Lack of civility in the reloading forum.

[les.b]

Originally Posted by gen3guy

Many of my friends thing I am out of my mind because I still use an old RCBS single stage press. It's simple, paid for, and I'm retired so I'm not in a hurry. They aren't mean spirited about it though. They're still my friends.

Good for you. That has been my only press since the 1970s. Still going strong!!!

Best Regards, Les

[just plain joe]

I second what Les B has said. I have used the same RCBS RockChucker single-stage press since 1972 to load many revolver, pistol, and rifle cartridges. I reload regularly and prefer the single stage system as there is less chance that I will make a mistake.

Find out what works for you and have at it. Many times I have found that the less a persons knows, the firmer their convictions. When I post on this, or any other forum, I occasionally add that this is not "the" way, it is "a" way.

JM2C.

Joe

[Tom S.]

Reloading can be the most dangerous endeavor a newbie can take on. That's why it is important for us to encourage them to ask questions rather than chase them away. Even experienced reloaders make mistakes, despite what some may claim.

The internet is a great place and at the same time a terrible place to seek advice. While most people are eager to help, we sometimes let our prejudices into our replies. Worse yet are those who answer when they don't actually have experience, or tried something dangerous and got away with it so they think it's OK. New reloaders should spend the money for any of the very good reloading manuals (the more, the better). Don't try to shorten the learning curve by skipping reading what companies have spent a lot of time researching and proof reading for accuracy. Then, after reading, if questions remain, then by all means, ask!

Some people forget that at one time, everyone of us was a newbie.

[joeintexas]

Some people forget that at one time, everyone of us was a newbie.[/QUOTE]
Actually Tom I started out with nothing and still have most of it.

[Tom S.]

Originally Posted by joeintexas

Some people forget that at one time, everyone of us was a newbie.
Actually Tom I started out with nothing and still have most of it.

That's like me working on my second million because I gave up on the first.

[Wee Hooker]

I hadn't really noticed. Then again, maybe that makes me suspect as part of the perceived problem?
I sincerely hope not.

[flyrobb]

I have seen it occasionally and it seems to be when someone's safety might be in jeopardy and appears they don't know what they are doing that fellow hand loaders get excited. It's also seem to creep in when people are very passionate about certain equipment (LFCD ) or ideas but overall this forum is one of the best, in fact this site is one of the best I have been on. It is where I come most often because I don't feel I'll be belittled and want to turn of the computer with my tail between my legs.

It's hard enough to make that first post hoping you won't get hammered for asking a stupid question but I have never felt that way here. In fact this forum is the reason I started reloading in the first place two years ago. I got my first press, Lyman Spartan, from Bluejax01, dies from Novalty and great advise from so many others! I even had a fellow member send me some bullets to try for a new caliber I was starting to load. I will remember that and do the same for someone else some day.

Although still very new to hand loading and don't feel qualified to give out much advise there are times I feel ok to contribute to a thread. As mentioned, we were all new at one time. As a fly fisherman for 20+ years it always irritated me, when I was a beginner, that another angler would snub me on the river for asking what fly a guy was catching fish on. I vowed to never be like that. If I see someone struggling or ask me a question I will always stop and be as helpful as I can with equipment or advise that might help them catch a nice trout.

I have learned much from this forum and has kept me and my guns in one piece (knock on wood) up to now. Good post Hillbilly as a reminder to "Keep is Civil"

[Jupiter01]

Originally Posted by otisrush

Be sure COL (Cookie Overall Length) does not go below minimum!

Absoflamin'loutely!
MY wife of 47 years doesn't get upset anymore when I throw another big handful of chips into the Chocolate Chip cookie dough!(A +P charge, you know!) Recoil, or izzat reflux...can be stout, particularly after a large Holiday meal! And...I do have to watch the CPT (charges per tray)closely, and do random QC checks, both before and after baking!

Life is exceedingly good!

[2tall79]

I'm quite the opposite. This is probably my favorite forum to visit. It helped me start my habit from scratch ( now over 10,00 rounds in), helped me find components when none were available (thanks novalty!), is the basis for many of my favorite loads, and is my go to forum for product recommendations.
I haven't really experienced the negativity that the OP refers to but as in all the other forums I subscribe to, if it starts to go south...move on.

