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  #101  
Old 08-30-2017, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by DRAINSMITH View Post
. So why would I want to pay 1/4 more for one of your "superior" presses?
Now as far as "Marketing". Wouldn't you want to pay $11.00 for 500 bullets, or $13.00 for a calendar will a large chested gall on it?
Actually I was pointing out that your figures were off by quite a bit. I have owned both presses new and the actual difference was about 125 dollars...And yep I would even pay 25% more to own the superior product. Especially when I realized I would lose no money after using the superior one for however many years. And seems you acknowledged that the Dillon is the superior press ...even off handedly. LOL
As far as paying for "free" bullets of course I would pay the 13 bucks for them but if they weren't something i would use it is a waste. I still have 4 of the 5 boxes I was given when I got my ammo plant. They were the closest to what I may have used...but still not what I need. I actually gave that one box away. Not really trying to step on your toes. I really am glad you are happy with your Hornady. I was less than thrilled with mine. I can actually out produce my Ammo Plant with a 650 w/no bullet feeder. Also,,,my dealings with customer service from Hornady have been less than stellar trying to get 3 small parts that were missing from my A P. Dillon still has the best CS..but Big Green is very close. I may have to try using the AP again.
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  #102  
Old 08-30-2017, 09:49 PM
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Years ago a friend and I went 50/50 on 2 Dillon 550 loaders and set them up to load some 15 different calibers.

The reason we purchased 2 is to set one for small primer and one for large. This eliminates changing primer size assemblies.

I had a Square Deal and have had Mec 9000 progressive loaders.
Personally, I prefer Manual indexing and gravitate to the 550. I like being able to stop and/or back up to deal with one shell or double-check one shell without having to cycle all the others.

Long story, but I gave my part of those loaders to my friend when I moved farther away. Am now ready to replace them and yes, will be buying 2 model 550s for myself - one for small primer and one for large.

Love 'em!!
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  #103  
Old 08-31-2017, 11:05 PM
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Well, some of you know, and some of you don't, Well for the last three years I have left an open invitation to any one that wants to bet their 100% Dillon against my 100% Hornady. Now, this is a 500 round run for both speed and quality of ammo made. Winner takes all. And the loser gets to say good bye to their press. So now you all know that not only do I talk the talk, but I am willing to walk the walk.

Well, Grasshopper I got some good news for you. I have a grand daughter getting married on the 15 of April In Costa Mesa Ca. So after your last post, I called my son in law and he has agreed to let us use his safe room to set our benches up and run the bet. Not only that but he will hire a company to video the run so everyone can enjoy.

Now, this is your chance to be a man and walk the walk. Or you can keep flapping your lip with your legs crossed.

The only bad thing is if I win your press I have to give it to my son in law. But I think he will be rooting for you. In 25 years he has never heard of me losing a bet. And I am sure he would like to have that on video.

Now, for SKEET 028.

It sounds like you have a great running 650 or you don't know to get you Hornady running right. Now I would hate to bring my press all the way to Ca. and come back with out a new press. So if you are on the I-80 corridor I would like to come by. But to be nice I won't take your "great running Press" I would rather take your Hornady.
  #104  
Old 08-31-2017, 11:28 PM
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Originally Posted by DRAINSMITH View Post
Well, some of you know, and some of you don't, Well for the last three years I have left an open invitation to any one that wants to bet their 100% Dillon against my 100% Hornady. Now, this is a 500 round run for both speed and quality of ammo made. Winner takes all. And the loser gets to say good bye to their press. So now you all know that not only do I talk the talk, but I am willing to walk the walk.
I wouldn't be slamming the handle on a superior machine, such as my Dillon 650 anyway. Speed of powder flows vary, and all of that.....

For mass quantities of quality ammo, a good steady pace is required, taking into account the variables or various powders, etc. I wouldn't for care a speedy slam fest.

At the end of the day, I know my Dillon is doing a fine job. That's what counts.
  #105  
Old 08-31-2017, 11:29 PM
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This thread is FASCINATING!
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  #106  
Old 08-31-2017, 11:46 PM
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Originally Posted by DRAINSMITH View Post
Well, some of you know, and some of you don't, Well for the last three years I have left an open invitation to any one that wants to bet their 100% Dillon against my 100% Hornady. Now, this is a 500 round run for both speed and quality of ammo made. Winner takes all. And the loser gets to say good bye to their press. So now you all know that not only do I talk the talk, but I am willing to walk the walk.


