Hello guys (and gals),

New to the forum but been shooting on and off for nearly 30 years. In the past I did a lot of clay shooting and reloaded shot shells on a MEC 9000. I loved that press, and I loved the relaxing nature of reloading. Also, at that time, I was saving significantly, when I would be shooting 100-150 rounds of 12 gauge a day... lead shot was cheap.

Now I'm doing a lot of HG shooting, in 9mm and .40. I realize the cost savings for reloading these calibers is negligible at best, when I can buy Winchester white box for .19 per round. I'm estimating my reloading costs will be around .10-.14 per round... that is a hell of a lot of shooting to reach the break-even point, but again I understand that it is a hobby and for enjoyment. One other concern is occasionally I'd get a bad load in my MEC (low powder), and obviously this was very frustrating. I don't want that to happen if I start loading handgun.

On the press: I had my heart set on the Hornady Lock-N-Load AP press. All in, I figured I would be right around $500 with press, die set, shell plate. I know it's not perfect but overall it has good reviews and good support. (And 500 free Hornady bullets to get me started... possibly another 100 with the die set)

I saw someone here mentioned the Dillon 650. I know Dillon has a great reputation and good equipment. I see it is priced at $580, plus $67 for the die set - $647. Am I missing something? Is there more to purchase to be all set to go above and beyond what is required for the Hornady?

I don't mind spending $150 more for the Dillon... but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything (not including things like recipe book, scale, case cleaning stuff, etc). Also, for those of you who have real experience with both of these, I'm of course interested in hearing your opinions.

Thanks!

I load on a Dillon 550 the difference being the 550 is manual index 4 statiaon and 650 is 5 with auto indexing I am very happy with press and like you load only a few calibers the conversions are cheaper also if you plan on adding case and bullet feed and want a powder check the 650 is the way to go hope this helps

Welcome to the forum.

Dillon 650 might be overkill. I'm quite happy with my 550B.

My cost of .45 reloads is about $0.135 each. I use lead bullets (Pennbullets, but there are several good manufacturers).

For jacketed bullet ammunition, I buy it; it's cheaper than I can make it.

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I've still got it made.

And, from the get go, I chose the 650 over the 550B. Not a single regret for doing so. However, there are still options to consider. The automatic case feeder, bullet tray, optional stand, etc.

About a year ago I was in your position. Had never reloaded anything. After much research I went with the Hornady. I had no intentions of adding the case or bullet feeder down the road. The ease of and lower cost switching calibers drew me in. Here I am a year later and successfully loading for 6 different handgun calibers plus 223/5.56 rifle stuff. So far the Hornady system has been 100% reliable although the tool pulling the handle has made a few mistakes.

I did buy a powder metering insert for each caliber I load which makes the switch even faster. At about $10 each it won't break the bank. You are correct about the savings. For 9mm and 40 the savings don't add up very quickly. Buying components in bulk will help there. For me loading 380, 38/357Mag, 44Mag and the 223/5.56 stuff is where the real savings come in. I can load all of those for well under 1/2 price of factory ammo and typically the die/shell plate runs about what a few boxes of ammo would cost. This is a hobby so if I only broke even it would still be well worth it simply for the "therapy" time I spend on it.

I have never run a Dillon press and only reloaded for about a year now on the Hornady. I don't consider myself to be brand loyal to anyone. My decision was based partly on price but mainly what I felt would best suit my needs and so far the Hornady has done just that.

Dillon is good stuff, but you'll notice half of what the catalog press photos show is all "accessories."

I can load 9mm ammo for 12¢ a round at current component prices. While I don't load for the 40 S&W right now I can load them for 15¢ a round.

Using your number of 19¢ a round for 9mm that's a savings of 7¢ a round or $3.50 a box/50. Depending on how much you shoot that could add up quicker than you think.

My friend shoots 1000 rounds if 9mm a week, that would be a savings if $70 a week or $280 a month. You could pat for your press and extras in a few months.

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Freedom is never free!!
SWCA #3437

Nothing wrong at all with the Hornady LnL progressive press; it's as solid of a platform for reloading pistol/rifle cartridges as you'll find out there. The Dillon 550 is also a workhorse, but has to be indexed manually from station to station.

The Dillon 650 does index automatically and, I believe,also includes a case feeder as standard. This explains better that price difference you see between it and the LnL. If you add the case feeder to the LnL, that price difference should be less.

Both Mfg. are known to have stellar customer service, but Hornady parts/accessories are widely available from a number of sources. Not so much with Dillon.

