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Old 01-26-2020, 08:08 PM
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Exactly how much powder is there in a late 70’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr case?
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Old 01-26-2020, 09:09 PM
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I guess you'll also want to know what powder it is.Just taking a round apart and weighting the powder won't tell you a thing;you also need to know what is the powder and that is THE question.
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Old 01-26-2020, 09:20 PM
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Even if someone disassembled a cartridge and measured the powder charge, the information would be useless without knowing the powder type, and lot number, and this powder would not be available to a hand loader anyway.
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Old 01-26-2020, 09:24 PM
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Judging by your very first question on this forum, you are, my friend, swimming in very dangerous water.
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Old 01-26-2020, 09:29 PM
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Default ^^^ Righto

Do you have a reloading manual? My Lyman book says that the max load for max velocity with a 158 gr fmj is with 14.9 grains of Acc #9 powder at 1357 fps.

Or look on the websites for powder manufacturer's websites for reloading data.

Of course observe all safety rules, don't start of with a max load and work up. And confirm reloading data for yourself. LEARN all you can about reloading before attempting any experimentation. There's a LOT more to reloading than just powder/bullet charges.
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Old 01-27-2020, 02:43 AM
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I can tell you this much, they called the powder 230, 231, or 296. I know this how? Because they call all of that range of powders those numbers! And none of the factory powders are what is sold to reloaders! (my info in the 80's showed 11 types of 231, and in the 90's 12 types, but not any were necessarily the same as the 80's powder. I'm told a batch of powder is around 10 tons. The test each batch for burn rate and pressure properties, Then use those figures to determine how much to use in a particular loading. Then they make a sample batch and test it; and adjust it or move to a different batch.

Ivan

10 tons would make roughly 40,000,000 rounds at 3.5 grains of powder. Or 10 million at 14 grains!
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Old 01-27-2020, 03:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewWeber View Post
Exactly how much powder is there in a late 70’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr case?
Can you tell us the reasoning behind your question? If we knew why you're asking, we might be of more help. As others have said, just knowing the charge weight of a 70's era load is unlikely to be useful.
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Old 01-27-2020, 03:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qc Pistolero View Post
I guess you'll also want to know what powder it is.Just taking a round apart and weighting the powder won't tell you a thing;you also need to know what is the powder and that is THE question.
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Originally Posted by Warren Sear View Post
Even if someone disassembled a cartridge and measured the powder charge, the information would be useless without knowing the powder type, and lot number, and this powder would not be available to a hand loader anyway.
Ok, do you know what powder type the factory put in their late 70’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr cases ?

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-27-2020 at 03:46 AM.
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Old 01-27-2020, 03:56 AM
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Originally Posted by rwsmith View Post
Do you have a reloading manual? My Lyman book says that the max load for max velocity with a 158 gr fmj is with 14.9 grains of Acc #9 powder at 1357 fps.

Or look on the websites for powder manufacturer's websites for reloading data.

Of course observe all safety rules, don't start of with a max load and work up. And confirm reloading data for yourself. LEARN all you can about reloading before attempting any experimentation. There's a LOT more to reloading than just powder/bullet charges.
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Originally Posted by Ivan the Butcher View Post
I can tell you this much, they called the powder 230, 231, or 296. I know this how? Because they call all of that range of powders those numbers! And none of the factory powders are what is sold to reloaders! (my info in the 80's showed 11 types of 231, and in the 90's 12 types, but not any were necessarily the same as the 80's powder. I'm told a batch of powder is around 10 tons. The test each batch for burn rate and pressure properties, Then use those figures to determine how much to use in a particular loading. Then they make a sample batch and test it; and adjust it or move to a different batch.

Ivan

10 tons would make roughly 40,000,000 rounds at 3.5 grains of powder. Or 10 million at 14 grains!
Ok, what would be the approximate amount of powder in a factory made early 80’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr case? I don't get it ?

