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Old 07-29-2020, 12:49 PM
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Default Copper plated bullet load data?

Greetings!

I just managed to track down a box of Xtreme copper plated bullets for my 9mm. In looking at the reviews on the Xtreme bullets' website, the reviews for their load data "book" were less than encouraging. My only other experience with loading plated bullets was with Speer's TMJ bullets for CMP EIC matches.

My question: would it be safe to use the load data from the Speer load sheets for a comparable Xtreme branded bullet?

As always, thanks in advance for your help!
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Old 07-29-2020, 12:53 PM
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Yes.


Plated bullets can use any data for lead or fmj of the same weight, COL will vary depending on profile.

Start low work up.
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Old 07-29-2020, 01:58 PM
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Please check the "Bullet/Load Info" section of the X-Treme Bullets website. It relates to the matter of velocity.

Good luck!

JPJ
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Old 07-29-2020, 02:25 PM
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I bought 3700 Xtreme 124hp plated and 4.7 of Vn340 is my accurate load in a 1911. I started low and when the slide started to function properly I added .2 more. OL length is 1.085. A buddy of mine tried some at 4.5 in his Glock and wouldn't lock the slide back on the last shot but 4.7 did. 4.7 of N340 fills the case nicely.
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Old 07-29-2020, 03:05 PM
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What bullet did you get-weight & shape? What powders do you have to use?
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Old 07-29-2020, 07:04 PM
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Shot lots of Xtreme 9mm bullets and have posted on their site.

They say to stay at 1250fps or lower with their plated bullets but the 115gr out of a 5" barrel will do 1350 with Unique powder but they do better at 1200fps with full loads if you want accuracy.

The Speer TMJ has a small flat point that is much better than the 147gr RN style for a 3-3.5" pistol for higher fps and MORE case volume for extra powder.........
over the minimum room in the little 9mm case with the long 147gr RN bullet, that needs x-fine powder to reach high velocities.

All plated RN weights worked for me and all ejected if they had enough powder in the case to work the slide's spring.

Good shooting.
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Old 07-29-2020, 07:42 PM
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I can confirm that their publication is light (VERY light) on data and powder options, but data from other publications using comparable bullets should be sufficient.
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Old 07-29-2020, 08:46 PM
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-PLEASE- take my experience and advice and don’t ever baby any handload with plated bullets. Load them like jacketed bullets and be careful not to overcrimp them as a crimp will cut through the plating.

Plated bullets offer a lot of resistance in a bore. In a revolver, this can be a problem if you baby them.

Just don’t approach them like a soft lead bullet.
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Old 07-29-2020, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyDads38 View Post
What bullet did you get-weight & shape? What powders do you have to use?
Cabela's website showed that the Xtreme 9mm 124JHP was in stock when I made this post. A few hours ago, I received an email that they cancelled the order because the item was out of stock.

I will now place an order directly with Xtreme for their 9mm 124gr FN. In the long-run it may cost a little bit more, but I will get my bullets. Yesterday, I placed an order for curbside pickup, but after the order was placed, it was cancelled because it wasn't in stock contrary to their website. Today's cancellation was from their central sourcing center.

The powders that I have to work with include: Bullseye, WW231, Unique, and CFE Pistol.
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:05 AM
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There is quite a hit of published load data on the Hodgdons site for plated bullets. There are Berrys plated bullets that are described as being HEAVY PLATE that are rated for higher velocities than 1,200 fps. As long as you stay under Xtreme's recommendation of 1,200 you should be just fine with Hodgdons data for similar bullets.

I have loaded thousands of the Xtreme 9mm bullets. Occasionally they have had FMJ versions and those worked EXTREMELY well (pun intended!)...

Cheers!
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lrrifleman View Post
Cabela's website showed that the Xtreme 9mm 124JHP was in stock when I made this post. A few hours ago, I received an email that they cancelled the order because the item was out of stock.

I will now place an order directly with Xtreme for their 9mm 124gr FN. In the long-run it may cost a little bit more, but I will get my bullets. Yesterday, I placed an order for curbside pickup, but after the order was placed, it was cancelled because it wasn't in stock contrary to their website. Today's cancellation was from their central sourcing center.