Now, for SKEET 028.

It sounds like you have a great running 650 or you don't know to get you Hornady running right. Now I would hate to bring my press all the way to Ca. and come back with out a new press. So if you are on the I-80 corridor I would like to come by. But to be nice I won't take your "great running Press" I would rather take your Hornady.
More BS comparison. Sad.
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  #107  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:10 AM
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LAA I took every thing you said into account.Here is the post of my original rules for the bet.
My JOHNSON is bigger than your JOHNSON....No, my JOHNSON is bigger than your JOHNSON. Well, the only way to prove it is to ...whip it out. Well, I am ready to whip it out. I will put up my 100% Hornady up against any 100% Dillon. 550, 650, 1050, you pick which one you want to lose.

Here are the rules. You must live within 50 miles of Omaha.
1 your press must be 100% Dillon Little things like screws, nuts, knobs, ergo handle permitted.
2 500 rounds timed. For every second slower than the other loader cost you 1 point
3 I know you, Dillon, reloaders say you produce Quality round. So before we start the reloader will write down his COL and power drop.
After all, rounds are run primer depth will be measured. Must be .001 or .002 below the bottom of the case or you lose 1 point.
All COL will be measured + or - .002 will cost you 1 point.
50 rounds will be pulled at random and will have the power measured. If you said it was to be 4.6 and it is 4.4 or less or 4.8 or more you lose a point.
4 It will be the best 2 out of 3 and the first loader will be decided by the flip of the coin.

Why am I so cocky? Well, I know that Dillon does not make a bullet feeder. And I know that You can not pull a handle and set a bullet as fast as I can pull a handle.
And this is what you're against. Oh, and they are perfectly timed, from the press to the case feeder to the bullet feeder.


I do expect to unbolt MY new press from YOUR bench on my second visit.

Last edited by DRAINSMITH; 09-01-2017 at 12:16 AM.
  #108  
Old 09-01-2017, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by DRAINSMITH View Post
Now, for SKEET 028.

It sounds like you have a great running 650 or you don't know to get you Hornady running right. Now I would hate to bring my press all the way to Ca. and come back with out a new press. So if you are on the I-80 corridor I would like to come by. But to be nice I won't take your "great running Press" I would rather take your Hornady.
Well I am about 8 hours from 80. but if you won a bet which one of the Hornady's would you want? The only thing I really pointed out was the inaccuracies of your figures. I happened to buy a 650(550) and a case feeder(175) as well as the MBF feeder(470). I received 10% on the press and feeder to reduce the price by 72 bucks and free shipping on the MBF...total was $1192. When I bought the Hornady Ammo Plant(it truly isn't) it cost $1120 delivered. It came missing 3 fairly small parts. Hornady wanted to charge me for the parts and eventually after talking with a supervisor I guess, they sent them for free. Setup on the 650 was very easy from start to finish The MBF worked as it should have and was reliable..actually I was surprised that it worked so well. The Hornady took longer to set up as it needed a lot of back and forth to the manual. The feeder from Hornady had a few hitches in it until I got the minor bugs worked out. The Hornady works ok but the Dillon is definitely smoother. Primer feed was markedly better than the Hornady from the start but the Hornady did get better after a while. It seems to work ok but not quite as smooth as the Dillon. Is it a bad machine...no. Is it a great machine..again no. The quality of the machine itself is as good as any I guess, better than many. The quality of the case feeder is not quite up to the Dillon and the bullet feeder is a far cry from the MBF in my opinion...but better than the RCBS unit(is it still available?). I don't run either machine in a very fast manner but if in a hurry I could get 600 rounds an hour. I sold the MBF to a friend as I wanted to be able to use the press for mostly cast bullets in handgun and they are not really compatible..The Hornady isn't either. Gums 'em up I guess. And like LAA said I don't need to load that fast any longer...so I don't. With the 1050s I usually keep them to about 750 an hour with no bullet feeder. I don't need to go faster and the quality of my loads are great. I have loaded a few with no primers on the 1050 when I ran out. Never had a race with someone reloading...but I'll bet on shootin 'em up fast! and as far as taking my Hornady...why would you want the inferior machine??? Don't get all fired up..just messing with ya.

