I have and do use the Classic Lee AutoDisc with the Adjustable Charge Bar. That said, I have ramped up PAST the Adjustable Charge Bar's volume.

Well, I decided to try the OEM Auto-Discs to get me ~25gr of H322. I am NOT happy with stacking two discs to get the proper drop. Using my RCBS #505 and a Redding Trickler, I am finding out that this "double-disc" system to be highly variable. I am getting +-0.2gr and an occasional 0.3gr outlier. Way TOO much to trust...

In other words....TOO MUCH WORK! I need a higher capacity with high accuracy for my rifle loads. Suggestions?

FWIW, I'll keep my Lee system for my HG loads, just need help for larger powder loads.

I have used a RCBS for over 50yrs. Load everything from 22 Hornet to 375H&H. It comes with two cylinders. Since you set the size of the cavity with a screw you are charging by volume. The different types of powder will not meter the same. On rifle cartridges I set charge light and trickle each one to 0. I’m in for quality not quantity.

Well, I'm guessing you are using stick powder? If so, none of the major manufactures powder measures meter stick powders extremely well. Some years back Hodgdon created the "Short Cut" to help with this. And it did. We have found over the years the Lyman 55 seems to do the best. Do your research and if you find you'd like one, I have a couple NIB left over from my Lyman Distributor days. Hope this helps. Thanks! Mick

Yes, if you're wanting quantity dumps and use a stick powder, than an electronic measure that dispenses by weight, not volume is what you need. Otherwise it's dump and trickle to desired load.

Unless you're loading on the jagged edge of safety, .3 grain difference of H322 in a .223 is meaningless.

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GOA
USA Shooting Supporter

If you are loading for 223 I can highly recommend CFE223. It actually does reduce copper fouling in the barrel, meters quite well, and with the correct bullet is capable of excellent accuracy.

BTW, in my case the wrong bullet was a 60 grain Nosler Ballistic tip. Loaded with Varget I can get sub 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards, with the CFE223 the groups open up to nearly 7 inches. What is another baffling aspect is that the targets are showing nice round holes, so no evidence of tumbling Never have figured out the cause for this and further compounding the mystery is that with the 68 grain Hornady BTHP the accuracy is wonderful with either Varget or CFE223.

Anyhow for me it's a good powder to put out consistent throw and go loads with the Hornady bullet. For the Nosler I take my time with Varget and trickle up each charge individually.

I've always reloaded with the RCBS chargemaster, which is accurate to the exact weight you set it for, but it's slow. Even then you get the occasional .1-.2 grain overcharge. I now load my large rifle cartridges with the Redding competition universal powder dispenser. All I use is H4350. The Redding gets it very close, or right on every time. I move it to the scale and trickle charge up to my target weight. It's a little more work, but way faster. If you want the exact weight, as far as I'm concerned, that's the way to go.

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What could possibly go wrong?

I use a 50 year old RCBS Uniflow an And yes...stick powderd it is perfect. I sometimes decide to not even trickle and the rounds are accurate as dropped. You could pick one up on eBay I bet. Best rifle measure in my book. And yes...stick powder only

FWIW, I have ~16lb of H322, so swapping powders at this point is moot... sorry.

I just hate dropping into the brass, emptying the brass into the RCBS #505, trickling, funneling the result BACK into the brass, inserting bullet and press, and finally measure for COAL. I just want an easier way to just drop powder into scale pan directly, and skip the back and forth. We're talking a couple of K' of rounds that are mostly for HD/SD, so I was hoping for a stable reasonably consistent loading system without being too anal. If not, then I guess I'll have one heck of an arsenal of trickled .223 in the thousands... May have to think about adding a scope... NOT! I have my trusty old #722 w/Original Weaver K 10 Series 60 from El Paso, TX (circa 1953)...

.3 gr on a 25 grain load is .12%. a negligible amount. If you are like me and like to load for strict accuracy, you need to trickle in the last few .10ths of a grain one at a time. If you are not shooting bench rest, just throw it and forget it.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

With the RCBS Uniflow you can go directly into the brass and be accurate enough I would think w/o trickling. Or go directly in the pan on all 10 rounds and spot check. Or go on a Dillon and not worry about it.

