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Old 12-31-2016, 07:56 PM
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kennethdlarson kennethdlarson is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Default So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum

Ladies and Gents,
I've owned and reloaded for a 6" Model 28-2 the past two years. In an attempt to minimize the battering to this revolver while attempting to keep performance up, I've limited myself to 158gr plated bullets from Xtreme and powders like 2400 and IMR4227. I've read the posts about the performance (on the plus side) and wear and tear (on the negative side) that W296/H110 can have on revolvers, especially with the lighter bullets - so I've steered clear of those. After all, this forum's namesake ain't making any new P/R revolvers and the ones out there ain't getting any cheaper! All this being said, I'm waiting for the "magnum" to show up in the .357! I've been loading 16.0 grains of 4227 w/ mag primer and 15.0 grains of 2400 w/standard primer and have been getting ~1200fps+/- out of the loads. There is no massive recoil snap or muzzle rise. You can tell when you light one off but nothing that makes me think "magnum."

Before I start a flame war about this powder or that load or just to go to a .44 Maggie, I want to defer to the "old hats" and reloaders that are more experienced than I. Am I doing anything wrong with these loads? Am I expecting too much? When I pull the trigger on this ~44oz beauty of 'Merican ingenuity, I don't get the feel of overwhelming 38 caliber "power." Yes, it is a heavy revolver but, I'm just not getting the sense of power that I'm expecting out of the world's first magnum cartridge and the most powerful commercial magnum for 20 years.

Any sage advice or recommendations are welcome. I like the .357 Magnum and what it means to the revolver community. I just want to make sure that I am expecting the correct performance out of the cartridge and not making overly presumptive demands on it. Thanks and Happy New Year!!!
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Old 12-31-2016, 07:59 PM
slickracer slickracer is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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H110/296 = real magnums.
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Old 12-31-2016, 08:06 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Shoot those loads in a J frame and get back to me.
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Old 12-31-2016, 08:42 PM
Will2 Will2 is offline
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I reload 15 grains of 2400 with 158 grain jacketed bullets, to me it feels like the 145 grain Winchester Silvertip HP... a moderate 357 mag load.

Will
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Old 12-31-2016, 08:44 PM
Mikeinkaty Mikeinkaty is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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What velocity for a 158 grain FMJ would you expect to be able to call it a magnum round? The Federal SJHP in 158 grain has the hardest recoil I have experienced in my 686 L-frame. I have no idea what velocity it has as it doesn't say on the box.
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Old 12-31-2016, 08:48 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Default I forget what I clocked them at.....

.....but one of my favorite 'barn burner' loads is a 140 gr. jhp out of a 686 "L" frame and when I get over 15 grains of 2400, it starts to smart. Over 15 1/2 gr. I find to be damaging to my hands, wrists, elbows, shoulders. A 29 is a heavy gun to chamber in .357
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Old 12-31-2016, 08:50 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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I don't reload anymore, but the 357 Magnum was designed to get just a bit over 800 foot pounds with a 158 grain bullet out of a 6 inch barrel. It looks to me that you're loading to attain around 525 foot pounds at muzzle. Don't worry. You can't break a M28. Just stuff in some more powder until you hit 1500 FPS with a 158 grain bullet, and you will see the magnum effect.
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Old 12-31-2016, 09:23 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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16.7 grains of H110 behind a Hornady 158 gr XTP is right off of Hodgdon's website. I shoot this in my 6" 586 and feel that it is a genuine "magnum" load.
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Old 12-31-2016, 09:53 PM
amazingflapjack amazingflapjack is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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hard to hurt the workhorse 28-2
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Old 12-31-2016, 09:57 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Quote:
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hard to hurt the workhorse 28-2
True, but it can hurt you😜
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Old 12-31-2016, 09:58 PM
moosedog moosedog is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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That gun will out live you. Shoot it and stop worrying.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:05 PM
gregintenn gregintenn is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ralph7 View Post
Shoot those loads in a J frame and get back to me.

