just started reloading coated bullets I have been doing lead and jacketed for a while. after loading dummy rounds and cycling found that the OAL shortened i have adjusted the tapered crimp tighter but still seem to have same problem starting OAL is well within the specs and shorter than my usual OAL. any suggestions
or comments( using 200gr missouri hi-tek 2 coating grooved 45acp)
angio

Depending on the bullet maker, your OAL can be very short, to very long and

the amount of taper crimp you apply, is wide open, to see what your weapon and bullets like.

You can even add a real "Crimp" if the design has a cannelure on it but
that is just an option for later test if the taper does not work out.

Even thought my picture is with 9mm coated bullets, this will give you an idea of of some loads and bullets that I sampled.

Good luck with that .45.

thank you Neved Ed. I need to experiment with different bullet makes and see what works best
angio

I normally set my separate taper crimp die to crimp .003. I have not experienced bullet creep. I have loaded 9mm, 38 HBWC, and 45 200 gr WC and RNL the same crimp. This is with Bayou, Missouri bullet Co., and various Jacketed and swagged bullets.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

How much setback? Most worry too mch about small setback issues. Nothing is getting crazy until you getbto,about 0.060" shorter. Even then, unless you are at max, not a real issue.
About all I shoot in my service rds are coated. Just make sure younare going at least 0.001" larger than jacketed. I use a mild taper crimp, bately visible.

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NRA Cert. Inst. IDPA CSO

May help to know how much set back, type of brass and the specific bullet profile. lrnfp, swc etc. Some bullets have very little interference fit with the brass, and some brass is thinner/less elastic.

Have you plunk tested that bullet in that chamber?

Taper crimping does little to nothing in terms of preventing bullet setback in semi-auto pistols. To prevent setback, you need firm case tension at the base of the bullet or a cannelure in the case. Do not over expand your brass. You might want to look at the expander plug, if it is expanding the brass to a depth that is below the base of the seated bullet, you might want to shorten the plug.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

There's the concept of bullet setback in semi-auto pistols and "jumping the crimp" in revolvers: both can cause operational problems (and being able to actually fire the next round is a BIG operational problem!) and setback can cause excessive pressures.

Proper case neck tension as stansdds has indicated is critical in all loads and calibers IMHO and is 1st delt with while expanding the case and completed during the crimping stage. Expansion to the point where the bullet can just be started into the case insures tension not only near the base but also along that length of a bullet from the ogive through to the shank (if there is one?), and that is where the real case tension exists.

Depending on the design and length of the bullet (wadcutter, vs. boattail vs. normal?) this area can be extensive: see how much harder it is to use a kinetic bullet puller on a 147gr 9mm vs. a 90gr 9mm bullet that has been properly expanded and crimped.

One does need to adjust the expander die specifically for each load and bullet as jacketed vs. lead vs. plated vs. coated vs. solid bullets all feed into their cases differently. Your expander dies are not truly set & forget...

Cheers!

P.S. This is why many like the features of the Lyman M-Dies and their ilk.

I appreciate all the info thanks to all I will keep working on my problem on the plink test it sounds good dropping in but drop out is a little hung up barrel is clean and ill keep setting the bullet till it releases freely (keeping in specs). even with a tight crimp it is easy to separate the bullet. this is my first experience with the coated. thanks will take all in consideration.
angio

trying to attach picture it is the missouri IDP #4-XD hi tek 2 extreme coating .452 diam

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Angio-That is a 200 gn lrnfp. Have been loading these in 45 acp for quite awhile, and they function great. However it is not easy to load them to have no setback, due the minimal bearing surface. Again, it also gets influenced by what brass you are using, especially if it is rem 45 acp brass.

To minimize bullet setback am using a Lee under size die and not expanding the case neck beyond belling the mouth adequately. The bullets are seated to 1.240-1.245. This puts the case mouth immediately rearward of the cannulure.

I treat my coated and plated bullet just like my cast bullets (same methods, same load data). I do not crimp any semi-auto handloads as neck tension is sufficient and just remove any flare and punk test. In the case of the round entering the chamber with a "plunk" but not freely falling out, closely inspect the bullet to see if they are hitting the rifling. Just not "free falling" isn't a problem as a bit of oil, case lube or bullet lube/coating may cause them to hang up, but make sure they are not "sticking" on anything...

PS-Normal col specs mean nothing when using these 200 lrnfp's. It would help to have more specifics, like brass used, what col you are loading them to and what powder charge/velocity desired you want.

That bullet will work just great.

If your expander is the correct dia. you should have enough case friction
to hold the bullet from any "Jump" if the loads are not past a medium loading.