Another vote for getting a Dillon.
They may cost more, but their service is great.

I have used a Neil Jones powder measure for a long time when I throw charges at the range and load there.

That's exactly right. The only charges I trickle are for large rifle bench rest shooting. Everything else just goes straight into the case.

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What could possibly go wrong?

I had one many years ago and gave it to the Jr Program at the club when I switched to all Dillon. The Dillon sliding powder dispenser is troublesome with IMR 4064.

I tried to PM but your box is full

Thanks,

John

I have bad news. When it comes to rifles with single based powder all powder measures are feces. The lee is a steaming pile of choleric dysentery while the Dillon is a rabbit bean but they are all garbage/dangerous. You have 3 options. A lot of work, a prometheus, or a chargemaster and slightly less work.

I just gave up and load bloopy loads with the occasional flier.

Oh, I don't know about that. My Herter's powder dropper is quite consistent. when I need to trickle a bit more to get an exact load, it's usually only a few granules. And I mean a half dozen or less.

I believe in loading as precision as called for by the firearm it will be used in. Low velocity hunting rifles that are used with iron sights at relatively short ranges don’t need trickled to 0. My bolt guns from varmit 22 calls to big bore magnums are trickled. All that are not trickled are checked every 10th round.

I am skeptical. How are you getting that kind of accuracy with a volume type measure? Is your scale true?

Set your powder measure to throw charges approximately one-half grain below the desired charge weight. Use a powder trickler to complete the charge.

Harrell's Precision makes some of the best powder measures out there. A lot of benchrest shooters have used these with great results.

The fundamental issue is how the measures work. They all use volume when you need mass. The little rods don't always stack the same, this causes the density to change and this causes the mass of each throw to change, no matter how perfect the volume of the measure is.

Have you tried a Lee Perfect Powder Measure?
I haven't tried one myself, BUT I've heard good things about them and I just picked one up to give it a try.
The design looks like it would fill and dump really clean.
Guess I'll find out when I try it...

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Send lawyers, guns & money...

If You decide to go with the RCBS it’s important you get the powder baffle.The baffle gives you a much more uniform charge keeping the powder volume consistent. I could never figure why such a critical part was only sold as an accessory.One last thing mark the powder hopper with a rubber band or piece of tape around the midway point. When the powder level gets to this point refill the measure to keep volume consistent.We used a Dillon and a RCBS UniFlow measure during the years we shot hipower SR.All our short range ammo(200&300yds) was thrown straight from the measure mostly charges of 4895/Varget and Reloader 15.We usually managed to burn about 15000 rounds a year of short and long range ammo.

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SWCA#2288
SWHF#407

Well, for the near future I think I will return to being JUST "...a Double Dipper..."

Using the LEE dippers, I adjusted my desired load to accommodate two dippers. Originally my desired load required three dippers, and as we all know each "dip" has its own propensity for error...

At least I can eliminate the back-n-forth of the powder through the brass, saving "some" time.

• Dip, Dip
• Scale
• Trickle
• Funnel
• Bullet and Press

I run with a RCBS uniflow for my .223/5.56 and it works great no leaks and consistent drops...

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This is the way....

I have been using the Lee Auto Drum for H-335 in .223 Loads once set it has been pretty reliable & repeatable accuracy also have the Auto Disk that I have used for pistol loads for years couldn’t get the Auto Disk to do the charge I wanted & Double Disk kit leaked powder badly


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have to concur. Back when I was able to shoot service rifle, dumping from my powder dispenser was acceptable.

Now that I am shooting F class, I have to trickle my loads to my desired weight. At 600 yards, I am shooting a customized AR (26" White Oak 1:7" barrel) using AA2520 behind either Nosler Custom Competition 80gr HPBT, or the Sierra 80gr HPBT, sparked by a CCI benchrest primer. I find that with uniform charges (all rounds trickled to the same weight of 23.4gr) I can keep my groups within the tight side of the 9 ring of the MR-F target. [On this target, the X ring is 0.5 MOA (3"), the 10 ring is 1.0 MOA (6"), and the 9 ring is 2.0 MOA (12").]

