Cannot seem to find reliable load data for older canadian IMR4227 (metal can) using a 158 XTP in .357mag. Im guessing 14.0 to 17.0gr. Could someone school me please? Trying to develop an accurate hunting round this season out of an 8" Dan Wesson 15-2. Thanks!

4227 then is 4227 now. Use any IMR4227 or H4227 data.

thank you.

I used to use that exact same powder when I lived in Canada. Used to get it from Le Baron's. Very good, consistent over the years since.
Start low and consult a good manual. It tends to burn with a lot of unburned powder type residue at the lower end. As you approach top loads, it tends to clean up nicely, and really start performing in terms of accuracy and velocity. I never needed magnum primers, either.

Enjoy!
Jim

In addition to its use in magnum handguns, 4227 is very good for use in light CF rifle cartridge loads with cast bullets. Today I loaded nearly 100 rounds of .300 Savage ammunition using 172 grain gas-check cast bullets and 22 grains of H4227 for an MV of around 2000 ft/sec. Much more pleasant to fire vs full-power jacketed bullets.

17 grains............... maybe.

My jacketed 158 gr bullets had a full case at just 16 grains.
I did not use magnum primers either, just standard cci.

Target load with a 158gr lead SWC at 12 grains was accurate
in my revolver.

A good crimp adds to complete combustion.

This powder works best at the top of its range, I can tell you that much from experience. I locked up a 28-2 with unburden powder packed up under the ejector star messing around in the mid range. Once you get the load right, you'll notice the highly consistent accuracy becomes boring

Beside pistol usage, the 4227 powders also make for some quite accurate 22 Hornet loads too. I used to use IMR4227 back in the 60's to reload 22 Hornet and could shoot dime sized groups at 100 yards with them back then out of a Savage bolt gun of my Dad's.

I have loaded quite a few 30-30 loads using IMR 4227 with a 173gr cast bullet , Lyman Mold . I don't remember the load but it was sure accurate . I use it mostly in magnum hand gun loads . My experience showed that , for me it worked better with a full magnum primer vs a std or the " in between primers " like Winchester and Remington . I gave up a bit of velocity vs other magnum powders but the accuracy is always right there . I also have used it quite a bit in 45 Colt with a 255 gr cast bullet .

It's an under-appreciated and versatile propellant. I have loaded it in .30 Carbine, and it works OK, the problem being that it has a low bulk density. Even with the .30 Carbine case nearly full to the mouth, the MV is only about 1800 ft/sec (using the standard 107 grain FMJ bullet), over 100 ft/sec under standard ballistics with 2400 or H-110. But you don't need to worry about double charges.

Not according to Hodgdon/IMR. The old IMR4227 and H4227 were two different powders and altho load recipes were close, they were not interchangeable. Recently, the old IMR4227 powder is no longer produced. The old H4227 powder has been rebranded as the "new" IMR4227 and the brand H4227 discontinued.

That said, my older Hornady manual shows a max of 14.5 with the old IMR4227 under a 158 gr XTP. Start is 12.4. This is using a SPM primer. They show a max of 15.1 for the old H4227.

I will dispute that, no matter what Hodgdon says. I have compared 4227 (old duPont IMR and new Hodgdon and old Hodgdon) side by side using identical loads and get identical average MVs. There is probably more difference between powder lots than makers (Hodgdon gets their powder from various sources worldwide - Scotland, Australia, Eastern Europe, you name it). It would be absolutely insane and legally suicidal for Hodgdon to sell a powder under the 4227 name without it being essentially the same ballistically as the old original duPont IMR4227 powder.

Well, your dispute is with Hodgdon, not with me. I'm only telling others what they told me when I asked. First time I asked was a decade ago and was told that altho load recipes were very similar, that IMR4227 and H4227 were indeed different powders and thus one should follow the recipes for each. Coupla years back when I noticed the recipes had changed on Hodgdon's website, I was told about the change in branding. I'd assume that since the powders were once very close, that using a published max charge for one, was still within safe parameters of the other.

That said, I find that while I really like IMR4227 in my .44s and .460, performance in my .357 revolvers, seeking legitimate magnum type loads is dismal. In the .357 carbine, performance is okay, accuracy is great.

I just got through shooting 50 rounds , loaded with IMR 4227 in a 357 , accuracy was stellar , recoil softer than some other magnum powders . I always use full magnum primers .

Hunting???

I too use mag primers with it . Won't give top velocity but it usually gives tack driving accuracy . As stated above works best near the top . Watch spreads when they narrow & a dab more shows no increase you got your load before adding the dab .Long time favorite among silhouette & Cast Bullet rifle shooters for eons right along with Unique , 4198 , 4759 & others .

My 1979 Hodgdon #23 is the oldest manual that I have with H4227 data.

I don't think you need to worry about a full load of powder with this being
used in the .357 Magnum revolver, with the pressures listed.

158-160 lead with H4227: 15.0... 1396... 32,600 CUP
160gr JSP ......... " " ........ 14.5... 1377 .. 34,100 Cup

I also agree on a full load of powder, with a magnum primer and a heavy crimp..........
produces the cleanest, most accurate load with this powder......
even though there might still be some unburned or a lot of powder residue left after shooting.

Good luck.

I have used both "old" and "new" IMR4227 with the same recipes with success.
It's my go to powder in magnum and supermagnum.
Good midrange loads in the 444 as well.

Having said that, I do know that IMR and H-4198 ARE completely different powders.
They look different and act a little differently.
H-4198 is a tad slower and has temperature compensation.
H-4198 is a favorite in the 444.

This is a long running discussion.
Many load manuals show different characteristics for W296 and H110 while we have been told
till they are blue in the face by Hodgdon that they are the exact same powder.

I tend to believe them over the loading manuals.

__________________
NEMO
"Everything 44"