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Old 12-12-2016, 10:44 AM
tpole tpole is offline
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Default Poor, anemic .38

Some of you might recall my summer purchase of a .38/44 Outdoorsman. I've been methodically working up loads and range testing ever since in preparation for what I thought the revolver was built for (and reasonably capable of).

Anyway, to get your Mondays off to a controversial start, I attach the results. 58 yards, angling to me, dropped at the shot. Our deer in the Piedmont aren't midwest monsters. She weighed about 100 lbs.

Since I'm in the reloading forum I guess i better 'fess up to the recipe. The dearth of 2400 on the market had me spending a lot of time with what I could find, including relatively slow-burning shotgun powders. Incidentally, 800x performed well.

I finally settled on 13g, H110,158g LSWCHP.

Recovered the bullet just under the skin of the far side. Great performance there.
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  #2  
Old 12-12-2016, 11:07 AM
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Jingles Jingles is offline
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Don't you know the .38 is too weak to take a deer?

Nice job on the hunt; that bullet mushroomed very nicely.
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Old 12-12-2016, 11:17 AM
308 Scout 308 Scout is offline
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Excellent job! Proof positve that all one need do is poke holes in the lungs and/or heart.

What brand bullet? Did you chronograph?
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Old 12-12-2016, 11:20 AM
cowboy4evr cowboy4evr is offline
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In lieu of A2400 , I have found that Accurate #9 and Accurate 4100 work very well . #9 is on the fast side of 2400 , 4100 is just on the slow side of 2400 . They both meter very well , easier to handle than H110 / W296 and I just use small pistol primers . That's a great score getting that 38/44 . Thanks for sharing the results of such a great find .
You mean you didn't have to use a 500 Linebaugh on your recent kill ? LOL
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Old 12-12-2016, 11:35 AM
tpole tpole is offline
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Bullet was by Anderson Ballistics.

I did chrono--extensively. This load is low 1200s. My goal was 1250; didn't quite get there. But this load was so accurate, and without visible pressure signs, I parked the bus. 13 gs is a damn tight fit anyway.
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Old 12-12-2016, 11:35 AM
gregintenn gregintenn is offline
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Good shot!


The folks around here who swear it takes a minimum 8mm Magnum rifle to kill a whitetail seem to have no problems bowhunting. All it really takes is massive blood loss.
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Old 12-12-2016, 11:37 AM
tpole tpole is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboy4evr View Post
In lieu of A2400 , I have found that Accurate #9 and Accurate 4100 work very well . #9 is on the fast side of 2400 , 4100 is just on the slow side of 2400 . They both meter very well , easier to handle than H110 / W296 and I just use small pistol primers . That's a great score getting that 38/44 . Thanks for sharing the results of such a great find .
You mean you didn't have to use a 500 Linebaugh on your recent kill ? LOL
Nice to know about AA4100, I'll keep that in mind.
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Old 12-12-2016, 11:48 AM
tpole tpole is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregintenn View Post
Good shot!


The folks around here who swear it takes a minimum 8mm Magnum rifle to kill a whitetail seem to have no problems bowhunting. All it really takes is massive blood loss.
Yep. Kinda funny. I'm primarily a bow hunter, but a few years ago shot a big doe at 140 yards with an iron sighted Handi Rife in .357 Magnum. That load was a 180 grain Nosler Partition pistol bullet (sadly discontinued) over 4227. The results were so solid, I wondered where the hell I'd been all these years.

That began the quest to hunt with a handgun... one of .357 diameter.
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Old 12-12-2016, 12:51 PM
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Default That looks like.......

That looks like a very happy bullet/powder combination.
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Old 12-12-2016, 01:00 PM
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Eddie Southgate Eddie Southgate is offline
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That bullet worked perfectly . Is it yours or did you buy it ready made ? Congratulations on the deer and the load .

Eddie
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Old 12-12-2016, 01:15 PM
tpole tpole is offline
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I'm into handloading, but not bullet casting.

Bullet was an Anderson Ballistics hard cast hollow point.
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Old 12-12-2016, 01:41 PM
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Not only will a 38 not kill a deer but those old fashioned cast lead bullets wont work on them either.......or is seeing believing !
Excellent job, well done.

I'm a believer !
Gary
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Old 12-12-2016, 02:24 PM
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In Oklahoma a handgun cartridge must be 1.25" in length. (.357 Magnum is minimum for traditional 4" barrels which are also the shortest barrel length you can use.) Your .38-.44 did the job, though!
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Old 12-12-2016, 02:26 PM
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Nice to have all that work and testing finally pay off for you.

That deer is about the same size as the Black tail found in central California.
They taste mighty fine and they pack out easy.
I never had one I wanted to toss back and a well placed lung or heart shot saves the most amount of meat on the animal.

