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Old 08-02-2020, 03:55 PM
J. R. WEEMS J. R. WEEMS is offline
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Question BULLET CHANGE?

Wondering just how much should your charge change when you go from a lead bullet to a JHP using the same powder, in this case RED DOT??? Thanks for your input.
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Old 08-02-2020, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by J. R. WEEMS View Post
Wondering just how much should your charge change when you go from a lead bullet to a JHP using the same powder, in this case RED DOT??? Thanks for your input.
There can be quite a diff in pressure & vel. Bullets arent really plug & play, but at midrange & below, you wont see a whole lot of diff. At max, everything matters. Btw, I cant think of any application where I would plug a 158gr jhp into a RedDot load.
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:32 AM
J. R. WEEMS J. R. WEEMS is offline
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There can be quite a diff in pressure & vel. Bullets arent really plug & play, but at midrange & below, you wont see a whole lot of diff. At max, everything matters. Btw, I cant think of any application where I would plug a 158gr jhp into a RedDot load.
Well these are 250gn Gold Dot for a 45 COLT - gun in question is a REDHAWK- ??
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Old 08-03-2020, 01:48 AM
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Well these are 250gn Gold Dot for a 45 COLT - gun in question is a REDHAWK- ??
Doesnt matter caliber. Shooting jhp over fast powders doesnt really serve a purpose? Same applies to any caliber. There are three levels of load data; lead, plated & jacketed. Bullets are really not plug & play. If you are just punching paper with light loads, coated lead are way cheaper. If you must shoot them up. You can use lead data for jacketed, just not the other way around.
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Old 08-03-2020, 03:28 AM
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Speaking in GENERAL terms, it is considered safe to use jacketed bullet data when substituting a lead bullet of the same or lesser weight. Not so much the other way around.

Jacketed bullets have more resistances in the bore, and more bearing surface, leading to higher pressures than similar cast lead. Jacketed bullet loads should be confirmed in a good loading manual specific to that bullet.

I really like Red Dot in the .44 and .45c cases for cast bullet, lighter mid-range loads, but it is not the ideal powder for higher velocity jacketed loads in these calibers. A little on the fast side. Less pressure, and better velocity with something slower like Unique or even 2400.

Larry
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Old 08-03-2020, 03:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishinfool View Post
Speaking in GENERAL terms, it is considered safe to use jacketed bullet data when substituting a lead bullet of the same or lesser weight. Not so much the other way around.

Jacketed bullets have more resistances in the bore, and more bearing surface, leading to higher pressures than similar cast lead. Jacketed bullet loads should be confirmed in a good loading manual specific to that bullet.

I really like Red Dot in the .44 and .45c cases for cast bullet, lighter mid-range loads, but it is not the ideal powder for higher velocity jacketed loads in these calibers. A little on the fast side. Less pressure, and better velocity with something slower like Unique or even 2400.

Larry
Larry, this was the answer I was looking for. The question was ask because nowhere can I find published loads for the Gold Dot using Red Dot. I do have the latest Speer book, in fact most of the as I am a reloading book junkie. I want to carry this when hunting and need it to do the job if need be. I have pretty much always been a 'by the book' loader and not much for what is concocted out on the back 40- as it were.

Last edited by J. R. WEEMS; 08-03-2020 at 03:41 AM.
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Old 08-03-2020, 07:53 AM
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Alliant web site has a load for the 200gr. GDHP, from 5.5 to 7.6 grs. I'm sure you could use this info as a starting point.
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:07 PM
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I use a lot of Red Dot, since I also shoot a lot of 12 Ga. trap loads.
It is a great powder once you use it enough to find what weight of powder works in a certain weapon.

Great with lead and good for copper bullet in my 38, 357 and all my 9mm pistols.
Lots of data out there to look up.............

Just don't go below the starting loads with copper bullets and you will be fine.
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:29 PM
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Jacketed bullets and cast lead bullets are totally different bullets. If this question is just an academic question, the differences are mainly in the friction coefficient of jacket material vs cast lead. For real life uses, why not find the correct powder charge for a jacketed bullet? If you can't find data in a manual, the powder manufacturers or distributors can help.

Last edited by mikld; 08-03-2020 at 12:31 PM.
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:34 PM
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Alliant lists the 250 GDHP with loads using Unique, Power Pistol and 2400. I know that is not the Red Dot loads you asked for but it gives an excuse to buy another type of powder!

Ed
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:43 PM
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The reloading data for lead bullets is different from jacketed bullets .
If you wish to reload lead bullets , use the data for the weight and profile lead bullet you wish to reload .

You shouldn't just use jacketed bullet data for lead and as far as I know there is no formula to convert jacketed bullet data to lead bullet data .

Your best bet is the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th Edition for lead bullet loading data .

I reload 99% cast lead and Red Dot is a favorite powder ...what are you looking to load ?
Gary
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Old 08-03-2020, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. R. WEEMS View Post
Well these are 250gn Gold Dot for a 45 COLT - gun in question is a REDHAWK- ??
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Originally Posted by gwpercle View Post

I reload 99% cast lead and Red Dot is a favorite powder ...what are you looking to load ?
Gary
uh oh the post is too short so I am lengthening it!

Ed
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Old 08-03-2020, 08:13 PM
J. R. WEEMS J. R. WEEMS is offline
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Originally Posted by nedlate View Post
Alliant lists the 250 GDHP with loads using Unique, Power Pistol and 2400. I know that is not the Red Dot loads you asked for but it gives an excuse to buy another type of powder!

Ed
HA!! I have both Unique & 2400. Just was trying to keep it simple, as not having to clear my Chragemaster.
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Old 08-04-2020, 01:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwpercle View Post
The reloading data for lead bullets is different from jacketed bullets .
If you wish to reload lead bullets , use the data for the weight and profile lead bullet you wish to reload .

You shouldn't just use jacketed bullet data for lead and as far as I know there is no formula to convert jacketed bullet data to lead bullet data .

Your best bet is the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th Edition for lead bullet loading data .

I reload 99% cast lead and Red Dot is a favorite powder ...what are you looking to load ?
Gary
But you can use lead data for jacketed. Look at the lyman manual, lead vs jacketed in various calibers. Its a pretty safe extrapolation to use jacketed bullets with lead data. You are or should be starting low & working up.
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Last edited by fredj338; 08-04-2020 at 01:25 AM.
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Old 08-04-2020, 03:09 AM
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Do you want to use Gold Dots for range fodder? The Speer GDHP needs good velocity to expand and perform. A slower powder sounds like the ticket here.
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