The powders that I have to work with include: Bullseye, WW231, Unique, and CFE Pistol.
I checked the Xtreme website a few days ago, and surprisingly they had several 9mm bullets in stock. Their price has gone up just a few dollars, where other vendors' prices have doubled in some cases. You will have to pay shipping, so I always buy at least 2,000 to get the best deal. If you buy the 3,000 bulk, makes even better deal.
I've only been loading plated in 9mm and 40 S&W with TiteGroup powder. The data is from Hodgdons website. You can also find data for W231 there also, Berry's plated bullets are used for the data. I've had good luck using plated bullets, for target/range ammo, any of your powders should work. :-)
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:40 AM
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The Xtreme 124 plated RN "Ball" type bullet out of my 5" pistolcan get....

Bullseye starting at 993fps up to 1155fps
Unique at around 1060 moving up to around 1238fps.

Bull/w231 at 1150 fps gave a nice, accurate target load but they both
can be good at only 1025fps if you need an X-Lite load, with a 1.14" OAL.

Have fun.
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:55 AM
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With plated bullets you can use the data given for Cast Lead .
Lyman and Lee have manuals .

Accurate Arms has specific data for some plated bullets in their manual and on their reloading site ... might want to check them out .

Be sure and stay below the maximum fps the mfgr states...plated can't be driven as fast as jacketed and the velocity matters.

Gary
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Old 07-30-2020, 12:52 PM
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I have posted this info so many types, Plated Bullets are not that difficult! There is no mystery

Bullet/Load Info

Load Info

Our Copper Plated Bullets can be run at mid-range jacketed velocities or higher end lead velocities. We recommend keeping velocities to less than 1500 FPS (Feet Per Second) and using only a light taper crimp
Any velocities over 1200 FPS we recommend either our Heavy Plate Concave Base or Hollow Point products for superior accuracy. We recommend keeping velocities to less than 1500 FPS (Feet Per Second) and using only a light taper crimp


FAQ - Berry's Manufacturing


Where can I find load data for your bullets?
Load data from any load manual or website can be used. Full-metal jacketed, lead bullet, or plated bullet load data can be used as long as the following standards are adhered to:
  • The data contains the correct grain weight of bullet.
  • Berry's max recommended velocity is not exceeded. (This info is displayed on bullet boxes and product webpages.)
    • Standard Plate Bullets Max Velocity: 1,250 fps.
    • Thick-Plate Bullets (TP) Max Velocity: 1,500 fps.
  • Do not over-crimp the bullet. Crimping so tight that bullet deformation occurs, or plating is separated causing visible exposure of the lead core will cause tumbling, key-holing, and reduced accuracy.
Load data containing bullet descriptions such as Plated (P,) Berry's Bullet (BERB,) Total Metal Jacket (TMJ,) Copper Plated (CP,) or CPJ (Copper Plated Jacket,) refers to plated bullet data.
Cartridge Overall Lengths (COL) are found in the load data being used. DO NOT EXCEED SAAMI MAX COL SPECS.
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Old 07-31-2020, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rule3 View Post
I have posted this info so many types, Plated Bullets are not that difficult! There is no mystery
Where can I find load data for your bullets?
Load data from any load manual or website can be used. Full-metal jacketed, lead bullet, or plated bullet load data can be used as long as the following standards are adhered to:
It may be true that this is posted on their website, but it doesn't mean that it makes sense. Use any load data, FMJ, Lead, or plated -- really?

If you compare load data for the same weight jacketed & lead bullets with the same powder, you will see that the jacketed bullet will have a higher powder charge to get the same velocity and also will max out pressure at the same or lower velocity as lead. If that's true then how does it make sense to use load data interchangeably for either?
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Old 07-31-2020, 11:17 AM
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I treat all "Standard Plated" bullets as a lower class real copper jacket bullet like and XTP or Win/Rem jacket bullet.
True plated do come with a "Heavy coat" of plating but I have yet to try them.

All mine have been for my 9mm's , so I don't need a crimp.

In a 3" I will load a 115 or 124gr down to 945fps but in a 5" my minimum is 1025fps so I don't run into squibs.
A bullet hole in a target is a GOOD thing!!

