cases I will use lube to make things easier. Then it's into a wet bath with stainless pins for an hour or so and into a ziplock bag after the cases are dry. When I do use lube I use the RCBS case lube. I keep thinking about trying the spray stuff but I still have plenty of the RCBS lube on hand and I know exactly how much to put on a rifle case so the shoulders don't buckle. As for lubing handgun cases, I tray up 50 cases and simply press the lube pad down on the entire tray. Doing this leaves a tiny ring of lube that is just perfect for a tray of handgun cases.

I too load 32 S&W Longs with Lee dies. I have no problem with the sizing die, but that
silly powder through expanding die with the "floating" expander inside is a clunky
pain. Virgin brass it wouldn't let go, better with used brass, but not much.

I only lube rifle brass when I size, but here's something to try. Treat your tumbling media with Dillon rapid polish, and cut up a dryer sheet and put that in with the cases. Between the two they essentially come out "sorta lubed" and breeze through sizing dies with nothing to clean off after. Every few months I clean my sizing dies with a patch wet with Balistol, which also helps quite a bit.

Most of my dies are Redding or RCBS.
I really like Redding and use their dual ring carbide dies for 44.
If you are using polish in a tumbler, I have found that just leaving that on the brass is enough to help them thru a carbide die.
Nickel plated brass is a different story. I have quite a bit of it.
I do as several of the above suggest and put a very light spray on those.
Once you get galling on a die you must clean it or you will scratch the brass.
I put JB on a patch on a tight jag and mounted in a batdrill, polish the carbide ring until the offending metal is gone.
Lubing all the brass is certainly not going to hurt anything and will make everything slicker than hog snot on a brass rail.
Steel dies I clean every time they are used. Mostly by running an oil rag thru them to pick up any loose schmutz.

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NEMO
"Everything 44"

Apart from the fact that I've never had cause to even think about lubing cases in the 25 or so years I've been using Lee dies for other calibers, I wouldn't mind applying a spray lube to cases before starting the reloading process on a progressive press. What I'm not at all thrilled about is the prospect of having to deprime and size, THEN put the cases back in the tumbler to get the lube OFF.

I do that with rifle cases out of necessity. But it would mean handling each 32 case again (after the second cleaning) to be sure there's no cleaning media stuck in the flash hole. And there's no easy way to start deprimed cases in the priming stage of a Loadmaster to carry on with the rest of the steps.

I know I've sized hundreds if not thousands of virgin Starline cases over the years without a separate lubrication step and without a hint of problems. And all of the tens of thousands of rounds I've reloaded with non-virgin brass have gone through pretty much the same cleaning cycle before getting resized. Again, without lube and without a hint of the problems I've seen with these two 32 dies. I'm guessing that the residue of the polish I add to the corncob has been enough for the other calibers, but for some reason isn't enough for the 32 cases/dies.

I think I will try adding even more of the polish to the corncob and run some virgin Starline brass through that. I'll pick the flash holes just to see if the process will eliminate the galling/scratching.

If that doesn't work, does anybody know if the Hornady One Shot is truly intended to be left on the cases after processing, or does it need to be cleaned off like all other lubes before the ammo is fired? I see hints that it's OK to leave it on, but haven't found anything specific.

I've lubed using a dab of alox diluted in Alcohol. Just a little dab ill do ya. . Sorry couldn't resist.
It dries quickly and I've never removed it. Lube, load, shoot.

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Reg. Magnum wants/Rossi wallet

I lube all my cases, including straight wall handgun cases. It makes a 100+ session with a Dillon easier on the old arm joints. I do this by spraying a couple of pumps of RCBS spray lube into a gallon Zip lock bag, add a couple of hundred cases, Zip her up and roll the bag around in my hands for a minute or two and it's done. leaves a very thin, but effective, coat on each case and powder from case cleaning sticks to the bag, well at least some of it. The lube coat is light enough that I don't clean it off. Bottleneck rifle cases are another matter.

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Foster Positivity.

I deprime and size first, then I tumble in walnut media and car polish. A quick spin in the media separator has never left anything behind, but even if it did, I sonic clean the tumbled brass anyway and rinse them off after that. Brass is shiny inside and out. When they're dry I expand them all so they're
Ready for primers as I need them.