...or even a k frame can be a handful in 357 mag.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:14 PM
cowboy4evr cowboy4evr is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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I have the exact same gun . when I load 180 gr cast bullets with a slightly compressed load of H110 / W296 it gives you that " magnum " feeling . The current load data falls a bit short . I have always found that a slightly compressed load of the above mentioned powders have always worked better for me . Your results may vary .
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:17 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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I have been shooting full power 357 Magnum loads with H110 powder since the 70s. Well over 10,000 of them have been 125 JHPs


Your Model 28 and all N-frames are built for it. Shoot it all that you want. With any weight projectile that you want.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:32 PM
Jackcpat Jackcpat is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Default Magnum

Running the same combo as Just another 22. 16.7 gr of H110, small pistol CCI magnum primers over 158 gr Hornady XTP out of a 28-2 4 inch cut for moon clips. Nice stiff recoil, fireball big enough to make you lose you night vison. No flame cutting, no forcing cone damage. It's a N frame.
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Old 12-31-2016, 10:34 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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If you are talking about "original" 1935 performance of the cartridge there is only one way to do it. Shoot cast lubricated bullets and get a gun with 8 3/8" barrel!

Because of the higher coefficient of friction of Copper coated bullets, whether jacketed or plated makes no difference, you will lose from 100-150 FPS compared to a Lead alloy bullet. Shorten the barrel from 8 3/8" to 6" and you will lose another 75-150 FPS. Now you are down to 1325 FPS best to 1200 FPS worst velocity for a plated bullet from a 6" .357. What more do you expect to get?

Buy some 158 cast SWC bullets and load them with 15.3 gr./2400 and chronograph them. Consider whatever you get as your best velocity for your gun, because it is.
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Old 12-31-2016, 11:05 PM
Lee's Landing Billy Lee's Landing Billy is offline
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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We get 1,250 FPS with a 200 grain Cast Performance Gas Check out of 4 inch guns. I will never need more from a .357.
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Old 01-01-2017, 12:46 AM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Default I almost ruined my friend......

He said he wanted a .357 and I let him shoot some, included some max loads. it turned him off like crazy. I had to show him that you could shoot ANYTHING below that, even 148 gr HBWCs and it still took a few outings to convince him otherwise.

Then he bought an alloy .38 and he doesn't like that. I put a Hogue monogrip on mine and now my wife shoots it. I'll let him shoot it next time.
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Old 01-01-2017, 03:21 AM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Light bullets at high velocities are known to damage the forcing cones on K frame revolvers, not N frames like the M28.

If you want a real magnum load but 158gr Hornady XTP bullets and load them over a full charge of W296/H110 and you won't search any longer. I'm happy with 158gr Cast SWC bullets but that's not what you're looking for here.
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Old 01-01-2017, 03:35 AM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Default What is 300 MP?

The Alliant tables show that it can push a 170 grain GDHP at over 1600 fps. Ok, take off a little for the exaggerated 'published claim' but you still have a round that will knock your socks off.
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Old 01-01-2017, 09:44 AM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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[QUOTE=kennethdlarson;139395010 15.0 grains of 2400 w/standard primer and have been getting ~1200fps+/- out of the loads. [/QUOTE]

My bullet speed checker does not read the same as yours.
M19, 2 1/2 in.=1246fps
M19, 4 in.=1306fps
Python, 6 in.=1429fps
I'm getting more speed out of a 2 1/2in than you are a 6in. and there is buck and roar in all 3 guns.
Larry
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Old 01-01-2017, 12:22 PM
buck460XVR buck460XVR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethdlarson View Post

Any sage advice or recommendations are welcome. I like the .357 Magnum and what it means to the revolver community. I just want to make sure that I am expecting the correct performance out of the cartridge and not making overly presumptive demands on it. Thanks and Happy New Year!!!
I for one think you are expecting too much as far as recoil and muzzle blast from moderate loadings with a heavy for platform firearm. What you find disappointing is what many folks that shoot .357 desire. Mild recoil from legitimate .357 performance ammo. The magnum suffix in firearm caliber does not stand for brutal, but larger as it pertains to it's parent case. I take many new to handgun shooters to the range and a good medium/large frame .357 revolver is what many of them enjoy the most, even with legitimate .357 magnum loadings. Being pleasant to shoot and easy to acquire accuracy is the reason.