[cjw3]

I agree with OP 100%. I also became tired of the atmosphere created by a tiny minority of users on a few occasions, so much so that I just stayed away for over a year.

Condescension and ridicule are counter productive, particularly so with folks that are just getting started. I think the guilty parties know who they are; let's see if they can take this to heart in the right spirit.

[Cariboo Canuck]

I'm happy with the level of decorum on this site. Subscribers are generally supportive and don't mind steering a newbie in the right direction.
A lot of people take advantage of the anonymity of the net to beak off in a manner they wouldn't dare use in a face to face conversation for fear of a bloody nose.

The worst experience I've had was a brief spell on the Shiloh website when a newbie who asked a sincere question was likely to get buried in abuse from the old hands. I quit visiting the site for quite a while as it was getting too contentious.
It got so bad that BPCN Editor Steve Garbe stepped in and commented that such behaviour was ungentlemanly and counterproductive to furthering the sport.
There was a lot of snobbery re: rifles (if it wasn't a post-Farmingdale Shiloh, it was a fence post) and you dare not mention C. Sharps or any of the Italian imports.
There was also a "mine's bigger than yours' faction that sneered at anyone not willing to endure the recoil of a 45-110 or 45-120.

I'm happy to report that the situation has much improved over the past few years and it's back to a civilized nature.

My pet peeve with some reloading forums is the perpetuation of the "everyone knows" myths that have been accepted as fact with not much to back them up.

Remember the "Tite Group is the spawn of the devil" rhetoric because it was possible to double charge a case? Like that wasn't possible with Bulls Eye or other powders?

[joeintexas]

Originally Posted by flyrobb

I have seen it occasionally and it seems to be when someone's safety might be in jeopardy and appears they don't know what they are doing that fellow hand loaders get excited. It's also seem to creep in when people are very passionate about certain equipment (LFCD ) or ideas but overall this forum is one of the best, in fact this site is one of the best I have been on. It is where I come most often because I don't feel I'll be belittled and want to turn of the computer with my tail between my legs.

It's hard enough to make that first post hoping you won't get hammered for asking a stupid question but I have never felt that way here. In fact this forum is the reason I started reloading in the first place two years ago. I got my first press, Lyman Spartan, from Bluejax01, dies from Novalty and great advise from so many others! I even had a fellow member send me some bullets to try for a new caliber I was starting to load. I will remember that and do the same for someone else some day.

Although still very new to hand loading and don't feel qualified to give out much advise there are times I feel ok to contribute to a thread. As mentioned, we were all new at one time. As a fly fisherman for 20+ years it always irritated me, when I was a beginner, that another angler would snub me on the river for asking what fly a guy was catching fish on. I vowed to never be like that. If I see someone struggling or ask me a question I will always stop and be as helpful as I can with equipment or advise that might help them catch a nice trout.

I have learned much from this forum and has kept me and my guns in one piece (knock on wood) up to now. Good post Hillbilly as a reminder to "Keep is Civil"

Hey fly, if you ever fish this quaint little lake above Durango, Colorado use a #16 grey hackle yellow, you'll slay em! By the way, good post.

[Qc Pistolero]

Originally Posted by mikld

I agree with the OP, but unfortunately there's "human nature". Human nature combined with "tool snobbery"

Mike

Tool snobbery hey!Certainly not ME!!!

Honey,have you seen the car keys?No,not the Benz,I meant the Ferrari's!!
And a good 2017;may it bring you all good health and lots of 10s in your target.
Qc
P.S":honestly,I ride a Ford truck and love it!

[mikld]

My only problem with the posts badmouthing a particular piece of equipment is some new reloader will read it and shy away from that equipment, most often missing a good investment and good tool (I have always done my own research before buying any tools/equipment and I try to ignore the "Mine is best" posts). These are mostly posted by the tool snobs that think their choice is the only tools/equipment that is workable and the best thing to come along since smokeless powder. We cannot control the interpretation of what we write on a forum and new reloaders can easily be persuaded, wrongly...

[mikld]

Originally Posted by Qc Pistolero

Tool snobbery hey!Certainly not ME!!!

Honey,have you seen the car keys?No,not the Benz,I meant the Ferrari's!!
And a good 2017;may it bring you all good health and lots of 10s in your target.
Qc
P.S":honestly,I ride a Ford truck and love it!