I'm sure you'll be happy loading with either one. I didn't need a case/bullet feeder for my volume needs, so the LnL was my best choice. YMMV

FWIW if you don't ever plan on loading rifle but want a nice auto index press that will save you some coin over the above options look at the Square Deal from Dillon. You can get the change over kits and dies sets from dillon to do both calibers.

The case feeder for the 650, is an option. Won't be included with any unit in the $550-600 category. But it didn't take long, before I knew I wanted one. What a difference! As far as dealers go, Scheels carries complete Dillon parts & setups. Also at very competitive pricing, even comparing to the internet.

Thanks for the responses guys.

In time I will also likely be loading .223 and .308. I'm also pretty set on an auto-indexing press, since I was spoiled with it on my MEC 9000. Considering I plan on keeping and using it for many many years to come, I don't have a problem stepping up to the 650 (if not the Hornady).

By the time I add all the little Dillon add-ons, it looks like I'm going to be closer to $750-800, not including a case feeder. However it does seem like an awesome setup.

I am curious about some of the price-per-round some of you guys are quoting. I'd like to stay with FMJ bullets, and I haven't seen them anywhere for less than 11-12c each, plus 3c for a primer, and 1c for powder, for 15-16c each total, and that's using my own recycled brass. I just can't see getting it any cheaper than that.

At 4c each savings, that is about 20,000 rounds to break even. Tough to justify it... but again, I see it as a hobby. It's just the idea that if I do spend this money, I want to earn it back as quickly as possible! (Yes, I know.. just shoot more!)

The volume you load and/or will be loading in the future may determine what machine you buy. I load shotgun on a MEC9000 and it is a piece of cake. I load .32 Long, .32 H&R Mag, .380, 9mm, .38 Spec, .357, .45 acp, 44 Spec, 44 Magnum, .223/5.56, 22-250, .243, .308, 30-06. My volume is 9mm, .38 Spec, and .45 acp which I load on the Dillon 550B. All the others I load on a single stage loader, as only load a few hundred a year of the other calibers. (Other than the 22-250 which are my Prairie Dog guns which I load one at a time for match accuracy).

If you need to crank out 1000 rounds a month or more for competition shooting you need an auto indexing machine, My 550B will easily do 400 rounds per hour with manual index, The Dillon 650 I'm told will easily do 600 per hour, (as long as you can keep the hoppers full). My experience is the Dillon 550B can be caliber switched in about 5-10 minutes. The Hornady, maybe 30-45 minutes after you become very familiar with it. The Dillon 650 I'm not sure but the info is available on line. Good luck with your decision. I feel all the machines are capable of making comparable quality ammo.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

I just checked my original invoice from when I ordered the Hornady press. The order included the press, a 10 pack of the LNL die bushings, 2 sets of pistol dies, 3 shell plates, 2 powder metering inserts, an extra pack of the case retainer springs, 2 cans of Hornady One Shot cleaner, and a kinetic bullet puller. Total including shipping was $695.72 from Midsouth Shooters supply. I had already purchased 9mm dies so total to load 3 different calibers ended up at $740.

Once you have the dies set up swapping them out takes a couple minutes. Resetting the powder drop for length of cartridge takes a couple minutes. If you have to swap primer sizes that will take another few minutes.

I have a powder metering insert for each caliber. It generally stays set really close. At this point I will easily spend 15 minutes verifying the correct powder charge. Taking my time I can turn out 200 rounds per hour easy.

I've been buying FMJ's from Everglades Ammo. If you buy case quantities the 9's run 8 cents each and the 40's are about 12cents each. Shipping is free. So far these have been excellent bullets.

re: " it does seem like an awesome setup."

actually a very true statement.....
Personally I'm at the 'half-way mark'....

I started loading on a then-new 450 Dillon, soon upgraded to 550 and used that for 20 years. Then the 650 for the last (now nearly) 20 years....

I've never used another color press, nor a single stage, whatever that may be.

And I ~almost never~ find a need to load FMJ, although once in a while may try out a few Berrys plated etc.

Once you learn how to operate the Dillon, the few complaints you might hear really don't count for much. And after all this time the Dillon tech guys really ARE example of EXCELLENT in all ways.

I recently sent my 650 in for rebuild after 16 years of pretty hard use. I fully expected to pay for repairs. They said it would take "maybe 4-5 weeks" to return. Surprise, back in 8 days. And NO charge. Fully 'as-new'.

