What is your favorite powders for short barreled .357's. 3 1/2 " 27, 2 1/2 " 19 and a 340. Using 125-140 grain boolits. That pretty much rules out all the high pressure powders. Idea's ?

I load mid-range .357 with Titegroup or HP38.
That said, 2400 will give higher MV, also more recoil and blast.

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Science plus Art

I've found the 357mag one of the easiest to handload with a dozen powders and bullets. I expect under an inch at 25 yards benchrested.

Your bullet choices are a little on the light side for me personally. I start at 158gr and go up.
Top strap cutting and forcing cone erosion can see some extra wear from the EXTRA powder that lighter bullets require to get the same velocity as heavier bullets.

I have successfully used faster powders like BullsEye, TiteGroup, and Trail Boss; and slower powders like 4227, 2400, H110. Mid speed like 231, HS-6.

But, my favorite has been Vihtavouri N340. It is accurate,
stable, and clean.

I'm a long barrel kind of shooter.

However, your short-barrel sixgun doesn't seem to like slower powders because there's not enough length (time in the barrel) to build velocity from pressure.

Prescut

You've already put yourself behind the 🎱 shooting magnum ammo out of short bbld gun, 38spl would be better choice in those little guns. As for powder in magnum loads, 2400 is the ONLY way to go.👍🏻😉

If for SD with JHP design's the 125-140 will work........

Don't count out unique-2400 powders for high fps loads but
w231 will also work if you have some on hand for a good fps.

What are you looking for..... SD or target loads?

Regardless of barrel length, I would use the same powder. #2400 is hard to beat in the .357.

As for light bullets in the .357...they'll probably have less recoil. However, unless you're getting exceptional accuracy with the light as opposed to standard weight 158's, there is no real advantage to light bullets over standard weight bullets.

I thought the #1 SD bullet in the .357 Magnum was a......
125 gr JHP in all the data reports and dead goats ??

Maybe it is; I didn't know this was specifically another self-defense thread and I don't know anything about dead goats. I'd think a 158, except for maybe a FMJ would be more than adequate for defense as well as anything else.

Primary use for 135 gold dots would be SD. 125 XTP's and generic 125's for target shootin

The powder/bullet combos that give the highest velocity in long barrels will also give the most velocity in short barrels. Fast burning powders do not necessarily equate to more velocity in short barrels. Bob Hagel did a piece in Handloader 92, July-August 1981

This was common knowledge in the past. I mentioned it in an earlier post on this thread. However, many don't seem to be aware of it, so it doesn't hurt to mention it again. The late Bob Hagel was certainly among the very best of the gun/handloading writers.

In a 38 & 357 2" revolver.............
with a 125 JHP and a 158 Lead bullet..........

Load Bullseye, w231 and 2400 powder.......
and see what maximum safe load comes out with the highest fps.

I agree with the above statement.

I'm not really experienced enough to weigh in here, but I've been pleased with the Unique loads I've tried (with the bonus that it's good for everything else too).

Got a can of 2400 and that is whupass. If I was shooting something I could stand the kick, 2400 would be my choice for higher-end loads.

Finally found my Speer loading manual and here is the results for 135 gold dots with a 19 w/2 1/2 inch barrel
AA9 max load 15.5 =1258 fps
H110 max load 18.5 =1205 fps
2400 max load 16 =1176
kind of surprising but it looks like for short barreled .357's AA9 is the highest velocity and a little more efficient.

I haven't used #9 in a long time, but as I recall, I never got the accuracy with it that I did with #2400 in the .357.

Be aware that if you use the GD 135 short bbl bullet, Speer designed them to work best around 900- 1000 fps. Any faster, and they tend to expand much too fast for adequate penetration

Unique
True Blue
Accurate #5
Green Dot

These are medium burners and will do quite well in 357 Magnum short barreled loads . Data for these powders should be easy to find.
When I started reloading in 1967 Unique was THE powder for 38 Special / 357 Magnum reloads in a Ruger Blackhawk... but the others have shown their worth also.
Good luck finding powder,
Gary

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NRA Member

I'm thinking Blue Dot speed , N350 , Longshot , WSF AA7 or 9 , Silhouette . Heavy slugs or longer tube I like the old stbys ie W296 , 2400 , Enforcer , N110 .

My wife told me that a 158 XTP at 1113fps, is enough for her to play with.

It's just what the person shooting feels comfortable with and can handle.

Now shove some 38 specials in the K or L frame and you can't bring ammo, fast enough.

That's my attitude. I use 3N38 with every 357 load in my 3" 586, be it 140, 158, or 180 grain bullets.

The highest velocities from ammo in a 4" barrel will also be the highest velocities in a 2.5" barrel too. Of course not as much velocity but the highest.