There are are loads that will give you more recoil and muzzle flash/blast. Odds are they will not "wear" the gun out any faster than what you are shooting now. I doubt tho, that they will satisfy your desire to be overwhelmed with recoil and flash in the firearm you have. Big recoil and absolute velocity with my mag revolvers has never been a priority to to me. If I want to see fireballs coming out the barrel of my .357s, my go to H110?W296 hunting loads in low light give me all the show I want. If I want more recoil and more power, I shoot something bigger. The beauty to me in the caliber is the accuracy that can be achieved, while enjoying the shooting experience. While the .357 mag is a powerful caliber, in a long pipe N-Frame configuration, even with legitimate .357 loads, it's gonna be relatively pleasant to shoot if you have decent grips on it and it fits your hand. Nuttin' else to say.
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Old 01-01-2017, 01:09 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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.357 Magnum is an eminently shootable round, especially in a large steel revolver. A 6" 686 certainly belongs in the "large" category. 1200 fps may not be a doughnut-maker (in the muzzle blast), but it represents twice the muzzle energy compared to a standard .38 SPL in the same revolver. If you want pain, switch to .44 Magnum (or .50 SWM). Even .38 SPL is a pain in a 15 oz J-frame. In a 42-48 oz revolver, NOT.

Muzzle velocity is elusive if all you have are loading specifications. You need to know what test fixture was used, which is typically a 8" or longer barrel with a closed breech. If you want to know, rather than interpolate your own performance, use a chronograph.

Reloading tables don't represent the edge of the envelope. There are too many variables to do that without extensive testing and quality control. Be happy and safe. If you want the ultimate performance, look to Buffalo Bore or other heavy hunting ammunition. Not all BB ammunition is safe for a Smith revolver, so read the label. For most of us, Federal or other standard brands provide a cheap, safe thrill at 1300+ fps from a 6" barrel.
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Old 01-01-2017, 01:24 PM
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For *me* the most unpleasant part of any '357 magnum' recipe, is not the recoil, but rather 1) muzzle blast noise; and 2) muzzle flash.

Those are dependent on variable of powders used and other details.
I really don't care to shoot most '357 magnum' loads because they annoy me.

I prefer the 41 magnum as it just sounds different, as does the 44 special.

This is not to bash any metric of 357 magnum, just to mention something I rarely see in such discussions. Even the heavy loads decades ago when trying to develop suitable loads for IMHSA, and in fondness for the historic recipes of the great Skeeter Skelton.

Too much treble-range sonics for me. 38 special somehow escapes that bit of annoyance.
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Old 01-01-2017, 03:52 PM
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A few things to keep in mind.

First, the original 357 Magnum load featured a LEAD bullet. Note, lead has less friction in the bore than a copper jacket and that reduced friction is probably worth a 100 fps difference.

Second, when it was originally developed the only means of measuring pressure was the old Copper Crusher method. A method that really only measures the AVERAGE pressure but does NOT measure near instantaneous spikes in pressure.

Third, those 1500 fps velocities were probably the result out of a 10 or 12 inch barrel and longer barrels will increase the measured velocity. There is also the simple fact that the means for measuring velocity today are undoubtedly much more accurate that what was used in 1935.

So, what is a "reasonable" expectation for a jacketed 357 Magnum today. Someone referenced an American Eagle Semi Jacketed Soft Point and stated that the velocity was not given but it was a rather hard hitting load. I've shot that particular load back when the velocity was published and at that time is was listed as 1250 fps from a 6 inch barrel. This is achievable if you use a near maximum charge of H110 with a 158 grain Hornady XTP. It's also an accurate fairly hard hitting load but not one I would recommend using at an indoor range because of the loud booming report may alarm neighboring shooters. I also would not recommend this load during a "fire emergency" due to a drought, because out of a 6 inch barrel the muzzle flash is rather impressive. Personally I reserve these loads for use in my 357 Magnum rifles where they are much quieter, feature no visible muzzle flash in daylight, and get up to about 1700 fps from my 20 inch Winchester.