I worked for a large city Power Co. as a heavy equipment mechanic and saw, first hand some "Tool Snobs". Those fellers that chose their tools by cost ("It costs the most so it's gotta be the best, right?"), by what tools their favorite TV motorcycle builder, their favorite NASCAR pit crew used, or who was the "best" tool truck salesman. I've seen $7,000 tool chests, and even $75.00 individual combo wrenches. These fellers look down their nose at anything other than their particular choice ("If it ain't Snap-On [or MAC, Williams, etc.] it's just junk"). I see some of this same way of thinking with reloading tools...

[Cariboo Canuck]

One way to solve it is to ask what negative experience people have had with various reloading machines.
Years ago I bought a Hornady progressive that had a 45* steel piece that actuated the indexing. It was only a matter of time before me and others got a finger punctured by it.
I wrote a letter to Hornady and didn't get the courtesy of a response. I sold the press and bought my first Dillon.

I often wonder if they changed the design .....

[Engineer1911]

Originally Posted by cadmike

Well if you all would stop making such boneheaded mistakes and start using the proper equipment I wouldn't have to get so grouchy.

Now if any of you could enlighten me how to properly seat and crimp these .223 slugs I have into a 44 magnum case using a pair of vice grips and a hammer I'd really appreciate it.

Any Dummy knows the bullet diameter is 0.224" and you gots to use the Lee Carbide Factory Crimp Die to achieve proper bullet tension. Statistical studies prove that duct tape and a vise grip crimp aren't needed, but do work the brass necks excessively.

Be safe out there, folks.

Merry Christmas !

[Wise_A]

The forums are fine, for the most part. Any kind of "what X should I use" thread quickly degenerates, but what did you expect?

And to be completely honest, a bunch of the posters that screwed up the Turret-vs-Progressive thread with brandwars and off-topic badposting are now over here, posting about how uncivil the reloading forums have become.

[flyrobb]

Originally Posted by joeintexas

Hey fly, if you ever fish this quaint little lake above Durango, Colorado use a #16 grey hackle yellow, you'll slay em! By the way, good post.

I'll be sure to tie a few wet's and dry's! Just like a new load, new patterns are always fun to use but you have to start small and work your way up. Too large a hook can be disastrous! You must be very cautious getting patterns off the interweb! Sorry we are "drifting" a bit here

[rwsmith]

I ONLY buy the brand that I can find and afford at the same time.

[Cariboo Canuck]

For years the only press I owned was an RCBS "Jr." purchased in 1974. I still have it and do my rifle reloading on it.
I did a lot of reloading for IPSC (9mm, .357 and .45 ACP) on it and once when I complained to a pal who was loading for himself and his lady on the same press, I was told to suck it up!

Shortly afterwards, I got my first Dillon, a 450 with push-type powder measure.

[muddocktor]

Cariboo Canuck, I'm still using my old Dillon 450, as well as my Pacific 007 press single stage. They both put out good loads and I just don't see the need for me to upgrade to something new just to have something new. I just might upgrade the 450's powder measure though to the newer model as it has always been extremely problematic with 296/H110. I guess the particle size of that powder is just right to get in between the slide and measure and jam it up.

[Qc Pistolero]

Originally Posted by muddocktor

Cariboo Canuck, I'm still using my old Dillon 450, as well as my Pacific 007 press single stage. They both put out good loads and I just don't see the need for me to upgrade to something new just to have something new. I just might upgrade the 450's powder measure though to the newer model as it has always been extremely problematic with 296/H110. I guess the particle size of that powder is just right to get in between the slide and measure and jam it up.

Muddocktor,save your $$$$;I got a RL300(old powder dispenser model)and a Square Deal B(new model PD)and they both have the same problem as what you are experiencing with W296/H110.Actually,I get more problems with the new model!
Qc

[BigBill]

I have plenty of soap on a rope. Lol

No this forum is one of the better ones.

[Isis1200L]

I am so glad I logged on today. HillBilly... great post.
Reloading is a skill I wish to get deeper into in 2017.
All I've done so far is amass a mess'a 'quipment.
I've got almost every flavor, 'cept Dillon. Mebbee a couple others.
This is the first post I've read here. Super introduction.

I've said it before,

I love this place.