In the .357 Magnum I will use W296/H110, HS-6, 2400, AA#9, Longshot and a few more. In a short barrel the only powder I avoid using is W296/H110. Too much powder left not burned in the barrel. I hate waste.

I like 2400, HS-6 or AA#9 in a short barrel. Accuracy in your gun dictates which one you should use. (when W571/HS-7 was available that's what I used.)

__________________
Freedom is never free!!
SWCA #3437

HS-7;
to soon olt & too late smart.

Water under the bridge now................

The 135 Gold Dot bullet needs 860fps out of my J frame 2" for it to expand 100% of the time
with a perfect mushroom.

Some revolvers get low or higher fps with the factory stuff, so
a water jug test or wet news paper, can give you an idea of what's happening.

I have always taken Bob Hager’s load advice with a grain of salt. He had a habit of using cas head expansion to determine pressure limits and many of his loads were, shall we say…hot…even by the standards of the day and SAAMI specs for a number of loads have backed off a bit since then, given the switch to piezo electric pressure sensing.

——-

That said I don’t think he was necessarily “wrong”, but I don’t think the the small increase in velocity was ever - and still isn’t- worth the extra recoil. In short, the juice just isn’t worth the squeeze.

Based on my own ballistic testing, the difference in velocity between a max load of a powder like Unique and a max load mod a powder like Win 296 is about 50 FPS in a short barrel revolver with a 125 gr bullet. However the recoil energy you get with more than twice the mass of powder, but only 50 FPS more velocity is 42% greater, the recoil impulse is 31% greater, and the recoil velocity is 33% greater.

Win 296
Charge Weight: 21.0 gr Muzzle Velocity: 1300.0 ft/s
Firearm Weight: 2.4 lb Bullet Weight: 125.0 gr
Recoil Velocity: 16.6 ft/s Recoil Energy: 9.6 ft•lbs
Recoil Impulse: 1.2 lb•s

Unique
Charge Weight: 9.0 gr Muzzle Velocity: 1250.0 ft/s
Firearm Weight: 2.4 lb Bullet Weight: 125.0 gr
Recoil Velocity: 12.6 ft/s Recoil Energy: 5.6 ft•lbs
Recoil Impulse: 0.9 lb•s

——-

Now….folks will claim the extra velocity is worth the extra recoil, and most of those same folks will claim they are not recoil sensitive.

However if we start shooting for speed and accuracy over a 100 round range session I guarantee they’ll be getting better hits and much faster follow up shots with the lower recoiling load. That makes far more difference than an extra 50 FPS of velocity.

Even with just a single cylinder fired at 7 yards double action at speed, shooters will get faster follow up shots and better shot placement with the lower recoiling load.

The irony is that the extra recoil of the slow burning load will convince most shooters that the slow burning powder load is a lot faster and a lot more powerful than the slow burning load, even if I load them to the same velocity in the same revolver.

I have a S&W 66-5 and a Ruger Speed Six both with short barrels. One thing you got to remember ( for every action there's equal and opposite reaction). Slow powders work fine, but the muzzle blast is to say at least deafining! Try shooting with out hearing protection, like in a true self defense situation. Holly Smolly! In a house or closed area I don't now how many you could get off accurately unless you were deaf. You would be after 6! Its very difficult to shoot when your head is ringing from concussion. 6.5 gr of Titegroup with a 125 is tolerable. But, my go to is a 158 gr cast SWC with 4.5gr of TiteGroup. Loud ,yep. But I can stay with 6 rounds double action X - 9 ring at 7 to 15 yards with no hearing protection and not have muzzle blast concussion. I've tried every load imaginable ( because I love .357's) . But there's only so much your ears can take! Shooting accurate, and comfortable is by far the most important thing to consider. And , bad guy's are not going to let you put on hearing protection! On a side note: my 66 and Ruger will stack both these loads at 15 yards

In the .357 Mag with 2.5” to 3” barrels and 125 gr bullets I like Unique for the reasons described in my previous post.

There is some old data out there that is pretty hot, and not just for the faster powders, so beware as data in current manuals is almost always for the newer or slower powders so you end up looking at older manuals for Unique load data.

In most J or K frame revolvers the cases will start sticking a bit on ejection with loads in the 8.5 to 9.0 gr range - J frames closer to 8.5 and K and L frames closer to 9.0. I generally increase the powder charge in .2 gr increments and back off to the last increment once cases start to stick.

Loads that stock are gr ally still under the max published loads (even in current manuals) but for a self defense load, I prefer cases that will drop out on their own.

The odds of ever having to reload in an armed citizen self defense shoot are remote (as is ever actually needing to shoot as the presence of a gun is enough to deter or stop the majority of imminent threats), but I like knowing a smooth and trouble free reload is in the cards if I ever need one.