For my handgun loads I am perfectly willing to "give up" about 50 fps and use a much more user friendly load using Accurate #9. From my 6 inch Dan Wesson I've clocked these loads at an average of 1200 fps and they are quite pleasant to shoot.
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Old 01-01-2017, 04:09 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Thanks for the replies...I enjoy reading them! I was thinking about it this morning (at church of all places) and as some of the above posts indicate, I am getting the performance I am asking of the cartridge as loaded. I am not looking for the wrist/elbow crunching, atomic fireball spewing screamer loads that are out there - though I would like to put a few cylinders thru the gun just to see what they are like! I have to remember that in circa 1935 this was THE definition of revolver performance. Now we have revolver/cartridge parings that'll suck the paint off of your house and give your family a permanent orange afro. (Name that movie and you'll get 100 points.... ). I'll keep in mind the power/flat shooting/manageable recoil in an N-Frame that buck460XVR spoke of.....and I might try a little more 2400 in the loads. Happy New Year!
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Old 01-01-2017, 04:45 PM
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So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum So....I'm waiting for the "Magnum" in .357 Magnum  
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Default And Happy New Year to you...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethdlarson View Post
Thanks for the replies...I enjoy reading them! I was thinking about it this morning (at church of all places) and as some of the above posts indicate, I am getting the performance I am asking of the cartridge as loaded. I am not looking for the wrist/elbow crunching, atomic fireball spewing screamer loads that are out there - though I would like to put a few cylinders thru the gun just to see what they are like! I have to remember that in circa 1935 this was THE definition of revolver performance. Now we have revolver/cartridge parings that'll suck the paint off of your house and give your family a permanent orange afro. (Name that movie and you'll get 100 points.... ). I'll keep in mind the power/flat shooting/manageable recoil in an N-Frame that buck460XVR spoke of.....and I might try a little more 2400 in the loads. Happy New Year!
I shoot target load and moderate loads for an hour and a half or so, but before I clean up and go I fire off some barn burners just to get the 'feeling'. I don't hunt and I have NO reason to fire a .357 full blast, except for occasional kicks.
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Old 01-01-2017, 05:17 PM
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speaking of '460 S&W'.....my buddy last summer got a 4" version to go with his full length hunter style (what, 8 3/8?)

Same load for both, a bit down from the published max loads, in his long barrel, was noisy but almost pleasant to shoot, as I did a few cylinders full.

I stood behind him for the 4" trial. Same load. He was hurting by the 3rd round, invited me to finish it, which I declined. I was bruised & maimed just from the muzzle blast, and that with his body & head between me & the muzzle.

I don't have any use for those kinds of recipes.
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Old 01-01-2017, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moosedog View Post
That gun will out live you. Shoot it and stop worrying.
If you have an extra barrel.....

An N frame forcing cone can erode just like any other when it's hit with the FlowJet like abrasive force of slow burning, high temp, ball powder. I have several 6" 28's. My primary has such an exquisite action, that yes, I bought an extra barrel off the forum here ($65 delivered ) because I do anticipate killing the one in the gun at some point. The forcing cone is starting to show signs of enthusiastic magnum shooting. I expect to be around for a long time, and I'll be reloading and shooting every weekend until the day I check out if I can help it.
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Old 01-01-2017, 06:17 PM
Qc Pistolero Qc Pistolero is offline
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1500fps 158gr outta 6''bbl;these were the original velocities in 1935 but if I remember correctly the great Skeeter Skelton said about these loads that''they were hot as a depot stove''.He also mentionned something about the ammo manufacturers tuning them down a bit a little later on.
A .357Mag when shot from a N frame is not a hard kicker.My standard load for the .357 is a 166gr cast SWC pushed at a little over 1300fps with H110(chronoed in a few different 6''bbl guns)and some will show primers that are beginning to deform a bit.When shot from my K frame,while not yet a brute,it certainly gets your attention.From my 4'' N frame,it is almost a *****cat.

Please don't push your loads too hard.It is a .357 mag.If you want heavy kick,get a .41 Mag or anything bigger.Every gun has it's limits and when it fails,you might loose a lot more than just your pride.
Have fun and be safe!
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:29 PM
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Scooter123,

From your post:

A few things to keep in mind.

First, the original 357 Magnum load featured a LEAD bullet. Note, lead has less friction in the bore than a copper jacket and that reduced friction is probably worth a 100 fps difference.

I have posted this information many times, the last was in my post in this thread.

Second, when it was originally developed the only means of measuring pressure was the old Copper Crusher method. A method that really only measures the AVERAGE pressure but does NOT measure near instantaneous spikes in pressure.

True, but millions of rounds have been fired with no problems, at the pressures determined by this method. It is just as valid as it ever was! And, it has nothing to with the current discussion of velocity.

Third, those 1500 fps velocities were probably the result out of a 10 or 12 inch barrel and longer barrels will increase the measured velocity. There is also the simple fact that the means for measuring velocity today are undoubtedly much more accurate that what was used in 1935.