I've been reloading for over 25 years and also believed that lube wasn't necessary if I use carbide ring dies on straight cases. I eventually learned that a quick spray of Hornady One-Shot sure did give my beat-up right elbow a lot less stress. I just sprayed a big batch of 9mm this afternoon when I noticed the sizing die was giving a lot of resistance.

Spray...a little spritz will save your arm!

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Bob.
SWCA 1821

Toss the loaded rounds in for five minutes,it won't hurt anything.

Haven't read anything specific in that regard, but since I use One-shot as my primary gun cleaner and lube, AND the properties of that are very similar to One-shot case lube, I've never bothered cleaning off the minimal amount of case lube remaining after I've reloaded them. Heck, I figure it's already inside the chamber and bore anyway from my cleaning.

Ref: http://www.hornady.com/assets/files/...-Advantage.pdf

I haven't been lubing my straight wall cases but I do wash and tumble them which makes them negotiate the dies very easily. I'll also try some lube. Thanks for the tip.

I wouldn't overthink it... For pistol calibers, like you, I tumble my brass in corncob, with some NuFinish polish mixed in. I then spread the clean cases on a high sided sheet metal tray, spay a little One Shot over them and roll/mix them around. I usually let them dry, but not always. I also don't spray too much on the cases. Then it's loading as usual. I never tumble decapped cases, that is done on the press after cleaning.

I do not clean off the One Shot, and don't notice any troublesome residue. And yes, the lube does help. Just smooths things out. Don't "need" it, but it is easier on the shoulder and, again, nice and smooth.

I don't load 32s, but if the case is like 9mm, it will have a slight taper. 9mm is definitely helped by a little lube... I also use Lee dies for some of my calibers, and they work great.

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NRA Life Member

I lube my dies about ever 10 case just makes them work better for me.
HORNET

OK, I've got a can of One Shot on order. Should be here in a couple of days.

+1 on the Hornady One Shot.

I use it on my 9mm, 44Mag, 45 Colt, 460Mag & 500Mag brass. The 9mm is tapered, the 45 Colt's are fired in generously sized chambers, & the 460/500 are just LONG cases. It makes it so much easiler on them. I lie them flat in my old/retired plastic oil change pan to spray them, then I mix them up & give them one more shot of lube. Then I media tumble after sizing.

.

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Waiting for the break of day

I had similar issues when I started loading 32, also with Lee dies and new Starline brass. It was particularly noticeable with cases sticking in the expander die. I did a light chamfer/de-burr of the case mouths using Lee's cheap little hand chamfer tool, and this solved the problem for me.

I am working my way through 2,000 pieces of new Starline .32 S&W Long with RCBS dies (no lube) and haven't had a scratch yet. Same with 32 H&R new brass.

Stu

I've never lubed handgun cases and never had a problem with scratched cases. I suspect those Lee dies were the problem.

As for reducing the resizing effort, I find lubing cases and cleaning them afterwards far more work than a little more tug on the press handle. Some 12-ounce curls would help build up those press muscles.

I use Dillon case lube instead of One Shot (which I used to use) mainly because One Shot is an aerosol while the Dillon is a pump spritzer. I find I can control the amount easier with the Dillon. They both work fine as a lube. At the peak of the shooting season, I load about 1000 rounds a week, I only load 9mm Luger and wouldn't even think about loading without lube, it's just so much easier. Even Dillon (in their instruction manual) says that while it's possible to load without lubing the cases, they recommend lubing. I don't use a lot of lube, about 3 squirts on 2500 cases and then roll them around in a towel hammock.

I've never had the scratching issue (even without lubing). I lube the first one and when the force needed to run the case through the sizer gets back to the un-lubed amount I lube another with an RCBS pad. Works out to be about every 5th case or so.

A number of years ago, I began reloading .32 S&W Long for a new Walther GSP-C, starting with 500 pieces of new Lapua brass and a new Redding sizing die. I like to resize even new cases before I load them, and started noticing scratches on the cases after I'd run a few dozen through the die.

It turned out that what I was getting was galling of the brass in a few spots on the inside of the carbide ring, and that was giving me the scratches. After some discussion with a Redding tech, he explained that brand new brass is much cleaner than any that's been fired and tumbled (not sure if that's also the case for the newer stainless-steel pin method) and that's what can result in the galling. He recommended I clean the galled brass out of the die and use light lube for the first sizing of the remaining brass, both of which I did, and had no further issues. He also said that subsequent sizing of the same brass sans lube following firing and tumbling shouldn't result in the same problem, and that turned out to be the case as well.