Happiness is a warm Dillon 650.

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Dum vivimus Vivamas

Before purchasing a progressive press, consider how much you'll really be shooting. I think many overestimate shooting needs but use the inflated figure as justification for buying a progressive machine. I did.

Over the years I've had several progressive presses including two Stars I still have that haven't been used in six months or more. I probably shoot no more than 5,000 handgun rounds in a year's time; not very many by comparison.

For such purposes, my 1960's Texan turret press still works very well. While such a press is not as fast at actually cranking out ammo as a progressive press, a progressive takes longer to convert for loading different cartridges than a simpler machine. I've found Redding powder measures to be very accurate, certainly at least as accurate as what is available on the best progressives. And, if you're experimentally inclined and try a variety of components when working up loads, some progressives are not designed to do this in an easy and practical manner.

I'm not denigrating progressives as they are useful and certainly fill a niche.

You will save more per shot reloading handgun rounds than you ever would loading 12ga. I can load any service caliber for 50% of ceap bulk factory, Russian steel krap excluded. I shoot 9-10K rds a year, so even with "cheap" 9mm, that is a $1000 savings a year, enough to pay for even a 650 with case feeder & other goodies.
I run a 550 & 650 w/ case feeder. The 650 is great, but w/o case feeder, no faster than a 550 , a bit slower & more expensive to convert. If you never want a case feeder, then a LNL is not a bad press. I would consider nothing less than a quality progressive for any serious amount of handgun or 223/AR ammo. Just the work saved in handle pulls is worth the slightly higher cost of the gear.
Really, too many reloaders agonize over a few $100 for a quality press when you compare what factory ammo cost today. Keep in mind the "cheaper" LNL comes with nothing. If you decide to go case feeder, the total cost diff with the 650 is about $75 less. For $75 you get a better case feeder & superior priming to the LNL.

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NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

As with all these threads it's lets jump on the Dillion Bandwagon! It's amazing that there are any other brands still in existence.

Are they top of the line and have great service?, absolutely but do you need one??

The main question is how much ammo do you need??

Are you in competition? Do you need hundreds of rounds a week? How much time can you devote to reloading? What is your budget?

After adding all the things you will need to a Dillon press the price is a lot more than advertised. How many caliber change overs will you need. That gets expensive and time consuming.

So, do your homework and check the cash flow add up ALL the things required and then make a decision.

So you're thinking about getting into reloading...

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Still Running Against the Wind

If you're still young enough to enjoy many many years of reloading then I'd get a Dillon 650 or 1050.

In my 1000s of rounds a week shooting days long gone it was Star Machines for high volume output,today it's Dillon.

If you're about ready to retire or already retired and moving to smaller quarters and a fixed income other options may look better and still offer enjoyable reloading.

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NEVER GIVE UP YOUR GUN

After nearly 40 years of reloading, I'm going to be a single-stage guy for life. I started with an RCBS Reloader Special press which I have used ever since. I've tried other dies and equipment but always find myself gravitating back to RCBS.

There is really nothing to add to a 550 or 650 to load ammo at 400-500rds per hour. Yes you can add stuff, but the stock presses are ready to run as is, just add a scale to verify powder charges.
More to relading than high volume. The older i get, its more about an easier work load. Go fast or slow, a progressive give you options a ss or turret cant touch. Its a few $100, compared to the effort saved, pennies guys.

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NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

Same here, but . . . .

I was Green for 40 years. But my volume of pistol shooting went up, so I went progressive. I laughed at the Red vs Blue for many years, as I was Green.

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I've still got it made.

I use a 550B and have set ups for .40, 9, and .45 which are the rounds the wife and I shoot the most. Flawless operation and outstanding uniformity in the final product. In addition I use the Lee cast iron single stage for all my revolver cartridges (5) and .223. This is also a very good machine. Did 100 rounds of .357 last night with a +/-.001 OAL.
In the end I do save money, easily 50%. More important is the fact that I enjoy the process immensely, achieve excellent accuracy, and come away with great satisfaction that each and every round was developed and loaded by my hands. It's the next best thing to shooting!

Can't find any faults with your math, and if all I wanted to shoot was 9mm ball ammo, reloading wouldn't make a lot of sense. In my case, for 9mm, 38Spl, 38Super, .357, 44Mag and 45ACP I mostly load LSWC's for general range use and also like to work up my own defensive loads using JHP, etc. vs factory Then, compared against $1/per round, the economics work much more to my favor. If you throw rifle rounds into the mix, then it's a no-brainer.