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-27-2020 at 04:05 AM.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:36 AM
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Hi, Andrew:
These fellows are dancing around your initial question because they are concerned that you might be trying to duplicate the original loading (Bullet weight/velocity) by simply picking a currently produced powder and pouring the original amount/weight of what was the original factory powder into a reload. This is not the way to duplicate the original factory bullet.
Duplication can be done, but only by chronographing the original load and then duplicating the velocity with modern bullets and a safe load of appropriate, MODERN powder, called canister powder.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:46 AM
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We can measure the original charge weight. We CANNOT know for certain what powder was originally used. Cartridge powders can't be identified by how they look, smell, taste, or what they weigh. Powders used in factory loads are also frequently discontinued. Attempting to duplicate a factory load by choosing a powder at random and pouring in what the original weight was, will always result in disappointment at best and (Usually) disaster at worst.
The folks replying to your original post are trying to be helpful.
They are not treating you like an idiot. All of the questions they asked and the points that they, and I, made are part of being helpful.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex1001 View Post
Hi, Andrew:
These fellows are dancing around your initial question because they are concerned that you might be trying to duplicate the original loading (Bullet weight/velocity) by simply picking a currently produced powder and pouring the original amount/weight of what was the original factory powder into a reload. This is not the way to duplicate the original factory bullet.
Duplication can be done, but only by chronographing the original load and then duplicating the velocity with modern bullets and a safe load of appropriate, MODERN powder, called canister powder.
Hi, Tex1001
I am not planning to try anything. I just want to know what the approximate amount of powder was in a factory made early 80’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr case?

1 grain ? 2 grains ? 3 grains ? and so on ? I have no idea but want to know.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:56 AM
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Originally Posted by AndrewWeber View Post
Ok, do you know what powder type the factory put in their late 70’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr cases ?
The simple answer is, no one knows. The powder type and lot number is buried in Winchester's records. Whatever powder it was, it was never made available to the public.
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:00 AM
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Post #12^^^This post makes your original question valid. There IS an answer.

I have a box of Winchester metal piercing 357 magnum from the late '60s. Give me a couple of days to dig it out and pull a bullet.
Someone else may beat me to it.
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:09 AM
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By the way, that Winchester metal piercing load was a big disappointment. The bullets looked wicked but they never performed up to the factory hype. I was a LEO back then and we tested them on an old engine block.

We did find that the 30-30 150 grain RNSP was a much better metal piercer.
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Old 01-27-2020, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewWeber View Post
Hi, Tex1001
I am not planning to try anything. I just want to know what the approximate amount of powder was in a factory made early 80’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr case?

1 grain ? 2 grains ? 3 grains ? and so on ? I have no idea but want to know.
With that 158gr bullet I'd go with 16.0gr of ww296 powder. What they did, who knows??? Back then they used ww297 powder (commercial grade) that common handloaders like us couldn't buy. I remember seeing drums of it back in the early 80's.
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Old 01-27-2020, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Tex1001 View Post
Post #12^^^This post makes your original question valid. There IS an answer.

I have a box of Winchester metal piercing 357 magnum from the late '60s. Give me a couple of days to dig it out and pull a bullet.
Someone else may beat me to it.
Ok, Tex1001

Thank's, can't wait to hear the answer
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Old 01-27-2020, 03:07 PM
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Just as a note;

The same load put out by Remington or Federal will probably be
totally different in powder weights and types and even FPS.

As mentioned and printed in "Rags", this load was a flop along with the 200 grain flying "Ash tray", back in those days.

"BAR"......... the only way to go.
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Old 01-27-2020, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by AndrewWeber View Post
Ok, Tex1001



Thank's, can't wait to hear the answer
After reading this thread I still can't imagine why you want the answer so badly. It will be a completely meaningless piece of information, whether it's two grains or twenty.
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Old 01-27-2020, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewWeber View Post
Hi, Tex1001
I am not planning to try anything. I just want to know what the approximate amount of powder was in a factory made early 80’s Winchester .357 Magnum Metal Piercing 158 gr case?

1 grain ? 2 grains ? 3 grains ? and so on ? I have no idea but want to know.
Well, there are literally zero true, full-spec and proper .357 Magnum loads that have ever used 1, 2 or 3 grains of powder.

Starting at it’s most basic (as we have no idea of your level of knowledge or your intent) it first makes sense to note clearly that in this endeavor, a “grain” is actually a standard unit of measurement. So simply to be clear, a grain isn’t a “granule” or a piece of powder, it is a weight measurement whereby 7,000 grains equals one pound.

Full-spec .357 Magnum (properly!) uses a powder that is a bit slower with regards to burn rate, relative to other handgun ammo. While a target level load might use a faster powder and 5-6 grains of it, a “late 70’s Winchester metal piercing 158gr” case would typically use a slower burning powder and MUCH more of it, such as the 15-17 grains mentioned in a post above mine.