For my carbide sizing dies I lube a case every 200-300 rounds or so.

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Dave
SWCA #2465

For my 32 Long and 32 H&R Mag I use a wipe of Imperial sizing lube with the Hornady Titanium Nitride dies on every 3rd or 4th case. It seems to work well. I do not do this on any of my Carbide dies.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

I only libe them if my right shoulder is bothering me. Otherwise i wind it quite managable and doesnt hurt anything. That being said Im speaking of .357 and .44 RM.

S&W HE, I like that idea of one every 2-300. I think I can learn to do that.
Thanks,
Stu

I lube my .357 cases. Don't have to, but a few don't like coming out of the expander die without a little umph. A touch of either Lee resizing lube or RCBS lube2 makes them very easy to both size and slide right out of the expander die. Both of them are water soluble, so there is no need to clean them before loading powder or primers. I normally just put a little on my finger and run my fingers through the container of cases. It easily puts a thin layer of lube on the cases.

I rough polish my cases then run then through the carbide sizer dry. No problems.

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Plant garlic in the fall

I normally don't lube, But when I do, It's Imperial sizing wax !!!

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Brand new brass is much stickier than old brass that has been through the tumbler. The dust from the tumbler makes a decent lube. My Lee dies are much stickier than my Hornady dies. The only time I lubed cases was running .45 auto brass through my Lee resizer.

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Common sense isn't so common.

https://www.dillonprecision.com/dill...8_8_23666.html

This stuff works great. I have to lube all of my 30 carbine brass even with carbide dies. Get a metal pie pan, throw 25-50 cases in it (no stacking) and give it a few shots. The stuff just evaporates in a few hours and leaves no residue. I don't know the chemical make up and I don't want to know. Slicker than snot on a door knob.

I don't own dillon anything but I use their case lube.

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That's just somebody talkin.

Groo here
You POLISH your brass??????????????????
I will clean the brass as needed but felt little need to get a high
shine on range brass.
If I make hunting or serious target loads I will use new, shined ,or
nickle brass.
But I will lube some brass just to make sizing easier.

At times I lube 357 Magnum cases. I lightly spray some Ballistol on a piece of paper toweling and lightly rub each case. I'm not a volume reloader but find that this slow and deliberate method with Ballistol/paper toweling really helps with smooth sizing through my carbide dies.

Ballistol will not harm primers, proven fact, but one would not even come close to getting some in the pockets with my method.

I use carbide dies and I have never lubed a pistol case when sizing. I tumble them to make sure they are clean before I start and have never had a problem.

That had been my experience for ~25 years before I got these two die sets in 32 caliber. Either something has changed with Lee's production QC recently, or there's something different about sizing 32 cases compared to larger diameter ones.

One thing that occurred to me recently is that, if cartridge case walls are generally about the same thickness, it may be that the smaller diameter of 32 cases makes them "stronger" in the sense that they resist being squeezed by the carbide sizing ring a bit more than larger diameter cases. That can't be a complete answer, because the die that Lee polished clearly worked more smoothly than before the polishing. But perhaps the difference in strength, or stiffness (if there is one) is just enough to make the smaller case more susceptible to having brass squeezed off the case and becoming embedded in the carbide ring, and causing scratches after a while. Any engineers out there? Does this make any sense?

In any event, I now have a can of One Shot, so when the next reloading time comes I'll be ready to try it.

Sadly, S&W condemned my new 432 when I sent it in for a couple of problems - that it came with, new in box. Cannot be repaired and they have no 32 caliber guns to offer as a replacement. So at the moment I'm down to 2 guns in 32 Long only, and I have all of my Long cases already loaded up. I was going to try the One Shot on some new Starline brass in H&R Mag, but I'm going to wait to see what kind of gun, if any, I can find to replace the 432 before I load up any more ammo that won't fit in any gun I now own.

I have never lubed my pistol cases except for .38 S&W. Similar to the OP's scratch problem with the little .32. It's the only Hornady die set I use BTW.

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"from my cold dead hands" C.H.