Last edited by Skeet 028; 09-01-2017 at 02:03 AM.
  #109  
Old 09-01-2017, 02:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Skeet 028 View Post
Well I am about 8 hours from 80. but if you won a bet which one of the Hornady's would you want? The only thing I really pointed out was the inaccuracies of your figures. I happened to buy a 650(550) and a case feeder(175) as well as the MBF feeder(470). I received 10% on the press and feeder to reduce the price by 72 bucks and free shipping on the MBF...total was $1192. When I bought the Hornady Ammo Plant(it truly isn't) it cost $1120 delivered. It came missing 3 fairly small parts. Hornady wanted to charge me for the parts and eventually after talking with a supervisor I guess, they sent them for free. Setup on the 650 was very easy from start to finish The MBF worked as it should have and was reliable..actually I was surprised that it worked so well. The Hornady took longer to set up as it needed a lot of back and forth to the manual. The feeder from Hornady had a few hitches in it until I got the minor bugs worked out. The Hornady works ok but the Dillon is definitely smoother. Primer feed was markedly better than the Hornady from the start but the Hornady did get better after a while. It seems to work ok but not quite as smooth as the Dillon. Is it a bad machine...no. Is it a great machine..again no. The quality of the machine itself is as good as any I guess, better than many. The quality of the case feeder is not quite up to the Dillon and the bullet feeder is a far cry from the MBF in my opinion...but better than the RCBS unit(is it still available?). I don't run either machine in a very fast manner but if in a hurry I could get 600 rounds an hour. I sold the MBF to a friend as I wanted to be able to use the press for mostly cast bullets in handgun and they are not really compatible..The Hornady isn't either. Gums 'em up I guess. And like LAA said I don't need to load that fast any longer...so I don't. With the 1050s I usually keep them to about 750 an hour with no bullet feeder. I don't need to go faster and the quality of my loads are great. I have loaded a few with no primers on the 1050 when I ran out. Never had a race with someone reloading...but I'll bet on shootin 'em up fast! and as far as taking my Hornady...why would you want the inferior machine??? Don't get all fired up..just messing with ya.
Mr. Skeet 028.
I apologize I miss understood your post.

Now Sir. If you would like I can talk you through on how to get the Hornady as smooth as mine. And I will gladly help. The total cost of my modifications is under $15.00. And if you would like I have a Dillon primer buzzer that was on one of the Hornady presses I bought and resold. Just PM me.
  #110  
Old 09-01-2017, 07:52 AM
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For me reloading has never been about speed
Steady and smooth with the lever and the press does exactly what it is supposed to do
Especially when I was using a SDB, too fast or too jerky and it would toss powder. That press made me a believer in a 5 station press
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  #111  
Old 09-01-2017, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddietruett View Post
I'm looking to upgrade my loading process. Currently using a Lee Classic 1000 which I love with the exception of the primer loading. Just not fast enough. Been considering a Dillon 650. But open minded. Would like a press to give around 300 rounds per hour which the Dillon should handle easily. Any reviews or suggestions of other brands?
Wow !! OP simple straight forward question. ( ' need a press to do about 300 rounds an hour'.)
Now we are talking about who's Johnson is bigger ?
My dog is bigger than your dog !
Sounds like kids in elementary school,, or the Yo-Yo's in Washington.

Back in the 80's when my single stage RCBS wasn't keeping up with my need for ammo, I purchased a Dillon 550. Now I have 2 Dillon 550's , which I am quite happy with. And they will do about 300 rounds of quality ammo per hour.

I don't hate Hornady presses. , I figure they make a decent product, even though I've never used one. And If you are happy with yours ,, I'm happy for you..

I'm not sure I understand what appears to be the extreme hatred for Dillon ??
Or what appears to be a inferiority complex about the size of your Hornady..

Obviously I don't understand. . But, I don't understand why anybody would buy a Ford, when everyone knows a Chevy is Better.