I loaded handgun and rifle ammo quite happily on RCBS single-stage presses until I stopped shooting trap and took up handgun shooting more than I had before. At about that same time, "King Arthur's disease" kicked in and while I was able to justify the time spent with a single-stage press for handgun rounds as enjoyable, the pain of arthritis soon made that enjoyment fade away. So I looked into progressive loaders and chose the Dillon 650.



Like you, I had used progressive shotshell loaders from RCBS, P-W and MEC so there was no thought given to a non-prgressive handgun loader. And even if there was, I'm sure that years of buying low and then paying to upgrade taught me to buy the better unit up front and save money in the long run.

I passed on the case feeder as I didn't want that tall unit blocking access to the shelving behind the loader. I have no problem with reaching through the loader to set an empty case on the feed rail before placing a bullet on the case in the seating station. My right thumb holds back the part that feeds the case into the loader while I place the case. My right hand never leaves the operating handle.

The mention of the operating handle reminds me to state that for those of us with joint ailments, the roller handle locks your hand, wrist and arm into one angle the whole way through the operating cycle which I found uncomfortable. I found the standard ball much more comfortable as it permits your hand to change angles on it.

I know us drinkers of the blue Kool-Aid get to some folks but Dillons really are a great machine that are well thought-out and backed by equally great customer service.

Ed

I have been reloading since about 1976. I started with an RCBS single stage for everything. In the mid 1980s, I bought a Dillon Square Deal B, but I would get frustrated with the change over cost as I added a new pistol cartridge. I upgraded in the 1990s to a Dillon 550B.

When I got seriously involved in Service Rifle matches, I tried to reload my 30-06 and 308 rounds with the Dillon, and was unhappy with the results. I was loading stick powder (IMR4895 & 4064) because of Garand port pressures. I found quickly that my Dillon didn't meter stick powder well. As a result, my 550B was relegated to handgun ammo, and rifle ammo comes off the single stage.

Where the Dillon products really shine is in customer support. I don't own any other progressive, so I can't compare support between companies. The last time I used my Dillon was before my accident in 2007, and it remained unused until earlier this year (2017). Over the 10 year gap, some small/critical parts "disappeared". A quick call to Dillon, and the parts were quickly replaced, at no cost to me. I never expected parts to be replaced at no cost to me on a machine purchased almost 20 years ago. To me, that is a major selling point to keep in mind.

As an aside, I have never felt the need for a case feeder. If I am organized, I am able to do about 350 pistol rounds and hour without killing myself. I am not out to set any land speed records, just build reliable ammo that functions 100%. If I were to add anything, it would be additional powder assemblies in order to expedite cartridge change overs. BTW, I use my Dillon to reload: 9mm Luger, 380 ACP, 38 Special, 357 Magnum, 41 Magnum, and 45 ACP. In a pinch, I could probably be comfortable loading 223 with ball powder for "battle grade ammo", but the precision rifle ammo (223, 308,and 7 Rem Mag) comes off the single stage.

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Judge control not gun control!

While the Dillon might or might not cost a wee bit more than competitors models, I can honestly say that the first 35 years I used a Dillon Square Deal B and then 4 years ago stepped up to the Dillon 6650. NO LOOKING BACK!!

Anyone who intends on reloading medium to large amounts of ammo could not (IMO) find a better press that is backed up by the #1 Customer Service oriented Company in the Hobby. AGAIN, IMHO the 650 is THE WAY to go! Others will surely have different opinions and I do respect them - just giving you mine.

I agree that the 650 might be overkill. I reload my 9mm and 45 ACP for about 8 cents for 9mm and 10 cents for 45ACP because I bought a lifetime supply of hard cast bullets 10 years ago. I reload 556 using 52 grain smk's for about 25 cents and 308's with 168 smk's for about 37 cents. Much cheaper than 168 FGMM which run over $1+ a round. Those prices because I also stocked up on powder at the same time.

Welcome to the group. Mec just introduced a single stage metallic press. I saw an article in the current edition of Guns Magazine. You have experience reloading so you know what your doing. I tell people to buy what they can afford when it comes to presses. I have been reloading pistol and rifle for sometime. I load for 9 hand guns calibers and 3 rifle calibers. All of it is done on a Lee Turret Press. The press produces quality ammo. Each set of dies are in there own turret; changing calibers take 30 seconds.Any changes to the die set is normally changing the setting depth.

I thought the the Lee Reloading presses should be represented also.

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Carpriver.