Nothing wrong with 800-x powder in the little 38 either.
I got a 125gr Winchester SJHP up to 952fps in my M49 snub nose.
I logged this load for K frame work. It is used up now
and I use Blue or 2400 for the heavy 158gr bullets in the long barrels.

Nice going.
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Old 12-12-2016, 03:21 PM
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Congrats on a memorable hunt! Good story, too.

Deer hunting dominated my life for over 20 years, but kinda burned out and unleashed my passion on other things. I have recently been slowly working up a load and my accuracy in an effort to take one with a .357 revolver. I placed the sights of my Marlin 1894c on a couple last season and "whispered" bang, but I may actually pull the trigger with the handgun. Still have to decide between the XTP or hard cast over H110.


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Old 12-12-2016, 03:35 PM
rich5674 rich5674 is offline
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Default Where I hunt

Deer are made of Kevlar and have Lazarus atitude. Nothing less than 30-06 will do.
And you didnt get 100% penetration. FAILURE.
PS. Good Job!
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Old 12-12-2016, 07:31 PM
Qc Pistolero Qc Pistolero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jingles View Post
Don't you know the .38 is too weak to take a deer?
Just like the bumblebee;according to scientists and the laws of aerodynamics,it's not supposed to be able to fly.Only problem,the bumblebee doesn't know it ain't supposed to.
Probably your deer didn't know the slug was coming from the ''lowly''.38Spl or it wouldn't have died!
Good job with a great gun!
Qc
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Old 12-12-2016, 07:45 PM
Pisgah Pisgah is offline
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Don't tell a soul, but --I once killed a buck (a pretty hefty one for around here) with a 125 gr. JHP non-+P load out of a Model 10 snub at a range of 40 yards. I'll admit I had to track it -- about 25 yards.

A good 90% of what is "known fact" about what it takes to cleanly kill deer is horse-hockey. What it takes is -- a capable hunter. You have demonstrated both your capability and that of the gun/load!
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Old 12-12-2016, 08:17 PM
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Good work!

There is really no advantage to using a jacketed bullet in any handgun when compared with a properly fitted cast bullet of the right alloy for the pressure / velocity. The cast bullet, with a little load development, of course, will expand well and give excellent accuracy.
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Old 12-13-2016, 09:52 PM
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Meat on the table. I likey.
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jingles View Post
Don't you know the .38 is too weak to take a deer?

Nice job on the hunt; that bullet mushroomed very nicely.
Guy's around here been trying to convince me you need a 7mm Mag if not a .300 mag to kill a deer . They try to tell me about their 300 yd shots and not having to hold over with their Mags. I tell them I shoot a minimum powder load and a 100 grain bullet in a .243 sighted to be 2 1/2 " high at 100 yds and I can do the same thing without the bruise or the flinch they all seem to have. Besides , you usually can't see more than 75-80 yards where they hunt anyway !!

Eddie
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Old 12-14-2016, 08:07 PM
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Much of America still has "Magnumitis" and it's almost comical. I always enjoy reading post like this one where the OP had a goal, reached it and had a fun in the process. He's a "method hunter" like many of us are. We choose to hunt with a particular method, caliber, style, etc. and find our success and enjoyment with that.

I do admit,however, hunting Deep South Whitetail deer with a 7 mm magnum for many years. Absolute overkill.


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Old 12-28-2016, 12:38 PM
Rogeronimo Rogeronimo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tpole View Post
Yep. Kinda funny. I'm primarily a bow hunter, but a few years ago shot a big doe at 140 yards with an iron sighted Handi Rife in .357 Magnum. That load was a 180 grain Nosler Partition pistol bullet (sadly discontinued) over 4227. The results were so solid, I wondered where the hell I'd been all these years.

That began the quest to hunt with a handgun... one of .357 diameter.
Gentlemen, I have a stockpile of Nosler 357 180gn PG bullets that I could thin out a bit. PM me if interested.
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Old 12-28-2016, 01:38 PM
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Groo here
I laugh at you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
To say a 38-44 high speed is a 38 is like saying a Cobra is a Mustang!!
158gr at 1100 to 1200 fps is some "factory " 357 specs.
[ They sure have de-nutted the old magnums]
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Old 12-28-2016, 02:00 PM
STORMINORMAN STORMINORMAN is offline
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An ol' buddy of mine ( and I mean ol' as in OLD!) once opined around a campfire 40 years ago, or so, that there were "more deer taken in the United States and Canada with a 22lr than all the other calibers... COMBINED!"

His having lived through the Depression, I gave much weight to his opinion...

Wonder if it still may be true today?

Cheers!
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Old 01-02-2017, 02:17 AM
Scrateshooter Scrateshooter is offline
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Nice job putting the old S&W to its namesake.

I took a 5 pt buck with a 1911 before Thanksgiving w/ a 255gr SWC going about 860fps, deer dropped in his tracks and no bullet recovered; right through the both shoulders.

Growing up reading hunting magazines had me believing battleships were made of deer hide.
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