Commercial ammo typically doesn’t use the same powder that handloaders can purchase. They tend to use HUGE lots of powder that they alter to do specifically what they want that powder to do. They don’t read a load recipe from a book like many handloaders do, they load a charge and test it and alter things from that point to get the result they desire and they do this in controlled laboratory conditions with a bankroll that exceeds the handloader’s typical net worth.

And in the 1970’s, they had much more primitive equipment and it is likely that they didn’t have nearly the full idea of what they were making and selling nearly as well as they do these days.

Often we will have an author show up at the forum to ask questions similar to yours so that he can write something in a fiction novel that will read well even to those select few that will appreciate the level of detail. The general audience here include exactly those kinds of folks and nobody has ever minded these kinds of questions and are happy to help.

But the process tends to run more smoothly when the person who asks the question gives some sort of background or goal behind the question. Otherwise, to many of us, it reads as if perhaps some neophyte might attempt something downright dangerous using poor research.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:24 PM
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Well, there are literally zero true, full-spec and proper .357 Magnum loads that have ever used 1, 2 or 3 grains of powder.

Starting at it’s most basic (as we have no idea of your level of knowledge or your intent) it first makes sense to note clearly that in this endeavor, a “grain” is actually a standard unit of measurement. So simply to be clear, a grain isn’t a “granule” or a piece of powder, it is a weight measurement whereby 7,000 grains equals one pound.

Full-spec .357 Magnum (properly!) uses a powder that is a bit slower with regards to burn rate, relative to other handgun ammo. While a target level load might use a faster powder and 5-6 grains of it, a “late 70’s Winchester metal piercing 158gr” case would typically use a slower burning powder and MUCH more of it, such as the 15-17 grains mentioned in a post above mine.

Commercial ammo typically doesn’t use the same powder that handloaders can purchase. They tend to use HUGE lots of powder that they alter to do specifically what they want that powder to do. They don’t read a load recipe from a book like many handloaders do, they load a charge and test it and alter things from that point to get the result they desire and they do this in controlled laboratory conditions with a bankroll that exceeds the handloader’s typical net worth.

And in the 1970’s, they had much more primitive equipment and it is likely that they didn’t have nearly the full idea of what they were making and selling nearly as well as they do these days.

Often we will have an author show up at the forum to ask questions similar to yours so that he can write something in a fiction novel that will read well even to those select few that will appreciate the level of detail. The general audience here include exactly those kinds of folks and nobody has ever minded these kinds of questions and are happy to help.

But the process tends to run more smoothly when the person who asks the question gives some sort of background or goal behind the question. Otherwise, to many of us, it reads as if perhaps some neophyte might attempt something downright dangerous using poor research.
Ok, we could then expect Tex1001s late '60s metal piercing 357 magnum case to contain 15-17 grains (0.971984-1.10158 gr.) ?

I just need the info for some research, don't have a gun nor a bullet, nor planning to get one

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Old 01-27-2020, 04:27 PM
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if
you know the velocity and charge weight you can atrempt
to cross reference published load data to duplicate with with know powder and load.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:32 PM
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Glad you got your answer.

If you look up “.357 Magnum case capacity” online you would find one holds 27 grains. Subtract the space the bullet takes up seated into it and you can make a reasonable estimate - more than 1 and less than 26.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:36 PM
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After reading this thread I still can't imagine why you want the answer so badly. It will be a completely meaningless piece of information, whether it's two grains or twenty.
i'll have a follow up question for you, when I get what you call "meaningless piece of information" from Tex1001
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:38 PM
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Ok, we could then expect Tex1001s late '60s metal piercing 357 magnum case to contain 15-17 grains (0.971984-1.10158 gr.) ?

I just need the info for some research, don't have a gun nor a bullet, nor planning to get one
I would say that it is beyond possible, perhaps even approaching probable but at the same time... I wouldn’t bet my money on it.

If I were headed to my load bench right now to load a 158gr jacketed bullet up for full-nuts .357 Magnum, the load that has worked nicely for me would be carrying 18.6 grains of a powder that Winchester did not use in the 1960’s or 1970’s.
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:42 PM
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Glad you got your answer.