These groups are achieved with the rifle on an articulating bipod and stock rested in a bunny bag. These groups are affected by environmentals and my ability to read the wind. I am seeing comparable performance with my 7mm Rem Mag on the thousand yard line. What I do see, is that when powder charges vary by 0.1-0.2gr, my vertical dispersion can launch the bullet into the 8 or 7 ring.

For me and my style of shooting, I can see a significant effect as the result of a 0.1-0.2 gr difference in powder charges.

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Judge control not gun control!

I have a Dillon 650 XL but, I do not use the powder dispenser, too many inconsistent charges. I use a Redding for .223 and a Uniflow for pistol. For accurate loading I use a Pact dispenser.

When using charge throwers of any brand to get uniform charges you need to adopt a rhythm. They will never throw perfect charges but will be more uniform if you crank it the same each time. Especially using stick powder that you are shearing off each charge. I do a bump bump on back stroke to settle powder in drum.

These are HD SD and not benchrest loads, correct?

I mean no disrespect, but if you're not uniforming your brass to benchrest standards my opinion is this is much ado about nothing.

Any volume type measure with most any powder will have slight variances in weight. Environmental factors like humidity will effect weight.

Some people have great success loading on volume alone, no weighing at all.

I believe in safety and quality so no shortcuts, but if I'm loading a high volume of rifle rounds I set the measure below max and get it dropping a consistent amount and if it stays within .3 grain I consider it an acceptable range for anything I load with.

Just my added two cents worth.

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GOA
USA Shooting Supporter

^^^ This ^^^. If you want to get as accurate a charge as possible with a volumetric powder measure, it doesn’t get any better (for most powders and charge sizes) than the proper size Harrell. There are measures by Linwood and then all the rest!

Froggie

Secrets of the Houston Warehouse - Lessons In Extreme Rifle Accuracy - PrecisionRifleBlog.com

I believe in a good electronic scale/dispenser like the Lyman 1200. One of the more informative things for me in the above article, which I try to read annually, is the maintaining of groups with a large powder variance, in some cases more than a grain. I would not be as concerned about a small variance in powder loads until the rest of case preparation was done.

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Front sight and squeeze

I too recommend the Lyman 1200 DPS 3, although they have a newer and more compact version out that looks better. I normally just use the scale part, but when loading near maximum pistol loads or any rifle loads, I use the dispenser, which is super accurate. I check mine with Lyman check weights frequently and it is always dead on when the system is warmed-up per instructions.

RCBS Chargemaster 1500

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Common sense isn't so common.

I had been using a Lyman 1200 DPS (GEN1) up until last fall, when charges of 23.4gr of AA2520 and 64.0gr of IMR7828SSC started overflowing the cartridge cases. I had thought that the vertical dispersion that I was seeing was due to my eyes (my cataracts became an issue very fast). Come to find out, despite calibrating the dispenser according to the instructions, it started to throw charges up to two grains greater than it was programmed for. I am now back to throwing a "light" charge with my Hornady dispenser, and trickling to my desired weight with an electronic scale.

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Judge control not gun control!

Get a Redding Match grade and never look back. Or a Dillon.

I've heard things here than I haven't in general powder measure discussions.


I should have thought of the baffle on my RCBS Uniflow It improved my consistency a lot and probably will with any tall, cylindrical hopper.

For precision work I tare the pan for my scale, drop powder from my Uniflow on the pan, put it back on the scale and trickle to adjust.

Again for close work with pistols I tare the cartridge case I want to fill, drop the powder and put it back on the scale to check it. Sometimes I dump a few and try again if they aren't +/- .2 grain.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

What he said.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

IMO the Lyman #55 is the best powder measure available at a fair price baring the $200+ measures.

The RCBS Uniflow is also a good measure.

As for the Lee Perfect Powder Measure, it works surprisingly well at a very low price. I keep one as a backup measure.