These are both absolutely untrue. Original chronographed velocities were determined by shooting the cartridge in actual revolvers with 8 3/4" barrels, not from universal receivers or longer than standard barrels. You want to know more about development of the .357 Magnum? Then read Phillip Sharpe's "Complete Guide to Handloading" originally published in 1937. There is an entire chapter specifically about development of the .357 Magnum. Mr. Sharpe played a direct role in development of the cartridge, both with S&W and Winchester. His information is as "Straight from the horses mouth" as anything available anywhere!

Contrary to modern "lore" electric "Counter Chronographs" were available in the 1930s. They are far slower than modern chronographs (Ever wind wire screens? I have!). The tables would only give velocities in 10 FPS increments, but this hardly constitutes being less accurate. Shoot the same load over different chronographs available today and you can see far greater variation than this from one to another. Even the same machine on different days and conditions!

Finally, velocities in the 1500 FPS range are very doable in the .357 Magnum, from an 8 3/8" barrel. I have shot many rounds of 15.3 gr. 2400/158 LSWCGC from 2 different 8 3/8" Model 27s bought specifically for this purpose. Depending on conditions and which gun this load developed from 1498 FPS to 1530 FPS uncorrected. Corrected to the muzzle adds another 10 FPS approximately! If you don't believe it I can show you the chronograph date from my Oehler Model 35-P. The velocity variations I have posted here and before are not what I read in a magazine or on the internet, they are actual experience from shooting hundreds of rounds over the chronograph so I would have a personal grasp of the true effects of changing bullet type and lubricants on .357 Magnum.
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Old 01-01-2017, 07:46 PM
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Do you realize how annoying it is to read red print?
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Old 01-01-2017, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SMSgt View Post
Do you realize how annoying it is to read red print?
Particularly if you are using the "Dark Blue" font. Change to light blue and it isn't nearly as bad. Or, you can "Hi-Lite" the red text and it will change to white on blue.

Is the green any better?
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Old 01-01-2017, 08:39 PM
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Since nobody has brought it up..Try these, and see what magnum feels like..From the manual.
Alliant Powder 300mp
357 Magnum
125 gr Speer GDHP 300-MP 22.3 1,995
158 gr Speer GDHP 300-MP 18.6 1,686
170 fr Speer GDHP 300-MP 17.5 1,617
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Old 01-01-2017, 10:59 PM
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Magnum JHP loads, 357, 41, 44mag. 2400 powder.

Leadcast loads, 38 spec, 357, 41, 44 mag. Unique powder.

There's been lots of talk here in the past about flame cutting / torch cutting the throats on the barrels when hotter loads are used.

My most accurate 357 magnum load is the Speer 140gr JHP with 2400 powder in my 6" barreled Python.
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Old 01-02-2017, 11:50 AM
cowboy4evr cowboy4evr is offline
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My most accurate 357 magnum load is using a lyman style 358156 (with the gas chk removed) double crimp groove , Ray Thompson design , it weights about 160grs . Tom @ Accurate molds has it in his catalogue . This bullet crimped in the top crimp groove sitting on top of 7.5grs of WSF , spp performs extremely well in every 357 I have tried it in , and that's quite a few .

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Old 01-02-2017, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just another 22 shooter View Post
16.7 grains of H110 behind a Hornady 158 gr XTP is right off of Hodgdon's website. I shoot this in my 6" 586 and feel that it is a genuine "magnum" load.
Agreed. Im at 16.5 Anything with H110 will feel MAGNUM
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Old 01-02-2017, 02:33 PM
GavinLee GavinLee is offline
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As far as original loadings are concerned wasn't the the .357 magnum developed around 43,500 psi where it is now 35,000 psi?
GavinLee
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Old 01-02-2017, 03:09 PM
daniel lawecki daniel lawecki is offline
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Break out the H110 and work up to near max or max.
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Old 01-02-2017, 03:14 PM
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Dear OP:
You bought the wrong cartridge.
I was shooting .357 Magnum when I was 10 years old and never had a problem. You will need at least a .44 Mag.
All 296/H110 can safely give you is 50-100 fps more velocity.
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Old 01-02-2017, 06:04 PM
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@ OP, like someone has already stated; take your loads and throw them into a J frame and get back to us. I'm afraid that an N frame like your 28 will tame down 357 Mag pretty decently, even with max power loads. If you want to up the ante in an N frame, go to a model 57 or model 29 or their stainless steel derivatives and shoot some 41 or 44 Mag rounds.