If you look up “.357 Magnum case capacity” online you would find one holds 27 grains. Subtract the space the bullet takes up seated into it and you can make a reasonable estimate - more than 1 and less than 26.
I don't have the answer yet, I am waiting for Tex1001 answer

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-27-2020 at 04:47 PM.
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:57 PM
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Okay, here we are:

Cartridge loaded with EXACTLY 14.0 gr., no more, no less, of a very fine grained powder. Charge weighed 6(SIX) times, three on electronic scale, three on balance beam scale.
Pictures are below. Note the July, 1969 price. Box photo'd with an intact cartridge and the pulled projectile.
Notice that the bullet is swaged lead with a pointed cap made of what appears to be gilding metal (Non magnetic).

This report is worth every cent that you paid for it.
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Old 01-27-2020, 06:05 PM
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After reading this thread I still can't imagine why you want the answer so badly. It will be a completely meaningless piece of information, whether it's two grains or twenty.
What is meaningless to you is relatively important to him. Andrew has stated that he is not trying to duplicate a load. Like he stated twice already, he is simply doing research. I don't really care. I'm doing a favor for a new member. Over the years members here have done favors for me. I'm paying it forward.

He has his info. Now he can sleep at night.
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Old 01-27-2020, 06:07 PM
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Wow, I wonder if those suckers leaded up some barrels?

Have you ever chrono’d any of them? I wonder what kind of speed they are running at? If the bearing surface is swaged lead, they may scoot along pretty swiftly!
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Old 01-27-2020, 06:14 PM
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Wow, I wonder if those suckers leaded up some barrels?
As I recall, they leaded up my old Python pretty quickly. This is what's left of a two box purchase and this box is almost full.
Never been chrono'd. I have had no desire to. Like I stated above, we did some non-technical evaluations and at the time none of us were impressed.
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Old 01-27-2020, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex1001 View Post
Okay, here we are:

Cartridge loaded with EXACTLY 14.0 gr., no more, no less, of a very fine grained powder. Charge weighed 6(SIX) times, three on electronic scale, three on balance beam scale.
Pictures are below. Note the July, 1969 price. Box photo'd with an intact cartridge and the pulled projectile.
Notice that the bullet is swaged lead with a pointed cap made of what appears to be gilding metal (Non magnetic).

This report is worth every cent that you paid for it.
I am so thankful, I couldn't have got a better answer ! Thank you for your understanding, Tex1001 !
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Old 01-27-2020, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by AndrewWeber View Post
"Originally Posted by Tom K View Post
After reading this thread I still can't imagine why you want the answer so badly. It will be a completely meaningless piece of information, whether it's two grains or twenty."

i'll have a follow up question for you, when I get what you call "meaningless piece of information" from Tex1001
and the follow up question is?
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Old 01-27-2020, 07:43 PM
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Glad Andrew got his answer but Im still shaking my head over his question.
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Old 01-27-2020, 08:19 PM
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I am so thankful, I couldn't have got a better answer ! Thank you for your understanding, Tex1001 !
We're buds, now. Just call me Tex.
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Old 01-28-2020, 02:53 AM
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Originally Posted by ruggyh View Post
and the follow up question is?
Is it now possible to return let's say only 3.0 gr of the 14.0 gr into the case ? And what would be the result on recoil, sound, velocity ? how much difference would it be from 14.0 gr to 3.0 gr in the case ?

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-28-2020 at 03:01 AM.
  #36  
Old 01-28-2020, 03:32 AM
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While it would be technically possible, it would be a very bad idea. Going from 14gr. way down to 3gr. of what is undoubtedly a very slow pistol powder would reduce muzzle velocity dangerously and might very well lodge a bullet in the handgun's barrel.
Finding a reduced charge of the original powder that MIGHT reliably reduce muzzle velocity would involve:

1 Pulling the bullet so as not to deform it
2 Removing a very small amount of original powder
3 Recording how much powder was removed from the original powder charge
4 Replacing the bullet
5 Firing the bullet to observe and record ballistic characteristics

The five steps listed above are theoretical in nature.
PERFORMING THESE STEPS IN THE REAL WORLD WOULD BE EXTREMELY IRRESPONSIBLE!
PEOPLE HAVE PROBABLY BEEN INJURED OR KILLED AS A RESULT OF ATTEMPTING THIS!