If they "Jump" or your expander is too large, you might use a light crimp on the case
into the bullets cannelure, if the round will stop at the cut chambers shoulder and not advance.

Stay safe,

It sounds like the bullet is hitting the lands. When you plunk test, you want to be able to spin the round freely by hand. If it doesn't, move the bullet in until it does, then subtract another .003 to .005" off that length for your final OAL.
You do not have to crimp the case to do this test (it's easier if you don't, actually). Just use a fired case or, if that is too lose, a case that has been sized only.

Ok, I see the bullet you are using. That bullet is actually designed for 45 Colt, a revolver cartridge. Back in my USPSA competition days, I experimented with 45 Colt cast lead bullets in my 1911 pistol.

Getting a seating depth that allows for reliable function is the first goal. You will probably need to seat so that the crimping groove is just below the edge of the case mouth. This will give the loaded round a profile similar to that of a 230 grain FMJ load. If you load the bullet long, odds are the bullet will hit the barrel lead and result in a round that will not chamber, but due to the short amount of bullet shank in the case, the bullet will be driven deeper into the case.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

There are two bullets from MBC in .352" 200gr format: one is a Cowboy bullet for 45 Colt and the other is a harder bullet (as in Brinell 18) for 45 acp...

I don't know if the canelure is located at a different point as I don't have both to compare, but they advertise the 45 acp version as "FEEDS LIKE BUTTER IN SPRINGFIELD XD".

For any bullet being used, always good idea to function and setback test. If the 200 lrnfp came from standard Magma mold, the bullet dia directly in front of the cannelure may be .450, or .002 thonsands less than behind the cannelure. How they feed/function at differing OAL may be dependent on the individual pistol owned. The common 255 gn rnfp seen has tthe same diam behind/immediately in front of the cannelure, and can alos be extremely accurate from your 1911, if they function.

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I totally appreciate the feedback that’s why I love this site to answer some questions I am using federal and S&B brass. I have gotten hold of clays and plan on starting at 3.6 gr if I seat the bullet to meet the cannulure it comes to 1.204 the brass measures .888 - .890 I will watch the belling and see if any rifling marks are on bullet of course with my swc 200gr was set at 1.240(different configuration ).
Thanks again angio

What is the Brinell of your bullets: 12 or 18? (S/B on the label)

Just thought I'd mention that with a 1911 magazine, you need to make sure your COL greater than 1.2" will work. Once you get up to 1.24" you are close to problems.

One of the cast bullet companies advised that you should back off your seating die and screw in the seating plug to the desired bullet depth, then screw in your crimp only enough so you feel a little contact, and then add 1/8 turn.

The desired COA final length of that loaded cartridge (.45 ACP with 200 gr H&G 68 style SWC bullet) is 1.255" +.005" with a taper crimp of .469" -.005. The sizing die must be "tight" enough to produce a tight fit of the bullet, such that the base of the bullet is clearly visible on a finished round.

Longer or shooter rounds are not dependable to reliably feed. Greater or lesser TC causes failure to feed or bullet deformation respectively.

These run 100% in every .45ACP 1911 that I've ever tried them.

What brand of brass are you using? Back when i had a 1911, I had bad luck with neck tension using Remington brass. Dies wouldn't size it small enough on account of it being thinner than the Federal and WW that I also used.

to STORMINORMAN THE BRINELL IS 18
IDP #4-XD - Hi-Tek
#HT-452200RNFPM
.452 Diameter
.45 ACP
200 Grain RNFP
Brinell 18
For Major Powerf Factor
FEEDS LIKE BUTTER IN SPRINGFIELD XD
Hi-Tek 2-Extreme Coating from J&M Specialized Products P/L

Tim357 I'm using mainly federal and some S&B brass

I'm getting ready to load some test rounds with this bullet in 45 acp, in new Starline 45 AutoRim cases & 45 Colt. Will report back as to any crimp issues: in addition to the LEE Carbide FCDs for the acp & 45 Colt I also have LEE's collet-style 45 crimp die to try on all three.

Cheers!

P.S. Just received quite a few of these bullets recently (Oh, what a lucky man, he was!) with the precise intention of using them in all three applications.

This is why started using these bullets. For 45 acp, 45 ar, and 45 LC. For the 45 LC had to file down the ruger bh's front site to get poa=poi at 25 yds. Use the same bullet and same powder (hp-38) for all 3 cartridges.

For the 45 ar, the use of coated bullets enhanced the accuracy. Perhaps due to adding .001 in dia. At least the Acme coated dis increased.