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  #112  
Old 09-01-2017, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by DRAINSMITH View Post
Mr. Skeet 028.
I apologize I miss understood your post.

Now Sir. If you would like I can talk you through on how to get the Hornady as smooth as mine. And I will gladly help. The total cost of my modifications is under $15.00. And if you would like I have a Dillon primer buzzer that was on one of the Hornady presses I bought and resold. Just PM me.
I'd like to get that Hornady AP to run better. I'd get it set up for the 44 Special. If the bullet feeder would work with cast I'd like it better. Maybe it would work with powder coated..does anybody know if they work through a bullet feeder??
  #113  
Old 09-01-2017, 11:16 AM
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LAA I took every thing you said into account.Here is the post of my original rules for the bet.
My JOHNSON is bigger than your JOHNSON....No, my JOHNSON is bigger than your JOHNSON. Well, the only way to prove it is to ...whip it out. Well, I am ready to whip it out. I will put up my 100% Hornady up against any 100% Dillon. 550, 650, 1050, you pick which one you want to lose.

Here are the rules. You must live within 50 miles of Omaha.
1 your press must be 100% Dillon Little things like screws, nuts, knobs, ergo handle permitted.
2 500 rounds timed. For every second slower than the other loader cost you 1 point
3 I know you, Dillon, reloaders say you produce Quality round. So before we start the reloader will write down his COL and power drop.
After all, rounds are run primer depth will be measured. Must be .001 or .002 below the bottom of the case or you lose 1 point.
All COL will be measured + or - .002 will cost you 1 point.
50 rounds will be pulled at random and will have the power measured. If you said it was to be 4.6 and it is 4.4 or less or 4.8 or more you lose a point.
4 It will be the best 2 out of 3 and the first loader will be decided by the flip of the coin.

Why am I so cocky? Well, I know that Dillon does not make a bullet feeder. And I know that You can not pull a handle and set a bullet as fast as I can pull a handle.
And this is what you're against. Oh, and they are perfectly timed, from the press to the case feeder to the bullet feeder.


I do expect to unbolt MY new press from YOUR bench on my second visit.
I use mainly cast and swaged lead bullets with standard lube. If we both used them in your "challenge", you'd lose.
  #114  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:49 PM
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So drain has shown why his LNL run, he never swaps calibers?? So lets see the economy one tool head & caliber change or an entire $1100 machine? Now I get it.
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  #115  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Skeet 028 View Post
I'd like to get that Hornady AP to run better. I'd get it set up for the 44 Special. If the bullet feeder would work with cast I'd like it better. Maybe it would work with powder coated..does anybody know if they work through a bullet feeder??
Most feeders will run powder or HT coated, even Hornady. The issue us with cast & lubed bullets gumming up the feeding.
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  #116  
Old 09-01-2017, 01:01 PM
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I'd like to get that Hornady AP to run better. I'd get it set up for the 44 Special. If the bullet feeder would work with cast I'd like it better. Maybe it would work with powder coated..does anybody know if they work through a bullet feeder??
Well, I got bad news, good news, and some more bad news. For the last 3 months, I have tried to get a 45 bullet feeder to load lead. I have failed, but I have heard others have been able to do it. So I haven't given up yet.

Now the good news, I had a friend make me some .30 bullets and they loaded just fine through the rifle feeder.

Now for the last bad news. I called Hornady and asked them if they intended to make rifle type dies for pistols. The answer is "no".

But as we old geezers know "The squeaky wheel gets the grease". If enough call and ask for it they might put it out.
  #117  
Old 09-01-2017, 01:11 PM
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I use mainly cast and swaged lead bullets with standard lube. If we both used them in your "challenge", you'd lose.
You are 100% correct. But I don't run diesel in my gas truck either.
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  #118  
Old 09-01-2017, 01:56 PM
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This thread is FASCINATING!
Yeah?
I imagine it is kinda like digging through a landfill- you can find some interesting stuff if you dig through a lot of trash.

There is enough good data here for the OP to form a conclusion, so we'll forego further posturing and chest beating.
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Old 09-01-2017, 02:01 PM
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Remember folks-
Putting forth an opinion is fine.
Just don't get bent out of shape when other people do.
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