That is one thing I really like about 357 Mag, actually. It is a pretty darn potent round but is still eminently shootable in a large frame revolver or lever action carbine. Last time at the range I ran around 50 rounds through my 627 Pro and better than 100 rounds of hot 357 through my Rossi 92SRC and no pain.
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Old 01-02-2017, 07:59 PM
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Yeah, a .357 J-frame is my definition of "almost a good idea." I'd like to have that "magnum feel" and not carpal tunnel symptoms. I'll keep to my N-frame and try loading up some hard cast bullets to see what that gets me. Thanks again for all the posts!
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Old 01-02-2017, 08:50 PM
daverich4 daverich4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethdlarson View Post
.and I might try a little more 2400 in the loads. Happy New Year!
Might want to take a look at the Alliant web site first. They list 14.8 grains of 2400 as max with a Speer 158 gr. GDHP. Might be better to switch to a different powder if you want more grunt.
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Old 01-02-2017, 10:15 PM
alwslate alwslate is offline
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I have been loading the 357 magnum since the late 60s. No this doesn't
make me an expert but I have learned a few things over the years.
Magnum performance out of a 6" 28 means 1400+ fps with a cast lead
bullet with lubrication grooves and a crimp groove that you have heavily
roll crimped the case mouth into. 15.0-15.5 grs of 2400 with a magnum
primer. Winchester is my favorite. This load was basically the standard
full charge load for many years and will not batter your 28. Forget 4227
if you want the magnum in the 357. 296/H110 will give you the illusion
of magnum with flash, blast and face stinging spitting from the brl/cyl
gap but the numbers on the chrono will be lower. That's about what you
can expect unless, as mentioned above, you go to the 8 3/8" barrel 27.
296/H110 creates more forcing cone erosion than 2400. If you use
std primers and plated or jacketed bullets expect much less velocity.
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Old 01-02-2017, 11:13 PM
10xatten 10xatten is offline
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Or perhaps try a Speed Six W/125 gr. Seriously, if you have a given amount of any powder in a case, and you use a copper cased projectile which has more friction going out of the barrel than lead
, and hence, is slower, where does the extra energy go? To Heat?
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Old 01-03-2017, 12:55 AM
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Full power lead or jacket loads are fun but................

I also enjoy a 158gr Plated out of a 686 6" doing 1108 fps with a medium
heavy load of HS-6 powder.

No lead build up, medium recoil, whats not to like?
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Old 01-03-2017, 01:15 AM
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I have to agree with the above. Been loading .357 over 30 years and probably 90 + % of those loads have been in the medium to light catagories. Reason is simple - need. Most of my shooting is offhand target & field with a lot of varmint hunting in between. I want to be able to shoot 100 - 150 rounds in a day without beating myself (or the gun) to death!
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Old 01-08-2017, 04:31 AM
alwslate alwslate is offline
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"Try this as your "baseline"
UNDERWOOD performance357 Magnum 158 Grain Bonded Jacketed Hollow Point
Caliber: 357 Magnum
Bullet Weight: 158 Grains
Muzzle Velocity: 1500 fps
Muzzle Energy: 789 ft. lbs
Then you'll know where the "magnum" is.
It's not hard at all to load the .357 Magnum to maximum
peformance." [Quote] Actually it's not hard at all to list unrealistic specs
for the ammo you load. If you actually believe that this ammo will
chrono at 1500 fps out of a common 6" revolver just because the mfg.
lists that as the velocity ....well ... buy a box, test it and report back
please.
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Old 01-08-2017, 05:00 AM
shawn mccarver shawn mccarver is offline
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To the OP: The reason you are missing the "Magnum" in your loads is because you are, in effect, loading a 38/44, not a .357 Magnum.

The 38/44 pushed a 158 grainer out the door at about 1,150 fps.

The original Magnum pushed a 158 grain bullet out the 8 3/4 inch barrel at 1,550 fps.

If you want to see about what the original Magnum feels like, try Buffalo Bore SKU 19C/20.
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Old 01-08-2017, 05:35 AM
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This is crazy! I want more recoil. I want more fire. I want more pain! One of the best things about the 357 MAGNUM in an N frame is the fact that you can shoot high power rounds without beating yourself up. As stated before if you want kick and noise and lots of fire get the full MAGNUM effect of a Smith&Wesson 44 rem mag like a 29 or 629 (as previously stated). Try on 21gr. of IMR4227 under a cast gas checked 240gr SWC. The take to me about the full MAGNUM effect.
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