No responsible person should ever reduce a factory powder charge at all, much less as drastically as you have suggested.
Tinkering with charges of a powder with unknown ballistic characteristics is always dangerous.
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Old 01-28-2020, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Tex1001 View Post
While it would be technically possible, it would be a very bad idea. Going from 14gr. way down to 3gr. of what is undoubtedly a very slow pistol powder would reduce muzzle velocity dangerously and might very well lodge a bullet in the handgun's barrel.
Finding a reduced charge of the original powder that MIGHT reliably reduce muzzle velocity would involve:

1 Pulling the bullet so as not to deform it
2 Removing a very small amount of original powder
3 Recording how much powder was removed from the original powder charge
4 Replacing the bullet
5 Firing the bullet to observe and record ballistic characteristics

The five steps listed above are theoretical in nature.
PERFORMING THESE STEPS IN THE REAL WORLD WOULD BE EXTREMELY IRRESPONSIBLE!
PEOPLE HAVE PROBABLY BEEN INJURED OR KILLED AS A RESULT OF ATTEMPTING THIS!

No responsible person should ever reduce a factory powder charge at all, much less as drastically as you have suggested.
Tinkering with charges of a powder with unknown ballistic characteristics is always dangerous.
ok, ok no one is going to do that !

But what would be the result on recoil, sound, velocity ? let's say at only 5.0 gr ? you didn't answer that

And another thing, judging from your post, this would certainly not be something an amateur would do, but only a very experienced reloader with deep knowhow in reloading data and so on, since it's so extremely dangerous ?

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-28-2020 at 04:31 AM.
  #38  
Old 01-28-2020, 06:48 AM
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If you disassembled a round of that stuff and had ONLY the original powder from that round to put back in to that round, a 5.0gr charge of that powder may very well not even get the bullet far in to the bore. It could move the bullet forward enough to lodge it in the barrel just enough where it will stop and allow the bit of gas to escape behind it out the cylinder gap.

However, if you had 5.0gr of a fast burning powder such as Titegroup or Bullseye then you would get a typical discharge/shot fired, but it wouldn’t have the power, bullet speed, deep sound or recoil that 14 grains of the slower burning (proper) powder would give it.

To actually do all of the above, you needn’t necessarily be skilled but you would need the proper tools, and only a handloader would have those tools available.
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Old 01-28-2020, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
If you disassembled a round of that stuff and had ONLY the original powder from that round to put back in to that round, a 5.0gr charge of that powder may very well not even get the bullet far in to the bore. It could move the bullet forward enough to lodge it in the barrel just enough where it will stop and allow the bit of gas to escape behind it out the cylinder gap.

However, if you had 5.0gr of a fast burning powder such as Titegroup or Bullseye then you would get a typical discharge/shot fired, but it wouldn’t have the power, bullet speed, deep sound or recoil that 14 grains of the slower burning (proper) powder would give it.

To actually do all of the above, you needn’t necessarily be skilled but you would need the proper tools, and only a handloader would have those tools available.
It seems that I am not getting any answer to my follow up question, because I randomly say "3.0 gr" or "5.0 gr" ?

So I try this way: If you have less than 14,0 gr factory powder, any amount less. What would be the result or effect on recoil, sound and velocity ?

I do understand that nothing changes at 13,0 gr, so pic a leser gr

When will the recoil, sound and velocity change ?

And once again, I am not planing to do this. I don't have the 1969 bullet, Tex has the 1969 bullet and factory powder

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-28-2020 at 07:14 AM.
  #40  
Old 01-28-2020, 07:31 AM
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To add clarity to the discussion, in 1990 I shot through the 1/4" thick steel web of an I-beam at approximately 25 yards with a 30 Herrett Thompson Center Contender. The bullet was cast lead 130 grains with a gas check. Muzzle velocity was 1,500 FPS measured on my chronograph.
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Old 01-28-2020, 07:46 AM
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If the factory round has a jacketed 158gr bullet14gr of 2400 powder giving @ 1300fps. Reducing it by 1gr would probably only reduce by 50 or 75fps. 2gr less 100 or 150fps. At @ 10gr you would be less than 1,000fps. Going down to 8gr would be taking a chance on sticking a bullet in barrel.
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Old 01-28-2020, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engineer1911 View Post
To add clarity to the discussion, in 1990 I shot through the 1/4" thick steel web of an I-beam at approximately 25 yards with a 30 Herrett Thompson Center Contender. The bullet was cast lead 130 grains with a gas check. Muzzle velocity was 1,500 FPS measured on my chronograph.
I will get to, what the bullet can go through question, after I get the answer to my follow up question.
  #43  
Old 01-28-2020, 07:52 AM
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If the factory round has a jacketed 158gr bullet14gr of 2400 powder giving @ 1300fps. Reducing it by 1gr would probably only reduce by 50 or 75fps. 2gr less 100 or 150fps. At @ 10gr you would be less than 1,000fps. Going down to 8gr would be taking a chance on sticking a bullet in barrel.
Ok, that's more like it!