Some pistols really do well with plated bullets........
I have a lot of test done to finally find a good target load with all the powders that I have tried for my pistols, from Bullseye to imr4227 !

Of course my chrony was a big help, keeping me out of harms way and
letting me learn what my powders were doing, in the test.

However I do think that plated is a great bullet for "Target work" only.
Stay safe.
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Old 07-31-2020, 01:44 PM
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"Technically" Speer Gold Dot bullets are "plated" bullets, Not a jacketed. So does one use "plated" data?

They use a electro chemical bonding method to put the copper on the lead core.

Todays "plated" bullets (depending on brand) are not much different than FMJ or TMJ

The key word in load data is "mid-range" There is a lot of reloading that doesn't make "sense" There is a bit of
"black magic" involved (Richard Lee) It is not all cut and dry
If it was, all manuals would have the exact same data.
Pressure and velocity will vary all over the place . Some powders have a large leeway, others not so much.


Different COL, different powders, different lead hardness, different brass, different test methods, different temp, humidity, phase of the moon. etc etc.
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Old 07-31-2020, 01:55 PM
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MyDads38 - Great info about Extreme Bullets!! I just ordered some and the pricing is fair – unlike most every place else. I have been using Universal powder for my 9mm’s with 115-g Berry’s. Universal fills the cases to the point that I don’t worry too much about setback. Now, if I could just find a brick of SP primers
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Old 07-31-2020, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
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I have been using Universal powder for my 9mmís with 115-g Berryís. Universal fills the cases to the point that I donít worry too much about setback.
I too like Universal for 9mm as it meters really well. Universal likes to have some pressure in order to get complete powder burn so I find that it works best in medium to hot loads.
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Old 07-31-2020, 09:09 PM
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Never heard of concerns about setback with properly reloaded 9mm. If the expanding doesn't create such an exaggerated bell that the cases won't just drop into a barrel or case gauge a normal taper crimp should be all that is needed.

Certainly do agree that almost every 9mm load (I am familiar with!) would make any double charge very obvious: there would be powder overflowing the case.

Plated bullets do differ from lead, but not at the medium velocities that most reloaders use: either pf loads or over MAX loads can make things interesting, though...

Cheers!
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Old 07-31-2020, 09:32 PM
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I also use the Power Factor data in my 9mm loads and with a 115 to 147 grain bullet from.......
114 up to 157 PF, but I also let this factor settle down with the type of bullets that I am using
along with the OAL of the bullet in the case along with the type of powder used in my loads.

I load 9mm coated, plated and factory JHP bullets and they all call for different loadings to be within the pressures for the 9mm case and pistol.

I just try to load per the pistols spec's and age and what I think will be a safe load for that weapon.

Good shooting.
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Old 08-01-2020, 09:35 PM
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I have loaded the Xtreme plated like I would jacketed bullets getting almost the same results except for accuracy. I also try to keep the 124gr sub-sonic. I try to keep my 9mm bullets 120 to 130gr - they seem to work best. I have found that accuracy usually ran raw lead, then poly coated lead and jacketed with plated bringing up the rear but it also depended on the profile of the bullet where flat points or hollow points worked a little better. There wasn't much of a difference but the plated always came in last.

As others have said, go light with the crimp.
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Old 08-01-2020, 10:54 PM
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Some pistols might not do well with plated bullets with the powders used or the fps that they were pushed at.
Good accuracy is not always at a medium or full loading, but they can work, just that I seem to get good accuracy at just above a starting load and one at around 125PF in a lot of my 9mm pistols.
Full loads can work, just that you have to use a lot more powder..........
and I am cheap and like to load more ammo, in place of high fps, for my shooting, if bot are a accurate load.

I generally don't give out load data but these are low pressure target loads that should be safe in modern weapons in good condition, but use at your own risk.

This OAL worked best in my 5" 9mm pistol, though I did stretch it to 1.13" OAL to get enough Unique and Blue Dot onto the case for one of my test, for a full load.

Make sure with light loads that there is a hole in the target or a splash of dirt, before pulling the trigger again !!
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