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Freedom is never free!!
SWCA #3437

As Green Frog and Benchrest1 said, it doesn't get any better than the Harrell Precision powder measures.
Favored by benchrest and other competitive rifle shooters.
They retain their value, so don't worry about the cost.

Harrell's Precision Online Store

Jim

OP, remember that weighing error is best thought of as a percentage of the total, so as you move to heavier powder charges, a discrepancy of a couple of tenths or even a grain or two becomes less and less significant. If you are off by a grain in 50, that constitutes a 2% error... if you are off by a grain in a 12 grain pistol charge however, that same grain amounts to a whopping 12.3% error. With very small pistol charges, the problem is magnified, while as charges get larger, a fraction of a grain becomes way less important. Note that several makers of powder measures make provision for charges in large or small ranges... each design has a range over which it is most accurate.

Froggie

The Belding and Mull Visible powder measure was, and I suspect still is, the most accurate powder measure one could buy. When I was a young'un, all the serious bench rest shooters used one.

As they are long out of production here's another vote for the Lyman 55. Mine's been in use since Nixon was Vice-President and has been reliably consistent. I grew up on IMR stick powders. I've lost track of the IMR-4895 that got loaded in .30-06 for service rifle matches alone.

It's grandaddy, an Ideal #5, loads all the black powder stuff from .38 S&W up to .577 Snider.

The Belding & Mull Visible powder measure is an outstanding one and I've used one for years. I also use the Lee dippers to get close to the desired charge and then trickle as needed.
Montana Vintage Arms markets a powder measure very similar to the Belding and Mull, but the powder reservoir is brass instead of polycarbonate. I use it to throw BP for my Sharps loads. It's very accurate.

WYT-P
Skyhunter

Being a reloader that has always been " financially challenged " I found that making a special dipper for a particular load was a lot cheaper than trying to buy another powder measure . It doesn't vary hardly at all , being consistent with your technique . Regards Paul

+I still use dippers for many rifle rounds. They work just as well as they did years ago. With the right technique they ever work well with powders like 4831. Most of us don't NEED large quantities of hunting ammo

Well, I'm beginning think that sticking with dippers may actually be to my benefit, at least from the replies I see above. Since I (anal as I am) will continue to trickle up to my target, this really does seem to be the most convenient, economical, and probably most efficient method (barring big $$$).

FWIW, I kind of got stuck in my lower volume, HGs and my old 222, and using my Lee adjustable charge bar (excellent for what it does within its designated range). Out of my comfort range, I am learning alternative methods and really appreciate the feedback! THANKS!

I've often wondered how a Harrells differs from an RCBS or Redding? Aren't they all variable chambers? Once a specific charge has been set is there less variance between consecutive charges? I know that the Harrell "click" system allows for precise changes but is that the main advantage?

having had a couple of the Harrel's(I no longer have one) I found they were somewhat better than the run of the mill powder measures mainly because they had easy repeatable adjustments. But with the larger powders such as 4831 and 4350 they truly weren't much better. Almost any measure can throw a ball powder or the small grain powders I used Lyman 55s and even had one that was worked over by a fellow who knew what he was doing. I have a Redding BR measure and a couple of RCBS measures with the BR powder additions. They are pretty repeatable too. When it comes to the large powders and use a scoop on an electronic to finish up. Pretty quick. Not saying the Harrel's are not good.. But for less than half you can get a Redding BR or the RCBS BR measures. The BR guys don't use an awful lot of the bigger stick powders anyway. The flake powders like 800X(terrible) and Blue Dot don't throw well out of any type of drum measure

Not the cheapest thing out there and not the fastest, but I use the rcbs charge master lite electronic measure/scale, I used balance beam scale before that.

I've loaded flake, stick, and ball powder with it, it's dead on 99.5% of the time. I get a .1gr overcharge once in a blue moon, throw it back in and try again.

I wouldnt think (one hole with an eyebrow) five shot groups can come from a powder throw, I'm sure they're good enough for deer or hogs, I feel the same about turret and progressive presses, too many moving parts, too many chances for something to change and throw something off.