Will the gun also have less recoil and less sound at 9gr ?
  #44  
Old 01-28-2020, 07:53 AM
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Speaking strictly theoretically, about only the physics involved, each tenth of a grain reduction in powder will of course lower the 1. recoil, 2. noise and 3. velocity. BUT there comes a point with some powders where, at low load levels you get tremendous pressure spikes. That point is mostly unknown and totally unknown for unknown powders. For example, a friend just had that level of curiosity and using a 357 Magnum revolver, loaded .38 Special cases starting at +P+ with Bullseye powder and worked the load by tenths down to 7/10th of a grain total load at which point the cylinder jammed as there wasn't sufficient velocity for the bullet to clear the cylinder. As he suspected, Bullseye was not a low level spiker.
He has never repeated the experiment with any other powder.

Stu
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Old 01-28-2020, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by stu1ritter View Post
Speaking strictly theoretically, about only the physics involved, each tenth of a grain reduction in powder will of course lower the 1. recoil, 2. noise and 3. velocity. BUT there comes a point with some powders where, at low load levels you get tremendous pressure spikes. That point is mostly unknown and totally unknown for unknown powders. For example, a friend just had that level of curiosity and using a 357 Magnum revolver, loaded .38 Special cases starting at +P+ with Bullseye powder and worked the load by tenths down to 7/10th of a grain total load at which point the cylinder jammed as there wasn't sufficient velocity for the bullet to clear the cylinder. As he suspected, Bullseye was not a low level spiker.
He has never repeated the experiment with any other powder.

Stu
Very good ! Now the final and probably most difficult question, judging by the answers so far.

What would be the minimum gr of factory powder necessary for this particular bullet to just go through a human body, not any further, if you hold the gun directly to the chest ? Whats the sufficient velocity ?

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-28-2020 at 08:29 AM.
  #46  
Old 01-28-2020, 08:11 AM
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If you are considering the round that "Tex" took apart, totally unknown as the powder has unknown specs. Other than that it will take a forensic pathologist to answer your question. I think that is out of the realm of general reloading knowledge unless one of us happens to be a forensic pathologist who happened to have a spare body or two around to play with.
:~))

Stu
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Old 01-28-2020, 08:20 AM
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If you are considering the round that "Tex" took apart, totally unknown as the powder has unknown specs. Other than that it will take a forensic pathologist to answer your question. I think that is out of the realm of general reloading knowledge unless one of us happens to be a forensic pathologist who happened to have a spare body or two around to play with.
:~))

Stu
Funny answer But we do agree that the factory 14.0gr will go through and the 9.0gr will not. Or will it ?

Yes I am considering the round that "Tex" took apart

Bullet velocity knowledge is included in general reloading knowledge ?

Last edited by AndrewWeber; 01-28-2020 at 08:32 AM.
  #48  
Old 01-28-2020, 08:30 AM
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Ok, that's more like it!

Will the gun also have less recoil and less sound at 9gr ?
Yes, you would have reduced recoil and sound with that reduced powder charge - but not substantially reduced. Recoil would not be as stout as the original Magnum load, but still very noticeable. Sound levels would still Be loud and require sound dampening (earmuffs or plugs for comfort and safety). What you have created ballistically, in effect, is a 38 Special.

To your second question, yes, a 38 Special would go through a 2x4 at point blank range.
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  #49  
Old 01-28-2020, 08:42 AM
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Yes, you would have reduced recoil and sound with that reduced powder charge - but not substantially reduced. Recoil would not be as stout as the original Magnum load, but still very noticeable. Sound levels would still Be loud and require sound dampening (earmuffs or plugs for comfort and safety). What you have created ballistically, in effect, is a 38 Special.

To your second question, yes, a 38 Special would go through a 2x4 at point blank range.
So, you say 9gr is equal to a 38 Special and would go through a 2x4 at point blank range. Would it go much further after it has gone through the 2x4 ?
  #50  
Old 01-28-2020, 08:44 AM
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